Happy Birthday Ceefour



http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v480/ylla/capA2630-85.jpg

Be very sure that Ylla gets some too.....we all want to see her drop that piece of Thai duck on the floor!!!!

a joke that only Ceefour..Achila and Pelagia would understand!!!!

Happy Birthday, CEEFOUR! :k :k :k

Sssshhhhh! He's been waiting since yesterday to tell you himself, but he fell asleep! Looks like an angel when he's sleeping, doesn't he?
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/jonathansleeping.jpg

ETA: Forgot to say how much I enjoyed seeing you back, Pelagia! I miss you!
And Bunnie, thanks for that "Bobby" poster! I do love seeing Elijah's above the title!

honey!

Awww... Whiteling beat me to the lemur joke. :D
And it's been awhile since I've had to worry about LOL at the office, but Frolaldriel did it. :lol:

---------------

Happy Birthday C4!

I don't have any pictures of Elijah as other LotR characters, but I happened to run across this one from when he was auditioning for a role in The Partridge Family :haha: :

http://www.frodolivesin.us/picsfrodo/24dce310.jpg

---------------

Regarding scripts, etc. I have the early script for the football scene in The Ice Storm that Achila provided on this page (http://www.frodolivesin.us/ejw/id36.htm) (both some comments and the script itself), primarily because it's an early script. I know I'm somewhat unusual in this, but I really do try to stay within copyright law boundaries on the website (probably because I do some writing myself - the same way that I leave good tips because I used to be a waitress ;) ), and I'm not sure where that would stand with a more finished script. Also, since the script from the early IS scene was different from the way it was finally shown, I could write some commentary on it and not just post the script. I'm sure I push the fair use boundaries sometimes with the ratio of commentary to screencaps, but I do try to add something useful :rolleyes: .

If there's enough interest, I could post the other script on the protected part of the site that includes the Paint Shop pics; since that's not available to the general public, copyright considerations don't apply (the reason my "derivative works" are there). But if it's on a LJ somewhere, that may already fill the need. What say you?

Regarding another movie, the shooting script of ESOTSM can be purchased (I suppose being a Kaufman script has something to do with that). And, yes, it is available at amazon, and, yes, I just happen to have a link to it at the bottom of my review. (http://www.frodolivesin.us/ejw/id12.htm) ;)

------------

The copyright topic did remind me, though, about a link I keep planning to post, but keep forgetting to. Those who were around between TTT and RotK may remember it as ye olde crebain site: http://home.earthlink.net/~screencaps/index.html . It's the main reason TTT scenes aren't very well represented on my main site - I'd already done a lot of them here. I keep thinking I should redo the screencaps from a legitimate DVD and post them on the main site, but there are always so many other things to do.

The "RotK scans" are all from before RotK was released, so there's not much to see there, except maybe for the "Enough for what?" discussion. But the "TTT Archives" have a number of scenes from that movie.

There's a permanent link to the crebain site from the opening page of "The Wizards Are Odd." Just follow the link to "The Saga of Brego the Wonder Horse." Hey, we're nothing if not high-brow. :haha:

And at the end, I expect everyone to know how to say "No, Master, No!" in Malaysian. ;)

------------

Happy Birthday C4 !!!!

hmm IF I stay up here maybe i see were the party is !!!!!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v399/erendil/gapbillboard.jpg

Good to see you Ylla ,and all the rest of you of curse :k :k

Oh and [B]Pelagia the picture you were wondering about is from Bumblebee!!

WOOD

Hi all! Yes, TG, I am a big fan of your website, and it really helped get the wheels turning in my head. I suppose a lot of your insights came through in my post, but hopefully I added enough of my own ideas!

Stokely definitely gets it in the pool from Mary Beth, (why, again, do Casey and Stokely run towards a body of water to get away from an alien that thrives in water?) Again, props to TG for making that observation in frodolivesin.us.

Does the real Stokely still have some control over alien Stokely? Or was she just not moving very efficiently in trying to take Casey in the locker room?

If Delilah already got done in when she's "in disguise", why doesn't she get Casey when they are in the bathroom stall together? (Oh my, I realize how that must sound! :rolleyes: )

Yes, birthdays around here are WONDERFUL!!! Lots and lots of wonderful pics. Before I found out about the Faculty Lounge, my main source of pics was always.ejwsites.net, an absolutely wonderful site! If the lovely keepers of that site read this at all, major props to them!!! :k

Hugs everyone!

-FT

whiteling: Froladriel is wonderful! More, more, pleeeeeeease?? I agree that an all-Elijah cast would leave the lemurs choking in the dust. The concept even outdoes Achila’s and my all-canine version. :haha:

wood: Thanks for IDing the [I]Bumblebee pic. I think I better go back and watch that movie again – forgot how he looked!

As for good movies with all-“star” casts, I strongly second Achila’s mention of Crash (we mean the 2005 one, not the weird David Cronenberg extravaganza). How about Robert Altman’s The Player? Or Nashville (great movie!), although most of those people weren’t really stars. Magnolia was supposed to have been pretty good, too, wasn’t it? (I never saw it.) And then there’s Love, Actually – not a great film, but it’s one of my guilty pleasures. Ditto for The Life Aquatic with Steve Zissou.

I think a lot depends on how well the script manages to develop each character in an ensemble cast to some level of believability (obviously within the limits of the limited screen time each one has). Where the “all-star” component becomes annoying, IMHO, is when the stars are basically just doing cameos, rather than actually contributing something to the story.

I think a lot depends on how well the script manages to develop each character in an ensemble cast to some level of believability (obviously within the limits of the limited screen time each one has). Where the “all-star” component becomes annoying, IMHO, is when the stars are basically just doing cameos, rather than actually contributing something to the story.I would also add that although there are some big "names" in this (Anthony Hopkins, our own One Lad, etc.), there are no Tom Cruises or anyone "larger than life". That also makes a difference in the overall effect -- it's why those sorts were rejected from The Lord of the Rings cast.

One other recent film with a big, well-known cast I just thought of (that worked out pretty well ;) ) was Sin City.

I would also add that although there are some big "names" in this (Anthony Hopkins, our own One Lad, etc.), there are no Tom Cruises or anyone "larger than life"...
Another thing that makes a difference is whether the "Stars" can Act :haha: . Anthony Hopkins being at the top of the cast list is very hopeful, IMHO. Maybe "larger than life" translates into the star's persona being more important than the character?

Maybe "larger than life" translates into the star's persona being more important than the character?That's basically what I was getting at -- and I was glad you said the bit about "the stars can act", because I thought it but didn't want to say that!

ETA -- From Filmstew.com:

"The Warner Brothers animated feature Happy Feet doesn’t come out until Thanksgiving ... of 2006.

But this Thanksgiving season - Tuesday, November 29th to be exact - Warner Home Video will be dancing a jig as a trailer for that movie (which chronicles the adventures of a separate penguins colony and features the voice talents of Hugh Jackman, Nicole Kidman, Robin Williams, Elijah Wood and Brittany Murphy) tags along with the DVD release of March of the Penguins, the second most successful documentary of all-time."

May I have another birthday, please?

Thank you Shelbyshire, Pelagia, Achila, Goldenberry, BunnieBugs, whiteling, saile, ylla, honeyelf, tg, wood, and Fast Toadfoot!

Alas, neither wizard nor dwarf came knocking at my door. However, I recieved something Tolkienish from NZ. A shawl made form the Elven cloak material was my present. How did Mr. ceefour know?! (Maybe because I ordered it myself last month and it's been sitting in my hall closet for the past two weeks.) And who's face is on the Stansborough Mills tag attached to the shawl? You guessed it!! I'm sitting here wrapped in it right now and every so often swirl it around to try and get some cloak action going. :rolleyes:

C4

Even though she doesn't post here anymore, I thought some of The Faculty might like to know that Flourish's father passed away today. :(

oh,sorry to hear that c4!!

if you talk to her give her a hug from me !!!

WOOD

Everyone must be exhausted by all the birthday festivities!

A little peak of the inside of the Complete Soundtrack of FOTR

http://images.barnesandnoble.com/images/10360000/10363801.jpg

I had to get FOTR out to compare the cloak action on screen vs. the shawl on me. More research needed...

C4

(wood, I'll pass your message along.)

C-4 exploded: I had to get FOTR out to compare the cloak action on screen vs. the shawl on me. More research needed...

Try this site. I still have it bookmarked waiting for MY birthday (hint hint): http://shop.newline.com/search/?keywords1=cloak&method=all&collection=sitebuilder%2Fcatalog-1&go_search.x=7&go_search.y=6
It's prrrrrrreeeecioussssss and we wants one...

Happy happy C-4! We like playing with C-4 too...makes big booms!!! Tommorrow is the 230th Birthday of the U.S. Marine Corp., Nov.10, 1775.
We plan on going out and celibrating with many big booms! Will be playing with a lot of C-4 tommorrow! ;)

Happy birthday, ceefour!

(Am I late? I'm sending this guy in the sweater to beg your forgiveness on my behalf. :z: )


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v382/mechtild/pics%20for%20posts/ElijahsweaterComehitherpeek.jpg


~ Mechtild

TxTac (who else?) said: We like playing with C-4 too...makes big booms!!! Tommorrow is the 230th Birthday of the U.S. Marine Corp., Nov.10, 1775. We plan on going out and celibrating with many big booms! Will be playing with a lot of C-4 tommorrow!

:eek: :eek: :eek:

Well, just be careful, and don't blow off anything you might want later! Yer scarey, dude!

C4, you got the Lorien cloak for your b-day?? :D Notice my verdant complexion.

Meant to say how much I enjoyed Legolijah, and Froladriel!

ceefour, I expect you to wear your birthday shawl on our next outing with Achila! Also, I got all excited when you mentioned the FOTR Complete Recordings. I thought maybe they had finally come out. But then I checked on Amazon.com, and saw that the release date is December 13th. :( What, pray tell, is a "DVD-Audio disc," which is what the 4th disc is? Is it just a DVD that has nothing but sound? (We're low-tech in this household.)

Thank you, Mechtild and txtac, for the birthday wishes!

Honeyelf, I have the shawl, not the Elven cloak. It's more practical (there aren't many places one can wear an Elven cloak to), plus it's less $$$. The exchange rate favors the U.S. The cloaks appear more green in the movies, though. Anybody know if the material was dyed?

txtac, have you been celebrating early? ;)

Young Miss ceefour's comment on seeing the Stansborough tag with EW's picture on it as I opened the package last night: "Mommie got Frodo for her birthday!" :lol:

C4

Pelagia, a DVD-Audio disc is like surround sound without the picture. Instead of the usual 2 speaker tracks that a CD (or stereo LP or tape) has, a DVD-Audio disc has 5 or 6 tracks, and possibly room for pictures.

C-not a plasticine explosive or computer virus-4

What are we doing here? Lost is on in 20 minutes!

ceefour, thanks for the definition. Not that surround sound is going to matter in my apartment. . . .

And yes, it's almost time for Lost. Let's hope that something actually happens tonight!

And yes, it's almost time for Lost. Let's hope that something actually happens tonight!Someone's supposed to die tonight, I think

Elijah and Frodo. Frodo and his elvish clothes. Is that on-topic?

ceefour, excellent choice your husband made for your birthday present! May we see a picture of it?

Below is a picture of the "Hobbit Scarf" I got while at the exhibit in Indy. They had a full size cloak there (very high $) a Hobbit size scarf and an Elf size scarf. I showed mine to Hewene who promptly went and bought what they told her was the last Hobbit scarf they had. It seems they only had a half dozen maybe as someone had brought them up from New Zealand to sell at the exhibit. The fabric and pattern are gorgeous. Frodo and Sam thoroughly enjoyed relaxing in it after our long day at the museum. :( I do believe they were somewhat missing Middle-earth after that though. I have put mine out of reach of the kids and the dog since it seems too easy to get a snag in it.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v638/Shelbyshire/PICT1307.jpg

Enjoy the "cloak action research"! :D Since I have no cable or television antenna in my house, I have to wait until tomorrow to buy the Lost episode at iTunes. So, we watch it on Thursday night instead.

I had to get FOTR out to compare the cloak action on screen vs. the shawl on me. More research needed...

I know! I remember being amazed by the translucency and the floaty-ness of the cloaks in FOTR (especially Frodo at Amon Hen). And then discovering that that it was the cloth, not some fancy CGI. It really does move like that, pass light like that, compress like an Elven cloak should into a very small package, and emerge wrinkle free. Yardage is now available, as opposed to a shawl or scarf, or the tres expensive premade cloak.

I thought the cloth was dyed, but I may be misremembering - one of the commentaries, or in one of the books? but IIRC the cloth was actually discovered in NewYork; the buyer was intriged with the pattern.

Ah here - http://www.alleycatscratch.com/lotr/Buyit/Artisans/Stansborough.htm.

chattegrise

ps: Happy Birthday!

Shelbyshire: Love the picture of Frodo and Sam nestled in the Elvish fabric! And you can really see the weave. What is the texture of the wool: soft, rough, or what?

(And yes, as Achila said, someone did die on Lost. The perfect person, IMHO.)

[ADDED LATER] Just looked on the Stansborough website, where I see that the cloth is described as "silky." I also see that they provided some of the fabrics used in the upcoming The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe. With a completely different color palette, of course.

The hobbit-sized scarf was my one big splurge in Indianapolis. The [very] young man in the special exihibit gift shop was afraid he'd get into trouble if he sold me the last one there because it didn't have a tag on it (someone had tied it around standup Gandalf's neck :D ), so he called the main museum gift shop, found out they still had a couple left, and actually ran down to the other floor to get them (the special LotR gift shop was considered to be inside the exhibit, so if I'd gone myself I wouldn't have been able to get back in -- no re-entries to the exhibit if you left). Kinda scary that I'm old enough to say, "What a nice young man" and really mean it. :p They were completely out of elven-sized scarves by then, but the hobbit one has such a nice picture on the tag, who wouldn't want it anyway :p ? The cloaks were special order. There was an Aragorn-sized cloak on display, and, yes big bucks for that. They didn't have any shawls. :(

One of the first things I did after I got home (after sleeping a few hours ;) ) was pull up the best close-up screencaps I could find for comparison. And the weave is exactly the same, which was very reassuring to discover because just looking at the scarf I'd swear the pattern is more obvious on it than on the cloaks. But the material actually does seem to have some of the "Elvish" properties it does in the book, in that the variegated grays do actually seem to look different depending on the surroundings. I think that's even why they often look more green onscreen than they do "in person." One flock of sheep in the world that has that kind of wool, I think they said?

Thanks for the news on the yardage, chattegrise [and, hi! :) ]. I've been to the website before, but it must have been before they were offering it that way. I'm a bit afraid to look at the price, though :eek: . I'd thought about ordering a scarf from the website but I'm glad I waited, because this way I have both the scarf and a lovely souvenir of the trip at the same time (and for one price ;) ).

I'd say silky is a good description. But it's definitely wool, not silk. A little "scratchy" if you rub it the wrong way.

ETA: I'm not going to put my scarf through one comparison test, though. The scene where Sam wakes up Frodo when they're on the ledge above Minas Morgul -- I love how their blankets are tattered by then, but the cloaks are still in perfect condition. Great little touch for the movie, but I'm afraid would need an Elvish touch to pull off in real life, without a wardrobe department. :p Random thought: I suppose that means they didn't have to make as many versions of the cloaks as they did the rest of the clothing, especially Frodo's and Sam's, that had to show progressive deterioration.

Fantastic bit of interview with "Sound and Vision" magazine here (http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/article.asp?section_id=4&article_id=993), especially if you're like me and love to hear him geek out over music, film and video games. Also some new tidbits about his Iggy Pop role! :cool: Make sure you catch both pages. :)

Thanks, Bunnie -- cool that we now know a little more about the Iggy film, like the name and the director! :k

...cultivating
...infrastructure
...unscathed
...organic
...irrelevant
...gratifying
...ritual
...unification

:cool: [and a slight swoon :D ]

Thanks, Bunnie :)

Elijah: ... It's looking like sooner, rather than later, we'll be able to get first-run movies at home at the same time as at the theater. Really? Sooner, rather than later? Elijah: ... I just hope that there'll be a special place in people's hearts for the movie-theater experience, because it would be a shame to see it die out. :eek: I cannot imagine not having seen Frodo, Sam, and Gollum at Mt. Doom at least once on the big screen! I truly missed FotR at the theaters but made up for it by seeing the EE when it was released. And I already have my Harry Potter tickets for the 18th. :) Then Narnia and Kong!

Thanks, Bunnie! Awesome article!!

tgshaw said: I'd say silky is a good description. But it's definitely wool, not silk. A little "scratchy" if you rub it the wrong way. Pelagia, yes it is just gorgeous but it can be scratchy. The pattern of the weave is what I just love about it. So that makes 3 of us that bought a Hobbit scarf at the exhibition! Cool!! :cool:

OT post from the resident textile geek:

You ladies might consider giving your hobbit scarves and shawls a very gentle hand washing in a mild soap (NOT Woollite; it's actually very bad for wool!) Don't agitate it too much, but a little gentle agitation wouldn't hurt to marry those fibers up, and keep them from snagging quite so much. Also, on the last rinse, add a teaspoon of hair conditioner before you put the scarf back in the water (whatever you put on your own hair) This will make the wool more "silky" and less scratchy.

honey!

:eek: *folds scarf into it's small compact size and hides it from honeyelf*

You want me to get it...it...wet? With soap...and hair conditioner?

Okay, ceefour, tgshaw...you go first! ;)

Oh Bunnie thanks for the link. I love to hear him talk about music . Lapping up (hmmmmmm :eek: ) every word.
saile

Shelbyshire said: :eek: *folds scarf into it's small compact size and hides it from honeyelf*

You want me to get it...it...wet? With soap...and hair conditioner?

Well, not if you don't want to. Just a suggestion. I don't think the 'Elven Magic' would wash out. ;) But I'm not gonna come make you! :lol:

honey!

ETA: I just looked at IMDB for a listing of The Passenger. Turns out there are already eight or nine movies with that title, including one IMDB doesn't list, a Michelangelo Antonioni directed 1975 Jack Nicholson vehicle. Did I do a double take tonight when my Landmark theater newsletter listed The Passenger as opening in the theater tomorrow night! :eek:

Anyhow, long way around of saying I'm guessing that is only the working title for the Iggy Pop project.

Honey -- So if you don't recommend Woolite, what's best to use?

...So if you don't recommend Woolite, what's best to use?
I prefer a liberal application of "Dog's Tongue." No soap, nor physical excertion required. Good for old wet wool as well as the fluffy new stuff. Guaranteed to wear out evan the most deeply soaked gravy stain and pesky splash of orc's blood. Just throw the item on the floor and in two, or three days time "Dog's Tongue" will have miraculously worked your favourite wooley into finger-licken clean and as soft as an old chewed cat's hide. :haha:

Just throw the item on the floor and in two, or three days time "Dog's Tongue" will have miraculously worked your favourite wooley into finger-licken clean and as soft as an old cat's hide. :eek: :eek: Do not...I repeat, do not take your scarves or shawl to txtac's house! Very dangerous there. A wool's nightmare. Kinda like Isengard with the wargs around. :eek: :eek:

(((Faculty))) :k (((honeyelf))) (((txtac)))

-Off to pick up my Harry Potter tickets so I don't have to wait in the ticket line next Friday and grocery shop. The scarf is tucked away "secret and safe".

Honey -- So if you don't recommend Woolite, what's best to use?

TG, I recommend Ivory Snow. Put just a little in the sink as you run cool water in, rubbing it between your fingers to release the suds. Then put in the scarf (or what have you.) Agitate very gently, and very briefly if at all.

TxTac, I see y u managed t keep a y ur digits! Congratu ati ns! Did y u have fun b wing stuff up?? :D :haha:

((Shelbyshire)) ((TxTac)) ((Faculty))

Honey: For those of us who usually let others clean our delicate unmentionables, what is the difference betwen Woolite, Ivory Snow and Dog Syliva? All are light cleaning agents made for delicate unmentionables. One is organic and easier on the environment, the other two are not. Without getting into a long chemical breakdown and analysis of the two compounded cleaners, why is Ivory Snow "better" than Woolite? Was not Woolite specifically designed/created/engineered for light wool delicate unmentionables?

Did y u have fun b wing stuff up??
I will let you know when my ears stop ringing and pull next weeks laundry out of the dog'(s) house. :p

BunnieBugs: Thanks for the link to the Sound and Vision interview. 3,000 CDs – my god!

I was delighted at this comment: I love the ritual of going to a movie, and all that entails: getting your popcorn and drink, sitting down, watching the trailer. It's an important experience, and there's an audience there reacting with you. You don't get that at home. . . . I just hope that there'll be a special place in people's hearts for the movie-theater experience, because it would be a shame to see it die out. Now that I’m working for a nonprofit movie theater, I feel even more strongly about this than before. And especially since I took a class last month (run by the theater) called “The Language of Film,” which naturally included lots of film clips. It occurred to me that I had never seen such films as Citizen Kane or The Wizard of Oz on a big screen. And they look completely different. [ :( Sniffles over the fact that she never got to see FOTR on a big screen, and that it was her own stupid fault!!!]

(Tangentially related to Elijah – the PJ connection) The current issue of Entertainment Weekly has an article on King Kong, including a terrific two-page picture of Kong (on all fours) confronting Naomi Watts at a snowy intersection in (I assume) midtown Manhattan. Also a funny quote from Jack Black: I couldn’t remember my lines. I kept thinking, In one week, Viggo Mortensen could be taking over my role. The issue also has a retrospective on Rob Reiner’s films, including North (Elijah is just mentioned in passing as having played the title role). Reiner says, of the critics’ trashing of the movie: [The response] was so off-the-charts bad that I couldn’t get bothered by it. If I’d made some movies nobody knew about, they’d watch this and go, “Ehh. It’s cute.” Not [slightly misquoting Roger Ebert] “I hated it, hated it, hated it.”

Just happened by the "Bobby" entry on IMDB and noticed that a bunch more (technical term -- I'm a scientist) people have been added to the cast again, including our GSH pal, Charlie Hunnam (and, oh yeah, Meryl Streep too).... :eek:

ETA -- The release date now says August, 2006 but those things are so fluid, it's a sure bet the studio will move it to the fall to be in awards contention

I just saw the Faculty for the 5th time, and I think this was the best time! I noticed a lot of extra stuff I didn't get from the first four times.

Someone mentioned Stokely at the water fountain having something stick in her throat when Mrs. Olson looks at her. I think that is the alien screaming out to Stokely. They're really trying to work her over by persuasion. Mary Beth talks to her out in the school yard, wants to be her lab partner, and pushes her onto Stan throughout the course of the movie.

Also, Principal Drake is absolutely freakin' hysterical! :lol:

Casey: Coach Willis and Mrs. Olson just attacked Nurse Harper!!!

Drake: Now why would we do that? (The way she says it is the funny part)


Drake: Now, why would Mrs. Brummel be in the closet?

Casey: Cause they killed her.

