Khazad-Dum - The Faculty Lounge -- An Ongoing Elijah Wood Discussion x10

honeyelf

10-07-2005, 08:26 PM

From HERE (http://www.stuff.co.nz/stuff/0,2106,3436735a1860,00.html) a really interesting bit.

While Wood, who is 24, might be a much younger actor, he has nonetheless been making movies for 15 years and also possesses a canny sense of himself. "Elijah didn't do 'The Lord of the Rings' to become a movie star," says his veteran William Morris agent, Nicole David. "Nobody knew that it would be the amazing phenomenon that it turned out to be. He loved the books and did everything he could to get the part."

But while Wood gained respect as an actor for his bravura performance as the heroic Frodo, playing a diminutive hobbit with hairy feet isn't exactly a ticket to leading-man status, especially for an actor who is still transitioning into a grown-up onscreen. "It's not like he bulked up and went romantic in Spider-Man," one talent agent says.

David did recommend that Wood accept several mainstream studio offers, but "he didn't like them," she says. "He does things because he believes in them and loves them." Thus Wood has embraced a range of weird and comedic roles in a series of indie films, including Everything Is Illuminated, Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind, Hooligans, Sin City and Spy Kids 3-D: Game Over.

His next roles couldn't be more diverse: He's voicing a penguin in George Miller's upcoming computer-animated feature Happy Feet; joining the sprawling ensemble in Bobby, Emilio Estevez's accounting of the assassination of Robert Kennedy; and next year plans to inhabit the outrageous punk persona of Iggy Pop. Now that should erase Frodo from moviegoers' minds.

So Elijah has been going against his own agent's advice by turning down mainstream roles? :eek: WOW! That's bold! But I'm glad for it. I would think the less main-stream the role, the more memorable. Most main-stream stuff is pap that you soon forget. He doesn't seem to have made any big mis-steps since Rings, either.

honey!

Alyon

10-08-2005, 02:47 AM

Thanks, Mechtild, for starting the new thread!! And to everyone for the lovely pics!!

I just saw Elijah on the Tavis Smiley show and thought it was great. Tavis is a serious, politico guy--I knew this from his radio program--so I wondered how Elijah would fit into his TV show. It was a half hour show--the first half was a man who wrote a book about the increasing segregation in American schools. Then Elijah. It was great because this was Elijah answering serious questions, not just having to repeat stories to try to get a laugh like on a regular talk show. Though I enjoy those very much, this was a nice change. He seemed very comfortable in this situation. He was articulate and intelligent and mature and I kept thinking it must be much like a print interview during which he is asked more serious questions. Tavis asked him what he learned about Jewish culture ...things we have read him give answers to--but it was interesting watching, because it is different than a Leno or Conan. It must be more like interviewing him in print, where he listens closely and answers seriously (and, of course, with charm). Very nice. It's possible it will show up on the Tavis Smiley website (probably accessed through PBS.org) because they did say for more info on todays show, go to the website, though possibly that might be just for standard bio material.
He had a cold (still) and looked very very lovely, in tie and blue shirt. A clip from Eil was shown (from the train), and I was surprised that at the end they showed the bit from the end of Fellowship with Sam and Frodo contemplating their journey into MOrdor, and wondering if they would ever see the others again. Loved that :)

Sharpe's Girl

10-08-2005, 08:39 AM

I find this comment to be, well, wrong:

"Nobody knew that it would be the amazing phenomenon that it turned out to be. He loved the books and did everything he could to get the part."

Everyone in Hollywood (and England, Australia, and NZ) knew darn well that LotR was a potential blockbuster. Yes, it was not a definite, at least until we saw what PJ was capable of producing, but why else do you think everyone was competing to get cast? I remember the IGN interview with Dom, when he talks about gettting the call from his agent that he got the part of Merry while he was in a van full of castmembers of the TV movie he was filming. After he got off the cell phone, he told them that he got LotR, and he could practically feel the waves of jealousy coming off them, since they had all auditioned for it as well.

Also, EW still has never read the books, so how could he love them? The script, yes. Doing everything he could to get the part, also yes. Loving the LotR books? Not really possible without reading them, so don't try to tell us that he did, Ms. Agent.

Not that I'm knocking his decision to avoid them while filming--I recently saw a rerun of the Morgan Freeman "Inside the Actors Studio," and one question the moderator asked him (in reference to the short story behind "The Shawshank Redemption") was "Do you read the source material when cast in a film adaptation?" His immediate response was, "Never. I always trust the script, because the script is the source for the film." I completely understand that for an actor like Freeman (and, I believe, Elijah), who trusts the director and will follow them to the letter.

It's something that the actors in the Golden Era of Hollywood did without questioning, but back then, the director, writers, and actors were all subordinate to the producers and studio heads, who held ultimate control over all productions in their studios. (I personally think that PJ is a Kiwi LB Mayer [the first "M" in MGM] in his rather vast operation in Wellington. He's got Weta Workshop and Digital and his other frequent collaborators behind the scenes, and just casts the roles from outside his "studio.")

Mechtild

10-08-2005, 09:30 AM

Whiteling, Honeyelf, GREAT pic spam. And Shilohmm, I think the shots you chose to post together are an uncanny match in expression. Thank you!

Alyon, I wish they had broadcast the Tavis Smiley show here. It sounds like just the sort of interview I would have loved. If you see that it is being hosted on the PBS site, even in transcript, please let us know.

Sharpe's Girl, I noticed that discrepancy about "because he loved the books," too. Still, I thought it was a good article over all. And I appreciated your astute post very much.

Everyone in Hollywood (and England, Australia, and NZ) knew darn well that LotR was a potential blockbuster. Yes, it was not a definite, at least until we saw what PJ was capable of producing, but why else do you think everyone was competing to get cast?
But did they all think it would be a blockbuster? I think they were hot to be in it because it was such a huge classic, period. If the film turned out to be good, it, too, would be a classic -- no matter how wide or narrow its commercial appeal.

Personally, when I heard they were filming the book, I was certain nothing good would be made from it. I don't know why everyone else should be so sure it would be. But, if I were an actor and I knew I had a chance to be in something that might be great, a real keeper for the ages, I would certainly want to be in it, just in case.

There is no book comparably venerated and cherished that I can think of (other than LotR) that has not yet been made into a decent film at least once, but I will try to make an illustration. Growing up, after deciding I wanted to be an actress, one of my sorrows was that the bible movie era was over, because I thought I would be a natural for that genre (stop that laughing! :D ). I suppose that would be comparable. With that in mind, if I had heard someone were going to do a new adaptation of one of the gospels, I would have done everything I could to be in it -- even if I knew the director was someone I had barely heard of, working out of a country that I didn't even know had a film industry, who had done a string of horror films I would never have paid to watch, who had done one arty film that I had liked, but which was a very, very small project. Would I expect the film he directed to be good? Possibly. That it would be a blockbuster? Probably not, but I wouldn't care. If someone were doing a new bible movie, I would want to be in it -- even as a walk-on -- just because I loved the source material and the genre.

I would make an exception, though, if Mel Gibson were directing it. ;)

~ Mechtild

BunnieBugs

10-08-2005, 09:39 AM

Sharpe's Girl, I think Elijah's agent was just confused or forgetful; Elijah had read and loved The Hobbit, which is what made him go for the part. He had, but had never read, LOTR, and he always intended to do so... I guess he got about halfway and was so deep into filming that he stopped.

There is still some debate as to whether he has now finally finished them. He was quoted somewhere as saying he had, I believe, but you know how even quotes can go awry, so I'm not really sure about it. I wonder if he read EII after the fact?

As for it's potential to be a phenomenon: sure, the potential existed, but how many people really believed it would be? Remember how hard a time PJ had in selling the darn thing? Remember how badly Ralph Bakshi's version bombed in the 70's? I don't think anyone could have predicted exactly how HUGE (or, "massive" in Elijah's own lexicon) these films would turn out to be!

While I'm here, a present for the new thread:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v32/bunniebugs/Elijah/flower12.jpg

I can't remember whether anyone posted one of these over at The Lounge, or not, but there is a whole series that was taken in Venice in early September, and they're just lovely. I believe there are more up over at the Hugs Haven.

Mechtild

10-08-2005, 10:26 AM

Good point Bunnie, about how hard it was for PJ to sell the project. Hollywood was precisely not convinced the films would be a hit. All the more does it stand out that actors were keen to be in it. No to mention art directors. Remember how quickly Howe and Lee signed on, according to their own testimonies on the DVD extras? They were huge fans and did not want to miss the opportunity to be in on the project, whether it succeeded or failed.

Oh, and I had forgotten completely that EW had read and enjoyed The Hobbit. Another good point.

Nice sunflower, too. :cool:

~ Mechtild

honeyelf

10-08-2005, 11:34 AM

If anyone wants to see the Tavis Smalley clip, it's in the elijahnewsdaily user group at LiveJournal.

honey!

Linwë

10-08-2005, 01:30 PM

If anyone wants to see the Tavis Smalley clip, it's in the elijahnewsdaily user group at LiveJournal.

honey!

And here's the transcript (http://www.pbs.org/kcet/tavissmiley/archive/200510/20051007_transcript.html).

Sharpe's Girl

10-08-2005, 04:29 PM

I don't know. I really think that the potential for blockbuster status for LotR was always there, and a definite possibility that the suits in Hollywood were aware of. I know that (admittedly fanboy) websites like AICN and (later) TORn were championing the films as the potential Next Big Thing way back in 1998-9, before filming even began, when the initial two-film script was leaked to the Internet.

The problem was that nobody (except New Line) wanted to spring the $150+ million that the (then) two-film project demanded, for fear that the first film would be a fanboy success but mainstream bust (see the recent film "Serenity" for the definition of that term--less than $20 million in the first two weekends, probably, and that film has a very fervent if small fanbase; luckily, it only cost $40 million to make), and the second film would go straight to DVD. You have to risk big to profit big (and trust a relative unknown director halfway around the world), and that's something that only New Line was willing to do. Of course, the result of LotR's success has been a scramble by other studios to match it with films such as Alexander, Troy, and Kingdom of Heaven, resulting in the lack of blockbuster status for any of them.

Studios never learn the right lessons from groundbreaking films. IMO, LotR's lessons were:

(1) Get a solid script (or solid source material with an excellent screenwriter(s) to adapt it) with lots of depth and personal characterizations to go along with the grand spectacles;
(2) Rely on a strong director who can delegate to skilled people in their respective fields, but retain control over the production;
(3) Put the money on the screen (IOW, don't rely on a big-name actor to draw the crowds, just good ones);
(4) Use the fanbase as a foundation, but also effectively market to the average moviegoer to build serious word-of-mouth buzz.

Any other suggestions for What Hollywood Could Learn From LotR?

Fast Toadfoot

10-08-2005, 05:35 PM

Did I mention I love Elvish? Yes, I think that's "Elbereth Star-Kindler", we still remember we who dwell" the first line from a song that I don't remember exactly where it is in Fotr the book.

Hey all. Great new thread! With picspam! Yes, on October 6, I told some people at work that it was the day Frodo got stabbed on Wethertop. They thought it was great!

Hopefully in a few days, after I've watched it, I will post my take on Sin City. I'm looking forward to watching it.