Drake: Oh, righhhhht.


I really caught on to the alien's tactic of persuasion in this viewing much more so then before, Jon Stewart: "It's better this way, kids"

After Delilah was taken, when she's talking to Casey on the school bus, she really tries to tempt him. Stan tries to tempt Stokely, and she also, like Casey, makes the concious decision to reject what the alien in the form of Stan is offering her.

One big change Stokely has is that she "starts wearing purple", as she is wearing a purple outfit at the end of the movie, when before it had all been dark colors. "Start Wearing Purple" is the song in the end credits of EII! I know, I'm probably a geek for making that connection, but oh well. :)

The Faculty is becoming one of my favorite movies!!!

Bunnie, that Sound and Vision interview was very enjoyable. Thanks! :)


More, more, pleeeeeeease?? [Imagine that “pleeeeeeease” as spoken by Stu.]
Pelagia, who could resist that extremely charming plea?! Certainly not me :D!
Therefore I'll bring you ---
~~~Frodagorn~~~


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/whiteling/Frodomanips/Frodagorn.jpg

Poor guy. He *doesn't* want to be king, does he? :p
(Somebody stop me, please! :eek: I don't know where this could lead to....)

----------


Ceefour, give Flourish a hug from me, too, will you?

whiteling pleaded: Somebody stop me, please! I don't know where this could lead to....
Not until you do Frodimili ! :z:

Don't forget Frodéomer!

C4

Will do, Whiteling.

ETA-Honeyelf, would that be Ivory Snow flakes?

Whiteling!

"Frodagorn"!!!

:lol:

Gah! Love it! Love it! Love it!

(Somebody stop me, please! :eek: I don't know where this could lead to....)
Well, I don't see it going too far past redoing every face in each frame of all three movies... ;) (The battle scenes might be quite a challenge :haha: )

Isn't it nice that different programs have different strengths? Paint Shop isn't very good for making photo manips (thank goodness :eek: ;) ; how could I possibly compete?), so I'm limited to things like this --

After doing that "just a glance" page, I was even more intrigued by Frolijah's Elvishness. One thing I like about the first pic below is that it uses no special effects, except for the frame. It's completly done with adjustment settings (contrast, etc.), so brings out what's already there:

http://www.frodolivesin.us/picsfrodo/2e00a230.jpg
"I see you are an Elf-friend.
The light in your eyes tells me so."

(Now that's "Frodo as I always knew him.")

------------

This one uses polished stone:

http://www.frodolivesin.us/picsfrodo/2df56670.jpg

--------

Ceefour, if you're still collecting (((Flourish))), please add one from me.

Well, I don't see it going too far past redoing every face in each frame of all three movies... ;) (The battle scenes might be quite a challenge :haha: )
:eek: *faints at the very thought*. Uuuuh, that's a massive challenge! :D

I for one love the results of your "limitation" ;). Fascinating, how much you carved out Frodo's Elf-friend trait. *sigh* He is gorgeous.

FT -- I must have been so enthralled by Frodogorn :p that I forgot to comment on your Faculty observations. I hadn't noticed the purple, so will have to watch for that and other changes (besides Casey's hair, which is pretty hard to miss ;) ). IIRC, the Ally Sheedy character in The Breakfast Club goes through a somewhat similar change.

--Yeah, reading those lines involving Principal Drake you can't really blame Casey's parents for thinking he'd gone off the deep end :D .

I know, I'm probably a geek for making that connection, but oh well.
Your point being...? :confused: ;)

Read this earlier today on a different geeky message board:

--How many geeks does it take to change a light bulb?

--Geeks aren't afraid of the dark.

:haha: :D

A bit of trivia I learned today. Howard Shore was a member of the group, Lighthouse, in the late 60's-early 70's. At a concert in Chicago, the opening act for Lighthouse was Iggy Pop and the Stooges. HS says the Iggy Pop audience's response to his band was "interesting." HS is such a gentleman. The band was driven from the stage, the crowd was so hostile. I wonder if this incident might make it to EW's movie and if EW has spoken to HS about his musical past.

C4

I will, tg.

C4--Interesting. I could see it if HS's band had been opening for Iggy Pop and Iggy's fans wanted to see him, but the other way around is pretty unusual. Even though Iggy's band was the opening act, was it the big draw for the concert?

From Whiteling:
*sigh* He is gorgeous.
It's been said (possibly by me at some point ;) ) that it would have been better if Elijah'd been a few years older when he played Frodo. But looking at that picture, I think he was exactly the right age. There is something about that "caught between boyhood and adulthood" look that has an agelessness that not only fits Frodo (since book-Frodo stopped aging physically the day he came of age, so was literally "caught" between boyhood and adulthood until the Ring was destroyed) but also gives a glimmer of that drop of fairy blood he inherited through the Took line. (One of the "little things I loved" in the movies is the tiny bit Elrond has aged between the Last Alliance and the end of the Third Age. :) Elves would have to grow up and mature, after all, even if they were immortal.)

whiteling! Frodagorn! Thank you! The only thing that could have made it funnier would have been a slightly longer shot, to reveal Mr. Mortensen’s hirsute chest. Now I’m having fun imagining Frolurtz, or Frodo the Witch King (what’s his name? He’s the WK of Angmar, but doesn’t he have a name?? I guess he could just be Frodangmar).

ceefour wrote, re Howard Shore’s time with a group called Lighthouse that had the great misfortune of opening for Iggy: I wonder if this incident might make it to EW's movie Oh, good – let’s try to think of someone to play young Howard. Someone suitably “adorcable.” Zach Braff?? (BTW, ceefour and I are off to see Savion Glover on Tuesday evening.)

Yesterday, in the absence of any theatrical movie we wanted to see, Achila and I watched All I Want. Much fanning of selves during and after the "This is not happening" scene. (ylla: You know what I mean!)

[ADDED AFTER READING TG’s COMMENT THAT: There is something about that "caught between boyhood and adulthood" look that has an agelessness That reminded me of Alan Lee’s comment in The LOTR Sketchbook: In my illustrations he [Frodo] looked quite a bit younger [than his age in the book]; being unsure of the rate at which hobbits mature, I kept him in a state of indeterminate youth, alongside Gandalf’s indeterminate old age.

There is something about that "caught between boyhood and adulthood" look that has an agelessness that not only fits Frodo (since book-Frodo stopped aging physically the day he came of age, so was literally "caught" between boyhood and adulthood until the Ring was destroyed) but also gives a glimmer of that drop of fairy blood he inherited through the Took line.
Tg, there is even another picture proof to illustrate your words - look:


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/whiteling/Frodomanips/frowen_small.jpg

~~~ *Frowen* ~~~

Awww, ain't (s)he beautiful :p ;)??
(I hope Pelagia won't insist on a hirsute chest here!! :D)

Whiteling, it's a good thing you gave him Arwen's neck in this pic, that's all, or this would be a *very* unconvincing manip. :D

As it is, all the more does this pic make me wish EW really did have a twin sister so they could both appear in a production of Twelfth Night, as Sebastian and Viola. How I would love that! :z:

~ Mechtild

Whiteling! Love the Fro-manips! :lol:

* marvels how good a woman elijah makes. Its the bone structure y'know *

A little more info on Happy Feet here. (http://comingsoon.net/news/topnews.php?id=11988)
Sounds good.
Why dont they mention Elijah more though?? Hmmmph. :rolleyes:

whiteling: Another triumph, with "Frowen"! As for your comment: (I hope Pelagia won't insist on a hirsute chest here!! ) Lord, no. Although some cleavage would have been very amusing;) . I join Mechtild in thanking you for retaining Liv's neck (and in fantasizing about Elijah playing both Sebastian and Viola!).

* marvels how good a woman elijah makes. Its the bone structure y'know *
...with cheekbones emphasized by the lovely make-up job. :D

Hi, quicksilver, and thanks for the Happy Feet link. That's a great write-up (but, yes, a shocking lack of press for the hero :rolleyes: ). I tried the link to the official Happy Feet site and it immediately re-directs to the Warner Bros. main movie page, with no link to Happy Feet that I can see. But maybe it's a bit early yet - the farthest "out there" movie they show at this point is Superman Returns for next June. (And, as a "consolation prize" there is a link to EII's official site ;) .)

Seeing who's playing the "leader of the emperor penguins," of course, makes me immediately start thinking about what Felrond might look like. :haha:

Whiteling: Please continue with the minaps. Some of us are learning and it gives us some ideas and motivation to continue our own projects too! Thank you. :k

Quicksilver: Thank you for posting the Happy Feet article. That movie has been through H**L getting it made. This is the first big article that I have seen where they actually talk more about the movie than what it is just about.

Whiteling, I'm loving the Frodomanips! You can't stop until you've done Frodgandalf! Or Frodomir and his other brother Frodomir! :D

Speaking of Frodo and Gandalf, have I ever mentioned how much I love the way movieFrodo says Gand-alf, while the rest of the fellowship says Gand-olph?? I wonder if that was an Elijahism, or if PJ specifically requested that he say it that way to set him apart from everyone else?

Quicksilver, interesting article about Happy Feet. I'm relieved that we won't be getting bowling pin penguins, a la Madagascar. Though if the poster we've seen of Mumbles is any indication, the penguins do have rather individual faces. Am I the only one who thinks this little fellow
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/mumbles.jpg
bears something of a resemblence to this little fellow?
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/elwood87.jpg

It'll be interesting to see the DVD extras; I'm always vaguely embarrassed watching the actors wave their arms around in front of a blue screen, thinking it must feel very silly. This discomfort was finally confirmed for me recently by the daughter of a close friend who just did ADR on her second movie. It was her first experience doing ADR for scenes that had a lot of action in them, requiring giggles, grunts and screams. She said she felt very self-concious during the process.

*****

OT stuff about soap
TxTac said: I prefer a liberal application of "Dog's Tongue." No soap, nor physical excertion required....(and then later) For those of us who usually let others clean our delicate unmentionables, what is the difference betwen Woolite, Ivory Snow and Dog Syliva?
Well for one thing, I've never seen a box of Ivory Snow (yes C4, the flakes) do with its mouth some of the completely disgusting and unhygenic things a dog does! :eek:Can't you find a nice flat rock along the river? I understand doing your laundry that way is real good for building up the forearms! ;)

And I'm not sure what it is in the Woollite that does it, but it makes wool brittle. Not the first, nor perhaps the last time that a comsumer product that was supposedly "good for" us or our consumer products failed to live up to the hype.

honey!

Whiteling

You are amazing!

What a beautiful Frowen!

Pelagia...what is truly amazing is the fact I just bought an HDTV...and yesterday I watched AIW :D
Guess the three of us were on the same wavelength yesterday ;) ;)


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v480/ylla/alliwant10.jpg

Jones Dillon in HD
Swoonworthy indeed!

Some of us are learning and it gives us some ideas and motivation to continue our own projects too!
Well, I've never learned Photo Shop properly, so all results are more or less by guess and by gosh :o. Perhaps is my pigheadedness huge enough to finalise a part of the growing manip list!
Frondalf, Frimli, Frodomir&Frodomir (:D), Frelrond, Frodomer, Frilbo, Frodweis, Frerry and Frippin, Freoden, Froma Wormtongue, Froduman and .... FRAURON :eek:
... I think I quit my job in order to have the required time on my hands. *writes job resignation*
:lol:

Can't you find a nice flat rock along the river? I understand doing your laundry that way is real good for building up the forearms! ;)
And I could lend Txtac my granny's wash board. That should boost the work out effect on the forearms ;).

Am I the only one who thinks this little fellowbears something of a resemblence to this little fellow?
I thought it quite a good match, Honey. ;)

Thanks, Quicksilver for the HF link :).


Hi, Ylla :)! It's wonderful to see you. Jones in HD is... *thinks of an unswoony word... fails miserably* :k

Whiteling, don't forget Fram and Frosie!
C4

And Frigwit, too.

Frondalf, Frimli, Frodomir&Frodomir (:D), Frelrond, Frodomer, Frilbo, Frodweis, Frerry and Frippin, Freoden, Froma Wormtongue, Froduman and .... FRAURON :eek:
Can't forget a member of the Fellowship - Where's Frogolas? And I seem to be having a senior moment... Frodweis? :confused:

Have to note that "Frerry and Frippin" is kind of fun to say. :D

... I think I quit my job in order to have the required time on my hands. *writes job resignation*
:lol:
If you can figure out a way to make a living from doing strange things with EJW screencaps, let me know ;) .

Ylla -- Now stop that :mad: ;) ! I'm trying to convince myself that I don't need any more electronic consumer goods! :( (HDTV, eh?)

From Honey:
Or Frodomir and his other brother Frodomir!
Honey--I'd noticed that the names would be the same (while trying to think of other suggestions :p ), but hadn't caught that connotation! :lol: But then you'd need Frarry. :D

-----BTW, if the snow doesn't stop by morning, my scarf's first experience of getting wet may be completely natural. :)

Had to pop in to say how much I'm enjoying all the Fromanips.

I think I quit my job in order to have the required time on my hands. *writes job resignation*

You've made the right decision Whiteling - some things are more important than a mere job :) And with all the extra time you'll have, why stop at just the LOTR characters? You could extend it to those behind the camera, such as Freter & Frfran :)

Frowen is very beautiful, and s/he reminded me of something Lawrence Makoare told some fans at a convention (can't remember which one, I wasn't there myself). Apparently during the making of LOTR the cast had a party where the men dressed up as women. Lawrence said Elijah looked so pretty that he (Lawrence) really fancied him :D Now why didn't that appear on the dvd?:( So, if Lij ever gets stuck for good male film roles ... :D

Can't forget a member of the Fellowship - Where's Frogolas? And I seem to be having a senior moment... Frodweis? :confused:
Oh no, no senior moment on your part, Tg :) - *my* brain's speech area mixed up language there. I meant Frowise!! :o - And Frogolas already has seen the light of day, thanks to another manic Photo Shopper, a few pages back.

If you can figure out a way to make a living from doing strange things with EJW screencaps, let me know ;) .
That would be fantastic! Certainly there is a great demand for such a thing. :p (We two could make quite a mink with that! ;))


You've made the right decision Whiteling - some things are more important than a mere job. And with all the extra time you'll have, why stop at just the LOTR characters? You could extend it to those behind the camera, such as Freter & Frfran.
You are right... - my next project is Fring Frong :D

Apparently during the making of LOTR the cast had a party where the men dressed up as women. Lawrence said Elijah looked so pretty that he (Lawrence) really fancied him.
Shireling, I can believe that offhand - he makes even a handsome dwarf!

for Txtac (others may have a look too ;))

+++ Frimli +++

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/whiteling/Frodomanips/frimli_CoE.jpg

:D small but powerful, hehe

honeyelf wrote: . . . Or Frodomir and his other brother Frodomir! Shouldn’t they be Froromir and Fraramir? If only to minimize confusion. Or am I thinking of a different pair of brothers? Besides, that’s nearly as much fun to say as Frerry and Frippin. (Love the juxtaposition of Mumbles with young Lij. Is that from one of the extras on The Good Son?)

And did anyone mention one of my favorite characters, Freowyn?

And yes indeed, whiteling, Frodo even makes a handsome dwarf! You are definitely on a roll here!

ylla: I don’t think that I could take Jones Dillon in hi-def. You might have to sedate me (and Achila).

Hey, Pelagia, remember when we thought Frodo as Gimil wouldn't be all that, since there's so much hair on his face to begin with???

**faints at sight of Frimli (in a good way)**

ETA -- A little OT, but you guys will appreciate this. I went to a health and safety training class yesterday and one of the topics we had was confined space entry (which is something that people in my business encounter when they have to go into a petrol tank to clean it or somesuch). Anyway, instead of the usual dry lecture, the instructor showed us film clips to illustrate what not to do when entering confined spaces (like, don't think the atmosphere is breathable unless you test it, etc.)

The first film clip was something from the Sci-Fi channel, of people entering an alien ship and doing everything possible to get themselves killed. The second was Raiders of the Lost Ark (the scene with the Well of Sighs, and the snakes on the floor) -- and the first person you see is Sala. OK -- JRD -- first LOTR connection.

The last clip is The Goonies -- hehehe. No LOTR clips but still, lots of associations.

From this week's TV Guide interview with Dominic Monaghan:

Any chance a hobbit might show up on Lost?

The producers have been trying to have Billy Boyd [Pippin] play my brother. They were keen on that idea from the start. Elijah [Wood] has the kind of face that would work on the show--he's always looking shocked. And he's always calling. It's possible.

pelagia and I saw Savion Glover last night. We both enjoyed his tap dancing to classical music, but didn't enjoy the last dance to improvisational jazz (only because we don't care for that type of music and it was incredibly loud). It will be interesting to see when the movie is released how Glover's dancing will be shown. For an idea of his style, watch either White Nights or The Cotton Club, both with Gregory Hines, his mentor.

C4

Pelagia said: Shouldn’t they be Froromir and Fraramir? If only to minimize confusion. Or am I thinking of a different pair of brothers?

Yeah, it probably ought to be, but I was goofing on an old "Newhart" gag. TG got my reference. There were three side characters, all brothers, on the show. They were very back woodsy, and everytime them came on the eldest would introduce them: "Hi, my name is Larry. This is my brother Darryl, and this is my other brother Darryl." It was never clear whether their parents had run out of names, or even if they all had both parents in common. And my favorite part was that one of the Darryl's never spoke, but that Larry would quote him all the time as saying (relatively) astute things.

(Love the juxtaposition of Mumbles with young Lij. Is that from one of the extras on The Good Son?)

I'm sorry, but I don't know. :confused:

CeeFour, that's a funny quote from Dom. He'd drive me absolutely starkers; I'd always feel a half step behind him, trying to figure out if he was being serious at the moment or not. I'm thinking he's not serious this time.

Is that from one of the extras on The Good Son?

What extras??? :mad: Don't tell me we got short changed on this one too in Europe. First I find there is no directors commentary on Huck Finn, and now I am possibly missing extras on my favourite of his young films. Are these things missed off so that we can have the film in 5 languages, or does region 1 get that facility as well?

Whiteling I am really enjoying your photo manips. Can you do a Fram and Sodo shot?

Unfortunately, I can't remember where I got this from, but some wonderful person did manips to give the entire fellowship played by Mr Bean, and this Frodo one makes me laugh every time I look at it.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y84/pippa134/bean9.jpg

It actually looks more like the illustration in my LOTR encyclopedia than Elijah in the role, but just imagine if that got up from the tree in the opening shot. (Shudders at the thought)

Unfortunately, I can't remember where I got this from, but some wonderful person did manips to give the entire fellowship played by Mr Bean, and this Frodo one makes me laugh every time I look at it.LOL -- it's Beanlijah...or Beano! :lol:

Skater girl - you almost killed me!! :lol: WOW!
I wonder why PJ didn't cast Mr. Bean actually as Frodo. It's all there: the large expressive eyes, the pouty lips - and he is ENGLISH! :cool:

from Skater girl:
What extras??? Don't tell me we got short changed on this one too in Europe.
Okay, I won't tell you... :( but that's where it's from.
You didn't miss a whole lot, really -- a couple of featurettes with the director talking about how careful they were of safety issues with two such young actors (especially in the climactic scene), and showing the two young actors very briefly off-screen. The latter is where the photo's from; I've seen it labeled as actually being from The Good Son, but that ain't Mark. :D

On Mr. Bean (the one without a first name, that is ;) ):
It actually looks more like the illustration in my LOTR encyclopedia than Elijah in the role, but just imagine if that got up from the tree in the opening shot. (Shudders at the thought)
I've been writing something about that opening shot, and the thought of this being in it... scary! :lol:

Achila -- "Beano" :D -- Well, you know what that's used for! :haha:

----------
From Dom by way of C4:
Elijah [Wood] has the kind of face that would work on the show--he's always looking shocked.
That part is such an obvious riff on the "one expression" that I'm sure it's a joke. I'm not so sure about "He's always calling," though. :p The part about Billy--If he's referring to the brother Charlie actually has on the show, it'd be a joke, I think (the brother's quite a bit older than Charlie, gets him hooked on drugs and then pretty much abandons him to his fate). But maybe another brother that we haven't met? Separated at birth so they have completely different accents? You never know what's going to pop up in those backstory scenes. :p [Random thought: Orlando's done a couple of movies where he's had to take on an American accent. Do you think Dom or Billy...? Nah... At least, I kind of hope not. They'd lose so much of their charm. :k ]

If Savion Glover is anything like Gregory Hines... whoa! The description of the tap dancing in that recent Happy Feet article sounds as if it should be fantastic. White Nights was one of the very first movies I bought when I got a VCR. Love the dancing (and I admit to having had a bit of a crush on Mr. Baryshnikov at the time :) ).

Achila -- "Beano" :D -- Well, you know what that's used for! :haha: That's why I was :lol:, tg, and some of you know why "Beanlijah" was funny too ;) (although the Bean in question is usually Sean!)

Happy Feet website is live (http://www2.warnerbros.com/happyfeet/), complete with trailer. :cool:

Thanks, Bunnie! I didn't hear a voice that sounded familiar to me though. Well, I thought I might have heard a "Hey!". Did I? :)

Thanks, Bunnie! I didn't hear a voice that sounded familiar to me though. Well, I thought I might have heard a "Hey!". Did I? :)You sure did!

That little bit of Mumbles dancing at the end of the Happy Feet trailer was exactly how Pelagia and I saw Savion Glover dance last night. :cool:

Thanks for the link, BunnieBugs!

C-can't believe I am so-o-o gullible-4


ETA- If Sean Connery can play a Spaniard with a Scottish accent and Christopher Lambert a Scotsman with a French accent in Highlander, why can't BB be DM's brother in Lost?! :haha:

ETA 2-Just finished washing The One Shawl per Honeyelf's instructions. :z:

Just ran across this post on the IMDb message board for "Bobby." It is from someone on the production crew:
by - peruconsabor - 14 hours ago (Wed Nov 16 2005 17:40:06)
I am a carpenter working on this set. They filmed as much possible at the actual hotel. We recreated the hotel, (suites, ballroom, pantry, etc) and are currently filming In the Santa Clarita Valley. They will use The Plaza Hotel in LA for other shots starting tomorrow for a week!

If you live in and around the LA area, maybe you can check it out. :z: Take a camera and autograph book. One never knows who will be filming that day! :cool:

ceefour, ETA 2-Just finished washing The One Shawl per Honeyelf's instructions. :z: Love the name, The One Shawl! How did it turn out? Is it an appropriate size now for a scale double to use or is it still the same size when you received it?

Did yours get a natural washing, tg?

honeyelf: I remember Larry, Darryl, and Darryl, now that you bring them up. Thanks for explaining that!

BTW, do we need a name for the process by which whiteling is converting all these other LOTR characters into Elijah? Frolijafication? Frodomorphosis?? (Same term could be used for Mechtild's art gallery.)

Re Savion Glover: As I said to ceefour, after the first few minutes, I almost stopped thinking of the tapping as dancing, and considered it more as just another percussion “instrument.”

On a more serious note, the current issue of The New Yorker has a review by Adam Gopnik of a new biography of C. S. Lewis. Inevitably, there are some references to Tolkien (whom Gopnik describes as “a genuinely eccentric character”). Gopnik likes the Narnia books for their imagery, etc., but doesn’t go much for the Christian symbolism. He notes: Tolkien hated the Narnia books, despite Lewis’s avid sponsorship of Tolkien’s own mythology, because he hated to see an imagination constrained by the allegorical impulse. Though Tolkien was certainly a devout Catholic, there is no way in which “The Lord of the Rings” is a Christian book, much less a Catholic allegory. The Blessed Land across the sea is a retreat for the already immortal, not, except for Frodo, a reward for the afflicted; dead is dead. The pathos of Aragorn and Arwen’s marriage is that, after Aragorn’s death, they will never meet again, in Valinor or elsewhere. It is the modernity of the existential arrangement, in tension with the archaicism of the material culture, that makes Tolkien’s myth haunting. While I agree with him that LOTR is haunting, I’m not sure that I agree on why it’s haunting. But it’s an interesting thought.

Going off now to try to download the Happy Feet trailer. And then to salivate over my latest pop-culture purchase: Buffy the Vampire Slayer: The Chosen Collection (all seven seasons in a boxed set, oh, joy :) ).

Interesting notes on the book review, Pelagia. I'll agree that Tolkien was "a genuinely eccentric character" (makes me love him all the more :cool: ), and that he disliked the Narnia books partly because they were too allegorical for his taste (also because they kind of mashed different mythologies together in ways he felt weren't authentic). But I think Gopnik has some serious misunderstandings of Tolkien's cosmology:
The pathos of Aragorn and Arwen’s marriage is that, after Aragorn’s death, they will never meet again, in Valinor or elsewhere.
No, no, no :mad: !! Just the opposite! Mortal is mortal -- and that's what Arwen chooses in order to not have her fate sundered from Aragorn's. It's Elrond she's separating herself from. That's why Tolkien emphasizes how bitter their parting is - so bitter that he doesn't let us witness or listen in on it. I think the TTT movie does a bit of confusing on that, when Elrond is describing Arwen's future to her.

--------
Celebrian to Elrond: What?! You didn't bring any of the kids with you? :eek: :haha:
--------

Though Tolkien was certainly a devout Catholic, there is no way in which “The Lord of the Rings” is a Christian book...
No, it's just "fundamentally a Catholic and religious work..." :p although Tolkien didn't expect everyone to read it that way.

...much less a Catholic allegory.
I'd contend that "Catholic allegory" is an oxymoron. But that would take a lot more explaining than I should do here... You're welcome. ;)

It is the modernity of the existential arrangement, in tension with the archaicism of the material culture, that makes Tolkien’s myth haunting.
Hmmm... That's a mouthful. Of course, if he's talking about Arwen and Aragorn, he's mistaken, anyway - although you could possibly shift it to Arwen and Elrond. But, even then, "in Valinor or elsewhere" stretches it a bit too far. JRRT doesn't emphasize it or explain it, but he does provide for an "end of all things" when the fates of the mortal and immortal Children of Iluvitar will be rejoined. That is, Arwen and Elrond are "only" separated until the end of the world.

"Modernity" and "existentialism" are interesting word choices. Tolkien does approach his characters with a modern psychological understanding, which you won't find in most ancient epics. But I don't think he was concerned with modernity so much as he was with truth: this is how people are; this is how the world works. Whether you could call it "modern" or "existential" is beside the point, I believe.

I do think some of the haunting aspect of the story does come from that modern psychological understanding of the characters. We've gotten "inside" Frodo and some of the other characters enough that we actually care what happens to them, which isn't something that most ancient epics aim for.

--------
Anyway... :rolleyes:
--------

No, my scarf hasn't gotten washed yet, naturally or otherwise. The snow stopped during the night. The scarf has gotten worn a few times, though. I don't plan to wear it every day all winter, but this week the temperatures have been in the teens and 20's, not cold enough for a heavy winter coat but just right for my gray cape that looks so nice with the gray scarf. :cool: I can report that the material is warm but light. The first time I wore it, I had it over my head to keep my ears warm. Although my ears didn't get cold, I kept putting my hand up to put the scarf back in place - to find out that it hadn't moved. It's so light that I thought it must have slipped off my head. :)

Sort of OT....

Hmmm... That's a mouthful. Of course, if he's talking about Arwen and Aragorn, he's mistaken, anyway - although you could possibly shift it to Arwen and Elrond. But, even then, "in Valinor or elsewhere" stretches it a bit too far. JRRT doesn't emphasize it or explain it, but he does provide for an "end of all things" when the fates of the mortal and immortal Children of Iluvitar will be rejoined. That is, Arwen and Elrond are "only" separated until the end of the world.
Tg, where did you get this? I know this is the commonly understood view of Tolkien's mythology of M-E. I have believed it myself. But where does this belief appear in the actual text? Do you mean Aragorn's parting words to Arwen from the Tale in the the Appendix? When Aragorn told Arwen, "We are not bound for ever to the circles of the world, and beyond them is more than memory"? I was hoping to find something which showed that characters besides Aragorn shared this belief or knowledge.

I have researched the topic of what the mortal and mortal races could be shown to believe about afterlife from the texts themselves (I don't mean comments by Tolkien in Letters, for instance). Other than Aragorn's last words, I have been able to find nothing conclusive. Even the maiar and Valar seem unable to say what happens to mortals when they die.

The fullest narrative source I could find was in Tolkien's late work, Athrabeth Finrod Ah Andreth (also subtitled, "Of Death and the Children of Eru, and the Marring of Men"), the "debate" between Elven king Finrod and a daughter of the house of Beor, Andreth. In it Andreth does express a belief that Men are destined, in the end, for immortality. It is a belief that comes from lore, handed down through one branch of her family's house. But, she has no surety. She only knows that is an old tradition of unknown origins. Finrod, for his part, tells her he and the Elves know nothing of what happens to mortals, but that the Elves believe their own lives will end with the ending of Arda, to which the lives of their kind are tied.

I have read in secondary literature things like, "it was believed that Men were destined by Eru to live before him, beyond the ending of Arda" (unlike the Elves). But I have never actually found this said in the fiction itself, not in narrated sections or in speeches.

If you or anyone else can point me to specific references, it would be a huge help to me. :z: This is a topic in Tolkien that interests me greatly.

You can PM them to me, if you'd like, since this is not a very Faculty-related topic. :cool: Thanks! :k

~ Mechtild

ETA 2-Just finished washing The One Shawl per Honeyelf's instructions. :z:

:z: :z: :z: CeeFour? How did it go? I'm pratically breaking out in hives over the notion that I may have forgot to give your thourough drying instructions! (I'm too afraid to go back and look.) Is all well with The One Shawl???

From Mechtild:
You can PM them to me, if you'd like, since this is not a very Faculty-related topic. Thanks!
Or we could take it over to the Green Dragon and talk about it more... grovel, grovel... plead, plead...

In fact, I already said too much in this post, so I'm going to move it over there... :z:

tgshaw wrote: Or we could take it over to the Green Dragon and talk about it more... In fact, I already said too much in this post, so I'm going to move it over there...
No you don't!!! This is what the Faculty is for. Good discussions about movie related topics. Tolkiens varied and various meaning(s) depending on who you read, or talk to; found in, or applied to the LOTR trilogy and Middle Earth, is/are exactly what should be and is cussed and discussed on this board.

I am in the middle of the book "One Ring to bind Them All: Tolkien's Mythology" by Anne C. Petty, Univ. of Alabama Press, 1979. Chapter 4 is Trial, Death and Transfiguration. I will jump into this conversation later this afternoon when I finish reading it, but please keep this conversation going in the Faculty. It IS where it belongs. :)


Green Street Hooligans DVD Release Date Announced:
Just in time for Christmas...

http://www.dvdactive.com/news/releases/green-street.html

Title: Green Street
Starring: Elijah Wood
Released: 26th December 2005
SRP: £15.99

Universal Home Video has announced the release of Green Street for the 26th of December, priced at around £15.99. The disc will feature an anamorphic widescreen (2.35:1) transfer, Dolby Digital 5.1 audio, a 'From Hobbit To Hooligan; An interview with Elijah Wood' featurette,a 'Standing Your Ground: The violence of Green Street' featurette, 'A Clear Direction: Lexi Alexander Talks About Her Inspiration' featurette, 'The Making of Green Street' featurette, a One Blood music video and UK and US trailers. Here's the artwork. (Click on the link to see the cover of the DVD. I still can't post pictures here- yet... :( )

Just in time for Christmas... :(Wow -- the last we heard was March :D Of course, that's a date for the UK, but the US shouldn't be that far behind. ETA -- the film is still playing in theatres here so who knows when the release for us will be.

On another note, this had me cracking up today --


NEW YORK - Angus Young, lead singer-guitarist of AC/DC, tops Maxim's list of the "25 greatest short dudes of all time," standing tall at 5 feet 2 inches.

NBA guard Spud Webb, at 5 feet 7 inches, is No. 2, followed by Napoleon Bonaparte (5 feet 4 inches), Naim Suleymangolu (4 feet 11 inches) and Yuri Gagarin (5 feet 2 inches).

The magazine, in its December issue, claims to be helping women "begin a long overdue fight against their genetically determined shallowness when choosing a partner."

Yoda, at No. 6, is the shortest on the list. His height is calculated at 2 feet 2 inches.

Other great short dudes: Martin Scorsese, Jon Stewart, Prince, Kurt Cobain and two of the Hobbits from "The Lord of the Rings" films — Elijah Wood and Sean Astin.

The tallest "short dude"? Pro football player Doug Flutie, at 5 feet 10 inches, who is ranked at No. 24.


Short dudes rule!

No you don't!!! This is what the Faculty is for. Good discussions about movie related topics. Tolkiens varied and various meaning(s) depending on who you read, or talk to; found in, or applied to the LOTR trilogy and Middle Earth, is/are exactly what should be and is cussed and discussed on this board.
On this board, yes, but not in this thread, which is [supposedly] about Elijah Wood ;) . We do get off on tangents, but when an off-topic discussion looks as if it might get substantial, we try to move it somewhere else. (For one thing, I'd disagree that this is movie-related.)

One reason for moving Tolkien book-related discussions to the Green Dragon is that there are some people who are interested in/knowledgeable about Tolkien who never set foot in the Community Cafe, so if we had a great book discussion going on here, they'd never find out about it.


Green Street Hooligans DVD Release Date Announced:
Just in time for Christmas...
Kinda mixed feelings on this. An earlier DVD release probably means it didn't do as well in the theaters as hoped, but it also means those of us who haven't had the chance to see it in the theater will get to see it sooner.

Sorry, txtac, I followed tg over to the Green Dragon to discuss it. It really hasn't much to do with Elijah Wood, I fear, but thanks for making me feel as though it was ok to post that question here. :) Heck, I've never been to the Green Dragon, anyway.

~ Mechtild

Sorry, this is just a flyby--but there is an interview with Elijah in the current MovieMaker magazine (has anyone mentioned it?). It's an expanded version of one we've already seen online from an author who was at the Seattle roundtable with Elijah. It call him "Frighteningly articulate and impressively thoughtful." But it does start off with the fragile Frodo bit and could Frodo survive in our world in these dark times? :rolleyes: Give me a break. But other than that bit, it's nice :)

Alyon, I've been thinking about you. I even clicked your name yesterday to see when you last posted. It's great to see you even "fly by." :k

Thanks for that interview alert, too. This made me laugh, while I rolled my eyes along with you:

But it does start off with the fragile Frodo bit and could Frodo survive in our world in these dark times? :rolleyes: Give me a break.


~ Mechtild

from Mechtild:
Heck, I've never been to the Green Dragon, anyway.
Well, heck ;) , drop in on the quote game while you're there. I think you'll recognize the names of most of the players. :)

Good evening. Just got back from seeing Harry 4. Boy, take off the glasses, curl the hair, pluck some of them eyebrows, and ... looks like Frodo! Of course, it could be just me.

I've a research issue at hand. A friend I was with, who knows I'm obsessed (yes, I'll admit it ;) ) with EJW asked, "Did you know Elijah Wood is directing a movie?" So I started asking questions such as, is it a book to movie, thinking Russian here. He wasn't sure but said he read it on the last page or so of the current People magazine. Does someone have that issue to check it out? I believe I've read in here that that magazine isn't reliable (?) but I thought it might be worth a look. It's late here so I'm calling it a night but would be interested, as always, on current news.

As soon as I read the quote above regarding C.S. Lewis and Tolkien, I immediately thought, "this is one for tg that's for sure." I myself, an amateur Tolkien study, knew it contained false information.

And, yes, please check out the quote game. Maeglian posted the most recent quote which I believe hasn't been found yet. I'm on my way there next...well, maybe after visiting the Harem first. :D

ETA: I was wrong. tg found the quote and posted another. Thanks!

ETA 2: The Happy Feet trailer did play before Harry 4. This time I missed hearing the "Hey" said by EJW. I was too happy to see it on the big screen.

Good evening. I've a research issue at hand. Just got back from seeing Harry 4. Boy, take off the glasses, curl the hair, pluck some of them eyebrows, and ... it's Frodo! Of course, it could be just me.


Jonathan Ross (chat show host) mentioned Dan's eyes and how he could have been 'the guy with the eyes' in LOTR when he interviewed him last week. My reaction was something along the lines of 'No way! How can you insult Elijah in this way.' I can, however, see how the comparison could be made, and I think my reaction has a lot to do with how different the 16 year old Dan is to the teenage Elijah. There is no 'old soul' behind those eyes; just a rather over-excited teenager with little worldy experience (he is still in a single sex school for much of the year), and no inborn ability to read and react to others's emotions or to express emotion on demand. I will admit, though, after seeing Harry 4, that he is getting much better at acting (apart from portraying devastated and broken when he comes out of the maze).

I can imagine younger girls falling for his good looks, but had he been Frodo, I doubt he would have gained a following from the more mature women who
make up a sizable proportion of Elijah's fans.

Tx tac, I thought I'd point out that tg did open a thread in The Green Dragon.

Please come throw some ideas around, if you still are interested. (That goes for any of the rest of you who might be interested, too. :) ) I have needed to talk this through and every bit of discussion is helpful. Perhaps this is an issue that you, too, have chewed on for a long while?


Life After Death in Tolkien's Subcreation (tg's new thread in the Green Dragon):

http://www.khazaddum.com/forums/showthread.php?p=312984&posted=1#post312984


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v382/mechtild/pics%20for%20posts/FrodoBilboGH442.jpg


~ Mechtild

Mechtild - No mattter how many times I see that picture, my heart melts again.

-----

I'm coming to have some respect for Daniel Radcliffe. I think he's taken the opportunity to learn from the Harry role. He said this past week that he plans to stay with it til all the books have been filmed, because in reading the books as they come out he sees so much in them that he wants to do. (Although if his contract doesn't preclude it, I'd love to see him do something different between-times.)

During one of the years that LotR and Harry Potter were in a sense "competing," Daniel was asked who he'd like to work with in the future, and the first name out of his mouth was Elijah Wood - So we know the kid has taste and, most of all, recognizes good acting when he sees it, which makes me hopeful that he'll keep learning and improving. As Harry and the stories mature, I think Daniel is doing the same thing. I absolutely agree that he doesn't have Elijah's gifts, but he does seem willing to do as much as he can with the talent he has (which I don't think is lacking, compared to most actors).

I've never seen any of the Harry Potter movies in the theater. But... Trailer, you say, ShelbyShire? Must ponder plans (but maybe not for a couple of weeks, to avoid opening wekend and Thanksgiving vacation kid crowds).

------------------

txtac, hope you didn't really mind that I took the "afterlife" discussion over to the Green Dragon. If it weren't for the quote game, that forum would be dead in the water, and I'll admit to jumping on any opportunity to get something going there, just to have some good JRRT book discussion. But IMHO if that discussion would get as in-depth as it already is (and we've just started), it would far beyond a lot of Faculty members' interest. And we'd probably have veered off into a dozen new discussions here, anyway, and that one would be lost in the dust. ;) So, please do join us. I haven't read the book you mentioned, and would be interested in your input from it.

But beware: I've read Mechtild's latest post, and I'm gonna hafta get Catholic :eek: in responding to it. ;) (If the book you mentioned gets into how Tolkien's Catholicism affected his fiction, that would be a great addition.)

During one of the years that LotR and Harry Potter were in a sense "competing," Daniel was asked who he'd like to work with in the future, and the first name out of his mouth was Elijah Wood - So we know the kid has taste and, most of all, recognizes good acting when he sees it, which makes me hopeful that he'll keep learning and improving. As Harry and the stories mature, I think Daniel is doing the same thing. I absolutely agree that he doesn't have Elijah's gifts, but he does seem willing to do as much as he can with the talent he has (which I don't think is lacking, compared to most actors). TG, methinks young Daniel is more of a fan than he's letting on. He wore a green velvet suit to the GoF premiere, and every time he opens his mouth, he says something sort of...reminiscent...of something I've heard Lij say. He's also mentioned Elijah several times when it comes to being an example of someone who has been a child actor and successfully continued his career as an adult.

All I know is, he could find someone worse to emulate!

He wore a green velvet suit to the GoF premiere...
:lol:

All I know is, he could find someone worse to emulate!
...and all the people said Amen!!

My reaction was something along the lines of 'No way! How can you insult Elijah in this way.' Ditto! I love everything about The Harry Potter movies ( and books) except Daniel Radcliffe. If only he could act! I could "buy" him in movie 1 & 2 as he didn't actually have to do anything. He's cute enough but okay IMHO not much talent there.

saile

Honeyelf and Shelbyshire, relax, The One Shawl has survived its washing. I didn't notice any lessening of the slight itching around my neck, however. Will this decrease with time and washing? (Don't worry, Honeyelf, I pressed the water out and did not wring it, spread TOS out on a clean towel and rolled that up to express any extra water, and laid it out flat to dry. Do I pass Fabric Care 101?)

Check with your theater, tg, for what trailers are showing before HP. Mine did not have Happy Feet. :(

Young Master and Miss ceefour are impressed with the online trailer for Happy Feet, having seen The March of the Penguins. YMc (getting to be a smart-alecky preteen) said, "So, when Frodo sailed away he went to Antartica and changed into a dancing penquin?"

C4

(Although if his contract doesn't preclude it, I'd love to see him do something different between-times.)

Just dropping in to mention that Daniel Radcliffe is making his first movie outside of HP having just arrived in Australia to film "The December Boys". (http://www.smh.com.au/news/books/widows-windfall-for-teenage-novel/2005/11/17/1132016925495.html?oneclick=true)

Adding this snippet from Inside Film from when the film was first given the go-ahead by Film Finance Corporation.

From Inside Film 24/3/04
The long-nurtured project December Boys, based on Michael Noonan’s novel of the same name, is a poignant tale of four young orphan boys in the 1960s. This tight-knit group of friends find themselves competing with each other for a place in the home and family they all long for. LA-based director Rod Hardy will return to Australia to make the film and Richard Becker (The Real Macaw) will produce. The adapted screenplay is by Marc Rosenberg (Serpent’s Lair, Incident at Raven’s Gate).

I'm not familiar with the book, however, I read an article a few weeks back that said the adaptation will feature a romance with an older woman for Daniel's character that isn't in the book.

By way of interest, as there are a few writers here, the author of The December Boys passed away some years ago without children. When Daniel's casting was announced back in July it was expected that this would result in interest in the book (and film) being distributed internationally and there was some discussion in the papers on who was the actual literary heir. From the article that I linked above it seems this has been resolved.

And yes, I agree that Elijah makes a very worthy model for Daniel to emulate.

Everything is Illuminated is to be released here on Thursday but I haven't seen a whisper of advertising about it "Coming Soon" even in the Saturday papers big entertainment listing spread. I suspect it will only last a week :( before the cinemas are cleared out for GoF starting the following week.

(((Faculty)))

tg wrote: txtac, hope you didn't really mind that I took the "afterlife" discussion over to the Green Dragon. If it weren't for the quote game, that forum would be dead in the water, and I'll admit to jumping on any opportunity to get something going there, just to have some good JRRT book discussion. I’m glad that the Gopnik quote has proved thought provoking, and that you’ve given it a good home. I didn’t think it quite fit in here, since it didn’t relate to Elijah’s performance as Frodo; but it was just too interesting to pass up. (I have to go over to the Green Dragon at some point to find out why “Catholic allegory” is an oxymoron!)

Mechtild: I love that cap of Frodo and Bilbo, too. When you think about it, even though Elijah and Ian Holm have rather limited screen time together (within the context of 10 hours or so of film), what they DO have is brilliant. The “You’ll be all right” scene at the party; the scene at Rivendell where Frodo is looking through Bilbo’s book (one of Elijah’s best moments in FotR, IMHO, and a perfect example of his ability to let subtly shifting expressions drift across his face); the Sting scene; and the scene en route to the Grey Havens. Oh, my goodness. I may have to go watch a DVD. . . .

(I notice that we have an ad for ballroom dancing! Can't decide whether this was inspired by ceefour's and my comments on Savion Glover, or by references to Happy Feet.)

Bunnie, thanks so much for the Happy Feet trailer link :)! *dies of the cute*



And now for something completely different... ---
The Frodomorph studio* proudly presents


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/whiteling/Frodomanips/frodalf_CoE.jpg

the newest achievement ***Frondalf***


~~~~~

... and (for the sake of completeness)


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/whiteling/Frodomanips/fraurons_eye.jpg

```Frauron's eye´´´


:D


* thanks Pelagia for that nice labelling ;)

whiteling: What a great concept for Frauron's eye! As for Frondalf, that may be the strangest Frodomorph yet. There's something about the lack of wrinkles.

(Now we have ads for dance auditions. . . .)

Loved Frauron's eye!

I encourage anyone to come on over to the thread at the Green Dragon. It's good stuff. We're getting into some real deep Frodo/Tolkien discussions.

Hope all is well with everyone. I can't wait to see Happy Feet!!!! :)

Have fun all!

-FT

I went looking around the net this morning to see if I could find out when EII is being released on DVD. Ran across this site, VideoETA, which said it was estimated for February. The funny part is that it still says March for GSH. BTW, it also says that GSH has made $300,000 at the box office. So far, EII has made $1.6M

Now I'm feeling guilty I saw EII with a movie pass; at least I paid for Hooligans.

C4

ETA- Frauron! :lol:

Now I'm feeling guilty I saw EII with a movie pass; at least I paid for Hooligans.Yes, but who gave you that pass...?

We should hardly feel guilty -- the distribution of these films could not have been worse. :mad:

The funny part is that it still says March for GSH. Do you know something that I don't, Achila? Last I heard on the GSH message boards (and, granted, I don't go there much anymore), March was the US release of the DVD, according to the forum administrator. December, of course, for the UK.