Two weeks ago, when I watched Bumblebee twice, I thought that was so awesome! His and Rachel Leigh Cook's interaction was so great.

About the theatrical success of Lord of the Rings, I had read the books first, in 1999, and heard they were making a movie about it and was excited. I liked it a lot all through then, but it wasn't until the fall of 2003 that I really had a personal connection to the movie and Elijah. I had some tumult in my life, and LOTR/Lij was very soothing. And I found it was very relevant to me. I saw Return of the King 12 times in the theatre between December 17, 2003 and early March-ish, 2004. The seventh time was probably the most highly emotional for me.

Mechtild,

A few pages ago, you were saying you like feedback? Me too. I notice that especially at work with my manager, the one who I told him what his hobbit name was from the hobbit name generator. (www.chriswetherell.com/hobbit) I like your posts, I definitely give you props for them :) This is a great thread, and I love reading everyone's insights and goodies!

I should take the Lij approach to laundry. I should commit to once a week, and enjoy quietness while I do it. I used to do that, but got out of the habit.

(See everyone, I have been keeping up a bit!!! ;) )

Love y'all, have a great day!!!

shireling

10-09-2005, 10:34 AM

A little gift for the new thread. Not one of my own I hasten to add - taken by someone who calls herself Lioness of Freedom - she took hundreds of wonderful pics at ELF. I won't bother posting the few I took - you'd all need magnifying glasses :rolleyes:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v327/ShirelingUK/ELFCROP.jpg

Loved the Leno and Tavis Smiley shows - how spoilt we have been just lately, don't know how we'll cope when things quieten down :eek: Don't know why, but I love to hear Elijah talking about mundane, everyday things like laundry and cold cures :) I wonder if his orange stuff got the black marks out of his ELF t-shirt!! I am almost looking forward to my next cold so I can try his GSE drops :D But I agree with you TG about the antibiotics - natural remedies are all well and good but there are times when only conventional medicine will do. And as his mother is obviously concerned about such things, I couldn't help wondering what she thinks about the nicotine ... but no, perhaps I shouldn't go there :eek: I thought Lij was so articulate and intelligent on the TS show - I felt really proud of him :)

Bunnie ~ I missed it - did you post the Happy Shorts pic? Here - in the Faculty??!! :eek: :D :lol: :k Btw - your post about the green boxes made me laugh, quite hysterically! I am still not completely au fait with these - but I did recently acquire a second box (after nearly 3 years!!) and felt rediculously proud - though I still don't know how I came by it or who was responsible - but thank you, whoever you are :)

wood

10-09-2005, 12:15 PM

hallo all !!!

here is a present from me to all of you and our new home !!!!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v399/erendil/SinCityPremiereLA15.jpg

LOVE YOU ALL/WOOD

tgshaw

10-09-2005, 12:18 PM

The problem was that nobody (except New Line) wanted to spring the $150+ million that the (then) two-film project demanded, for fear that the first film would be a fanboy success but mainstream bust... and the second film would go straight to DVD.
Exactly. It was do or die -- blockbuster or The End for Newline (WB was waiting for the spoils). Yes, the potential for blockbusters was there, but definitely not the certainty. The direct to DVD route was the big fear for everyone in the Tolkien community except those who were so dead set against the movies being made that they would have liked to see them fail. The loss wouldn't have been just not seeing the other two movies on the big screen -- they would have had to be made from footage that was already shot instead of PJ having the chance to do more filming for them. It doesn't bear thinking about how the quality would have suffered if he'd had to crank them both out in a matter of months so the DVD set could be sold.

And I know I wasn't the only one (because we talked about it on the boards) who didn't take a breath until after that first weekend. Sure, the midnight showings did well, but that was all Tolkien fans (which really was true of FotR - the change in the midnight-show audience between FotR and TTT was amazing). Imladris kept a running total of positive and negative reviews that was watched like a stock ticker, and after FotR did well the opening weekend there was a collective sigh of relief around the world.

So I doubt if actors went after the parts because they knew the movies would be blockbusters; the stories told by those who got the parts don't suggest that. I suspect that good actors know good material when they see it, and want to act in good movies regardless of whether they're a sure success.

And, yes, Alan Lee and John Howe jumped in excitedly, but Ted Nasmith turned down the invitation. (I don't know why he declined, but when fans complained about him being "snubbed," the news came out that he'd been asked and had said no.) -- I still wanna know who let the Hildebrandts in for that Caras Galadhon set-up, though :mad: ;) .

Any other suggestions for What Hollywood Could Learn From LotR?
Make the composer/music director an integral part of the production from the beginning. Howard Shore talked about what a wonderful experience that was, as opposed to being brought in after a movie is finished and having to slap a score on top of it. And IMHO the results speak for themselves in the unity between the music and the rest of the movie. I don't remember any details, but within the last couple of years there was a composer who wanted to follow that example and score a movie that way (be involved during the movie-making process), and the studio didn't allow it :rolleyes: .

I'd started writing some other things, but realized they didn't really answer the question because they were things the director would need to do rather than the studio. I'll just add "If the director's doing well, keep your nose out of it." I'm hoping some day for a tell-all book that will let us know just how many of the plot changes in TTT came from Newline. In their defense, though, they did seem to learn enough to keep their noses pretty well out of RotK.

------------

As usual :rolleyes: , I can't remember details, but I know I've seen several quotes from Elijah after shooting was finished that have made me think, "Aha! So he has read the book." One of them was about appreciating Frodo's sense of humor, which you certainly wouldn't get from the script. OTOH, I think that's all he's read. His comments don't always fit with the Sil, or things Tolkien said in his letters, but they're very resonant with what a lot of us said/thought in the 1960's when all we had was The Hobbit and LotR (for example, his interpretation of the Grey Havens as Frodo going to heaven).

-----------

I'm very, very frustrated with the internet right now. I spent hours yesterday trying to get some pages published and there are still some pics that haven't uploaded yet. I can't really spend any time on it today. But here's one that has published (so I can link to it ;) ). So, as my contribution to the new location -- not a very happy picture, but one where Elijah's acting, and his understanding of Frodo's wisdom, saved an otherwise senseless scene:

http://www.frodolivesin.us/Pics/2127b630.jpg

Other than this, about all I can get are "page not found" notices, so it's probably not worth linking to them from here yet.

---------

Finally got my sig changed to the quote I wanted to use for October. I get a kick out of the reason Tolkien gives for wanting to be sure that RotK gets published on October 20 as scheduled:

Mechtild

10-09-2005, 02:02 PM

Fast Toadfoot, I tried your "hobbit names generator" link but could not for the life of me understand why the hobbit equivalent for my name (my real one, which is common in English but I know what it means in Spanish) could possibly be "Ruby". It was fun, though. :D

honeyelf and Linwë, thanks for those Tavis links! Woo hoo.

Bunnie and wood, dishy BIG pictures! :cool:

Bunnie ~ I missed it - did you post the Happy Shorts pic? Here - in the Faculty??!!
Shireling, how you make my eyes water! The Happy Shorts pic in The Faculty. One really might lose a few points (or gain them ;) ) for posting that one. No, you will marvel to learn that Bunnie's infamous screencap was one from the latter part of Flipper, showing EW in profile, head only, sillouhetted against the dark sea with gold gleams on it, just past sunset. A moody picture; quite pretty, and not the least bit naughty or even swoony. You couldn't even tell it was of EW if you didn't know it! Go figure. :confused:

Sharpe's Girl and tg, your continuation of the "what could Hollywood learn from LotR" has been interesting. :) tg, what you said about the score is so important. I hadn't thought of it that explicitly. I often have gushed over how I think the score lifted the films to greatness, but I forgot how the score was actually produced, with PJ and Howard Shore working together througout, fine-tuning every bit of it to suit the scenes, sometimes nearly frame by frame.

And, yes, Alan Lee and John Howe jumped in excitedly, but Ted Nasmith turned down the invitation. (I don't know why he declined, but when fans complained about him being "snubbed," the news came out that he'd been asked and had said no.) -- I still wanna know who let the Hildebrandts in for that Caras Galadhon set-up, though :mad: ;) .
I had not known this. Thank heaven he declined, say I, since I don't care that much for Naismith's work. And the work of the Hildebrandts I don't like at all. The Caras Galadhon crack -- did you mean the matte painting for the distance shot after Haldir "announces" it? -- or the interior of the place that they built? Just curious.

~Mecthild

tgshaw

10-09-2005, 09:46 PM

Mechtild, I meant this one:

http://www.frodolivesin.us/132f59fb0.jpg

Still having publishing problems, but could link to that because I had it already posted in "The Wizards Are Odd." I had to laugh because when I went to the "Just a Bit of Fun" section to get the link, FotR with the Hildebrandt's Caras Galadhon :eek: on the cover was showing on the amazon ad that rotates various Tolkien books; must have been an ad for the audio book. Theirs is somewhat different from the one in the movie because they have branches and leaves sticking out in rings (no pun intended) at various places on the tree, with bare trunk in-between. Kind of like a poodle with pom-pons trimmed into its tail.

IMVVHO, Ted Nasmith's portrayals of people are pretty bad, unless they're off in the distance. But he does have a talent for broad landscapes. One that shows the entourage of the Keepers of the Rings at dusk, descending from the hills as they go to the Grey Havens is quite beautiful, I think. But if he'd "moved in" close enough to see faces it most likely would have been ruined. IMHO, if we'd had all three working on the movies, the ideal "assignments" would have been Alan Lee for people, plants (including trees), and anything Elvish; John Howe for monsters, anything made of rock, and non-Elvish buildings; and Ted Nasmith for landscapes. PJ seems to have pretty much followed that "advice" for Lee and Howe. At least, Orthanc and the fell beasts were much like Howe's pictures, and Rivendell had Lee written all over it.

I'm probably going to have to go in and completely redo the entire Paint Shop section of the site in order to get it to publish correctly. My imagemagician account is also doing weird things (I emailed them about it a few days ago and haven't heard back yet.) Those two things together put quite a crimp into my image-posting ability. But I stuck this one into the "What's New" section so I could link to it. Frodo listening to Sam's "UN speech" in TTT, made into an op art poster. Figured we might as well start getting ready for Iggy Pop ;) . And, besides, I wanted to post something a little more fun than my earlier pic for the new Lounge:

http://www.frodolivesin.us/new/0a2de6b0.jpg

Mechtild

10-09-2005, 10:50 PM

tg, thanks for the clarification. I looked up the Hildebrandt Caras Galadhon. I am afraid his ring of mallorns reminded me of an atomic mushroom cloud. Perhaps that was how Galadriel went nuclear. ;)

http://images.tolkienworld.free.fr/hildebrandt/lothlorien.jpg

I looked through a lot of Nasmith illustrations and I see that he does nice landscapes, but they remain a little too "storybook-ish" for me. I much prefer Lee's mistier, more ambiguous and subtly drawn landscapes. Howe is great for monsters, yes. He has a keen sense of drama, too, which really suits "action" scenes.