Do you know something that I don't, Achila? Last I heard on the GSH message boards (and, granted, I don't go there much anymore), March was the US release of the DVD, according to the forum administrator. December, of course, for the UK.Sorry -- I guess I meant to imply that with the December release in the UK, we were sort of expecting to see a nearer US release than March. That's not funny at all -- I take it back -- that's downright sad. :(

Achilla,
I guess I meant to imply that with the December release in the UK, we were sort of expecting to see a nearer US release than March. That's not funny at all -- I take it back -- that's downright sad.

I agree...the release schedule for this movie has been patchy at best, and, although we in the UK had the opportunity to see it all over London, I don't know about the rest of Britain...

It's not for me to judge...however, if you are truly desperate, than you could always buy this illegal copy, then obtain the legit one when it is released ...

Green Street hooligans DVD Crebain - be warned - probably rubbish recording (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6454620447)


Is it just me that wonders this :-

"How on Earth, do these people get away with advertising obviously pirated DVDs on the Internet without any comeback ???..."

It is illegal of course, but you wouldn't know it, would you !!

But on a different note --

Here's an interesting piece of Elijah trivia, that I ran across whiled noodling around on the IMDB -- there's a scene in Deep Impact that was filmed at the Ambassador Hotel. I believe it's the one where Jenny Lerner meets President Tom Beck in what looks like a kitchen, when he tells her what ELE really is.

So Elijah has already been in a film that has a scene from the real Ambassador Hotel. :cool:

Lady Wendy wrote: "How on Earth, do these people get away with advertising obviously pirated DVDs on the Internet without any comeback ???..."
Most are coming out of China, Taiwan and Indonisia. They do not adhere to any International Convention and it is very hard and expensive to prosecute someone in another foreign country especially when that foreign country is protecting their citizens from what they consider "foreign intervention." Besides, the pirates are not harming anyone physically and they are bringing in hard U.S. currency into a cash strapped economy. To the pirate and their protective country it is a win - win situation. :mad:


Sorry to everyone over on the Green Dragon board. I had a trade show to go to this weekend and I am still a little stressed out and bushed. I will try and get over there sometime this week, but right now- no promises... ;)

Note on "The Eye of Frauron" If you have ever seen Elijah's eyes in living color, they are an electric shade of lighter bright blue with gold flecks running from the iris out in a starburst pattern. See if you can lighten up the color a bit and really make it an electric bright blue. The white area around the iris can be colored in with a yellow gold. It would make the "Eye of Frauron" more accurate. :z:

I went looking around the net this morning to see if I could find out when EII is being released on DVD. Ran across this site, VideoETA, which said it was estimated for February. The funny part is that it still says March for GSH. BTW, it also says that GSH has made $300,000 at the box office. So far, EII has made $1.6MThat's U.S. gross isn't it? EII has only been released in the U.S. but GSH has made a good bit in UK I think. Have to do the exchange rate bit to total it in U.S currency. So I'll beeeeeee back soooooooon.
saile :D

New "eye candy" out and up at A & F:
http://always.ejwsites.net/ps16.html

Haremites, check this one out: http://always.ejwfiles.net/images3/ps16_10.jpg

Uh-oh, txtac, I foresee some heavy right-click-and-save happening on those pics. And lots of cropping. Check the EW-centric LJ's in a couple of days. I bet there are a spate of new user pics (or icons or avatars or whatever they are called).

Thanks for the link! :)

~ Mechtild

That's U.S. gross isn't it? Yes, saile, I believe so.

Achila wrote: BTW, it also says that GSH has made $300,000 at the box office. So far, EII has made $1.6M Now that is very depressing – especially the figure for EII. I wonder what those numbers work out to on a per-screen basis. Do we know how many different theaters TMFKAH played in, in the US? (That number would probably be easier to figure out than the corresponding one for EII.)

Following up on saile’s sense that TMFKAH has made a good bit in UK I found a UK Film Council website that had some box office information. As of October 16 (the last time that I could find the film in the UKFC’s listings), it had made 1,272,238 pounds. At the current exchange rate, that’s about $2.2 million, I think. Here’s the website:

http://www.ukfilmcouncil.org.uk/statistics/boxoffice/ (http://)

And did the movie EVER open on the Continent??

mechtild wrote: I foresee some heavy right-click-and-save happening on those pics. And lots of cropping... a spate of new user pics (or icons or avatars or whatever they are called).
And that's a bad thing? :lol:

I just finished watching Ringers:Lord of the Fans. EW can do a great Fran Walsh Black Rider scream. :D

*still horrified that in 1995 I threw out my Ballentine Books LOTR paperbacks with the purple emu covers that I'd had since grade school* :eek:

Courtesy of TORN:

http://tvnz.co.nz/view/page/411319/630666

C4

ETA-I'm wondering if this is an old article (although it's dated today), as it mentions EW publicizing EII.

Thanks, ceefour, I loved reading that article about EW visiting New Zealand. :k

txtac, no it's not a bad thing. In fact, I think it's inevitable. :D

~ Mechtild

ETA-I'm wondering if this is an old article (although it's dated today), as it mentions EW publicizing EII.It's a new article for New Zealand -- EII is opening there in a few days. :)

Oh Well! After months of looking forward to 25/11 and EII, it seems I am going to be disappointed after all. I already knew that my local cinemas only ever intend to screen main stream comedies or a thrillers that will pull in the teenagers, but I find now that even the arthouse cinemas in Manchester aren't showing it. The only 3 places in all England that have it scheduled are Oxford, Bristol and Shepherd's Bush in London.

I think EII has suffered from being released at a time when there are quite a few marketable movies coming on to the screens, and Elijah just isn't a big enough name here to get it given a chance amongst such offerings. Johnny Depp's The libertine can't be considered mainstream, but at least that got one week before being moved to the late night one showing only slot.

I'll just have to look forward to the 21/12 for the release of the Green Street DVD.

The only 3 places in all England that have it scheduled are Oxford, Bristol and Shepherd's Bush in London.
Skater girl, do you know if that's just for the release date, or if it means they're not going to show it at all? If it's anything like it was in the U.S. (and usually is with "small" arthouse movies), it'll open in different cities on different dates. IIRC, on it's actual release date, EII only showed in two cities.

I hope that's the case there, anyway! Only three theaters total would be awful! :(

Empire magazine's Top 25 Films of the Year list is out --

1. Sideways
2. Batman Begins
3. Crash
4. Star Wars Episode III: Revenge of the Sith
5. Sin City
6. Downfall
7. Brokeback Mountain
8. War of the Worlds
9. Kiss Kiss Bang Bang
10. Serenity
11. A History of Violence
12. Wallace and Gromit: the Curse of the Were-rabbit
13. Million Dollar Baby
14. DiG!
15. Friday Night Lights
16. The Descent
17. Team America: World Police
18. Pride and Prejudice
19. Night Watch
20. Charlie and the Chocolate Factory
21. The Constant Gardener
22. Cinderella Man
23. Everything is Illuminated
24. Hotel Rwanda
25. Kung Fu Hustle

Most cinemas in the UK seem to be chain owned multiplexes that put the smaller places out of business over the years. They rarely start screening a film after its release date, and apart from the odd 20 screen one all show the same films. I checked the smaller independent Manchester cinema for several weeks hence and EII wasn't in the programme, but maybe I will have to turn detective and search out possible other locations.

I think the lack of interest here could also be because Liev Schreiber isn't that well know either, so not many people are curious to see what his directorial debut will be like. He has competition from home-grown talent such as Julian Fellowes with Independent Lies starring Tom Wilkinson, and Stephen Frears Mrs Henderson Presents starring Judi Dench, all much better know to and celebrated by the British than EJW or Liev.

I don't think there is any fear of us missing out on Mumbles though :D

ETA - Maybe the Empire list will persuade the powers that be to put it on here at a later date.

Can't tell for the rest of continental Europe, but in Germany Green Street is only released on DVD; there's no cinema release whatsoever! :(. And I am curious about which cinemas and how many theatres will actually show EII. I reckon I will have to drive quite a distance to get to see it at all. Grmbl.


Thanks, Achila for that list. Two movies isn't too bad, eh?



Help, I am addicted :eek:!! I *had* to create ...

}}} Frelrond {{{

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/whiteling/Frodomanips/Frelrond.jpg




----------

(P.S: Txtac, regarding your suggestion for improvement of Frauron's eye - well, yes... but you can do it *yourself*! Calibrate your computer screen a tad brighter, et voilà! ;) :k)

whiteling- Gorgeous picture of Frelrond. See, you can do great work! My computer is still drawing with crayons. You're the magic one ;)

Achila- Thanks for posting the list. I will post it over on the IMDb EW board. They need some reassurance that the One Lad IS doing a good job after all. TWO movies in the top 25! :)

ceefour- Thanks for posting the article. Evan though the information is dated, it is still nice to know what E. was up to and that he still cares about LOTR and it's cast & crew. It still proves what a kind, generous and loving person EW is. :cool:

Achila- Thanks for posting the list. I will post it over on the IMDb EW board. They need some reassurance that the One Lad IS doing a good job after all. TWO movies in the top 25! :) It's not the One Lad who isn't doing his job, after all. His role selections post LOTR have been almost universally applauded. What happens AFTER he makes the films isn't his doing.

And no, the Box Office for his two most recent efforts don't appear to amount to much, but let's not forget that Roger Ebert gave both GSH and EII 3.5 stars. He's the top movie critic in the country and surely, that means something too.

Achila wrote: His role selections post LOTR have been almost universally applauded.
Ash Wednesday?
I can accept critically acclaimed, but not universally applauded (except by his fans of course).

It's not the One Lad who isn't doing his job, after all... What happens AFTER he makes the films isn't his doing.
The biggest gripe(s) that are cluttering up the board are that:
1. He can not get a good leading role because of his height.
2. He looks ugly now.
3. He looks weird now.
4. He can not get a good leading role because of his (current) looks.


Does anybody know why Green Street Hooligans is not being shown in the movie theaters in Germany? There was that article about Lexi Alexander being an anti-semite that came out a couple of weeks ago. I think that it was just Lexi bashing, but she is German and was part of a German hooligan firm. I wonder why Germany is not willing to show Hooligans?

The biggest gripe(s) that are cluttering up the board are that:
1. He can not get a good leading role because of his height.
2. He looks ugly now.
3. He looks weird now.
4. He can not get a good leading role because of his (current) looks.

Which speaks to the mentality of a good many of the people who post on there. I have never seen more hostile boards than on the IMDB.

Whiteling, you're a wonder! Frelrond is a very handsome young elf. A very handsome, very young - young elf!

Achila, thank you for posting Empire's top 25 list. I've never heard of a lot of those movies so I could be very wrong, but I can only come up with one other actor who has two films on the list: Don Cheadle was in both Crash and Hotel Rwanda. And by the way, TxTac, Don Cheadle is also another "too short" actor! Let's hear it for the short really really talented guys!

Something that made me laugh. I read an article yesterday about the release of the Xbox 360. Apparentley everyone was made to stand in line for the thing, even our One Lad and his big brother. The writer of the article put it this way: even Frodo "Elijah Wood" Baggins was there...
Hmmm, I think someone needs a reality check!

honey!

ETA: I just had to post this, taken in September at the NY GSH premiere. Poor thing! So handicapped by his odd looks!
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/09092005.jpg

It's not the One Lad who isn't doing his job, after all. His role selections post LOTR have been almost universally applauded. What happens AFTER he makes the films isn't his doing.
And, of course, he's been taking roles in "smaller" movies that aren't going to be blockbusters. Does anyone have any idea how the box office takes for TMFKAH and EII stack up against similar art-house, indie type movies?

And no, the Box Office for his two most recent efforts don't appear to amount to much, but let's not forget that Roger Ebert gave both GSH and EII 3.5 stars. He's the top movie critic in the country and surely, that means something too.
Absolutely. One of the big hopes for Elijah when he got cast in LotR was that it would give him the freedom (afterward ;) ) to make the kinds of movies he wanted to, instead of having to crank out an occasional AMTSNBN to keep working and pay the bills. And I think he's been doing just that, and not worrying much about box office.

It would be nice if more people saw the movies, though. I can't fault the EII promotion too much; it was very well (and positively) covered in magazines that cater to movie buffs and indie folks, and that probably was the right target audience for it. But TMFKAH could have used a lot more help.

ETA: Simulposted with several people --

Regarding:
He can not get a good leading role...
I consider EII a great leading role. I take it they're not too impressed with Iggy Popp or Mumbles, eh? (You'd think with that range between characters, someone would be excited about one or the other. :p )

Right now I'm so proud of the town I live in! We kept EII in the local art house cinema for 3 weeks! I saw it there twice, once mid-day Friday, and once on a Tuesday evening. It was well attended both times. :k to the locals for their good taste!

Since we were talking about GSH and distribution and such, I thought I'd mosey over to Dougie Brimson's place and see what he's up to. This was part of his October 8th post -- I was on vacation when this was originally put online, so if this was posted here already, please forgive...

Anyway, as most people will be aware, Green Street has been on release both in the UK and the US for the last month and not surprisingly, the reaction has been wildly different on both sides of the Atlantic.

Here in the UK, despite some of the worst reviews of the year -and thank god for Guy Ritchie who's truly awful movie Revolver took the spotlight off us- Green Street is actually doing reasonably well at the box office. In the US however, things have been tougher. For whilst reviews of the movie have been generally more supportive, the box office results per screen seem to indicate that the number of people walking into cinema's is falling.

This has actually been the source of much debate in recent weeks and I would like to thank everyone who has taken the trouble to mail me and voice their thoughts and ideas about the distribution and PR issues. Interestingly, some have voiced the opinion that one of the problems could well be a lack of understanding of both football and hooliganism at the PR company and I must admit to having some sympathy with this view. I certainly think that in many respects the current approach is at best misguided and at worst, irresponsible. Ideas such as 'Hoolifans' and 'Team Green Street' might well be designed to give the movie a softer edge and encourage fans of the film to become more actively involved in spreading the word, but they are actually providing entirely the wrong impression of what is after all, a movie about a very nasty, dangerous and violent sporting sub-culture.

A number of people have also made the point that the lack of an English voice, let alone a male English voice, might well have had a detrimental effect on the promotion across the pond and I can certainly see why they are thinking that. Lexi is doing a decent job but let's be honest, as a German female she can hardly have or provide a proper insight into the psyche of your average English football lad which is after all, what the movie is really about. A point which I believe has been made at a number of Q&A sessions.

Of greater concern to me is the fact that when it comes to talking in-depth about the realities of hooliganism, some of the things she has been quoted as saying are simply bull*. The majority of mainstream America might have little or no idea about either European sporting culture or the issue of football violence but I have given enough interviews to the US press over the years to know that there are plenty who do and they would recognise that immediately. That has to be counting against us.

For my part, whilst I realise that trying to sell what is in effect a fairly alien concept must be incredibly difficult -even on the back of Elijah Wood and the fantastic festival successes- if it had been up to me I would have gone for broke in America. Not only by sticking with the original title of Hooligans, but by actively going on the offensive and promoting it as a dark and brutal look at England's underbelly. Enough people have made comparisons with Fight Club so why not exploit that? This is the real deal after all.

And as Lock, Stock and Two Smoking Barrels showed, there is clearly a market for low-budget British movies in the US, even football movies as Bend it like Beckham proved -that did amazing business in the US and let's be honest, it was s***e- so why not actively seek it out and target it?

Such a tactic might well have been risky and would certainly have been controversial but as long as you had the people ready and able to confront that controversy head on, so what? If you know what you're talking about, it's always easy to turn anything negative into a positive if only by warning the game over there that the movie provides a glimpse into what might happen in the future if they don't act now to stop it.

This is of course, easy for me to say and let's be honest, I'm neither American nor versed in the art of PR. But I do know my football and I also know what's been flooding into my inbox.


And to continue with refuting the thoughts on IMDB that "Elijah can't get a decent leading role", they've obviously forgotten (as TG said) that the roles he has taken were his choice. He could've easily cashed in on his LOTR success and made a pile of "big films" like Troy or Kingdom of Heaven and see how well *that* worked out.... ;)

ETA -- Honeyelf, you nearly blinded me with that big glossy picture of that weird-looking, ugly, short dude....*thud*

O.T. Has anyone heard anything new about Simian Records lately? I've been puttering around the net looking for Elijah news like everyone else has. He is shooting Bobby right now, so any current news has dried up. I popped over to Simian Records web site to see if anything new has happened yet. Nada. In one of Elijah's last interviews it sounded like he was doing all of the work himself??? :confused: Earlier Elijah said that Simian was going to be up and running by the end of the year. That is just over 30 days away. Shooting Bobby will slow him down a bit, but... Has anyone heard any updates?

I wonder why Germany is not willing to show Hooligans?
I have no idea. Perhaps it is concerned with the football world championship in 2006 here, so no-one wants the word 'Hooligan' to appear, not even remotely. :confused:

Honey, how dare you! Posting a pic of such an ugly guy!! Yuck! ;) :lol:



Dear Americans - have a Happy Thanksgiving!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/whiteling/loriot.gif

And don't eat too much. :p

----------


Oh, and here's another Frodomorph:


°°°Frodowyn°°°

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/whiteling/Frodomanips/frodowyn.jpg

Whiteling, I think we've entered into a seriously strange area of squeesearch. He, er-- she, but she's a he, um,-- the person in the picture is quite lovely. :lol:

Happy Thanksgiving!

C4

Happy Thanksgiving!
I'm thankful for this little hobbit of the Shire, without whom I'd never have 'met' all my friends here, for whom I am also thankful! :k {{{Faculty}}}
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/4352_1024.jpg

Whiteling, I think we've entered into a seriously strange area of squeesearch. He, er-- she, but she's a he, um,-- the person in the picture is quite lovely. :lol:

Hmmm... Does anyone have that screencap of Hannah in TTT handy? I think I see a definite family resemblance. ;)

http://overthebrandywine.com/A1/BrandyHall2/thanksgivingFaculty05.jpg

:k

Happy Thanksgiving Faculty!

oh, and while I'm at it...Happy Holidays from my new Frodoll and (not the official one) Mumbles!!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v638/Shelbyshire/724d0197.jpg

Hey Honeyelf, you haven't fiddled with that picture have you? His eyes look positively green. :eek: But then again, they sometimes do.

I was just reading an interview with Daniel Radcliffe in this month's edition of Empire. He sounds so much like Our Lad, you have to wonder if he hasn't made Elijah his rolemodel. Mr Radcliffe states that he will never get used to premières, and that he "deplores arrogance in anybody" and therefore hopes that he himself has not become arrogant. He also says he was planning to go to some festival in England with friends but somebody pointed out to him it might get tricky once people realize exactly whose tent that is... so he ended up staying in a hotel. It just sounds like something Elijah would say.

Empire also has a whole page that reads "Is there a hole in your life? Is it perchance shaped like this?" ...and there's a big photo of the One Ring, and a small notice saying they are trying to make up for the lack of a Rings installement this Chrsitmas by writing about Narnia and HP. Aw! :)

Hey Honeyelf, you haven't fiddled with that picture have you? His eyes look positively green. :eek: But then again, they sometimes do.
For some reason, when I'm using the Paint Shop eyedropper to "lift" a color from Elijah's eyes for a picture border, etc., it's usually very easy to find green, fairly easy to find gray, and very difficult to find blue. :confused: Must be some kind of stealth technology or something. :haha:

I was just reading an interview with Daniel Radcliffe in this month's edition of Empire. He sounds so much like Our Lad, you have to wonder if he hasn't made Elijah his rolemodel.
We know he has great admiration for Elijah, and would very much like to work with him, so "rolemodel" might not be far off. :) Hard to say whether he's consciously patterning himself on EJW, or admires him because their values and outlooks already resonate. Or a bit of both.

Originally Posted by Eandme Hey Honeyelf, you haven't fiddled with that picture have you? His eyes look positively green. But then again, they sometimes do.

Originally Posted by TGShaw: For some reason, when I'm using the Paint Shop eyedropper to "lift" a color from Elijah's eyes for a picture border, etc., it's usually very easy to find green, fairly easy to find gray, and very difficult to find blue. Must be some kind of stealth technology or something.

The real magic here is that his eyes are so much bluer in person than most photographs can convey. And the blue does have a touch of turquoise in it. I looked through the dozen ;) or so pics I have stored on my hard drive, and interestingly this one seems to come closest to a true representation of just how blue those eyes are.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/original1.jpg

I say interestingly because this is the unretouched version of that famous Angeleno shot, so nothing's been done to it to tweek his eye color, or anything else. Someone in LJ land unearthed the photo recently. I like it so much better than the retouched version that we got in the magazine; he seems more mysterious somehow.

Skater girl

Oh Well! After months of looking forward to 25/11 and EII, it seems I am going to be disappointed after all. I already knew that my local cinemas only ever intend to screen main stream comedies or a thrillers that will pull in the teenagers, but I find now that even the arthouse cinemas in Manchester aren't showing it. The only 3 places in all England that have it scheduled are Oxford, Bristol and Shepherd's Bush in London.

You may be interested to know, along with other Brits frequenting this thread, that Primula Baggins has found the initial release schedule for "Everything Is Illuminated" in the UK...
Here it is :-

Scotland

Cameo
38 Home Street
Edinburgh, EH3 9LZ
Tel - 0131 228 4141
1.30 3.55 6.25 8.55 11.30 (Fri/Sat)

Cineworld Renfrew Street
7 Renfrew Street
Glasgow, G2 3AB
Tel - 0871 200 2000
11.30 2.30 5.30 8.30 11.00 (Fri/Sat)

Ireland

Cineworld
Parnell Street
Dublin, 1
Tel - 00 353 1 872 8444
Fri-Sun 10.30 12.45 3.10 5.30 7.50 10.15; Mon-Thu 10.45 1.10 3.50 6.10 8.40

Queen's Film Theatre
20 University Square
Belfast, BT7 1PA
Tel - 028 9097 1097
Progs Fri 6.45pm, 9.15pm

England

Cineworld Shaftesbury Avenue at The Trocadero
13 Coventry Street
London, W1D 7DH
Tel - 0871 200 2000
Progs 11.20am, 1.40pm, 4.00pm, 6.20pm, 8.40pm

Shepherd's Bush Vue
West 12 Shopping Centre
London, W12 8PP
Tel - 0871 224 0240
Progs 11.10am (Sat/Sun), 1.40pm, 4.20pm, 6.50pm, 9.20pm, 11.45pm (Fri/Sat)

Screen on the Hill
203 Haverstock Hill
London, NW3 4QG
Tel - 020 7435 3366
Progs 3.10pm, 6.30pm, 8.50pm

Vue
Grenoble Road
Oxford, OX4 4XP
Tel - 0870 444 30 30
1.15 3.45 6.15 9.00

The Ozone Multiplex Cinema, Ozone Leisure Park
Grenoble Road
Oxford, OX4 4XP
Tel - 0870 444 30 30
1.15 3.45 6.15 9.00

Cineworld
Unit 1 London Road
Crawley, RH10 8LR
Tel - 0871 200 2000
10.30 1.00 3.30 6.00 8.00

The Showroom
7 Paternoster Row
Sheffield, S1 2BX
Tel - 0114 275 7727
Progs Fri 4.20pm, 6.30pm, 8.50pm

Vue Cribbs Causeway
The Venue at Cribbs Causeway,Merlin Road
Bristol, BS10 7SR
Tel - 0871 224 0240
12.50 3.20 5.50 8.20 10.50 (Fri/Sat)

Vue Leeds Light
The Headrow
Leeds, LS1 8TL
Tel - 0871 224 0240
11.40 (Sat/Sun) 2.10 4.35 7.00 9.20 11.40 (Fri/Sat)

From December 9th it will be playing at the Cornerhouse in Manchester...
This is from the Virgin Movie site here :-

http://movies.virgin.net/

Keep an eye on this site because apparently, Warner Bros, in their infinite wisdom,are going to release this film on a rolling release...an unheard of way of doing things here, as we are such a tiddly place...so, if you don't see your town or city featured here, it may do later on !!

Elsewhere on the Inrenet, here is a short interview with Elijah tellingof his surprise visit to the set of "King Kong" filming, whilst in Sydney, recording his part in "Happy Feet"...
Wood delights Jackson with NZ visit
Elijah Wood has revealed how he made a secret visit to New Zealand to surprise Peter Jackson on the set of King Kong.

Wood planned the trip for a bit of fun, but the actor who played hobbit Frodo Baggins in Jackson's Lord of the Rings trilogy was surprised just how emotional he was when he arrived at the Kiwi director's film studio in Wellington.

The studio was the same facility where Lord of the Rings was shot and Jackson had recruited most of the Rings crew for King Kong, many who were close to Wood after his 18 months in New Zealand.

"I was actually so surprised about how overwhelmed I was because I was walking on the same stage that we used with the same crew," Wood, while promoting his new film, Everything is Illuminated, told reporters in Los Angeles.

"It was amazing and great to go back.

"It will always be such a huge part of my life, that country and the people."

The surprise visit was a spur of the moment trip for Wood as he was in Sydney for two days to do some voice work for his new animated film, Happy Feet.

"I was like, 'Well, I'm going to be down there for two days. I may as well get a flight over to Wellington and spend a week in Wellington'.

"The timing of it was hilarious because I got an email from Philippa Boyens, one of the writers on Rings and Kong.

"She was like 'I haven't heard from you for so long. God it would be great if you could come out and visit'.

"And, of course, at that very moment I was planning on taking this trip and I said 'Funny you should email me because I'm coming out'.

"She freaked out and said 'I'm not going to tell anyone'."Boyens did end up on telling Jackson and his Rings producer wife, Fran Walsh, but the rest of the Kong crew were left in the dark.

"Philippa went on to the stage and asked Carolynne Cunningham, who was the first assistant director (AD) and first AD on Kong, if she could bring a visitor on set and she was like 'Yeah, yeah'," Wood said.
"She was busy and couldn't care less.
"Then I walked on the stage and the reaction from Carolynne was utter confusion and emotion. It was so amazing."

Wood had planned, with two other Hobbits - Billy Boyd and Dominic Monaghan - to make cameos in Jackson's big budget adventure film about the giant ape, but the actors' schedules ended up ruling it out.

"I think early on we had conceived of maybe getting the Hobbits out there - Billy, Dom and myself - to try and do some kind of cameo," Wood said.

"Get stomped on or something or maybe even have us dressed as Hobbits way in the background, but we never got to do it because Dom was super busy on Lost and Billy has been working, so we couldn't co-ordinate schedules to do it."

Everything is Illuminated is a big change from Lord of the Rings in almost every aspect, from the small budget, film location in the Czech Republic to the Coke bottle glasses Wood's character, Jonathon Safran-Foer, wears.

Safran-Foer is a young Jewish American who travels to the Ukraine to find the woman who saved his grandfather during World War II.

Wood, 24, said the journey Safran-Foer takes reminds him of his life-changing decision to travel to New Zealand to make the Lord of the Rings films.

"I left home at 18 and lived in New Zealand for 18 months on my own and it was an incredible learning experience and growing experience," Wood said.
"It was the first time I had really lived as an adult in my life on my own outside of my comfort zone. It told me a lot about who I am and my life."

We just got home from seeing Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire. While I enjoyed it very much, I couldn't help but think of Elijah at Daniel's age, and what he might've done with this role. Dan has certainly gotten better with every movie, but I don't know if his true acting ability has been tested yet. There was one point, though, that it looked to me like he made a very Frodo-esque face -- Frodo's expression when he stands up after fainting outside Shelob's lair, in fact -- and I had to smile at that. As we'd been discussing a couple of days ago, it does appear that young Daniel is watching our Elijah very closely, and taking pages from his book, so to speak. I would bet that a lot of people tell him he looks like Lij. I wonder if he enjoys that?

ETA -- As sort of a corollary to the previous thought, Daniel is now only a few years younger than Lij was when he won the role of Frodo. It's inconceivable that Dan could be Frodo, at least based on what we've seen him do so far.

You may be interested to know, along with other Brits frequenting this thread, that Primula Baggins has found the initial release schedule for "Everything Is Illuminated" in the UK...

Lady Wendy, you and Primula Baggins have made my day. You will have noticed that most of these venues are in the South, but lucky for me, Sheffield is one of the 2 northern venues, and I am off there this weekend to visit my mum anyway (weather permitting). I didn't even know of this cinema existing in what was my home town. So - less than 48 hours to go :)

I feel like a bit of a traitor to EJW - my collection of his works on DVD is no longer complete because I traded Black and White in for a good deal on Johnny Depp in Charlie and the Chocolate Factory. Can I ever be forgiven? :z:

...interestingly this one seems to come closest to a true representation of just how blue those eyes are.

I say interestingly because this is the unretouched version of that famous Angeleno shot, so nothing's been done to it to tweek his eye color, or anything else. Someone in LJ land unearthed the photo recently. I like it so much better than the retouched version that we got in the magazine; he seems more mysterious somehow.
I was going to be right back with this, but in the meantime I did something to Paint Shop (I still don't know what) that made all the menus I normally use disappear. After trying everything else I could think of, and looking under every related help topic in both Paint Shop and Windows, I finally gave up and did a system restore. That got Paint Shop straightened out, but disabled my virus scan! After connecting with McAfee for an update download, I think things are back to normal :confused: :eek: . So this took a lot longer than I'd planned! :rolleyes:

Anyway, here's the unretouched Angelino photo with 7 shades lifted from Elijah's eyes. The two darkest borders, toward the middle of the series, are from his left eye (our right). Since the lighting darkened that eye, the rest of the borders are from his right eye (our left). This is more blue than I've ever been able to get from Elijah's eyes - maybe "unretouched" is the magic word:

http://www.frodolivesin.us/Pics/2d19ff50.jpg


So glad more folks in Britain are going to be able to see EII than we feared! :cool: "Rolling release" is the absolute norm in the U.S. for arthouse-type movies, I'm guessing because (1) most of the theaters that show them have only one screen, and (2) there aren't very many prints.

Wow...thanks, TG, for giving me an excuse to save yet another copy of that photo!


So glad more folks in Britain are going to be able to see EII than we feared! :cool: "Rolling release" is the absolute norm in the U.S. for arthouse-type movies, I'm guessing because (1) most of the theaters that show them have only one screen, and (2) there aren't very many prints.There's another issue. It can cost a studio between $35-50M to market a film, so they need to be really certain that they'll make that back. A big studio can afford that sort of $ and gamble that the film will be a hit. I guess they hope it all evens out eventually, in that the profits made from the hits will offset the investment in the flops. However, an independent film or one from a small studio doesn't have that luxury. They don't have the money to finance the marketing, after putting up the funds to make the film. So that's the reason for the rolling premieres -- if it gathers steam, great, they put it into more theatres. If not, their loss isn't as big and they don't have to make as many prints.

I'm feeling rather peeved at the moment. EII had been listed on a major theatre chain as starting in Australia on 24th November. When I checked the paper for session times, I found it wasn't listed. I've since found out it's only showing at one theatre in Sydney! That doesn't help me - I'm in Perth! :mad:

And, would you believe, they're showing Thumbsucker. :(

Sorry to hear that, Kumari -- it appears that EII has been a disappointment everywhere, and not because it's not a good film!

This was in an article about Daniel Radcliffe, that showed up on a Google alert this morning -- note the last line (http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2005/11/26/1132966000140.html)

Radcliffe, 16, has a role in December Boys, a low budget Australian drama now being shot in the South Australia capital. He chose it because it was the polar opposite to playing Harry Potter.

An extra bonus for him is the fact he's practically anonymous as he goes about Adelaide.

"There has been a bit of speculation about where I am physically in the city, which has been quite funny," he said.

"Apparently there was a (newspaper) hotline to try and find out where I was.

"I was just really tempted to ring it and see what they did.

"It's just funny.

"It's not so much that I think 'oh, why are people doing this' it's just bizarre and strange and funny.

"I have actually been recognised more as (Lord of the Rings star) Elijah Wood than I have as me, which is a compliment."

I suppose that makes them even now, since loads of people think Elijah is Daniel!

Sorry to hear that, Kumari -- it appears that EII has been a disappointment everywhere, and not because it's not a good film! I'm hoping it'll turn up at an Independent theatre, but I'm not holding my breath.

I suppose that makes them even now, since loads of people think Elijah is Daniel! Either way, they wouldn't remain anonymous, whoever they're perceived to be!

I heard that Daniel Radcliffe was doing a movie over here, but I didn't now it was in South Australia. That's only one state away from where I live!

Achila - Loved the quotes from Daniel Radcliffe. :cool:

Kumari --Keep your eyes open for other theaters showing EII on future dates. Because it's a "small" movie, it probably won't open everywhere at once but travel from theater to theater. So don't give up hope yet. (And, frankly, I wouldn't expect to see it at anything other than an independent theater.)

And to continue with refuting the thoughts on IMDB that "Elijah can't get a decent leading role", they've obviously forgotten (as TG said) that the roles he has taken were his choice. He could've easily cashed in on his LOTR success and made a pile of "big films" like Troy or Kingdom of Heaven and see how well *that* worked out.... ;)
I thought I'd mosey over to Rotten Tomatoes and found it interesting. Let's see........
GSH 47% (rotten)/Average 5.5
EII 64% Fresh/Average 6.4

KoH 39% (rotten)/average 5.5
Elizabethtown 28% (rotten)/Average 4.8
Troy 54%(rotten)/Average 6.0 (More of a Brad Pitt movie don't ya think?)
Personally I am glad :D for Elijah's choices. I think they will serve him better in the Long Run too.
saile

Here's an interesting article (http://www.nytimes.com/2005/11/27/movies/27saro.html) about how former child stars are now making the transition to adult actor with greater ease than in previous generations.

Elijah is not seen by Ms. STRAWBERRY SAROYAN as one of those actors that has already "emerged as a master of his craft". He's done the important thing that Ms. Saroyan identifies as that which sets today's former child star apart from his or her troubled predecessors:
Before ...it meant remaining true to type. "If you played a doctor, you always played a doctor." There were exceptions like Elizabeth Taylor and Mickey Rooney, but for many young stars, their one specialty was playing a child. Dustin Hoffman, she believes, changed all that when he opted to do "The Graduate" and "Midnight Cowboy" back to back. "Look at the range," Ms. Dougherty said. After that, "good actors wanted to do something different, they didn't want to do the same sort of thing all the time."

I respect Elijah very much for choosing roles that he is "passionate" about, but look at his movies since LoTR. In Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind he played creepy flawlessly, but while Patrick was a catalyst in the story, he had little screen time. There's been Sin City in which Kevin appeared for perhaps 10 minutes total, and had no lines (though it was an incredibly memorable 10ish minutes!) Green Street Hooligans was plagued with problems, chief amoungst them the backdrop of football hooliganism. And in Everything is Illuminated Liev Schreiber injected the role of Jonathan with enough directorial-Botox to keep a studio full of starlets blank-faced for a season of awards shows! For Happy Feet he'll reverse the ages-old childrens' advice by being heard, but not seen!

As Elijah fans we're happy enough to just see his name above the title, and blissful to see him on screen, but we're hardly in the majority! (Just get a gander at the E-Online poll (http://www.eonline.com/) which asks who our favorite former child actor is; at the moment I type this Elijah is losing to Lindsay Lohan by 8%!)

BTW, one of those former child actors said to be "emerging as a master of his craft" is that other blue-eyed boy - Jake Gyllenhaal. Eljiah's senior by apporximately 3 weeks, he seems to be making the steps that make him an actor to be noticed of late.

Could Elijah's "passionate" choices be hurting his chances? I know, you know, all of us here know that he's got the talent. Even that his choices of role have been ones that must have looked very good between the pebbled covers of a script. I'm pleased that he hasn't appeared in universally panned mass-market stuff like Kingdom of Heaven too! But I don't wan't to see his chances ruined by choosing roles that won't play widely enough. He's certainly unique, but not what I would call "quirky" or "odd".

ETA: I want to see him acting for many, many years to come. And I'll be happy to keep going to the "art house" theater, rather than the multiplex to see him do his thing. If his career lies in that direction, I don't think anyone here will complain. OTOH, his career is rated as "rotten" at that TOMATO place, and I'd like to see him get more credit and acknowledgement for the fine actor we know him to be!

I'll shut up now, and let you all tell me what you think!

honey!

First of all I will add my pennyworth to Honeyelf's comments. I do think Elijah may have been a bit misguided in not taking just one fairly large role in a mainstream film since LOTR, preferably starring with another actor already known to the general population (Johnny Depp, Bradd Pitt etc). Toni Collette was a complete unknown to me until she came on the scene recently as a package with Cameron Diaz for In her shoes. I hadn't even realised I had seen her before in a Hugh Grant film playing a dowdy, depressed single mum. Although it may be hard for some to believe, there are a lot of people out there who never had any interest in LOTR whatsoever, and haven't a clue who Elijah Wood is. Even Jonathan Ross, the film programme presenter, referred to him as that guy with the eyes in Lord of the Rings, rather than by name. I know EJW doesn't want the whole Hollywood thing, but without becoming some kind of name that sells a film, his beloved smaller, independent projects aren't going to get seen and gain him the recognition for his work that he deserves.

I had a near perfect day yesterday. 10 am - ice skating, 12.30 pm - unplanned second viewing of Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire, 4.20 pm long awaited viewing of EII. EII was being shown in a art-house cinema, and I thought it was the perfect intimate setting. The auditorium had only about 70 seats, of which half were taken, which made it feel like it was quite full. I just wished it could have been full of Faculty members all seeing the film together and having a discussion afterwards.

I thought the film was wonderful. Elijah was perfectly cast and did an excellent job (I loved the bit where his eyes well up and he almost, almost sheds a tear), and the other actors seemed absolutely right as well. I have read the book, and after racing to the end to find out what connection there was between Grandfather and the woman they called Augustine, I was left thoroughly disappointed, as it seemed to fizzle out and not be what I hoped. The way Liev had written Grandfather's story seemed so much more satisfying to me.

This was another film, like LOTR, where I kept forgetting I was looking at Elijah. He just was Jonathan, and I loved the way he managed to play the character in a way that told the audience that this awkward, intoverted person knows he is strange compared to the rest of the world, but is perfectly at ease with the way he is. Even from my EJW biased perspective, I didn't think Eugene stole the show, as some critics have suggested. Each and every one of the actors took me on an emotional journey with them, and each stood out in different ways at different times.

I loved everything about the way Liev had put the film together: the stop motion bits, Alex's narrative, the use of music, the scenery, and especially the spoken Russian. This was a film which I know will become a treasured part of my DVD collection. Thank you once again Elijah Wood for taking me to a place I wouldn't otherwise have gone.

Could Elijah's "passionate" choices be hurting his chances? I know, you know, all of us here know that he's got the talent. Even that his choices of role have been ones that must have looked very good between the pebbled covers of a script. I'm pleased that he hasn't appeared in universally panned mass-market stuff like Kingdom of Heaven too! But I don't wan't to see his chances ruined by choosing roles that won't play widely enough. He's certainly unique, but not what I would call "quirky" or "odd". Honey, I know -- believe me, I know! -- but we're sort of assuming that Elijah was even offered roles in "big" films. His agent said that he'd turned down something but who even knows what it was? It could've been rubbish.

I enjoy the fact that directors are asking for him by name -- oddly enough, two actors turned directors -- Liev Schreiber and Emilio Estevez. That means to me that other actors have respect for him, and that's really great. And the more he does a "jewel" role like Kevin and gets a lot of acclaim for it, the more directors will want to place him in roles like that. Yes, it's 10 minutes and that's frustrating for us, but terrific if it leads to more and better in the future.

That said, I fear that his physical qualities may be a hindrance to him. Aside from the "altitude challenged" aspect that stupid Hollywood puts so much emphasis on, he's hard to make...well...not pretty. Look at what Liev tried to do to him in EII and it was still impossible to take your eyes off him. Add to it the fact that he still looks very young and you start to see what the problem is. He's a wonderful actor, and everyone knows it. That doesn't mean he's the right actor for the roles that are currently out there, in which he has to compete with a whole crop of other pretty twenty-somethings.

ETA -- On a lighter note, continuing with our theme about Daniel Radcliffe --

Daniel Radcliffe has revealed that Australian fans think he is Lord of the Rings hero Elijah Wood.

Daniel, who plays Harry Potter, said: "So often people shout out, 'Hey Frodo!' as they think I'm Elijah - who frankly is a very good-looking guy so I take it as a compliment.

"I admit when a couple of people have put autograph books under my nose I've signed them, 'Much love Elijah Wood'. It would be a bit deflating for me if I told the truth and they said, 'Don't bother signing it then'."

Here's the rest of the article for those who are following the confussion...

http://contactmusic.com/new/xmlfeed.nsf/mndwebpages/radcliffe%20im%20not%20elijah%20wood

RADCLIFFE: 'I'M NOT ELIJAH WOOD'

HARRY POTTER star DANIEL RADCLIFFE is having a difficult time as he films in Australia - because local fans keep mistaking him for ELIJAH WOOD.

The 16-year-old English actor is currently filming DECEMBER BOYS on Kangaroo Island, Australia, and is shocked when people believe he is the 24-year-old LORD OF THE RINGS star.

Radcliffe explains, "So often people shout out, 'Hey, FRODO!' as they think I'm Elijah - who frankly is a very good-looking guy so I take it as a compliment.

"I admit when a couple of people have put have put autograph books under my nose I've signed them, 'Much love, Elijah Wood.'

"It would be a bit deflating for me if I told them the truth and they said, 'Don't bother signing it then.'"
_________________________________________________________________

I wonder if Elijah should start signing his name "Dan Radcliffe" in fan's autograph books? Not Elijah's fans, but when Dan's fans mistake Elijah for Dan
Elijah could sign "Dan Radcliffe" as a counter-joke too. ???

NEW PIC's up on Always & Forever

http://always.ejwfiles.net/images/Spec01.jpg

http://always.ejwfiles.net/images/Spec02.jpg

http://always.ejwfiles.net/images/Spec03.jpg (Elijah is being "odd" again)

Is there still any doubt that Daniel is a fan of Elijah's? "Much love, Elijah Wood" is what Elijah himself usually signs.

Now...should we be concerned that people are mistaking him for a 16 year old boy? :eek: I wonder if this is happening to Tobey Maguire as well...(being mistaken for Elijah, that is)

I really hope that Elijah did NOT give Dan an autograph that said "Much Love..." ;)

Elijah has been fighting the "looks younger" thing his entire career.
Being mistaken for another 16 year old guy would erk me (especially at my age...). It has got to bother Elijah just a bit, but he is too polite and professional to say so.

Now who is thinking of making a movie with Elijah and Dan where Dan is Elijah's younger brother?

As Elijah fans we're happy enough to just see his name above the title, and blissful to see him on screen, but we're hardly in the majority! (Just get a gander at the E-Online poll (http://www.eonline.com/) which asks who our favorite former child actor is; at the moment I type this Elijah is losing to Lindsay Lohan by 8%!)

Honey, you don't actually see that as a measure of popularity, do you? I know for a fact that it's a bunch of adolescent girls who are clicking-clicking-clicking the link over and over again. How do I know this? Because I did it myself, last night. :o :D As an experiment, I clicked what may have been a couple of hundred times, and I got Elijah's numbers to move up two tenths of a percentage point, while Lindsay's numbers went down the same amount. They were within 7.8% of each other when I went to bed. Obviously, the preteen fangirls woke up this morning and started clicking again, because Lindsay is ahead of Elijah by a good 20% this morning.

That said, I have to agree with Achila that Elijah's looks are against him for mass popularity; no one would think of casting Elijah in Jarhead, or in Brokeback Mountain, for that matter. I think he could do a fantastic job with the latter, but regardless of whether he could actually learn to rope a steer (which he probably could), or whether there are really cowboys his size (which there undoubtedly are), the public would not buy it, just like they didn't buy him as a hooligan.

I have more to add, but I must run! Maybe I'll add to the discussion later.

That said, I have to agree with Achila that Elijah's looks are against him for mass popularity; no one would think of casting Elijah in Jarhead, or in Brokeback Mountain, for that matter. I think he could do a fantastic job with the latter, but regardless of whether he could actually learn to rope a steer (which he probably could), or whether there are really cowboys his size (which there undoubtedly are), the public would not buy it, just like they didn't buy him as a hooligan.Sadly, part of why they didn't buy him as a hooligan is because even the critics didn't understand that that was exactly the point -- that the least likely person imaginable could become seduced by this lifestyle. I don't know why this was so hard for them to accept :( -- it seemed so obvious to me.

[OT -- When it comes to Brokeback Mountain though, to tell the truth, I'm not sure that I buy Jake and Heath as cowboys either. They both look a little too "citified" for me.]

Going back to the Daniel thing, I was being sort of facetious above, but right there is our answer. The fact that people think Dan is Elijah tells you that the public thinks the One Lad looks like a young boy, and it may takes years before that's no longer the case.

Now...should we be concerned that people are mistaking him for a 16 year old boy?
Actually, the 16-year-old boy is being mistaken for him, which I can kind of understand being that Elijah was all of 17 when he started LotR - and that's still how most people picture him (especially those who shout, "Hey, Frodo! ;) ). Does it seem strange to anyone else to realize that Daniel will very likely be playing Harry Potter when he's older than Elijah was when he did the primary filming as Frodo?

I just hope Daniel doesn't get arrested for impersonating a former hobbit. Wonder what the people think who got that autograph if they read the interview later. :D Now he just needs someone to say (after he hands the autograph book back), "Oh, darn! I thought you were Daniel Radcliffe." :haha:

Another Daniel parallel: Recent interview had him defending the latest HP movie being a PG-13, and not geared toward younger kids. (A nod to the mother I met who brought her 3 young daughters to FotR because she "thought it would be more like Harry Potter" ;) .)