I did look with favour upon this Ted Nasmith illustration, though, "The Passage of the Marshes." Peter Jackson must have seen this and loved it. I have to admit, I think I love it myself. Here it is:

http://www.greatwar.nl/tolkien/tolkiennasmith.jpg

tg, you wrote of Nasmith,

[H]e does have a talent for broad landscapes. One that shows the entourage of the Keepers of the Rings at dusk, descending from the hills as they go to the Grey Havens is quite beautiful, I think.
Is that the one with them all standing on the quay with the Elven ship behind them? Here's a link to it:

http://img-fan.theonering.net/rolozo/images/nasmith/havens.jpg

One last question: your Iggy Pop photoshop project. What was the source shot? Just curious. :)

~ Mechtild

tgshaw

10-09-2005, 11:23 PM

Mechtild, no, the Nasmith painting I'm thinking of shows the line of horses and ponies from quite a distance, so that you see the entire group descending from the higher ground. There are more people in the entourage than are named in the book. I've seen it posted at KD, but can't remember where or by whom (for some reason, Ezzie comes to mind... :confused: ).

I'm having a horrid time linking to images tonight. I tried to open the page with the source photo of the Paint Shop pic, and it would have taken a good half hour for it to download. I can probably link to it when I get to the faster connection at the office tomorrow. If you can get to the LotR movies>TTT>Osgiliath-Leaving page at frodolivesin.us, it's the shot just below a comment about it not exactly being jawsetting but giving the same idea. It's while Frodo and Sam are face-to-face during the "UN speech".

whiteling

10-10-2005, 02:29 AM

I'm probably going to have to go in and completely redo the entire Paint Shop section of the site in order to get it to publish correctly. My imagemagician account is also doing weird things (I emailed them about it a few days ago and haven't heard back yet.) Those two things together put quite a crimp into my image-posting ability.
No, Tg - do not think less of your image-posting ability! :) Blame it on my hubby :D He is one of the hundreds and thousands of users who are downloading a free Linux system software these days. The slowness and weird behaving of the internet is caused by computer freaks like him. Two or three more days, and things should be back to normal.

Kind of like a poodle with pom-pons trimmed into its tail.
I looked up the Hildebrandt Caras Galadhon. I am afraid his ring of mallorns reminded me of an atomic mushroom cloud. Perhaps that was how Galadriel went nuclear.
:lol: You both are so right! That illustration made me think of a horrible gene mutation of broccoli or some weird preparation straight from an anatomic theatre (I won't go into further detail here :p).
Loved his Dead Marshes picture, though. Yes, PJ was definitely inspired by that one.

I'm still shaking my head over the fact that Bunnie actually earned herself negative reputation points with such a lovely screen cap :confused:. But anyway - thanks for the beautiful sunflower pic :)!

wood

10-10-2005, 05:01 AM

hallo!!!!

what are you talking about whiteling?????

how coulde Bunnie get minus in her reputation for that
gourges picture!!!!

I just love that serier of pictures!!!!!

LOVE YOU ALL/WOOD

tgshaw

10-10-2005, 08:21 AM

No, Tg - do not think less of your image-posting ability! :) Blame it on my hubby :D He is one of the hundreds and thousands of users who are downloading a free Linux system software these days. The slowness and weird behaving of the internet is caused by computer freaks like him. Two or three more days, and things should be back to normal.
Thank you for posting that! :k It explains many things.

:lol: You both are so right! That illustration made me think of a horrible gene mutation of broccoli or some weird preparation straight from an anatomic theatre (I won't go into further detail here :p).
Even worse than the trees, I think, is the penchant for Funny Hats. You can get a glimpse of some of them in that picture. I have a "guide to Middle-earth"-type book from the early 1970's that has a picture of the Fellowship on the cover that shows them in all their glory :eek: . Aragorn seems to be a musketeer or something -- very swashbuckling, including his boots, long mustache, and hat (tipped at a rakish angle).

Loved his Dead Marshes picture, though. Yes, PJ was definitely inspired by that one.
To clear up any confusion, the Caras Galadhon picture and the one of the Dead Marshes were not done by the same artist. The Dead Marshes is by Ted Nasmith, who really isn't too bad if he doesn't get close enough to the subjects to have to show their faces; he has a real handicap there--maybe that's why he took to doing a lot of landscapes ;) . Caras Galadhon, OTOH, is by one or another or both of the Hildebrandt brothers (I've never been quite sure about how that works). They've been doing Tolkien-related artwork for many years, more's the pity, and judging from how many book covers they've gotten, publishers seem to like them--much more's the pity. I did notice they had to publish their own 2005 calendar, so maybe they're being supplanted finally. :z: Unlike Ted's faces, their problem isn't so much with technique as with vision, which IMHO is much more important when it comes to representing anything Tolkien.

Mechtild

10-10-2005, 08:45 AM

To clear up any confusion, the Caras Galadhon picture and the one of the Dead Marshes were not done by the same artist.
tg, you were clear, and I did not confuse the two in my post. The Hildebrandts did the Caras Galadhon and Nasmith did the Passage of the Marshes.

Here's a link to that post, now that it's on the previous page, just so folks can continue to squee over the "Passage of the Marshes" print *grin*:

http://www.khazaddum.com/forums/showpost.php?p=310527&postcount=22

P.S. That picture of the Fellowship that is on that cover is an example of why I don't like their work for a book as grave as LotR: too storybook-ish. (I have my copy of "The Complete Guide to Middle Earth" right here; I find it very handy for a quick reference. Hate that cover, though.

~ Mechtild

ceefour

10-10-2005, 09:42 AM

The LOTR Exhibit has Alan Lee's original watercolors of Rivendell and Orthanc. There are also many pencil sketches of AL and John Howe displayed, complete with the smudges, fingerprints, and holes left in the paper from being tacked on walls. Many were in the Art of books, but seeing the originals is very different. Knowing little about art, there's a depth to the drawings I did not expect with just a pencil on paper.

On seeing the Caras Galadhon picture, I wondered what Errol Flynn (as Robin Hood) was doing in Middle-earth (but remembered he was from New Zealand :p ).

C4

Mechtild

10-10-2005, 09:54 AM

ceefour, you make me even more excited about going to Indianapolis! :p

But, I have to say, Errol Flynn was a lot cooler than Aragorn in the Hildebrandt illustration. :D He really knew how to wear a Robin Hood outfit.

~ Mechtild

txtac

10-10-2005, 10:02 AM

Foers' simple story a delightful debut for Liev
By Rachne Sheth
October 10, 2005

http://www.dailytexanonline.com/media/paper410/news/2005/10/10/Entertainment/Foers.Simple.Story.A.Delightful.Debut.For.Liev-1014992.shtml

Elijah Wood plays Jonathan Safran Foers, an awkward and confused young Jewish man searching for his identity in his ancestral Ukraine.

In hopes of finding the woman who saved his now-deceased grandfather from the Nazis, Jonathan enlists the help of the guides at Heritage Tours, where he encounters Alexander Perchov (Eugene Hutz). Alex is a ghetto-fabulous wannabe who in his colloquialism tells the audience "premium dancing makes many girls want to be carnal with me." Serving as translator between his hypochondriac, anti-Semitic, tour-guide grandfather and Jonathan, Perchov embarks on a journey to find the woman who saved Johnathan's grandfather with only the name of a river and a faded photograph.

The actors work extraordinarily well with the simple story line. Elijah Wood is almost unrecognizable with his slicked down hair and constipated countenance as a young man who missed the boat to adulthood. His awkwardness and subtlety allow for the strongest performance of the film. Eugene Hutz makes a sizeable impression as the interpreter and narrator of the story, keeping the audience laughing while coming to terms with his own Ukrainian identity.

Director Liev Shcreiber does a commendable job in his directorial debut, but with a few minor glitches. About two-thirds into the movie things start coming together, and we don't really get a sense of what just happened, making the closure one should feel at the end a bit jilted. And his efforts to include motifs and symbolism may fit more appropriately into a novel, as they slow the plot's pace.

But seeing foreigners react to Americans in such an authentic way made for a great dialogue; translated, but not foreign.

tgshaw

10-10-2005, 11:44 AM

tg, you were clear, and I did not confuse the two in my post. The Hildebrandts did the Caras Galadhon and Nasmith did the Passage of the Marshes.
(No, Mechtild, you didn't confuse them at all. My post was in response to our dear artist, Whiteling, whose post sounded as if she might have thought the two were done by the same "he", although that might very well have been just in my interpretation of her reference to "his" Dead Marshes picture without any change of subject.)

whiteling

10-10-2005, 01:33 PM

(No, Mechtild, you didn't confuse them at all. My post was in response to our dear artist, Whiteling, whose post sounded as if she might have thought the two were done by the same "he", although that might very well have been just in my interpretation of her reference to "his" Dead Marshes picture without any change of subject.)
:o He? Him? They?... D'oh... yes, I've mixed Nasmith up with the brothers Hildebrandt *hooowl*. *That's* why I asked myself why I would love the one illustration and dislike the other so much. My bad!

I did notice they had to publish their own 2005 calendar, so maybe they're being supplanted finally. :z:
Joins Tg in :z:

The LOTR Exhibit has Alan Lee's original watercolors of Rivendell and Orthanc. There are also many pencil sketches of AL and John Howe displayed, complete with the smudges, fingerprints, and holes left in the paper from being tacked on walls. Many were in the Art of books, but seeing the originals is very different. Knowing little about art, there's a depth to the drawings I did not expect with just a pencil on paper.
Thanks for your wonderful description, Ceefour! :) I'd love to see this Exhibit! There is nothing like seeing original artwork. Most reproductions cannot do justice to what they are displaying. Every great work of art has its own "aura" - unfortunately, that's hard to print.

Alyon

10-10-2005, 08:12 PM

I'm a bit late on this, I know. But regarding the little green boxes and reputations points. YOu need 100 points to get a box, right? I had no clue about them until one time when I went into my users panel and by chance saw the set-up. After that I noted it now and again, but what is curious is that I noticed that points don't go up at regular intervals when you get a new "post approval"--what determines that? Sometimes it goes up by 3, sometimes by 11, or some other number....with one "approval". Is there rhyme or reason?...or is this just one of the things designed to keep our minds puzzling and thus working as we age (bit by bit)? When I have given post "approvals" I didn't notice there being a rating which would give more or less "approval". I, too, pretty much only post in here and have found that I'm rarely allowed to give points to people in here anymore because you ahve to go through twenty (isn't it twenty?) people before you can go back to the same person again. If I go to another thread I get to spread the love a little more...which is fun. :k A good reason to do a bit of reaching out into the rest of KD.

Narya Celebrian

10-10-2005, 10:34 PM

TG, I agree with you about Nasmith's faces and figures. Close-up is not his strength - I find many of them actually painful to look at. His landscapes, however, often capture emotion in a way his close-ups never can - especially with the heart-breaking addition of two tiny figures.