-------------

Dustin Hoffman played 21-year-old Benjamin Braddock when he was 29. Less than 2 years later he was Ratso Rizzo. The year after that, in his early 30's, his young looks worked well in Little Big Man, because it allowed his character to start young and age - although I do have some recollection of complaints that he was too old to play the character's youngest scenes . (Just sayin'...)

------------

ETA: We seem to have given the page an identity crisis. We have LotR ads at the top and HP ads at the bottom. ;)

Actually, the 16-year-old boy is being mistaken for him,But isn't that ultimately the same thing? ;)

Just found this -- a picture someone drew of the Hobbits as Hogwarts students. Note Frodo...


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v236/aquila0212/crossot3small.jpg

from Achila:
But isn't that ultimately the same thing?
For us it might be, but for people whose mental picture of Elijah stops with Frodo, I don't think so. My guess is that Daniel's not being mistaken for the current Elijah Wood as much as for an earlier model that some folks don't realize has changed. :) It's basically a 16 year old being mistaken for an 18 year old, rather than for someone in his mid-20's. I don't think many people would look at the current Elijah Wood and confuse him with Daniel Radcliffe, but a lot of people don't know what the current Elijah Wood looks like.

TxTac said: I really hope that Elijah did NOT give Dan an autograph that said "Much Love..."

For men Elijah signs "Best Wishes...", right Fast Toadfoot? ;)

That said, I fear that his physical qualities may be a hindrance to him...he's hard to make...well...not pretty... Add to it the fact that he still looks very young and you start to see what the problem is. He's a wonderful actor, and everyone knows it. That doesn't mean he's the right actor for the roles that are currently out there, in which he has to compete with a whole crop of other pretty twenty-somethings.

I see your point. Pretty and young is a challenging combination. Probably the same reason he's yet to make People magazines' "50 sexiest" list. The mix of astonishing good looks and apparent extreme youth, which would ironically work for a female actor, are currently working against him. So there is hope, because he won't look that young forever, and he'll eventually age out of "pretty", and into "stunningly handsome."

The Iggy Pop role won't hurt a bit. He's said that it'll require a tremendous change in physical appearance. He's already looking "tougher," having lost that cuddly little puppy tummy for a leaner line.

Aquila again: I enjoy the fact that directors are asking for him by name -- oddly enough, two actors turned directors -- Liev Schreiber and Emilio Estevez. That means to me that other actors have respect for him, and that's really great. And the more he does a "jewel" role like Kevin and gets a lot of acclaim for it, the more directors will want to place him in roles like that. Yes, it's 10 minutes and that's frustrating for us, but terrific if it leads to more and better in the future.

Yes, it really is an excellent strategy while he waits for meatier stuff; be memorable now, building a body of diversified work to recommend him later.

I don't think many people would look at the current Elijah Wood and confuse him with Daniel Radcliffe, but a lot of people don't know what the current Elijah Wood looks like.Er...uh...didn't he say just last year on Conan that he's mistaken for Daniel (and Tobey) quite often?

*sigh*
I fear that Elijah will have to wait until he is 35 before he gets his pick of adult roles ;) :(
I'll bet he could could have his pick of teen roles now if he wanted them. :rolleyes: I know this is not news--but so many actors, especially small ones, who are in their twenties really really want to still be able to play the 16 year old roles. It's a plus in Hollywood. But it's not what he wants....

Glad you liked EiI, Skater girl--and I agree with you..I don't think Eugene overshadowed Elijah. I loved Elijah's Jonathon.

And Daniel Radcliff sounds very likeable. I do sometimes wonder what Elijah would have done with that role. Elijah could lend a little more intensity and otherness to the role. Not to diss DR. Just, I've wondered....

Er...uh...didn't he say just last year on Conan that he's mistaken for Daniel (and Tobey) quite often?
Could be - I don't think I saw that one.

There is an advantage in his being a male actor in that he'll age into more mature looks and more mature roles as time goes on, instead of being washed up when his youthful appearance is gone.

One more thing to add in the discussion about age and looks and whatnot. Both Johnny Depp and Tom Cruise went through this -- it took Tom Cruise until at least his 30s to not look 12, and Johnny was (and is) very very pretty (saw Bennie and Joon last night -- this' what made me think of it) and neither of them had the kind of respect as actors that Elijah has at his age. And look at where both are today. So, to my mind, Lij is making the right choices and doing the things he needs to to set himself up for a long-term career. It's just gonna take a little time.

On another note, the nominations for the Independent Spirit Awards are being announced today :z:

ETA -- EII received no nominations :( Ironically enough, Thumbsucker got a nomination for Best First Feature

Also ETA -- Just announced -- Elijah will be at the premiere of King Kong (and Billy Boyd too) next Monday, Dec 5 in NYC

Frodo or Harry?

Daniel or Elijah?

Couldn't resist posting this due to the recent discussion. Obviously, because of the writing, this was from one of the LOTR Japan stops. I'm not sure which movie though.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v638/Shelbyshire/ebf3bdcd.jpg

Shelbyshire, thanks for illustrating the current Elijah/Daniel discussion with that absolutely apt picture. :D


That was a wonderful review of EII, Skater girl. It makes me all the more looking forward to it. Theatres here will show it from 15th December. Just today I came across the German movie poster:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/whiteling/EII_plakat.jpg


Quite boring in comparison with the one with the sunflower before his mouth. Not much Magritte touch left. *yawn*


I miss Blossom - she's made herself rather scarce lately. Hope, everything is OK.

Honeyelf, I soooooooo agree I'd like to see him get more credit and acknowledgement for the fine actor we know him to be!Thanks for the link to the article. After reading all of it what struck me were these quotes: “Some credit the Nickelodeon and Disney Channel cable networks with creating a major change in career dynamics for the young. Founded in 1979 and 1983, respectively, the networks created shows for the newly defined “tween” demographic, the 29 million children 8 to 14 years old who control about $40 billion on their own annually, and influence tens of billions of dollars more in family spending, according to 2005 studies by the market research firm Packaged Facts.”AndMs. Osbrink said that image was very important for Ms. Fanning as well. “We’re totally moving into the teenage stage for Dakota,” she said. “Down to the MTV Movie Awards, dressing as a teenager. It’s all planned.”Wow. Now I know why Hollywood makes the movies it does. It’s all about HYPE I guess. :eek:

I actually did like the grouping Elijah was listed with much better. “Other former child stars like Scarlett Johansson, Kirsten Dunst (who starred in her first commercial at 3), Elijah Wood and Anna Paquin (who won an Oscar at 11) had no ties to the Disney Channel and Nickelodeon.”

Hopefully Achila you are right, We know Elijah has watched and admires the career of Johnny Depp.One more thing to add in the discussion about age and looks and whatnot. Both Johnny Depp and Tom Cruise went through this -- it took Tom Cruise until at least his 30s to not look 12, and Johnny was (and is) very very pretty (saw Bennie and Joon last night -- this' what made me think of it) and neither of them had the kind of respect as actors that Elijah has at his age. And look at where both are today. So, to my mind, Lij is making the right choices and doing the things he needs to to set himself up for a long-term career. It's just gonna take a little time.I am so happy to see him bypass The Hype. Even though it is THE HYPE that gets some movies made. I DO think he is respected especially among ACTORS.
Some critics appreciate his work, others IMHO have a little LotR backlash going. :confused: Hey, we all remember the critics that didn't appreciate Frodo :( either. IMHO they want him to pay his dues, and more dues. And You do know that LotR and everything (except Orly) associated with it is so NOT COOL with the "tweens" these days.

I keep remembering quotes from Elijah where he says.....I just want to keep working.....something like that. Makes me think he sees the Big picture ;) and has the stamina for a career as an actor. It's just gonna take a little time.Would be nice if weren't so Darn hard. Oh wait....that's life isn't it. I was hoping his would be magical.
Enough with the rambling.
saile

First image from the filming of Bobby!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v32/bunniebugs/Elijah%202/01bobby.gif

That's Lindsay Lohan with him. They look completely era-appropriate, don't they? :)

The photo accompanied this article (http://www.nytimes.com/2005/12/01/movies/MoviesFeatures/01bobb.html?pagewanted=2) about Emilio Estevez's journey to getting the film made. If it makes you log in, you can access it with username: bugmenot77, password: feeble.

Bunnie, awesome pic!!! I saw it over in LJ land just moments ago and waited till you posted it here.

White...I don't think we've seen him in white quite like this before!

Thanks! :)

OOOOOOOOO thanks :k Bunnie. Finally a photo from the film. I love it.
password: feeble.And your password made me laugh. Thanks.
saile :D :D

Is it me, or is Elijah's hair the color it's supposed to be??? Hope hope hope :z:

Do you mean in the Bobby picture? I think his roots look brown, but the ends look black.

Great picture from Bobby, Bunnie. Thank you for posting it.
I wish that he had trimmed the sideburns though. Those halfway sideburns that do not match the hair do not cut it with me. He has always had that problem. If you are going to wear long sideburns, they have to blend in with the rest of your head. The slight shagginess of his hair is also a good touch to show the anti-establishment, pre-hippy days of the sixties. Are we showing our age here, or what?
_________________________________________________________________

Great new article out in the New York Times about the movie Bobby. CLick here: http://www.nytimes.com/2005/12/01/movies/MoviesFeatures/01bobb.html?8hpib

Thanks for thinking of me, Whiteling. :k I'm here - but mainly lurking, as usual.

Thanks for posting the 'Bobby' pic, Bunnie. I'm not sure about those sideburns either, txtac, but he looks very dapper!

Mechtild I finally replied to your PM!!! Sorry for the delay.

De-lurking in a sulk, because I probably won't get to see 'EII' on the big screen after all. :( I just hope the DVD will be readily available in the UK. :z: :)

Thank you, Blossom, I replied to your PM. ;)

~ Mechtild

I wish that he had trimmed the sideburns though. Those halfway sideburns that do not match the hair do not cut it with me. I don't have issues with his usual sideburns anyway (I kinda like 'em), but these almost mutton-chop style sideburns that he's sporting here are perfect for the time period. I spent some time yesterday making sure that I wasn't mistaken about that, and looked up bands such as The Buffalo Springfield, and sure enough, three out of five of the musicians in that band were in full mutton-chops.

Unfortunately, Elijah doesn't have the ability to grow thick whiskers, but like most young men, he can't help but try. So I think it's probably very fitting for his character to be attempting to grow what his contemporaries and peers all have.

As far as his hair color goes, I'm thinking that it's just the lighting, and it's still dyed. It just doesn't look like his natural hair color, but maybe he's gradually lightening the dye until his own color grows back in, or something? Anyone know what Iggy's natural color was when he was young?

Anyone know what Iggy's natural color was when he was young?I thought he was a blond, Bunnie

Bunnie wrote: but these almost mutton-chop style sideburns that he's sporting here are perfect for the time period.

Unfortunately, Elijah doesn't have the ability to grow thick whiskers, but like most young men, he can't help but try. So I think it's probably very fitting for his character to be attempting to grow what his contemporaries and peers all have.
I have to take issue here at least for historical accuracy. Those are not "mutton chop" sideburns. If you want to see "mutton chops" dig up a picture of General Burnsides of the US Civil War fame. He was the one who popularized wearing "sideburns." When you look at his picture, you can understand why. His sideburns look like a chop of mutton. Most people's wearing of sideburns though only constitute a strip of hair in front of the ear. The length of which can show how old and/or conservative you are.

The rules for "The Proper Gentleman's Grooming" went into the dustbin for the twenty somethings in the late 60's and early 70's. The anti- Viet Nam war and anti-establishment (LBJ's presidency) was in full swing as well as the burgeoning drug and Hippy scene. The "properly dressed male" still wore his hair short, oiled and combed. The younger set who were pushing the bounds of the culture at the time wore their hair longer (as long as you could get away with) dry, braided and windswept. Long sideburns were "in" with some going to the full beard. If one wanted to let their hair grow out, it all grew out together. There was no half here and then half there. You let it all grow out together.

For Elijah to have shaggier hair means that his character was letting his hair grow out to show his anti-establishment feelings. Long sideburnes were also being worn, but not this half and half look. If wearing, or growing long sideburns was a secondary afterthought, the top part of the sideburn would be trimmed back to have a consistant and uniform length of sideburn hair. Letting one's hair grow out long was one thing, but to look bad was still something else. Evan hippies wanted to look good. Whoever is in charge of the hairstyling here blew it. I can live with the shagginess and long sideburns. That is accurate, but the half and half sideburns just stand out and are glaringly inaccurate. They need to trim back the top half of the sideburn to match the length of the lower half. A uniform length of sideburn that also blends in with the length of the rest of the hair is accurate and would look much better.

Not to butt into the sideburn discussion, but Ereshkigal, a fan I met in the Movies Forum at TORc (TolkienOnline), but who lurks and occasionally posts here in The Faculty, wrote an article about her fandom experience for a local magazine, read, as she says by persons mostly "un-savvy" when it comes to the internet. Her article was an introduction for them. Eresh is a mom and writer, fond of many others things but a complete Tolkien geek, a fan of the films (although still ticked at some of the things done to her favourite hobbit), as well as following Elijah Wood's subsequent career.

She posted a copy of her article, Hanging out with Texas Hobbit and Lembas Junkie (Published originally in She magazine, November 26, 2005 - Saturday) in TORc's The Reading Room, under Essays.

Here's a link:

http://www.theonering.com/docs/19435.html

The article focusses more on Eresh's experience over at TORc (Lembas posts here occasionally, but Texas-hobbit is a TORcer), but I'll post this excerpt, because a couple of Faculty-ites are singled out in it:

(...) On rare occasion we “come out” in our signature pictures, putting actual pictures of ourselves on the boards, sometimes with an actor from the films (the hobbits are generally the most likely to pose with fans, but I’ve also seen occasional Elves—not Orlando Bloom—and wizards and dwarves and plenty of third orcs from the right). Then I’m usually surprised at how normal we all look, and diverse. Male and female, young and old, of every race and from quite a few countries (Sweden, Australia, Great Britain, and the United States, of course, although I’m the only one from South Carolina that I’ve seen). But through posting, we’ve become a community. We comment if we haven’t heard from one of our group in a while, and every time a hurricane roars up the coastline I get concerned PMs (private messages). (...) I read their fan fiction (Mechtild’s is the best) and examine their fan art (Whiteling’s is magnificent) and visit their websites (TGShaw’s screen capping skills are miraculous) and log on to their LJ’s (Live journals, which I’m far too private ever to do). (...)
Just so you'll know. (Naturally, I like getting a mention, too. ;) )

~ Mechtild :)

That's very cool, Mechtild! I have another friend who recently was interviewed and written about in a Chicago paper, though her article centered more specifically on fandom and slash. How cool to know all these famous people, now! :cool:

Regarding the sideburns, perhaps it's not completely, totally, historically accurate, but I don't have any trouble believing that Elijah's character is only just beginning to head this direction with his sideburns and hair:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v32/bunniebugs/misc/1550821849.jpg

He'd never be able to have sideburns that thick, but we know that he can grow beautiful, thick, long, wavy, luxurious locks of hair.

Um... Where was I?

:D ;)

Oh, wow! Reading Ereshkigal's article (loved its title :D) I couldn't help but being constantly reminded of this very messageboard. It seems, Tolkien-based boards have the same type of caring, loving and really nice people. How wonderful. I reckon, this is one of the reasons I stick to you all, even now where the LOTR films are history. It is such a great place. :k

*bows and blushes* Well, I consider it an honour to get a mention in an American local magazine. I even prepared a thank-you speech. *clears throat*

"Thanks, Eresh!"
:k

I am *really* touched. And it is so great that you and Tg also have been singled out!

Thank you, Bunnie, for posting that album cover. I don't really care for sideburns as a fashion, not extreme ones, so I won't be distraught if EW can't grow them. I love beards though. I've never seen him wearing a beard except in Whiteling's manips. :cool:

Whiteling, that really was a good article, wasn't it? I thought it expressed a lot of what many of us have loved about our messageboard experiences. I loved that she brought up how great it is to be to other people only what we post. I have tried to tell other people about this boon in discussing things online, but they didn't understand. I think Ereshkigal's article would have helped me say what I meant.

For instance, I have had really pithy (and filthy) discussions with posters who turned out to be 18 - or younger (after all, I'm not checking their ID's). Sometimes I'd be floored, once I found out. Had I been able to see that they were "only" 18, I confess that I probably would not have spoken to them the same way. The age factor would have become important to me, even if it didn't matter to them. I would be thinking, "Should I speak this frankly to a person who is one year older than my daughter?" .... "Should I back off in my argument because this person is so much younger?" .... "Is this poster writing off my argument because she considers me a geezer?" Things like that.

Not knowing anything about the people with whom I have posted, personally, has made it possible for me to speak to each with perfect freedom, a freedom I am sure I could not have experienced if we had tried to say the same things in person.

~ Mechtild

I was reading your post, txtac, and was thinking to myself, "Self, I thought boys' hair was longer by then and sideburns bigger?" :confused: Of course, being a mere infant :rolleyes: in 1968, my memory could be fuzzy.

So I went looking and found The Beatles in 1968.

http://images.barnesandnoble.com/images/10260000/10261543.jpg

(Oops! It's The White Album. That won't work!)

How about The Beatles in 1967?

http://images.barnesandnoble.com/images/10260000/10261542.jpg

*C4 starts singing, "What would you do if I sang out of tune,
would you stand up and walk out on me?"*

ETA-Thanks for the link to Ereshkigal's article, Mechtild. She mentions Teremia, who, alas, never took us to the Grey Havens. Texas Hobbit and Lembas Junkie are very clever. And congrats to you, whiteling, and tg!

Thanks so much for linking to Ereshkigal's essay, Mechtild! Can't say about the fic, but she's spot on when it comes to whiteling and tg. Like you, I appreciated her mention of how, on message boards, "No one is prejudged before he writes, because the readers don’t know who the writer is." That's something I value very much.

[completely OT ramble]
Anyone else remember the Harlan Ellison DV collections? I think it was in the original version of Again, Dangerous Visions that he introduced the author of "The Women Men Don't Know" with a, "Here's the best (or best new) female writer in science fiction today" sort of thing. Then, with James Tiptree, Jr's story, the intro was, "If so-and-so is the best new female writer, here's the best new male." I don't have the exact quotes, but it sure read so much to me like, "Well, the girls can get pretty good, but here's the real deal."

I expect Ellison didn't intend it to come across that way, but if he did, turns out the joke's on him. He later found out that "James Tiptree, Jr." is a pseudonymn for one Alice Sheldon. :D Yet another confirmation of my childhood desire to be a writer and write with a pseudonymn. ;)

[/OT]

txtac's sideburns discussion seemed right to me (I thought EW looked a bit too scruffy), but I was born in 1960, so what do I know? :p

Sheryl

On another note, the DVD release date for EII in the US has been announced as Feb 28, 2006. :D

On another note, the DVD release date for EII in the US has been announced as Feb 28, 2006. :D*squee* Awesome.

Too bad Elijah can't grow thicker whiskers, or he'd have this sort of look going:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v32/bunniebugs/misc/B72724.jpg

Hair just a touch longer, and he'd be there.

I agree with Ereshkigal and Mechtild about the virtues of online relationships; thanks to the internet, I have fairly solid relationships with women who are young enough to be my daughters, and even after meeting in Real Life, the relationships remained the same, in spite of the age differences. That's something that I don't believe would happen (at least in my case) outside the internet. It's lovely! :)

Thanks for the link to Eresh's article, Mech! Lovely! My RL friends don't seem to understand my on-line friendships, but they're both equally important to me.

Achilla, Great News about the EII DVD release! I just checked at Amazon, but you can't pre-order it yet. If not now, when? ;)

I thought he was a blond, BunnieIn the search for the perfect sideburn photo :rolleyes: I nearly forgot that I found an album cover (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000005IU1/qid=1133551206/sr=8-2/ref=pd_bbs_2/002-1792956-9674467?n=507846&s=music&v=glance) that seems to indicate that Iggy's hair was nearly the same shade as Elijah's natural color. :cool: He probably bleached it upon occasion, but while I can picture Elijah as a young Iggy, I'm actually having trouble envisioning him as a blond! Like the rest of this film, it should be interesting, to say the least.

To tell the truth, it wasn't his sideburns I was looking at anyway.

C4 whacks herself on the head with her copy of LOTR. No swooning in The Faculty Lounge!

To tell the truth, it wasn't his sideburns I was looking at anyway.Touché, C4! :D For me, it was actually his eyelashes catching the sunlight, followed by his Perfect Profile and the angle of his jaw. *ducks and runs*

:haha:

Touché, C4! :D For me, it was actually his eyelashes catching the sunlight, followed by his Perfect Profile and the angle of his jaw. *ducks and runs* :haha:

Um-hmmm! *whacks self with LoTR boxed set (softcover)*

It is so cold in my computer room....I'm only dipping in here to say hi to everyone and to loudly voice my approval of the Bobby pic. Wow. Gorgeous. I think it would be instructive to look at high school year book pictures of the times. Famous people tended to be a little ahead with hair length etc, I think.?? And then of course those who were really out there as hippies or radicals. I think there was likely some variation going on with style. He looks darn good to me, though. And Bunnie...Beatles. :cool: Very nice of you to find a good excuse to decorate our lounge with lovely, lovely, Beatles :k

I'm looking forward to reading Ereshkigal's article. Thanks for the heads up on that, Mechtild.

Bunnie, do you see what I mean about picturing people according to what they post, not according to their real life selves? Perhaps because of your playful screenname and certainly because of your lively posting style, I not would have imagined you were old enough to have teenaged children.

ETA: Shilohmm, I missed saying how much appreciated your remark. I am PM'ing you.

Honey, I'm glad you enjoyed the article, too. Ereshkigal was a wonderful poster when she was going both guns at TORc. She wrote very insightful stuff in the superb "M00bies Reads the Books" thread, and when she dropped into "Frodo's Kitchen". One of threads she started that really ripped was called something like, "Jackson Absolutely Ruined Frodo". :D She later softened her stance, coming to see the films had a great deal to offer once she was able to stop comparing them to the book.

About styles in 1968, your observation is good, Alyon:

I think it would be instructive to look at high school year book pictures of the times. Famous people tended to be a little ahead with hair length etc, I think.??
This was certainly so, especially in the end of the 1960's. I graduated from high school the last year a dress code was enforced. It dictated things about clothes, hair and make-up. Females had to wear dresses or skirts. Males could not wear jeans or T-shirts, their hair could not grow over their ears of collars; the wearing of facial hair was prohibited (INCLUDING sideburns), their bangs could not touch their eyebrows. Hair was the really Big Issue for males. For females, the Big Issue was skirt length.

I lived in a big suburban area of Washington D.C. I think it took a lot longer for dress codes to be abolished elsewhere. Our styles were ahead of those in Minnesota or Georgia, but behind New York City and Los Angeles. Their styles were behind those of European cities. U.S. film stars tended to be a little behind the times compared to their European counterparts. Only U.S. rock musicians kept abreast of what was considered cool in Europe.

Me, I was extremely cool. I had a "John Lennon" hat, a ton of black eye make-up, flesh-coloured lipstick, and bangs to the bridge of my nose. Oh - and patterned stockings. :D

~ Mechtild

Mechtild wrote: ...do you see what I mean about picturing people according to what they post, not according to their real life selves? ...Me, I was extremely cool. I had a "John Lennon" hat, a ton of black eye make-up, flesh-coloured lipstick, and bangs to the bridge of my nose. Oh - and patterned stockings.
O.K. Where are the pictures! I have my mental picture of this, but I want to see your High School Year Book picture! :haha:

Mech 2. high school ...a dress code was enforced. It dictated things about clothes, hair and make-up. Females had to wear dresses or skirts. Males could not wear jeans or T-shirts, their hair could not grow over their ears of collars; the wearing of facial hair was prohibited (INCLUDING sideburns), their bangs could not touch their eyebrows. Hair was the really Big Issue for males. For females, the Big Issue was skirt length.
Are you sure you're not from Texas Mech? This was our exact dress code well into the 70's. :eek:

Here is a new pic of Lindsey Lohan's 60's look from Bobby (and they call this a "mini-skirt" !!!) http://people.aol.com/people/galleries/0,19884,1135830_8,00.html

Here is a new pic of Lindsey Lohan's 60's look from Bobby (and they call this a "mini-skirt" !!!)

But that's also accurate for the time; short and "mod" but not extreme. The real extremes of short skirts, and long coats and high boots didn't arrive until soon thereafter, and most people didn't wear them. Except for the fashion-forward, like our Mech! :D

ETA: :o That's probably what ya meant, huh, TxTac? Sorry. :rolleyes:

txtac, where I lived was not Texas then, but it is now. (i.e. the Northern Virginia suburbs of D.C.). :D

But that's also accurate for the time; short and "mod" but not extreme. The real extremes of short skirts, and long coats and high boots didn't arrive until soon thereafter, and most people didn't wear them. Except for the fashion-forward, like our Mech!
Lindsay Lohan's skirts would have got by at our high school, but only just. You are quite right about the skirts going up only after that. By the time I was finishing college in the early 70's, the skirts were about as short as they ever got: just skimming over the buttocks, ending just past the underwear (bikini, in those days; thongs were for exotic dancers, worn with matching pasties). Tops were tiny, too, like little string-strapped undershirts in pastel colours, but with no bras. The shoes were all platform-style. It was an extremely, shall we say ... tarty look. When I moved to New York ten years later, the hookers on West End Avenue were still wearing the same outfits.

But, I must disappoint you, honey. Once I left high school and left the Land of the Dress Codes, I never wore a skirt again, except under duress. I inclined towards clunky tops, farmer jeans and overalls from Penney's. I fantasized about wearing hot clothes, but, not being a "little slip of a thing," I did not wear the styles I described. Little blonde hotties like my roommate did, though, making the young men clustered in our dormitory lobby swooooon every time she made an appearance. When my long-legged roommate exited the elevator in her teeny-weeny skirt and her snug, tissue-thin shell-pink tank top, plastered to her perky etceteras, flipping her blonde mane like a latter-day Farah Fawcett as she balanced atop her five-inch platforms, it was as if the young ladies of Beauxbatons Academy had entered the room. There was an audible male sigh, but throatier, like a deep, airy "Guuuuhhh..."

I would have been jealous, had I not found it so sweetly amusing. Men. They're so cute.

~ Mechtild

Now our ads are for poodle skirts and kilts! We're talking about the 60s and minis and we get 50s poodle skirts. If we talk about the 70s and maxis, will we get minis?

Kilts?! This is an Elijah Wood thread, not Billy Boyd. :p

C4

I had a pair of platform clogs, but fell off them and sprained my ankle. :o

Wood turns his whole body into a coiled bundle of neuroses that he never actually lets us see. Jonathan is willing to take this trip, to make this search and to meet strange people and have accidental adventures in his quest. But it's not his thing, really. He's an introvert's introvert. It's a Chaplinesque turn and an utter delight, with nary a trace of hobbit in it.

Squeeeee! The whole review is HERE (http://www.thestate.com/mld/thestate/entertainment/13303157.htm)
Great Googly Moogly, I've read so many bad reviews of EII, I practically wanna send this lovely gentleman flowers! :rolleyes:

Mech said: But, I must disappoint you, honey. Once I left high school and left the Land of the Dress Codes, I never wore a skirt again, except under duress.
Now there you go, Mech. I'd totally pictured you as a skirt-wearer! ;) :D

honey!

Finally, a reviewer who actually saw the same movie I did. :D

Thanks, honey.

Sheryl

Thanks, honeyelf, for the link.

Schreiber...throws the balance of the story off in going to Alex for too many easy laughs.
I don't know that I agree with this, as the book started out very funny, LOL funny, with the darkness of the story gradually taking over.


Spoiler

If anything threw the story off balance for me, it would have to be the change in Grandfather's history.

End Spoiler

Wood turns his whole body into a coiled bundle....

This is especially seen in the shot of Jonathan walking in the train with his arms glued to his sides, yet somehow maintaining his balance. Also, when Jonathan walks around his grandmother's bed, he walks parallel to the foot of the bed, makes a right angle turn and walks parallel to the side of the bed. Very precise and contained. No unnecessary movements. These two little scenes, maybe just a few seconds of screen time, defined MovieJonathan for me.

C4

I pretty much loved everything about the movie EXCEPT THE END!!! :mad: :mad: :mad:

spoilers spoilers

I'm so dissapointed that Alex didn't get to have his bittersweet happy ending! Otherwise Grandfather Alex's death is only half as meaningful, and more than a little bit confusing. It could have been done so simply; the cookie jar and a fistful of money, Lenin-look-alike Papa standing out on the sidewalk with bag and baggage, a letter to Jonathan...Why, oh why did Liev change that, of all things?

[/spoilers]

Please check the Community Cafe Bulletin Board, found here (http://www.khazaddum.com/forums/showthread.php?p=313724#post313724), for an important announcement regarding a new mod for the Faculty.

Bridget is retiring from modding the Community Cafe, and as I will be taking over the rest of the threads, TG has kindly agreed to mod the Faculty. I think she'll do an amazing job, and I'm sure you'll all be thrilled. She'll do a super job.

Welcome to the mod squad, TG! :k :k

(And while I haven't been posting much in the Faculty recently, this doesn't mean you get to get rid of me entirely - I'll still be lurking and occasionally joining in, since I haven't ever tired of the topic. :D )

Welcome to the mod squad, TG! :k :k

Congrats, TG! I suppose this means we'll have to be extra-diligent not to swoon! :haha: Or, maybe - since we've seen so little of you lately :( - we'll just have to swoon a little more often so you'll appear to get us back in line! :k

Is everybody here?

I've seen two more EW films, "Paradise" and ""Radio Flyer." While Don Johnson and Melanie Griffith seem to be panned by the majority of critics, I thought their performances were very good and conveyed the pain of the characters' loss. (But then again, I liked "Phantom Menace" and "Attack of the Clones," so my opinions may be suspect. :haha: ) My favorite moment has to be the scene with Thora Birch and EW on the tower when she drapes her arm over his shoulder.

I needed to keep reminding myself watching "Radio Flyer" that the story is from the perspective of a young boy. So there would be nothing in the fridge but beer and the mother would never be there at all.

C4

I believe, this little fellow is delighted with the news as well:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/whiteling/Forever_young_sunshine.jpg

:) :cool:

Cool, TG! :) Makes perfect sense to me for you to be a mod, here.

...I can't decide whether it means that we'll be able to get away with less, or more, though. :haha:

TG I agree with Bunnie--no one better for the job. You have to be one of the most devoted of all the Frodo fans, and I'm talking about a truckload of really devoted people.

Thanks to all of you who complimented my article. It was fun to write. I actually had both boards in mind, but since TORC was my first home I gave it the credit. Many of the people in my town don't even own answering machines, considering them rude and too newfangled for decent people, so I thought I'd better not get too complicated on the messageboarding thing.

I really do enjoy lurking here. Without you guys, I'd never have realized that the little penguin was Elijah and that his upcoming costar is Lindsay Lohan (not for the same movie, of course---tee hee).

Mech, thanks for posting the link to my article and for using the euphemism "etceteras." :lol: :lol:

Oh, and Honeyelf, like you I'm basking in the glowing review EII finally received. That review was published in out state paper accompanying the news that the movie would be playing this weekend at an arthouse theatre in the capitol city.

Oh, why, why, why this weekend only?!? This is the one weekend this month I cannot possibly get away to see it. Woe is me, to be so close and yet so far.

Such is motherhood.

Oh well, Feb 28 is not so far away.

I found an interesting article/review from someone who loved Everything Is Illuminated the book, and viewed the film with much trepidation. It's a nice comparison:

Is everything illuminated? The curse of "logophilia" (http://www.opendemocracy.net/arts-Film/everything%5fis%5filluminated%5f3087.jsp)

On Topic: Hey, look! It's Elijah Wood as Patrick in Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind. Didn't he just creep you out? Great acting!

Off Topic: :D Check this pic out. It's The One Lad as that guy in that movie, can't remember the name of either. But, gosh, doesn't he look just gorgeous! :D

*ducks and runs*

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v638/Shelbyshire/sunshine04.jpg

Congrads on your new post, tgshaw!

Shelbyshire, you just boiled down the last four year's worth of Faculty posts, and their bi-chameral nature in one post! :lol:

The link is to the "Passion Index" -- it's made up of Top 10 critics lists of the last four years, ranked by % of lists the film appeared on. Notice the top 3...(and no, not the 3 you're thinking of)

http://geninn.net/critics/passionindex.htm

Congratulations, tg! You are a wonderful choice for moderator of The Faculty Lounge. I will try to be good. ;)

Bridget, thanks so much for the work you've done and good luck in your studies.

And, Narya, thanks so much not only what you already have been doing but for what you are yet endeavouring to do. (Shees, that was a mouthful!)

Achila, thanks for that link to the "Passion" list. It is astounding, really, that EW should have been in all three of the top "favourites" of critics, and in the #18 one as well. It's not as though a lot of professionals haven't seen his work.

Shelbyshire, your post was very witty and your pin-up very pretty. :p

BunnieBugs, the review of EII you linked in your last post by the lover of the book was very well-thought out. (But I am prejudiced, since I happen to agree with him. :rolleyes: :) )

~ Mechtild

The link is to the "Passion Index"Got my attention!!!!!

Congrats Tg! I met Tg. I haven't had any interaction with mods to my knowledge in the past online or other.Generally oblivious. Looking forward to your modding...modship....
saile

I haven't had any interaction with mods to my knowledge in the past online or other.
You've met Bridget! (Who doesn't seem to come visit her relatives in Omaha anymore - what's up with that?)

from Ereshkigel:
Thanks to all of you who complimented my article.
Which I haven't had a chance to do yet, so please let me add my compliments. IMHO, it gave non-computer-folks a good picture of what we find in online friendships. And I take special pride in the fact that I have some of Whiteling's artwork on my website. :cool:

I actually had both boards in mind, but since TORC was my first home I gave it the credit.
I feel bad that I dropped out of the chapter-by-chapter LotR discussion there. Didn't mean to do it, I guess I just got busier with other things.

Without you guys, I'd never have realized that the little penguin was Elijah and that his upcoming costar is Lindsay Lohan (not for the same movie, of course---tee hee).
No, that would be Brittany Murphy :p - as Mumble's love interest, that is.

Thanks to Achila for the link to the Passion Index and to Bunnie for the EII review. I agreed with some of the latter, but I didn't really feel the book had been "amputated" like he did. (And I'm surprised that he said the book has two threads - seems to me that it's pretty obviously three. There are even three different kinds of chapter headings to set them apart.)

I wasn't around here over the weekend because I was working on my website. Links to new stuff are on the What's New (http://www.frodolivesin.us/new/) page (what a concept :rolleyes: ). The new Shelob's lair material stops abruptly on the second page - there will be more later in the month. I'd love to get the poor kid (and me!) out of there by the end of the year. Not quite so difficult now that it's getting into my favorite part of the scene. From the looks of things, the Shelob's lair section alone will have close to 1000 screencaps before it's over with :eek: .

-----------

ETA: Well, I guess I just stumbled across my first "mod" experience. I wanted to fix a couple of typos in this post so hit the edit button -- and found myself looking at saile's post. Took me a couple of seconds to realize that everybody's posts have edit buttons now :haha: , so I have to be sure I'm hitting the right one. :p

An interesting and lengthy interview with Elijah here (http://www.timessquare.com/movies/wood/index.html), though it's written a bit oddly. It's five pages long, and doesn't have too much that's new, but there is some interesting stuff, especially toward the end. Whoever wrote it doesn't have a very good command of the English language, however (unlike Elijah). ;)

No sign of Elijah or Billy at the King Kong premiere tonight. Either they weren't there, or they were hiding from all the cameras. :( Too bad -- I was looking forward to some new photos!

NIce interview, Bunnie. Thanks for the link. And thanks for all the past mod work around here, Narya :k . And TG...now you can never leave.... :D :haha:

Just to let our German friends know (and everyone else too, of course!), that Hooligans (and NOT GSH) on DVD was found and purchased auf Deutschland. Ready, steady...SHOP! :D

ETA -- The weather was pretty bad here last night -- I wonder if that's what kept people away from the King Kong premiere (the appearance list was pretty thin, from what I can see, besides the absence of a couple of hobbits, etc.)

You've met Bridget! .............

ETA: Well, I guess I just stumbled across my first "mod" experience. I wanted to fix a couple of typos in this post so hit the edit button -- and found myself looking at saile's post. Took me a couple of seconds to realize that everybody's posts have edit buttons now :haha: , so I have to be sure I'm hitting the right one. :pOf course -Bridget !!! She was a sweetheart. Apparently capable and bright too. I Didn't know she was a mod. Guess you may be busy editing MY posts.
saile :D

Today's poll on IMDb is: Wich movie do you like better LOTR, or Star Wars?
So far it is a dead heat. Please go vote today for LOTR! :z:
http://imdb.com/poll/

________________________________________________________________
Don't know if ya'll caught this on Yahoo news today:

http://et.tv.yahoo.com/celebrities/13258/

(excerpt) Lindsay was given the prize for Big "It" Girl, beating out PARIS HILTON, NICOLE RICHIE and KRISTIN CAVALLARI. "Because being Big in '05 means getting in three car crashes in one year, people!" she joked.
Click on the link for the rest of the article...

I just voted and Star Wars was 65 votes ahead. :confused: :confused: :confused:

from Alyon
And TG...now you can never leave....
Like I was going to? ;) :k

Achila - The U.S. Amazon.com site is also calling it simply Hooligans. They're at the "sign up for notification when it's available" stage, so there's no picture of the cover.

Bunnie - Thanks for the interview link. Is that the first time we've had confirmation from Elijah himself about his interest in Novel with Cocaine? Movie with Cocaine. :p Thinking ahead I guess.]

Here's the cover of the German DVD --

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v236/aquila0212/Hooligans-DVD.jpg

Hmm...they're back to this...no complaints from me!

Me. neither, Achila. Plain "Hooligans" has always been the better title, to my eye and ear.

Hmm...they're back to this...no complaints from me!

tg, I just voted and Star Wars was ahead by a whole percentage point! Grrr! :mad:

~ Mechtild

Thanks for the info about the German version of Hooligans Achila. I think I'm going to opt for that one instead of the UK version. That way, I get not only the better title and cover picture, but also the opportunity to watch Elijah without being distracted by Charlie Hunman's accent. It does have an English soundtrack as well for if I do want to hear Elijah's lovely voice. I can't wait to see this film quietly in my own lounge, alone, without the nervous excitment of it being the premiere, and without having to worry about what hubby and the rest of the audience is thinking about it.

Danke, er, thank you, Achila for that reminder. :) I agree, that cover is much better.

I read a very good EII review in the German film magazine "Filmdienst". For Skater girl: http://film-dienst.kim-info.de/kritiken.php?nr=8036 ;)

I especially liked this part of the review:
With a reserved and shy portrayal Elijah Wood captures the essence of the introvert misfit, and gives the more room for the extrovert personality of Alex. Among them, grandfather acts as crotchety tour guide from another era. In the course of the film, all main characters gain their profile and the affection of the audience. While Foer's book brims with eloquent and sometimes trenchant dialogues, Schreiber takes heart to let speak the facial expressions of his actors, as well as the scant landscapes of East Europe.
Can you tell I'm counting the days till I finally get to see it? :rolleyes:

tgshaw asked: Is that the first time we've had confirmation from Elijah himself about his interest in Novel with Cocaine?
No. In a couple of interviews in the last three months or so, Elijah has said that he was negotiating for the rights to Novel with Cocaine.

In the last interview that Bunnie posted yesterday, Elijah is talking (hinting?) more about wanting to produce and possibly direct. After his experience with actor(s) cum director(s) Liev Schriber and now with Emilio Estevez, I wonder if he is screwing up enough courage to produce and direct his own movie (Novel with Cocaine) too? :z:


Achila That is a better cover picture on the German DVD of Hooligans. Thank you for posting it. I hope that they will use it for the US version too. :z:


http://news.yahoo.com/s/defamer/20051206/en_defamer/overheardcelebritymoviereviewselijahwoodonnarnia

Overheard Celebrity Movie Reviews: Elijah Wood On "Narnia"
Tue Dec 6, 4:10 PM ET

In our latest installment of Overheard Celebrity Movie Reviews, a reader gently eavesdrops on Elijah Wood, the much-respected expert on wildly successful film franchises adapted from beloved fantasy literature, and gives us this sneak preview of a soon-to-be holiday blockbuster:

Elijah Wood after the cast and crew screening of The Chronicles of Narnia at the ArcLight said:"The little girl carried the film. British teeth and all."

So sayeth the prophet Elijah: Disney's epic succeeds because a gifted child actress refused to wait for her date with the Tooth Faerie and bravely seized stardom from the terrifying maw of corrective dentistry.

So sayeth the prophet Elijah: Disney's epic succeeds because a gifted child actress refused to wait for her date with the Tooth Faerie and bravely seized stardom from the terrifying maw of corrective dentistry.
Well, he should know. ;) :haha:

Just a random question that may not be answerable. On the cover of Holligans, why is LOTR translated into German, but not SinCity or Cold Mountain?

...corrective dentistry. When Young Master and Miss Ceefour were to the dentist last month, braces were suggested for both! Double :eek: !!

(YMC has gappy teeth like EW, btw. The dentist strongly recommended braces.)

C4

ETA--Holligans, the Christmas season edition of Hooligans. ;)

I've seen two more EW films, "Paradise" and ""Radio Flyer." While Don Johnson and Melanie Griffith seem to be panned by the majority of critics, I thought their performances were very good and conveyed the pain of the characters' loss. (But then again, I liked "Phantom Menace" and "Attack of the Clones," so my opinions may be suspect. :haha: ) My favorite moment has to be the scene with Thora Birch and EW on the tower when she drapes her arm over his shoulder.I am quite fond of Radio Flyer and Paradise. Although I think RF is the better film, Paradise was the First film I saw after "meeting" TOL in LOTR. Was flipping through channels one day looking for escapism and OHHHHH, there he was on screen, Frodo before he was Frodo. He was soooooo very cute. I just ignore the adults here and enjoy the two youngin's.

On another note, I know there has been some discussion of his new Iggy role. I have not been paying close attention until I saw this article article (http://www.backstage.com/bso/news_reviews/features/feature_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1001614327) with this quoteElijah Wood told The Philadelphia Enquirer he was intimidated upon being cast as Iggy Pop in an upcoming biopic. The actor will have to go through dramatic weight loss to match the singer's skeletal frame at the peak of a heroin addiction…………..
Wood and the already frenetic Myers will also have to up their energy levels--and their pain thresholds--to accurately portray their real-life characters. Pop's stage antics in the late '70s included slathering himself with peanut butter, cutting himself with broken glass, and vomiting on the audience--often all at the same timeSo is anyone ( who :eek: me?) a little bit concerned about this role????? Yikes!
saile

So is anyone ( who :eek: me?) a little bit concerned about this role????? Yikes!
saile
Hey, it doesn't sound as though Iggy is anearly as nasty a character as Kevin, and folks just lapped EW up in that. Actions like cutting oneself or vomiting on stage are surely not as bad as killing people and then eating their bodies (or parts of their bodies).

In my opinion, anyway. :cool:

Seriously, I share the concern of many that EW may not be up for this, if the role is anything more than an itty bitty cameo in which they put him in an Iggy outfit. Looking for pics of Iggy when he was a kid (in case they were going to have EW play him only when he was quite young), I found and read this Rolling Stone interview with Mr. Pop. It's a pretty good article. But, all the more does it make me less than confident that EW could or would do this. I think it would require an actor who could really, really a) study a role (not an EW trademark) and b) throw himself into the role in such a way that he'd be willing to appear in a manner that people would find, well, shocking. Not just some cartoon bad guy who did cool leaps and got his limbs chewed off with flourescent blood effects. I can picture an all-out method actor doing this, say, like Ed Norton, or an actor who was not only method, but who could be very uninhibited when acting, like a Viggo Mortensen. I don't mean that Norton or Mortensen would ever be cast as Iggy Pop; I mean their working styles.

Rolling Stone article:

http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/_/id/5937621?rnd=1133535426096&has-player=true&version=6.0.12.857

~ Mechtild

Seriously, I share the concern of many that EW may not be up for this, if the role is anything more than an itty bitty cameo in which they put him in an Iggy outfit. Looking for pics of Iggy when he was a kid (in case they were going to have EW play him only when he was quite young), I found and read this Rolling Stone interview with Mr. Pop. It's a pretty good article. But, all the more does it make me less than confident that EW could or would do this. I think it would require an actor who could really, really a) study a role (not an EW trademark) and b) throw himself into the role in such a way that he'd be willing to appear in a manner that people would find, well, shocking.

I'm gonna have to disagree with you on this one, Mech. I think that Elijah is fully capable of shocking us. My only concern is whether I'll want to watch him do it!

Part of the difficulty that I think people have in seeing Elijah as Iggy is that they have an image of him. And Elijah's current image is suitable for a young man moving from "talented child actor" to "talented actor." But I fully expect that he'll begin to craft a new image - in fact I think he already is, and we just refuse to see it for what it is, because it defies the image we have of him as "sweet." This young man can swear like a sailor, tell tales of himself being publically drunk, and wax quite profane in ripping apart musical acts he dislikes. Remember, this is the young man whom Liev Schrieber described as being possessed of a strage mix of "innocence, depth, and perversity." (ETA: I forgot to add that he's also not above discussing the more intimate details of his person, such as the One Inequity, and his "Most Embarrassing Moment!" :lol: )

Having said all that, the article you linked was very interesting in that I saw commonalities between the two men:

The interviewer describes Iggy this way: he's warm, enthusiastic, friendly, open and apparently very well-balanced, when you'd think he might be anything but.

and then a fellow musician says this of him: "I didn't know what to expect from him. But he was one of the nicest guys ever. It was like talking to an old friend."