For instance:

Across Gorgoroth Plain:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v389/carrolb/tednasmithacrossgorgoroth.jpg

and At the Foot of Mount Doom:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v389/carrolb/nasmithmountdoom.jpg

His web site is at www.tednasmith.com if anyone wants to explore further. His Faramir and Eowyn make me want to cry...and not in a good way. :p

I can't remember which artist did the 'far off' view of the approach to the Grey Havens - now I'll have to spend some time looking for it. :D

Personally, I have a real soft spot for the Hildebrandts. For many years, their calendars were the only Tolkien ones I could get. For all that their hobbits were a little dumpy and their Rangers a little ... Robin Hoodish :D ... they in many cases did capture the spirit for me. At least they didn't, as Ted Nasmith often does, make the hobbits look like they'd as soon gut you as sit down to a good meal with you. ;)

Here's the silly tree one you were talking about:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v389/carrolb/hildelothlo.jpg

But they did do one of my favorite Galadriel pictures:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v389/carrolb/hildgaladriel.jpg

Here's a gallery of some of their works, if anyone is interested. http://www.lordotrings.com/artmedia/hildebrandt.asp See, while the Hildebrandts were by no means perfect (and in some cases were laughable), they captured a sense of the 'innocence' of the hobbits that few other artists did. They also drew my very favorite Bilbo, up until Ian Holmes gave him a new face. :)

Alyon, there is a rhyme and a reason to the little green boxes. Basically, the more reputation you have, and the more reputation you've given out yourself, the more 'points' you bestow when you yourself add to someone else's rep. That's why it varies all the time, depending on who's giving and receiving it. Don't worry too much about them, though - in Rivendell where political fights are common, they're often used to express agreement or displeasure when the conversation gets heated, but I wouldn't expect to see much of that in the Cafe. (And while we won't reveal who has done it, the mods can see who is handing out rep points.)

Mariole

10-10-2005, 10:51 PM

Wow, love your illustrative Nasmith piccies, Narya!

Well, I'm catching up, so here are random remarks. :)

Mechtild, that introductory lamppost shot sure put me into a celebratory mood. ;) Thank you, dear!

Glossophilia has two more syllables than lexiphile. That's worse than philology!
LOL! I love our lad and his big (or favorite) words.

Honey, I also enjoyed that "Rings payoff" article. My favorite part was:
unfortunately, Bloom is likely to face some of the same criticism that McConaughey suffered. "Orlando has gotten roles he never would have gotten in his life," one agent says. "People get pushed too far too fast. He's a boy, not a man. He should be doing leads in smaller films where he can be wonderful and work his way up, so that his acting catches up to his beauty."
It kind of compares Elijah's approach, which specifically was to pick these smaller roles. It seems to be paying off well for him. *crosses fingers*

I noticed the factual errors in the article as well, Sharpe's Girl. Ah, well. We all can't be certified Faculty members. :p But I very much enjoyed your comment about
Morgan Freeman "Inside the Actors Studio," and one question the moderator asked him (in reference to the short story behind "The Shawshank Redemption") was "Do you read the source material when cast in a film adaptation?" His immediate response was, "Never. I always trust the script, because the script is the source for the film." I completely understand that for an actor like Freeman (and, I believe, Elijah), who trusts the director and will follow them to the letter.
I agree. Initially I found it hard to accept, because I love the books so much. But then I felt sorry for Viggo, and particularly Christopher Lee, who knew the books by heart. Both their characters were changed--Saruman a little, Aragorn a whole lot. So the books might have been rather confusing to the actors, particularly in light of all the rewrites going on. You do have success stories of Ian McKellan (in particular) getting a little bit more of the book on screen. But for the very young Ring-ensnared Movie!Frodo, I'm not sure if Elijah could have fulfilled PJ's vision if he'd lobbied for the scene, "If you touch me ever again, you shall be cast yourself into the Fire of Doom." *smothers Purist whimpers* We'll never know. At this point, I consider that a blessing. It's over, I have the book and the movie, and my lovely online friends and fanfic. I feel adequately rewarded; to want more is greedy, although I suppose that's human nature. :p

I knew the director was someone I had barely heard of, working out of a country that I didn't even know had a film industry, who had done a string of horror films I would never have paid to watch
LOL! Yes, that sounds like me. I had a friend who was a fan from the beginning, and rounded me up for FOTR. It only took one viewing for me; I was in love. But expectations? I had none. I expected a flop. I eternally kiss PJ on the lips for that one film. Middle-earth come to life; it was a gift.

how spoilt we have been just lately, don't know how we'll cope when things quieten down
Oh, ain't it the truth! It always seems to run feast or famine. I hate being busy during a feast, but famines are far worse! *right-click-saves against future shortages*

I am almost looking forward to my next cold so I can try his GSE drops
Sweetie, that's beyond the call. :D

I still wanna know who let the Hildebrandts in for that Caras Galadhon set-up, though
LOL! Yes, exactly! I always wondered why that matte painting looked so weird! :D

That illustration made me think of a horrible gene mutation of broccoli
Whiteling, you slay me. The fact is, I had a friend who was a genetic researcher, and we actually grew mutant broccoli in our garden (it tasted terrible). The Hildebrandts captured the look, all right!

Even worse than the trees, I think, is the penchant for Funny Hats.
Now I'm laughing so hard I hurt.

I'm hoping some day for a tell-all book that will let us know just how many of the plot changes in TTT came from Newline.
No, no, no! Even now it is too painful. "Not if I found it on the highway"-- WAILLLL!!!! Alas, poor Faramir. I knew him well. *kisses his noble memory, because a skull is just too gross*

Tg, my favorite ROTK letter quote is the one where he is pleading for the book to be published, because his fans are eating him alive! I need to find that again someday.

And now, here's a little green box for Mechtild. You can cut it out and paste it onto your screen, so you always feel appreciated, no matter what the rep points say. *pets*

honeyelf

10-10-2005, 11:55 PM

Hi all!

TG, thank you for Op-Art Frodo! Might as well start early, as it will take me a very long time to get ready for Iggy Pop!

Don't know if I should admit this or not, but I just finished watching The Velvet Goldmine, with Jonathan Rhys Meyers as a vaguely David Bowie-ish character, and Ewan McGregor as a undeniably Iggy Pop-pish character. I know very little about Mr. Pop, but Mr. E.M. was him on stage, all the way; even recognizable to this punk-illiterate.

Oh. My.

I think I am very much dreading Iglijah Pop. Mr. McGregor's "Curt Wild" did a full-frontal on a concert stage. And I won't describe what Mr. Meyer's "Brian Slade" got up to in concert with "Curt Wild" during a concert, if you will. Why, no thank you, I do believe I won't. :eek:

What freaks me out most about it I think, is the way Elijah always tells interviewers the ways in which he identifies with his character. During LoTR he talked about how close he became with the other actors on their "journey" together. With EII he talks about his family, how important they are to him, and how the story made him curious about his own heritage.

I don't think I'm looking forward to knowing how he identifies with Iggy Pop.

No, no, no! Even now it is too painful. "Not if I found it on the highway"-- WAILLLL!!!! Alas, poor Faramir. I knew him well. *kisses his noble memory, because a skull is just too gross*

Mariole, you're so funny! Where you done been, girl? Here's a little green box for you, silly!

And since we're all going all O.T. here, and talking about Tolkien-inspired art, I'll just go ahead and post my favorite. It's by Michael Whelan, and I'm always amazed at how he chose to draw Frodo's "elven beauty;" remind you of anyone?
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/MichaelWhelanEagles.jpg

honey!

wood

10-11-2005, 01:08 AM

morning all!!!!!

thank you for posting all those beautiful pictures !!!

Honey and Narya and Mechtild and Tg !! :k :k

WOOD

whiteling

10-11-2005, 04:22 AM

Thanks for all the *great* pictures!! *does happy Snoopy dance* :k
Loved especially Nasmith's Gorgoth Plain. Wow!

I'd like to add a sketch Donato Giancola did for a LOTR cover, which is one of Tg's favourite book covers (unless I am terribly mistaken, this time :p)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/whiteling/lorddraw.jpg

I think it's quite interesting what Giancola says on illustrating Tolkien in general:

Q. What makes Tolkien such a challenge to illustrate?

A. Creating a painting from the worlds of Middle-Earth means you will be placed under the most intense scrutiny when it comes to details and accuracy. The admirers of Tolkien know no mercy when it comes to deviations and inaccuracies, myself included! I know those books inside and out, but still found myself making a few mistakes. I now run my sketches past my friends as a double check to catch any errors. Luckily Tolkien provided artists with a large loop hole for illustrating his novels: very little physical descriptions of either characters or places. His descriptions are generally emotional and for that reason resonate with the reader more than the offerings of other authors. This is what I love regarding the works, a strong emotional foundation upon which to build a very broad range of 'physical' interpretations.(...)
The power of Tolkien is that he does not need an artist to interpret his works for them to come to life. Yet when the artist successfully steps beyond mimicry, something more is added than mere words can describe. The two art forms resonate and create an emotional response greater than the parts. This cannot always be achieved, as any artist, but when it occurs, it is magical.

Note the "no mercy" bit :D. I found this quote on his absorbing website. Anyone of you who like to know the address, please PM me as I can't link to it directly from here (too less clothing in some pictures ;)).

And to tie back the whole thing to Frolijah - what do you think of Giancola's interpretation of his character?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/whiteling/frodo_dragon_back.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/whiteling/frodo_Don_Giancola.jpg

I must admit, although the drawing is wonderfully done, I find him a tad too snooty looking to my taste. Hmmm. I guess I'd rather have a pint with the guy above. :)

Mariole

10-11-2005, 08:56 AM

Honey, I've been very boring: working! It's deadline season. Due to limited computer hours, it means erratic KD and LJ participation. :( But it's lovely to drop in when I can.

Whiteling, I adore Donato Giancola's sketch, and especially his interview! He certainly got it right. What a lovely way to start my day. :k

Mechtild

10-11-2005, 09:23 AM

Back atcha, wood! :k

Shees! What a colourful looking thread! Narya, I have seen some but not all of those before. You are right about the smallness of the figures within such vast landscapes giving them added poignancy.

Whiteling, yes, Frodo is a little too aristocratic looking, even for the Halfling Prince, in Giancola's sepia portrait of him (lovely work, though). We actually took a look at the painting for which your posted picture with Gandalf and Aragorn is a sketch (in the Harem, that is). It is awfully good and I love the very dynamic composition, but as I revealed myself then, I am a stickler for maintaining a strong size difference between "the Big Folk" and the hobbits. In that picture, Frodo's head and hands are virtually the same size as Aragorn's, which implies they are the same size beings, which they aren't, especially since Aragorn is notably tall, even for a man of Gondor.

I think I am very much dreading Iglijah Pop. Mr. McGregor's "Curt Wild" did a full-frontal on a concert stage. And I won't describe what Mr. Meyer's "Brian Slade" got up to in concert with "Curt Wild" during a concert, if you will. Why, no thank you, I do believe I won't.
Honeyelf, your story of seeing Ewan McGregor do his Iggy Pop thing in The Velvet Goldmine was interesting. Personally, I can't believe EW will be appearing in something that requires him to appear in the all-together (not even one of Mariole's ;) ), or, in fact doing anything truly lewd. But I could be wrong. I didn't guess he'd play a woman-slaughtering cannibal, either. And, he has said over and over that he really wants to distance himself from Frodo in his viewers' minds. Few fans could picture JRRT's Frodo standing on the table in Bree to sing his song and dropping trou' in the middle of his number. That would have caused even more of a stir among the patrons than his disappearing act. :cool:

And now, here's a little green box for Mechtild. You can cut it out and paste it onto your screen, so you always feel appreciated, no matter what the rep points say. *pets*
Mariole, thanks. I plan to paste it and more little green boxes on my screen, but I am going to manip different Frodo faces onto them. Alyon, want some? I'd be willing to share. :p Maybe his facial expressions can be more and more euphoric as the points increase. :D

tg, your "op art" Frodo manip made me think strongly of this photo of Mr. Pop that had been posted here when news first came out about the role:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v382/mechtild/pics%20for%20posts/pop_iggyBWyoung.jpg

Was that the idea? Just curious.

Well, off to work.

~ Mechtild

tgshaw

10-11-2005, 06:08 PM

Whiteling, yes, that Frodo is a little too aristocratic looking, even for the Halfling Prince, in Giancola's sepia portrait of him.
Yeah, but he'd have to have a pretty sharp jawline to look the way he does in the Moria picture. And, yes, Whiteling, it's indeed one of my favorite bookcovers. I have a smallish pic of it on my home computer, so I can't upload it from work. I'd never seen the sketch, though--very nice.

from Mechtild:
tg, your "op art" Frodo manip made me think strongly of this photo of Mr. Pop that had been posted here when news first came out about the role: Was that the idea? Just curious.
Not consciously, but it might have creeped in. :p Consciously, I was just thinking "rock'n'roll" -- It's probably a little too early-1970's for Iggy Pop, but...

from Mariole:
Tg, my favorite ROTK letter quote is the one where he is pleading for the book to be published, because his fans are eating him alive! I need to find that again someday.
Do you mean this one?
When is Vol. III likely now to appear? I shall be murdered if something does not happen soon.
-- From a letter to Allen & Unwin, September 1955.

I had it as my sig here until a few days ago when I finally got around to changing it to an October 1955 quote, which I also think is pretty funny. The September one is still up as the "Quote of the month" (http://www.frodolivesin.us/tolkienintro.htm) on my website because I haven't accomplished much there yet for October.

Hi, Wood :k ! Glad to see that real life doesn't have you completely captured!

honeyelf

10-11-2005, 07:18 PM

Mechtild said: Personally, I can't believe EW will be appearing in something that requires him to appear in the all-together...or, in fact doing anything truly lewd. But I could be wrong. I didn't guess he'd play a woman-slaughtering cannibal, either. And, he has said over and over that he really wants to distance himself from Frodo in his viewers' minds.

I can hardly imagine Elijah playing Iggy like Ewan Mc. played him either. OTOH, I can't imagine Iggy's fans being satisfied if Elijah plays a watered-down PG-rated version of Iggy either! I'm hoping for lots of artful cut aways, and suggested action myself. Someone on LJ said that they'd heard that EW will be playing Iggy from his teen years, through the Stooges days.

Now I begin to suspect I know what Liev Schreiber meant when he said:

...and he's really very weird. And I think that people are going to see it in the next couple years, with the kind of choices that this guy makes. They're going to see a really interesting actor emerge.

Whiteling, I love Giancola's work, and I really love that quote you posted! Somehow it reminds me of movie Frodo; not what some people had pictured maybe, but he got to the emotional core of the character. And I like his Frodo, too; he doesn't look "snooty" to me, just like a hobbit with an 'elvish air' who's a little bit inside his head at the moment.

ETA: Just dropping this in, because the hair kind of reminds me of the pic of Iggy that Mech posted above. Wonder if that's around the time he did the audition?
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/elijahwood.jpg

ceefour

10-11-2005, 08:32 PM

Honeyelf, Mr. Pop?! :lol:

I have finally deduced that The Stooges was the name of Mr. Pop's ( :D ) band, and not Larry, Moe, and Curly. :rolleyes:

C4

Alyon

10-12-2005, 01:19 AM

Honey:
And since we're all going all O.T. here, and talking about Tolkien-inspired art, I'll just go ahead and post my favorite. It's by Michael Whelan, and I'm always amazed at how he chose to draw Frodo's "elven beauty;" remind you of anyone?

Really... :)

Beautiful art posts, everyone.

By the way, AOL had a list the sexiest geeks on their front page yesterday (or earlier today, if you live where I live). Guess who was included? Yeah, he was--along with Topher Grace, Zach Braff, Jon Stewart, The lead singer of Coldplay, clay aiken and Jon Heder and the guy who used to be lead on Undeclared (and in the movie Almost Famous), and a couple other people I don't remember. I am so good with names... :rolleyes: But really, not a bad list... :cool:

Wow, Mechtild, that picture of Iggy is much more along the lines of Elijah than others we have seen. I can see it.... ;) :)

BunnieBugs

10-12-2005, 01:51 AM

I can't help but jump in here with some of the Iggy Pop discussion. Recently, a friend of mine had a discussion going in her LJ about this role and what it might involve. Many people were afraid that the role is just too "out there", and Elijah could really be making a mistake to attempt it.

However, one person had some enlightening things to say, and I'm going to quote her here:

Okay no one knows a whole lot about the project yet, but if the movie follows Iggy from when he was a teenager, I can def. see Elijah playing Iggy (his real name is James Newell Osterberg)...before he 'became' Iggy! (If that makes sense) Back then, it seems, he was more into blues music. And was in a blues band called the Prime Movers.

Someone from that band said this about Iggy:
"Iggy played in a local band that mostly played for fraternities, called the Iguanas. That was how we met one another. Iggy liked what we were doing and soon joined up as our drummer. He came across as a shy, active, and ambitious young man.
The band liked Iggy and vice versa. Girls loved him, as he had long hair, long eyelashes, and appeared bashful around them. He loved to look down at the floor, when they crowded around him, and bat his eyelashes. They went wild."

If this is indeed the tack that the film takes, I can really see it working! :cool: What better way to get the audience involved with the "character" than to show him at his "shy" but "ambitious" beginnings? I know it is wa-a-ay too early to start anticipating anything about this film, but this really gives me hope. :)

Mechtild

10-12-2005, 07:52 AM

"Sexiest geek," Alyon? What did they give for the qualifications, do you remember? Or perhaps they didn't say. I wondered if they meant "geek" as in someone who has an obsessive interest in something (like a "computer geek", a "music geek", a "Tolkien geek", etc.), or if they mean only that the appeal of these men has a certain dorky or goofy quality to it. If the second, I would have thought Tobey MaGuire would be on it (an actor whom I like and think of as appealing in a "geeky" or "dorky" way).

BunnieBugs, your info. on Iggy Popp as a youth and young man was most intriguing. You are right; this is a role EW could be imagined playing. It's the over-the-top exhibitionist that is a stretch for me.

What a crack-up this part of your quote was:

"Girls loved him, as he had long hair, long eyelashes, and appeared bashful around them. He loved to look down at the floor, when they crowded around him, and bat his eyelashes. They went wild."
I feel indicted. :o

~ Mechtild

BunnieBugs

10-12-2005, 03:24 PM

BunnieBugs, your info. on Iggy Popp as a youth and young man was most intriguing. You are right; this is a role EW could be imagined playing. It's the over-the-top exhibitionist that is a stretch for me.I think that if it started this way and showed the transition in not only his professional but also his personal life, it could be very powerful and easier to accept as a characterization. I hope the person I quoted turns out to be right that this will be the approach that they take!

Lady Wendy suggested that I post this article here, as much of it invites discussion:

Illuminating role: Wood relished part in fact-based indie film

By JOHN HAYES
October 10, 2005

While vacationing in Europe, Jonathan Safran Foer flew to the Ukraine to find his family's ancestral home. He spent 24 hours in the small village, then hopped a flight west to Prague, where he holed up in a hotel room and fictionalized his visit in a novel that takes a longer, darker journey to the soul of pervasive East European racism.

His story, "Everything Is Illuminated," is an interesting mix of snapshots from his actual visit and the fictional tale they're wrapped around. One thing he didn't change: The central character is named Jonathan Safran Foer.

"That made it much more interesting to me," says Elijah Wood, who plays Foer in the film adaptation. A former child star who's matured into an actor capable of carrying the "Lord of the Rings" series, Wood says it was like "shifting gears" to play the shy and painfully wooden character in the low-budget, independent film.

"I think the fact that it was a very different and unusual role is what motivated me to play the character," he says. "Jonathan is so different from who I am, so awkward and somewhat strange ... yet he had such a clear vision of the story. The challenge was to make sure the character seemed alive and settled. He's so withdrawn; there's no life emanating from him. He's an observer, he lacks the experience of the other characters."

If there's any Elijah in the Jonathan he's created, it's in those big eyes, the same empathy-generating, doe-in-the-headlights eyes that set their gaze on Mordor in a perilous quest to destroy the Ring - even behind giant horn-rimmed glasses.

Wood chuckles at the suggestion.

"Yeah, I do that," he says. "The eyes are a part of telling the story and explaining the character. They're a conduit to articulate emotion without speaking."

Foer's story tells us that Eastern Europeans wonder why Americans travel around the world to research their family histories.

His real-life experiences with suspicious locals, long-lost records and ineffective bureaucracy add comic relief and authenticity to an otherwise serious fictional story.

Alex, the disinterested interpreter who leads Jonathan through rural Ukraine, is based on Foer's actual interpreter and is played to comic effect by Eugene Hutz, front man for an ethnic punk band, Gogol Bordello, that fuses supercharged folk influences with sideshow cabaret.

"It was hard to keep a straight face," says Wood. "But that was the whole idea - the stiff, awkward American (who's) compelled to collect things and the more experienced European who doesn't understand his motivations and just wants to get paid."

In the "Ring" films, when the producers needed a mountain or an army or a creature, they simply bought it, built it or hired a team of computer-generated imagery artists to animate it.

"The main difference in smaller and independent movies is everybody has to work together and work very long hours to achieve the film you're trying to make," says Wood. "You have more freedom with larger films, but that freedom can cost you in that you're buying what you need instead of finding creative ways to get it."

A key location in "Everything Is Illuminated" is a ramshackle house set in a field of sunflowers - the type of place, Wood says, that might have been "CGIed" for a larger film.

"But we didn't have that luxury, and as a result we had something more authentic and arguably more beautiful. We grew those sunflowers and built the house in the middle of them. And we mapped it out so by the time the sunflowers were in full bloom, and there were only a few days in terms of their growth, that was the point in the schedule where we'd go to film there.

"Working at the smaller, indie level is a whole different world."

~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

From here (http://www.kitsapsun.com/bsun/entertainment/article/0,2403,BSUN_19066_4149681,00.html).

tgshaw

10-12-2005, 04:04 PM

A key location in "Everything Is Illuminated" is a ramshackle house set in a field of sunflowers - the type of place, Wood says, that might have been "CGIed" for a larger film.

"But we didn't have that luxury, and as a result we had something more authentic and arguably more beautiful. We grew those sunflowers and built the house in the middle of them. And we mapped it out so by the time the sunflowers were in full bloom, and there were only a few days in terms of their growth, that was the point in the schedule where we'd go to film there.
Hmmm... Kind of like planting the gardens in Hobbiton a year before filming so the plants would look natural? Of course, that was bought in the sense that people were hired to do it instead of the cast and director being involved.

I'd also posit that PJ & Co. found some pretty creative ways of doing things.

shilohmm

10-12-2005, 04:27 PM

"Sexiest geek," Alyon? What did they give for the qualifications, do you remember?