Those both sound like things we've heard people say of Elijah. Liev Scheiber called him "insanely sweet," and Eugene Hutz called him a "total sweetheart."

And then there is this, discussing a very revealing nude photo of Iggy: The words are hard to believe. But looking at the photograph, you believe them; he does look like a genuine innocent... And Elijah certainly has that "innocent" quality about his person.

And more: He giggles, rolls his eyes and makes some rough-sounding guttural noises, all of which makes for a great moment, because, with all he's seen and done, you'd think it'd be impossible to embarrass the man, but here he is, flushing, geegawing and shy. And yet that's always been one of Iggy's redeeming qualities -- his vulnerability. Sounds so much like Elijah!

And then there's Nina, Iggy's wife, describing him: "You know," Nina says after a while, "I love Iggy Pop, and I respect him, but I don?t think I could live with him. But Jim, Jim is sweet and peaceful and romantic; when we're having dinner or making love, that's Jim, and sometimes I'll catch him just looking at the trees and birds. It's endearing and almost childlike, just the way he looks at the world with those big eyes.

It's frightening to contemplate some of the wild, even disgusting antics that Pop has got up to on stage in his younger days being portrayed in a movie. And I'm very anxious about Elijah doing those things. But can he pull it off? I have little doubt!

honey!

The other issue re: Iggy is that Elijah keeps repeatedly saying that the film covers the time he was with The Stooges, in the early days. That doesn't mean the film will even include the heroin addiction and the stage antics of his early solo days. I'm perfectly content to sit back and wait and see what this film will be.

As for research, I don't know that Lij would even have to do any, already being a "huge fan". ;)

Whew! Mechtild, I thought my first mod duty might be removing that link, but I went through the pics (yes, all 84 of them!) and didn't see any nekkid ones there, even though one's mentioned in the article.

a) study a role (not an EW trademark)...
Oh, I really have to disagree with this. I might qualify it by saying that intensely studying the role is a huge EW trademark, but he does see himself as helping the director fulfill his or her vision, so he's going to study the role as the script and the director see it, not as he decides it should be himself (will be interesting to see what he does with this when he starts directing - I'm guessing he has some interesting visions himself). He's certainly not alone in approaching a role that way; Meryl Streep said she specifically avoided meeting a real-life person she was playing until after the movie was shot, because she didn't want it to affect how she played the character. And, as Achila said, if Elijah's a "huge fan," he probably knows quite a bit about Iggy already. I think both Mikey Carver and Jonathan show that Elijah's very capable of creating a memorable character with the director, as he worked with both Ang Lee (very intensively) and Liev on developing those roles.

...and b) throw himself into the role in such a way that he'd be willing to appear in a manner that people would find, well, shocking.
I have no problem thinking him capable of this, either. IMVHO, "The Ring is mine" Frodo is more shocking than Kevin. I haven't seen Hooligans, but I'm guessing there are moments when Matt is more shocking than Kevin, just because he isn't cartoon-like (and maybe throw McPhee into the mix?).

I don't know if I'm going to like this movie, or this role, and EW and the director may not decide to play the character the same way I would (if I knew anything about him ;) ), but I don't doubt that Elijah has the capability to do it. He doesn't pull a character from the same "place" a method actor does, but in some ways I think that gives him a broader range rather than a narrower one.

Well, I hope you all are right.

What 84 pics, tg? I can't remember them; were they in the article itself, do you mean? (Oh, I found the nekkid picture, right on the net, never fear.) I thought the article was more than "PG-13," actually, but posters have linked articles from Rolling Stone in here before. Besides, it was a really good interview, much better than any of the others I'd browsed.)

I hope he can throw himself into it and I hope he will research it. And more than anything I hope the role amounts to something in a film worth seeing.

I thought the article was more than "PG-13," actually,

I always wrestle with that PG vs PG-13 vs R thing, myself. At CoE, one of the mods told me they not only have to check the stuff at the link but the stuff the link links to! :eek: Made linking a bit of a challenge....

I'm with tg on this one. I don't know that Elijah researches the role the way some people would, but I do think he researches his roles now. And he is a director's actor, so part of that "research" is just gaining an understanding of the director's vision. I don't know that I'll like the movie, but I think Elijah can handle the acting challenge. I just hope he doesn't harm his health trying to look like a druggie! :eek:

Totally not identifying with the idea that he can't throw himself into a role people find shocking. I think he'd relish the chance! :D

Sheryl

There's also a difference between portraying a real person and a fictional character that's open to interpretation. In the case of someone like Iggy, he's something of a known quantity. You may not be a fan, but a lot of us know basically who he is, what he looks like, etc., and of course, his fans, like any other fans, are going to demand a spot-on impersonation. Elijah HAS to get it right, and he will because he's a fan himself and understands all of the above.

In the case of a fictional character from an adapted screenplay, particularly a screenplay that's somewhat different from the source material, it doesn't always benefit the actor to "read the book". After all, the film is the director's vision, not the actor's, necessarily, and being contrary on behalf of your character isn't always a good thing. Yes, you guys might argue that if Elijah had read the book, we might've gotten a Frodo who was more...Frodo-like. Or would we? Would Pete and Fran and Phil have altered their characterization that radically, just because of Elijah's contention? I don't truly think so. We do know that Ian and Viggo argued for more dialog and so on from the book but neither of them argued against Pete's "vision". Surely book!Aragorn isn't movie!Aragorn.

And I know we've debated this endlessly, both here and in other threads, but Pete's approach to Frodo *had* to be altered in light of the change in age, at the very least. A very wise, very brave Frodo in the body of a 19 year old boy just would've seemed out of place, IMHO.

I have no problem thinking him capable of this, either. IMVHO, "The Ring is mine" Frodo is more shocking than Kevin. I haven't seen Hooligans, but I'm guessing there are moments when Matt is more shocking than Kevin, just because he isn't cartoon-like (and maybe throw McPhee into the mix?).

Yup, yuh-huh, and amen! ;)

You may not be a fan, but a lot of us know basically who he is, what he looks like, etc., and of course, his fans, like any other fans, are going to demand a spot-on impersonation. Elijah HAS to get it right, and he will because he's a fan himself and understands all of the above.

I always think these things are done more effectively when there is an artful, impressionistic approach which leaves you with the sense that you've seen the real thing. It's like computer animations; the more they look like life, the less real they look if that makes any sense?

Rant warning.

Well, I hope you are right about EW's working style. Having lurked in here for a year and half, I know about his typical approach, with its intuitive sort of "identification" with a character, so that he just "is" the character, dropping into it in a visceral sort of way. "A suitcase actor," they said. He gets in front of the camera, drops into character and there it is: his performance. Off he goes, picks up an Ipod or a Gameboy, and he's out of character. I also know he prefers to just trust, to put himself in the director's hands, not read the original texts for films he is working on, etc.

I know that's worked for him pretty well, but I am thinking that it's time for him to think of taking a little more responsibility for the characters he portrays.

No, I don't think he would have changed PJ's mind about Frodo, but I think EW might have felt better about the characterization, in retrospect, if he could look back and say, "Well, I fought for that point, even if I didn't win it." Also, I don't believe Mortensen and McKellen could have produced the performances they did had they not read the book and teased the text for nuances in their performances, even if it was only to get more screentime. Even staying within the parameters of what P.J. wanted, I think they were able to use a lot of what they conceived for the roles out of their own study and creative thinking.

In that Brad Balfour article, EW said things that made me wish he would consider putting more conscientious thought into his roles. That is, take more responsibility -- even though his own ideas may not prevail. At least he could know he tried, and that he had given an informed argument. I am the intensive thought would have shown in more complex, depthy characterizations, too.


Q: How difficult was it to do this role?

EW: It was a stretch in that the character is odd and still and lives in his own world, but he blossoms by the end of the film. This is definitely different from anything I've played before which is what attracted me to the film in the first place. There wasn't so much research involved. I wasn't really playing the character in any real biographical sense. It was largely based on the text that Liev had written. We created it together.

This leapt out at me. I had always assumed, knowing his typical "I do whatever the director/screenwriter wants me to; I am an instrument" approach, that he had no responsibility for the conceptualization of his performance. "I'm just following orders, ma'am." But here he is saying they created it together.

I would expect that someone helping to create, with the screenwriter, a role in a book-to-film adaptation, would have read the danged book. Tried to read the danged book. Have felt the need to read the danged book. Or have looked on the internet for a Golden Book Classics version of it, at least.
Someone tell me he actually read the book, even just the Jonathan sections.

For LotR, we all know the actors had little say in the scriptwriting or the conceptualizing of the roles. I won't say they had no influence at all, since Walsh and Boyens cranked out revisions daily, but we know that. But here he is saying, "We created it together." That implies a high degree of collaboration with the screenwriter, a screenwriter writing an adaptation of a book. I'm saying, I think it behooved him to read the book.

Reading this also unnerved me:


Q: Are you of Jewish background?

EW: No, I am not.

Q: Was there any effort on your part to research the Jewish experience?

EW: Not necessarily because I grew amongst Jewish people my entire life. There wasn't anything that I felt that my character had that required me to look outside the boundaries that I was already familiar with. There wasn't anything specifically Jewish about the character that I felt like I needed to add to him. There is an empty vessel to him initially, so I didn't feel it necessary and I already had knowledge of the Jewish experiences.

My mouth dropped when I read this response. I'm not Jewish, either, and I have read a lot on the holocaust, on anti-Semitism's history, cultural culpability, had Jewish friends and co-workers, gone to primarily Jewish schools and lived in Jewish neighborhoods. Why does this sound fatuous to me? Or just plain lazy? "I've seen Schindler's List and the Pianist ... Um, I read Diary of Anne Frank for school. And there are quite a lot of people in the film business who have Jewish backgrounds. Some of my best friends are Jewish. I've been to a bar mitzvah. No, I don't think I need any special research for the character. After all, it's not as though Jonathan is a rabbi or anything. How Jewish is Jonathan supposed to be, anyway?"

Jewish enough to write a book drenched in the subject, that's how.

Shees! Look, I'm getting too excited about this, as usual. I meant not to say it here because I know how "stand by your man" this place can be. But doesn't anyone think it's time for this actor to pay more attention to what he's doing when he's preparing for a role? I know he's keen to work with cool directors and make cool films and have a cool time doing it, but, in my opinion, and it's only my opinion, this interview makes me feel like EW needs to grow up as a professional, to take responsibility for the roles he creates and not just do what he's told.

:) I add a smiley face because I'm not mad at anyone here, or even at EW, but, when I read this, I began to feel "seriously impatient" with him, with his professional attitude, that is. For such a mature young person, he can seem awfully unconsidered in some areas. I don't know. Jody Foster showed she was up to learning a few things, even though she had been an excellent child and teen actress, enrolling in the well-known theatre program at Yale and getting a degree. Maybe EW might think of getting some in-depth training in a similar way, with or without a degree. I don't think it would hurt, and he'd look older by the time he was finished, too, which has been something holding him back, being considered for roles.

~ Mechtild

I always think these things are done more effectively when there is an artful, impressionistic approach which leaves you with the sense that you've seen the real thing. It's like computer animations; the more they look like life, the less real they look if that makes any sense?It does make sense. The only worry is that this is a "live" person, as opposed to an historic figure you can take some liberties with. But again, since Lij is a fan, I can't imagine him doing anything he doesn't feel good about.

ETA -- I simulposted with Mechtild, so I'll respond to a couple of the things she's said. First and foremost, the film EII was not based on the book. It was based on an excerpt that Liev read in the New Yorker magazine, so Elijah's reading of the book would've served no purpose in my mind (except to wonder what sort of drugs Jonathan was on when he wrote it -- no offense, book lovers).

As for the Jewish "thing", he said in another interview that he grew up among Jewish people and knew plenty of Jewish people so for the level of Jewishness that Jonathan needed to portray, his knowledge was already sufficient. I am Jewish, Mech, and this aspect of Elijah's "research" was fine for my benefit.

Interesting Rant, Mech! Just a small quibble:

Mech said: My mouth dropped when I read this response. I'm not Jewish, either, and I have read a lot on the holocaust, on anti-Semitism's history, cultural culpability, had Jewish friends and co-workers, gone to primarily Jewish schools and lived in Jewish neighborhoods. Why does this sound fatuous to me? Or just plain lazy? "I've seen Schindler's List and the Pianist ... Um, I read Diary of Anne Frank for school. And there are quite a lot of people in the film business who have Jewish backgrounds. Some of my best friends are Jewish. I've been to a bar mitzvah. No, I don't think I need any special research for the character. After all, it's not as though Jonathan is a rabbi or anything. How Jewish is Jonathan supposed to be, anyway?"

Jewish enough to write a book drenched in the subject, that's how.

When I attended JSF's lecture/interview-thing in April he said that he surprised himself with how Jewish the book came out, as he'd not really felt that much of a connection to his religious heritage. So how Jewish should Jonathan have been?

My husband also attended the interview with me, and when he saw EII he thought Elijah was using some of JSF's mannerisms, but I think what he was picking up on was a general impression of reservedness, a slight remove, an observant quality.

Nor was EJW ever claiming to be doing an impression of JSF. He didn't meent JSF until 5 or 6 weeks into the shoot. And Liev never called on him to do an impersonation. In fact, even had Elijah read the book, we see Jonathan only through Alex's eyes, in Alex's responses to Jonathan's letters, and in the Trachimbrod part of the story. So it's no surprise at all that LS and EW had to pretty much create the character out of whole cloth. ETA: And let's face it, the Jonathan who wrote the Trachimbrod chapters would have had to be a somewhat socially awkward fellow!

Mikey Carver's name was evoked up there somewhere. That was a role where Elijah did a lot of reading up on the social milieu of the era. All of the material was provided by Ang Lee, but EW had to internalize it.

:) Not mad at anyone either. Just debating the point!

honey!

Rant warning

This is the place for it. :D

I know that's worked for him pretty well, but I am thinking that it's time for him to think of taking a little more responsibility for the characters he portrays.

I think he is right to be wary of approaching his characters in too intellectual a fashion. He reminds me of Madelyne L'Engle, who has a very "muse" perspective on her talent. She believes strongly in "serving the story", in the sense of not trying to intellectually control it but letting it lead her where it needs to go. I think Elijah tries to serve the character in the same way L'Engle tries to serve the story - by allowing the character to "tell" him who it is. In my experience, taking too much control can kill that aspect.


No, I don't think he would have changed PJ's mind about Frodo, but I think EW might have felt better about the characterization, in retrospect,

But what evidence do we have that Elijah isn't happy with his characterization? He may see Frodo very differently than we do - for that matter, going on past conversations, the Faculty doesn't have "one" interpretation anyhow. :D

I also think Elijah generally focuses on the movie and doesn't worry about the book, myself. Maybe because that's the policy I'd take in his position. :p I grew up on Disney movies, so I gave up on expecting a movie based on a book to have much to do with the book long years back. :D When it's a good book and a good movie, I just feel blessed to have both, even if they aren't much like each other.

I wonder if on the Jewish thing he just felt people are people and he could get enough understanding from his past experience with Jewish people. But I guess I think some of these things can only be understood intuitively anyhow. You can lay out all the facts for a person, but if they don't get it, they don't get it - and if they do get it, they often get it long before they have all the info. To some extent it's a matter of empathy rather than knowledge.

Sheryl

Just for clarification, I AGREE with honey's comments below. I have NO DOUBT he can DO it.
It's frightening to contemplate some of the wild, even disgusting antics that Pop has got up to on stage in his younger days being portrayed in a movie. And I'm very anxious about Elijah doing those things. But can he pull it off? I have little doubt!honey!
And TgI have no problem thinking him capable of this, either. IMVHO, "The Ring is mine" Frodo is more shocking than Kevin. I haven't seen Hooligans, but I'm guessing there are moments when Matt is more shocking than Kevin, just because he isn't cartoon-like (and maybe throw McPhee into the mix?).

I don't know if I'm going to like this movie, or this role, and EW and the director may not decide to play the character the same way I would (if I knew anything about him ), but I don't doubt that Elijah has the capability to do it. He doesn't pull a character from the same "place" a method actor does, but in some ways I think that gives him a broader range rather than a narrower one.
And I just hope he doesn't harm his health trying to look like a druggie!
saile

I have little doubt that Elijah can throw himself into the Iggy role, either. He's certainly not afraid of shocking people, and I'm sure he will do his utmost to portray Iggy as accurately and fully as possible. I'm sure he's already watched hours of concert footage and read oodles of interviews and accounts regarding Iggy. Now, whether Iggy's fans will accept Elijah in the role, I don't know. It's more likely that he'll be accepted more by people outside the Iggy fandom than inside it. As a huge Beatles fan, I've yet to see anyone portray any of the Fab Four that I thought really nailed it. But show me someone playing, say, Elvis Costello, who I know very little about outside of what he sounds like, and I'd probably be satisfied with most any portrayal.

And this talk about researching the role reminds me of something I once read about Robert Downey, Jr. He had approached acting with a very casual attitude at first, until he won the title role in the Charlie Chaplin biography. Suddenly, he felt the need to research and actually "learn how to act" in order to ensure that he did the role justice. Sadly, I've not ever seen the film (must rectify that!), but from what I've heard, his dedication really paid off. He went from a likeable, fairly competent performer to an actual Actor, worthy of respect from critics, peers and audiences. I think Elijah, for the most part, already has the respect of his peers, but he has yet to win it from the majority of the critics and public. I'd like to think that something like this Iggy role could take him a bit further in that direction, but if not, I still feel certain that he will get there eventually. I'm just sure he has it in him.

Just to change the subject for a moment -- there is a site, www.aimsters.com, which is for Emilio Estevez fans, and Emilio posts on their message board. Here's his post about "Bobby", from 4 Dec --

EMILIO

Sun Dec 4, 2005 6:11pm
64.12.116.7


Hello All,

Not to worry...I will never stop coming by to say "hi"! Amy has created a space that is always groovy and always has interesting comments from the fans. Thank you all for hanging in there with me and for me, during these past few years of little on-screen activity.

"Bobby" is going very well, indeed - managing a cast this large is no small feat and all the actors have come to the field with their "game faces" on! Everyday, I am humbled by their talent and commitment - all the while, working far, far below their usual fees!

Harry Belefonte was an absolute joy to work with and to have one of the "elders" of the civil rights movement in our midst, gave the film set an awesome vibe. Harry performed all of his scenes opposite Anthony Hopkins and the crew would hold their collective breath in awe, as these two artists worked together.

Lindsay Lohan is absolutely stunning and is great in her scenes with Elijah - heartbreaking for sure.

We shot a scene with Sharon and Demi on Thursday night that was nothing short of electric.

Everyday I must "pinch" myself....The hours are punishing and there is little time to do much else, but be present to the work at hand. We will wrap up a few days before Christmas and then start the 20 weeks of post-production.

Hope all is well with you and that this week is fantastic one for everybody.

Regards,

Emilio



PS -- Guess who just got added to ORC?

You all know I love TOL, but I have to admit I share a lot of Mech's concerns about this role. What really brought my concerns to life is the mention of another actor's name: Ed Norton.

I am stunned at this young man's ability. Fight Club, Primal Fear, American History X, 25th Hour--just a few of his movies, and they are all roles that push the envelope of the envelope and still come off as remarkably well done without being ostentatiously acted. For example, in a scene in Fight Club which Norton could have played for high laughs, when the policemen, following the orders of Tyler Durden, must take Tyler Durden's . . . um . . . family treasures, Norton actually has tears of fear in his eyes. In another example, in the movie American History X, the look on Norton's character's face when we, the audience, finally get to see the act that had him sent to prison, in its simultaneous glee at getting to murder a black man so brutally and human in its realization of what he has done, is subtle and complicated and brilliant in a way that few actors ever realize.

Norton could play Iggy Pop in a second and be so believable we would never second guess his portrayal, nor would Iggy Pop fans, I believe. But Our Lad?

If he does this, he'll earn my respect in more ways than one. But with rare exception, I find Wood holds back too much. His role in Ash Wednesday was as close to being phoned in as I've seen, and he was nearly laughable in Black and White, although one could say he was supposed to be the model of white male impotence. Although this wonderful restraint works well with Mikey Carver and, from all accounts, with "Jonfen," it would be disasterous with Iggy Pop, especially in performance scenes.

I also worry, sometimes, that he tries too hard to please, to not complain, to be a good sport and obey the director. Kirsten Dunst talked very candidly about this tendency of child actors, since they grow up in that environment. He seems too anxious to please, often times, and that may be counterproductive to playing someone as professionally obnoxious as Iggy Pop.

But still, I think he deserves props for even trying this role, and I'm curious as to how it will come out. But I have to admit I'll watch it with my eyes squenched shut, the same way I'd watch a car wreck, but I hope I'm pleasantly surprised. If he does this, if he pushes himself this far, I think he'll come away a much better actor. If he hesitates at all, he'll crash and burn.

Which is not an unrecoverable thing, BTW. Think of Tom Hanks' turn in Bonfire of the Vanities.

The one moment in all his films that gives me hopes is also one of the corniest moments in all his films--Stu's outburst when his father dies. I don't like the scene, personally, but I do think for once in his acting career, Wood pushed himself farther than he was comfortable, and that is why that scene can be so moving. So maybe, maybe.

But I wouldn't buy stock in that film.

Mikey Carver's name was evoked up there somewhere. That was a role where Elijah did a lot of reading up on the social milieu of the era. All of the material was provided by Ang Lee, but EW had to internalize it.
Just to let you know, we watched The Ice Storm again last night. (Third time for me, twice for my husband.) I thought a lot of it the first time, thought it excellent the second time, thought it great the third time. Now that's what I call "a really good movie." And Elijah was excellent in it (as was everyone else).

Just to be clear, honey, I never meant to imply that EW ought to be doing impersonations of JSF, when I said I thought he ought to have shown more interest in learning about the Jewish background to the story and the character he was playing. I am sorry that I gave that impression. I was merely taken aback that EW took the Jewishness of the character as so inconsequential.

I certainly won't take EW to task for not knowing how deeply immersed the book is in the matter of Jewish roots and Jewish identity. How could I? He never read it and the film didn't delve into it the way the book did. It was just "background" for the film, rather than the subject matter. The film did more with Grandfather's identity as a Jew than Jonathan's, and book Grandfather wasn't even Jewish. As far as EW was concerned, Jonathan was from wherever Liev Schreiber told him he was from, and, whatever Liev Schreiber said Jonathan was like as a person, that's what Jonathan was like. Who was Elijah to say differently? He was just an actor doing his job, serving the Muse (mews?), punching the old Dutiful Actor's time clock.

But, you know what? I know that EW is capable of turning in an accolade-winning performance, even though he had read the book ahead of time. He showed up at the Sin City shoot having read the books: HERESY! :o EW didn't seem to find reading the book ahead of time a huge problem for him playing Kevin. I am so grateful! I would hate it if reading Sin City ahead of time had made EW's approach to the role too intellectualized, or took away from his "spontaneity".

~ Mechtild

(Oops, did a simul-post; maybe I'll have to recant when I read things.)