I always wonder that with the term "geek." I've seen Napoleon Dynamite defined as a "geek", but although I enjoyed the movie he's not what I think of when I think of "geek". More of a nerd or a goof - to me, geek implies intelligence and an interest in doing some sort of research into their subject of choice. Of course it took me a while to get used to the term back in high school when applied to computer geeks (which is my first thought now) - my first exposure to the word "geek" was in an old book when they were talking the guys in circuses who'd bite the heads off chickens! :eek: :eek: :D

I'd also posit that PJ & Co. found some pretty creative ways of doing things.

The actors worked long hours in LOTR, too. :confused: Maybe Elijah's point was that he was doing stuff together with non-actors? He felt more involved in more aspects, somehow?

Sheryl

tgshaw

10-12-2005, 05:39 PM

...to me, geek implies intelligence and an interest in doing some sort of research into their subject of choice.
I'd think that would have to be part of the idea if we use Elijah's statement that "Geeks are generally the most interesting people."

The actors worked long hours in LOTR, too. :confused: Maybe Elijah's point was that he was doing stuff together with non-actors? He felt more involved in more aspects, somehow?
Yes, I think that's the point he was making. I'd imagine the "job descriptions" on movies as big as LotR would be pretty specialized. There'd be so much of everything needing to be done that no one would be able to be involved in everything. Even PJ had to delegate things.

Eandme

10-13-2005, 07:15 AM

:eek: Is it me not being up to date, or is this truly a scoop? Has Elijah been hiding this from us? Or is contactmusic still not to be trusted?

THE FLAMING LIPS have finished work on their movie debut, CHRISTMAS ON MARS.

The film, which the group started shooting in 2000, centres around scientists preparing to celebrate their first Christmas in space.

The movie stars The Flaming Lips and ELIJAH WOOD. Lips frontman WAYNE COYNE directed the project.

http://www.contactmusic.com/new/xmlfeed.nsf/mndwebpages/the%20flaming%20lips%20complete%20christmas%20movie

tgshaw

10-13-2005, 08:48 AM

I remember reading about this a l-o-o--n-g time ago, but if work started in 2000, that's very possible. ;)

The movie's listed on IMDb as being "in production," with the most recent update being from 2003. On the message board for the movie it's said that this is the third year in a row that it's been announced that it's coming out "this" Christmas. Elijah's mentioned nowhere in the "complete cast and crew" list, which doesn't necessarily mean he isn't in it.

The folks on the movie's message board are much more interested in Isaac Brock being in it than Elijah. Here's all I found (I took out posters' names but left the dates for reference):

Someone posted in the Christina Ricci board that she is in this movie with her boyfriend Adam Goldberg, though it isn't listed on here. Does anyone know if she is in this?
Re: Christina Ricci in this?
(Sat Jun 18 2005 16:20:35 )

------------------------------

she is, wayne coyne said on "the fearless freaks" comentary track that she is in the movie, along with elija wood and isac brock
Re: Christina Ricci in this?
(Sat Aug 20 2005 06:38:14 )
---------------------------------

He didn't say Elijah was in it. Either Wayne or Steven said Elijah mentioned an interest in the movie but they haven't heard from him since.
Re: Christina Ricci in this?
(Fri Aug 26 2005 22:42:36 )

-------------------------------
dont know about Elijah but Ricci is going to be in the flick

BTW, Ms. Ricci isn't listed in the complete cast and crew, either. :p

There's a link to a trailer--the next poster says the link doesn't work. Since I'm really limited as far as downloads, I'll let someone else check that if they want to.

There's also a link to the Flaming Lips spot at myspace.com. I got a "page not found" error when I tried to use the direct link, but found it if I just went to myspace and did a search for Flaming Lips. Because I'm not a myspace member, there's a lot I couldn't get to. Didn't see a mention of the movie, but it's noted that the last update to the space was October 12, so there might be something elsewhere. There's really not much on the main page, so not having something there doesn't necessarily mean it's not happening. There are two pictures, one that looks as if it could actually be from a sci-fi movie, and one of someone dressed like Mr. Spock in shades (from the lyrics posted on the message board, it sounds as if the movie is actually supposed to be a commentary on consumerism, so I doubt if the Spock impersonation would be in it). When I click on "more pictures," it won't let me in.

If anyone's a myspace member (or is willing to give herself/himself to the cause enough to join), there might be more information there. Does anyone have the "fearless freaks" commentary track? :confused:

Anyway, the movie seems to be real but has taken quite awhile to make and isn't done yet, so who knows? Even the fans are saying it'll most likely be direct to DVD. Nothing solid about Elijah being in it, but that rumor was around a few years ago.

------------

Whatever happens, it'll never beat the MST3K version of Santa Claus Conquers the Martians -- Now that's a great movie! :haha: :haha:

txtac

10-13-2005, 09:17 AM

Elijah was involved at the beginning of the project. He was really into the Flaming Lips at the time. When he was asked by the front man if he wanted to be in the movie, Elijah jumped on it. Shortly thereafter, if I remember correctly, something came up (the F.L. had to go play with Beck, or something ) and the movie just disappeared. In a later interview, Elijah was talking like the movie never made, or that he didn't get a chance to do it. It will be interesting indeed to see what they did and if Elijah was able to squeeze in somewhere over the last five years of scheduling committments. Something in the back of my mind is saying that they did shoot some of the scenes way back when before they had to stop, so the Elijah bit(s) might be some of this original 2000 footage.

Fast Toadfoot

10-13-2005, 09:54 AM

I'm going with my friend Trevor to see Everything is Illuminated this Sunday. Also, I'm going to watch Sin City on DVD this weekend, and All I Want at some point in the next week or so! I'm so excited!

Hmmm... Elijah and the Flaming Lips in a movie set on Mars.. interesting. It will be cool seeing him in another movie with Christina Ricci. Which reminds me, the time I watched the Ice Storm, back in January, there was a pretty intense ice and snow storm that night.

txtac

10-13-2005, 09:58 AM

Just ran across this bit of background on the Flaming Lips. Scroll down and play #21 "Christmas on Mars 2001-2004"

http://www.shoutfactory.com/selection/198/The_Flaming_Lips_The_Fearless_Freaks.html?OVRAW=flaming%20lips&OVKEY=flaming%20lip&OVMTC=content

tgshaw

10-13-2005, 12:38 PM

I'm going with my friend Trevor to see Everything is Illuminated this Sunday. Also, I'm going to watch Sin City on DVD this weekend, and All I Want at some point in the next week or so! I'm so excited!
FT (May I call you FT? :p ), All I Want is the one of Elijah's movies that's caused the most disagreement here over whether it's good/bad/indifferent, so it'll be interesting to see what you think of it. And don't worry, no one will jump on you when you give your opinion--you'll just have to listen to everyone else's. ;)

Just checked the local movie listings, and the promised Oct 14 arrival of EII is there! It'll be at the little theater that shows "little" movies, instead of on one of the 24 screens at the big multiplex (where I saw ESOTSM). The multiplex seems to take on the small movies only if it can have an exclusive showing in the city, so maybe the little one beat them to it. Nice thing for me is that the little theater is within walking distance--the only theater in the city that is. :cool: This will be especially handy if I "have to" see the movie more than once. :p

Opening up an Omaha-related internet page and seeing the poster was enough to get me excited. Now I'll have to remind people I've talked to about it--let them know it's here (and, oh, I hope it stays more than a week).

Alyon

10-13-2005, 09:38 PM

Oh, maaaaannnnn---Green Street Hooligans and Everything Is Illuminated left town this week!!! Though it's not unlikely that they may re-circulate into another arthouse theater round here in coming weeks. But there go my weekend plans with Vinnie and Queenie!!!

And TG, you are right--I swear you can't trust IMDb regarding cast listings when a movie is in pre-production. Even very minor characters can be submitting their names and get posted before a major character is even listed-- because no one made the submission for them, and it takes forever to check the facts? Whatever, I know you can't rely on it. So who knows regarding the Flaming Lips movie? Really cool if it happens. :cool:

TG and Fast Toadfoot!! Have fun at Eil!!!! :D

ETA: Oh yeah, Mechtild, you asked what was meant by Geeky on the AOL list of sexy geeks. I think it was like Shilohmm said--smart and different that the rest-I think all the people listed were seen as following their own drummer. An example of Elijah being geeky was his action figure collection, and sexy for being in Everything Is Illuminated and for starting his own record company.

Mariole

10-14-2005, 08:46 AM

Arrggghh! on your behalf, Alyon! What a bummer!

I saw EII! I did! Out of the roughly 7 billion theatres in Denver, it's playing in one art-house theatre. The good news is that it's held over another week. I keep watching for GSH, but it hasn't shown up yet. I don't trust the official dates, based on what I've heard, but it should be here next week.

Now, EII! I wanted to love it but, and my impression was that it was a very good film. But SORT OF SPOILERISH...

It was so sad! The beginning was so funny, which just opened me up so that the wallop of the movie had an unimpeded chance to kick me in the stomach. And it did. I was actually upset when I came home. So I will say this is a very _good_ movie, but terribly difficult for me to watch.

That said, I will probably watch it again before it leaves town. With the extra week, I'll be able to get some distance from it. My friend was not able to make it, so maybe I'll try her again and see if she's interested.

The theatre was practically empty on a Tuesday night. Just 4 of us watched the film, but there was laughter in the right places. I cried. I did enjoy Elijah's performance, although I can see the complaints people have had about his "stillness." SORT OF SPOILERISH...

He really picked a rather mixed-up character to play. When an emotional moment comes up, he tends rather to turn to a ziplock bag, rather than exude the emotion. And this goes back to his kidhood. So it was a very quirky character. I can see why it appealed to him, but Jonathan is in fact very still and non-emotionally responsive. It makes those times when he does break through all the more potent.

REALLY SPOILERY: I just adored the quiet gift he gave to the Grandfather. His eyes welled with tears, and I did see Jonathan's whole soul in his eyes. As the Grandfather said earlier, "He's a good person." Aw!

In more general comments, I adored the thick glasses. I think they worked perfectly to set the mood and the habitual interaction of this character. I like how his face got all squinty the few times he took them off. I really enjoyed that touch. Just, generally, I really enjoyed all the glimpses we saw of the Ukraine and its people. It gave the story breadth and depth.

Okay, I'll be definite. I'll see EII again before it goes. Maybe I can stand up to it better a second time. I did very much enjoy the performances; maybe I'll be able to enjoy them better if I'm not so emotionally engaged. I also ordered the book from the library; it came in yesterday. Now I'll get to read what all was going on. Cheers, all!

txtac

10-14-2005, 09:21 AM

Mariole wrote: I also ordered the book from the library; it came in yesterday. Now I'll get to read what all was going on.
Sometimes it is better to read the book after you see the movie. This is one of those times however that the movie and the book need to stand seperate.
Much of the movie did not come from the book. The people who read the book after they see the movie, wanting to learn more about the movie from the book, are quite put out in learning that much of the movie is not in the book. Do not read the book to find out what else was going on. To me, the book was kind've a let down. There was so much more that they put into the movie. It would be nice to have a more flushed out script, but it simply is not there. The book and the movie need to be and remain seperate intities.

(1.) Maybe I can stand up to it better a second time.
(2.)I did very much enjoy the performances;
(3.)maybe I'll be able to enjoy them better if I'm not so emotionally engaged.
As touching as Elijah's performance as Jonathan in EiI, do you believe that this will be another one of his "cult following" characters like Casey in the Faculty?

tgshaw

10-14-2005, 09:28 AM

As touching as Elijah's performance as Jonathan in EiI, do you believe that this will be another one of his "cult following" characters like Casey in the Faculty?
...I said awhile back that I saw another possible fanfic character in him. ;)

BunnieBugs

10-14-2005, 09:51 AM

I have spent the morning perusing the latest articles and reviews about EII. Most are standard fare, and there are the unfortunate ones that dislike Elijah's performance for whatever reason (too "creepy", too "catatonic"... dang, I hate reading those! :mad: ), but this one just made me grin like an idiot and seemed the perfect nugget to drop into the Lounge:

Wood turns his whole body into a coiled bundle of neuroses that he never actually lets us see. Jonathan is willing to take this trip, to meet strange people and have accidental adventures in his quest. But it's not his thing. He's an introvert's introvert. It's a Chaplinesque turn and an utter delight, with nary a trace of hobbit in it.

I so agree! And I read one yesterday about how "Wood's open face lends Jonathan's search a soul." That's lovely stuff. I've seen it twice, now, and I found Elijah's performance to be just perfect, from his actions and reactions to the delivery of his lines. He did a wonderful job.

That first quote is from here (http://www.mcall.com/features/all-rev_everythingoct14,0,1705376.story?coll=all-features-hed) , btw.

txtac

10-14-2005, 10:06 AM

Fun (interesting) review quotes Bunnie. Thank you for posting them.

tgshaw wrote:
...I said awhile back that I saw another possible fanfic character in him.
What does it say about our culture, our understanding of human nature, our intellectual ability when a neurotic nebish is idolised.

Mechtild

10-14-2005, 10:17 AM

Thank you, BunnieBugs for that link! MWAH! :k

I say that not just because it said nice things about EW's portrayal of Jonathan. I mean, simply because I really liked the way the review was written. I felt as though we were sympatico, in terms of the sorts of things he looks for in a film, the nuances he lifted up for notice. And I just liked his writing, period. Some of the reviews that get linked, whether pro or con, are so boringly or drearily or even badly written, it's a pleasure to read the writing of such a reviewer. His style suited me to a "T".

Quote posted in white on white, since Mariole called it "SPOILERISH":
It was so sad! The beginning was so funny, which just opened me up so that the wallop of the movie had an unimpeded chance to kick me in the stomach. And it did. I was actually upset when I came home. So I will say this is a very _good_ movie, but terribly difficult for me to watch.
Your remarks reeeeeaaaaally made me want to see the film, even more than before. I'm not interested in seeing "a light-hearted holocaust comedy" ( :rolleyes: ) but one with a deep, dark edge -- which was what the book managed to do fairly well. Perhaps you didn't mean your remarks to make the film seem attractive, but they did.

Alyon, I am so sorry to hear the films left already! I have been hoping to see EEI when I am in Indianapolis for the LotR museum exhibit next weekend. It is supposed to open there at an arty house today. But maybe it will have gone before I get there. Boo hoo! And thanks for the explanatory note on "geeky" appeal. :)

~ Mechtild

Mariole

10-14-2005, 12:02 PM

Perhaps you didn't mean your remarks to make the film seem attractive, but they did.
:k Not at all. It was a lovely film, and I highly recommend it. I was merely trying to get across my personal reaction to it. I am sometimes more easily distressed than many people, which is why I never even considered seeing Sin City. I did enjoy this film, but it can never be like one of my EW favorites which I can see over and over again. I think one "over" will do it. :p

txtac, thanks for the head's up on the book. If I'm going to do both, I do generally like to see the film first, because books are simply so much more detailed. I'm sure I will enjoy it. I look forward to discussing it!

Thank you for all the reviews and links, Bunnie! I think it would be very interesting to discuss the character of Jonathan; he certainly has some limitations! I wonder, though, what is the appropriate forum for doing that? An exploration of a neurotic character really isn't related to Elijah's acting. :confused:

tgshaw

10-14-2005, 12:31 PM

I think it would be very interesting to discuss the character of Jonathan; he certainly has some limitations! I wonder, though, what is the appropriate forum for doing that? An exploration of a neurotic character really isn't related to Elijah's acting. :confused:
Actually IMHO it's completely related to Elijah's acting -- how he inhabits the character, which is what his acting is all about. I don't think it's too spoilerish to say that "movie-Jonathan" is unique to the movie. The book gave Liev Schrieber (and Elijah) something of a blank slate to work with, because book-Jonathan is almost a hidden character. So a discussion of movie-Jonathan would be a discussion of Elijah's acting, since his acting is the way we get to know the character.

But I suppose a broader discussion of the movie could be done in the Cinema forum (there's already a thread there about TMFKAH). Also, there's a thread on EII the book in the Library. It's been dormant for awhile, so an infusion of people who've just read the book would be nice. A warning, though, that the thread assumes anyone there has read the entire book -- unmarked spoilers all over the place! It's almost impossible to discuss the book any other way, because it's more cyclical than linear.

Mechtild

10-14-2005, 12:39 PM

Also, there's a thread on EII the book in the Library. (...) A warning, though, that the thread assumes anyone there has read the entire book -- unmarked spoilers all over the place! It's almost impossible to discuss the book any other way, because it's more cyclical than linear.
I'll say. :cool:

~ Mechtild

ceefour

10-14-2005, 12:48 PM

Hi, tg, and mechtild's here, too! I was just over in the EII thread in books seeing if that would be the place to discuss Jonathan, but since movie Jonathan is different than book Jonathan (or so I'm told by Pelagia, Achila, and ylla), that doesn't seem the place for it. Your suggestions of here or in Cinema are better.

I'm hoping to see EII soon, either this Sunday or next weekend. :cool: I don't think Hooligans will ever play near me. Knowing nothing about the ways and means of film distribution, it still seems to me Hooligans may have had more success on the art house circuit.

As for All I Want, I liked it, except for the scene with Deborah Harry. Being of a "certain age", it made me cringe. It may have been meant to be funny and/or fantastical, but I could not watch it.

C4

honeyelf

10-14-2005, 01:00 PM

I, for one, would love to discuss movie Jonathan here!

TGShaw said: Actually IMHO it's completely related to Elijah's acting -- how he inhabits the character, which is what his acting is all about. I don't think it's too spoilerish to say that "movie-Jonathan" is unique to the movie. The book gave Liev Schrieber (and Elijah) something of a blank slate to work with, because book-Jonathan is almost a hidden character. So a discussion of movie-Jonathan would be a discussion of Elijah's acting, since his acting is the way we get to know the character.

I think Elijah and Liev really brought book Jonathan to life. He's an extension of the odd little, off-kilter histories he writes for his Trachimbrod ancestors. Stiff, awkward movie Jonathan is a perfect expression of that, and his 'John Holmes' comment (lifted straight from the book) is an hilarious example of his inability to connect emotionally, equating certain attributes with sexual prowess.

Having read the book, and now seen the film, I feel enlightened as to what Alex said in the book, as to Jonathan being a coward.

But Jonathan is mostly a catalyst for Young Alex's new understaning of Grandpa Alex. And Jonathan does seem to grow a bit in the film, a thing that I think is hinted at by the ending of his letter-writing with Alex in the book.

I'm malingering. I should be doing homework... :rolleyes:

honey!

saile

10-14-2005, 01:02 PM

Oh so good to be back at The Faculty! :D :D

I will be soooooooo looking forward to the DVD release and CABLE TV release of both Everything Is Illuminated and Green Street Hooligans so EVERYONE can see them and we can REALLY discuss them and the acting in detail. From memory, seeing GSH twice in September, my impressions are I really liked it. If this seems nonsequential I just finished browsing the last 3 weeks of Faculty posts :haha: and this relates to that prior discussion and a question that Honeyelf posed IIRC. Just had to add .. Lexi had something to say so the movie though flawed was well acted and worth seeing and if it was playing in town Id be in line to see it today.I like BRUMMIES line The film was a bit shaky on the details, but as far as the broad picture is concerned, it was spot on.Yes I know what you mean Alyon but I didnt always like their lines Some of their lines were contrived or clichéd but IMVHO delivered well. The voiceover we hear in one of the previews of the film works better in the film. Okay so the screenplay could use one more rewrite but all in all, it worked for me. Of course it could be as Goldenberry says about the voiceovers.. we get to hear more of Elijahs soft mellifluous voice And in this case more is better. Bunnies comment about people must be so uncomfortable with his looks that they simply don't look at him is interesting. He has a distinctive look, well actually many many unique looks ( I realize that makes no sense but it seems to me he does.) and I think there are people and critics who have taken to disliking him and cant possible be looking at him. Frodo has one expression???. Jonathan is wooden???. Matt is unconvincing???? NO NO NO. Tg, I anticipate screen caps of these new characters once the DVDs are released. So much to work with in these two movies. I am all ready thinking of requests. (Love Stu :k and analysis too -thank you.)

Thanks Nenya and Achila for pointing out new GSH reviews. And Nenya I like your addition of fearless in describing Elwood for me..meaning he is fearful but tackles it anyway. Perhaps thinking of IGGY.

SPOILERS

I saw EII too Mariole!!!! I agree with peaceweaver and Goldenberry when they said And I loved Elwoods performance. His timing is wonderful. .....quiet film (when it isnt laugh out loud funny). I laughed out loud many a time, I know.
IMHO it is an art film, and actually a foreign language film. There isnt actually much English language spoken in this movie. Much was subtitled, which was good because it helps with Alexs spoken English as well as translating the other languages spoken. I SO WISHED I COULD UNDERSTAND WHAT WAS ACTUALLY BEING SAID. I know in the film Alex DOES NOT translate grandfathers comments accurately to Jonathan. It is part of the humor (very funny). And a lot at Jonathans expense. But I am guessing we are missing a good bit in the subtitled translation if only nuance. Actually it's a lot like Jonathan who is missing a lot. No one speaks to Jonathan in English but Alex and he doesnt translate much. So to watch Jonathans profound change in this extraordinary performance .aw.what a gift. A beautiful film.
Elijah has mentioned at least a couple of times that Liev suggested Peter Sellers Chauncy Gardner as a parallel role. By contrast Jonathan changed profoundly in this film. when he does break through all the more potent Well said. I loved the dog hug and the smile as Alex speaks his name again. I will have to jump over to the Book thread here at KZ as there are significant changes from the book I would love to discuss.

I read the book (many times) so I can only guess what I would think of this movie without that knowledge. But txtac is correct as the movie is Lievs version which stands in its right, but it is not the book. But when txtac said To me, the book was kindve a let down. There was so much more that they put into the movie.oh my....... So much was left out from the book(and I really loved this book)..... okay lets agree they are separate entities, each stands in its own right. And each is beautiful and a work of art IMVHO.

My local CityBeat has a critic I like and I watched for his review with fear and trepidation but woohooohe rated it a B. Thats GOOD.Despite his clunky glasses and mortician's suit, Elijah Wood strikes a balance between quirky eccentricity and a grounded devotion to his family, his grandfather's memory and the task at hand.READ More here (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v404/billiep/ReviewCityBeat4.jpg)

More to say but waitsoon others will see this wonderful film and I look forward to hearing their viewsthe promised Oct 14 arrival of EII is there........ Hopefully soon.

saile

p.s. Bunnie :k :k Thanks for all the links and articles and photos. Pleeeze continue.
And ceefour thanks for the link to the Philly article. Loved it. :k

BunnieBugs

10-15-2005, 09:46 AM

I thought you might like to see this blurb from "Inside Entertainment" magazine's "Reel Power: Hollywood's Top 50 Contenders", and Elijah was #7 in the second batch of 25 that was called the "Rising Powers" (the first 25 were the "Reigning Powers"):

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v32/bunniebugs/Elijah/inside_entertainment_crop.jpg

I'm not sure why anyone would call Black & White a "gem", though, unless they were being ironic... :eek: And just for comparison's sake, Robert Rodriguez was #8 and Orlando Bloom was #10. :)

honeyelf

10-15-2005, 09:57 AM

Beautiful, Bunnie! A "Rising Power" that sounds like our Lad alright.

Saile said: I SO WISHED I COULD UNDERSTAND WHAT WAS ACTUALLY BEING SAID. I know in the film Alex DOES NOT translate grandfathers comments accurately to Jonathan. It is part of the humor (very funny). And a lot at Jonathans expense. But I am guessing we are missing a good bit in the subtitled translation if only nuance. Actually it's a lot like Jonathan who is missing a lot.

I read an review of the movie, from a Jewish journal, where the reviewer spoke Ukrainian. He says that the Ukrainian dialogue is much funnier than the translations. It might be hard to translate, with lots of idiomatic speech, though.

honey!

ceefour

10-15-2005, 11:40 AM

Posted by me yesterdayI don't think Hooligans will ever play near me.

What do I know? :rolleyes: I was looking through my newspaper from Friday this morning and GSH opened yesterday at three theaters in the area. :lol:

From The Philadelphia Inquirer, October 14:

Elijah Wood jettisons his hobbit-y ways and becomes a steel-toed, head-bashing thug in Green Street Hooligans, a silly melodrama about friendship and football (the European kind).

Ejected from Harvard on a bum drug rap, journo-major Matt Buckner (Wood) heads to London, where his sister (Claire Forlani, looking forlorn-y) lives with an English lout. The lout's brother is even more loutish--the ringleader of a gang of rabid soccer fans who go around beating up anyone who isn't allied with their team. Matt, being a instinctive investigative reporter, but also a suddenly angry college dropout, insinuates himself into the inner circle of this group, and before he knows it he's fueling up pints and raining down violence in the street.

Saucer-eyed Wood brings a certain nostril-flaring zeal to the proceedings, but the script is a jumble of caricatures and cliches. There's one great soccer match sequence, though.

2 out of 4 stars

C-Howard Shore has been let go from King Kong over "artistic differences." :confused: -4

Mariole

10-15-2005, 11:48 AM

And just for comparison's sake, Robert Rodriguez was #8 and Orlando Bloom was #10.
Yeah, but how were they sitting? I mean, seriously; would you pass that young fellow by as #7? :p

Okay:

BEGIN SPOILERISH DISCUSSION OF THE NEUROSIS OF JONATHAN:

Since no one else started, I will.

Please bear in mind that I have only seen EII once, and have not yet read the book. Ahem! So, here's my uneducated beginning. Please correct any factual errors I might make. Thanks!

Okay, we first see J's "collector" response when he's a wee widdle pumpkin. Man, was Elijah ever so much cuter than the little peanut they picked! However, that has nothing to do with anything. Anyway, little peanut sees Grandfather Safran (right?) die. He doesn't react emotionally. He picks up the amber from beside the bed, and puts it in a baggie. Why? I don't remember anything about J's family; was he orphaned? Why was he unused to displaying emotion? Even Grandmamma wasn't very emotional; she looks sadly at her lost husband, but is very controlled. I would expect that reaction if they had been expecting his death for some time. Perhaps little J didn't understand that?

That part of the nuerosis I'm not sure was ever explained in terms of J's life, but it did find chilling resonance in the surviving sister. I'm wondering, was this some sort of genetic inheritance? When faced with something awful, you collect? There was that wonderfully horrific scene, where peaceful sister X (I forget her name) was there, sweetly collecting items from her murdered friends and family, and putting them in her basket. I'll tell you, I got a nasty knock, the first time I saw the wall of her collection, knowing that this was all that remained of Trachimbrod. It was as if her way of coping with this unbelievable horror had found an echo in the person of Jonathan. She believed that her collection, and her sister's ring in particular, drew him there. So was Jonathan really neurotic, or was he feeling from afar a disturbance in the Force, so to speak, that ultimately led to his journey?

PS: Saile, I loved your commentary!

tgshaw

10-15-2005, 04:24 PM

Many thanks for the continued reviews and articles. I emailed the Philly one to someone I'm trying to encourage to see EII. And, Bunnie, my favorite part of the #7 write-up is the mention of "his incomparable embodiment of Frodo Baggins" :cool: . At least some people get it. I know I'm a voice in the wilderness when it comes to B&W -- It's disgusting to watch, and leaves a bad taste (call Achila for some brain bleach afterward ;) ), but I think that's exactly what it's trying to do. So, in that sense, it's a successful film and isn't "bad" in the sense of poorly made. But the writer's pick of movies to name was strange anyway, such as mentioning B&W and Bumblebee without bringing up The Ice Storm. Forever Young and The War were good picks, though.

-----------------

Okay, I've seen EII once (so far ;) ). I feel like I'm back in my old home town where if you wanted to see a movie more than once you had to rush back to it within the same week--I hope it stays longer than that, but who knows? Of course, we didn't have DVDs back then :p . The theater was about half full for an early Friday night showing, but I don't know if that's good or bad, as it's an unusual theater and draws people who want to see a specific movie rather than a Friday night date crowd looking for something to watch. It was the movie's opening night, so everyone there must have heard about it before it came to town; hopefully good word-of-mouth will spread. Good audience reactions. I was somewhat surprised at how many people in the audience were decidedly beyond middle age. It'd be interesting to know how many of those were Jewish.

Nonspoilerish comments first: I'm surprised more reviews haven't mentioned the music--I loved it! It really carried the tone of the different parts of the movie. Great cinematography, too, but that's been mentioned a lot.

I completely disagree with those reviewers who've said that Alex "steals the show," and even the one that said Liev Schrieber went to Alex for too many "easy laughs." Maybe it's because I've read the book and I know how much Alex humor wasn't used; Liev certainly didn't pad it. I think Elijah very successfully holds the center. As I'm writing this, I'm realizing that I don't really have specific or detailed things to say about Elijah's acting. That'll probably take some time and viewings.

Slightly spoilerish for the movie

Carrying on from my last statement above, I think the addition of Jonathan-only scenes before and after the trip helped cement him as the center of the story. Those scenes are only in the movie, although in the book Jonathan tells Alex some things about his childhood. I loved the "not quite a smile" between Jonathan and his grandmother when she's lying in bed; it's obvious how much they care about each other, even though they don't show it openly.

And, OMG, I adored "little Jonathan"! :D :k A peanut, yes, but what a cute little peanut--and quite an actor, I'd say! I tried to catch his name during the credits but wasn't able to--maybe next time. Seeing how much Jonathan is already Jonathan at that part of his life is hilarious and sad at the same time. And IMHO, Elijah does again what he's done a number of times, particularly with Mikey Carver: take a character who other people in the story (rightly) consider strange and pull the audience into his own understanding of the character as a human being with real emotions and motivations.

End of spoilerish comments

I was going to add some comments labeled "Great Big, Honkin' Book and Movie Spoilers," :p regarding some of the changes from book to movie (two in particular that I wasn't expecting). But those don't really involve Elijah at all, so probably belong elsewhere. I've got to talk about them somewhere, though! Would the thread in the Library work, since everyone there has read the book? The spoilers are really more from the book than the movie (and they'd be big spoilers for the book even for those who've seen the movie, which makes it difficult to discuss in a movie-related thread in the Cinema).

BunnieBugs

10-15-2005, 04:39 PM

And, Bunnie, my favorite part of the #7 write-up is the mention of "his incomparable embodiment of Frodo Baggins" :cool: . I loved that part, as well! I'm reading the book to my older daughter right now, and I can't help but not only picture Elijah in the role, but read the dialogue as I think he might say it. I tried to catch his name during the credits but wasn't able to--maybe next time. His name is Ljubomir Dezera. :)

Alyon

10-15-2005, 05:23 PM

TGShaw:
I completely disagree with those reviewers who've said that Alex "steals the show," and even the one that said Liev Schrieber went to Alex for too many "easy laughs." Maybe it's because I've read the book and I know how much Alex humor wasn't used; Liev certainly didn't pad it. I think Elijah very successfully holds the center

I totally agree. I think Eugene was great--but Elijah's part had a weight to it and I really think it takes a good deal of skill to play that ackward character without it just being tentative and timid. There was a lot of control involved in being able to say those lines that sound a bit removed without them just becoming lightly read.

I was going to add some comments labeled "Great Big, Honkin' Book and Movie Spoilers," regarding some of the changes from book to movie (two in particular that I wasn't expecting).

Oh yeah--I understood many of the liberties Liev took--except....

(slightly spoilerish in essence...though gives nothing away)

...for Alexes grandfather's past. That change pretty much erases much of what the book offers as insight in that area, which was a pretty meaningful part of the book

tgshaw

10-15-2005, 06:40 PM

EII Spoilers-both book and movie-entire post
I just have to talk about this! :o

Oh yeah--I understood many of the liberties Liev took--except....

(slightly spoilerish in essence...though gives nothing away)

...for Alexes grandfather's past. That change pretty much erases much of what the book offers as insight in that area, which was a pretty meaningful part of the book
Yes, rather "turned it inside out," didn't it? Avoided a topic bound to be controversial, something the book never did. The movie kept the good guys good and the bad guys bad and stayed away from looking at the horrendous decisions good people had to make during terrible times. It was the hardest-hitting part of the book for me, especially when Alex thinks of Little Igor and realizes he would have made the same decision his grandfather had.

And since we've warned of spoilers, I found that change, as well as the elimination of Alex's confrontation with his father, completely undermined any understandable motive behind the grandfather's suicide. I'd be interested in knowing why people who've only seen the movie thought he killed himself.

If I'd been the screenwriter/director (oooh, haven't played this game for awhile :p ), I think I would have stuck with the original "very rigid search"--taken the time to get into the grandfather's real past (you could even use those cutaways to the German guns--would be even more effective in that situation, IMHO), and then stop with Jonathan's going home--omitting the suicide completely. IMVHO, the history is more hard-hitting than the suicide is, and would make a more than adequate conclusion to the story. If you omitted the suicide (not denying it, or being inconsistent with the book, since it happens after Jonathan leaves), it would be okay to ignore that third thread of the story about Alex's family; with the suicide included, I feel the story's really incomplete without that thread.

Like I said, nothing really to do with Elijah, or even Jonathan to any large degree. Except if the original end of the search were used, Jonathan would have been more involved in the discovery, which would have added to Elijah's role. When he gives the grandfather the bag of soil, I assume he's figured out the grandfather's (movie) past, although he hasn't been told about it?

---And, besides, if Alex could drive (as he does at the end of the movie), they never would have needed to take grandfather along in the first place. :confused:

Fast Toadfoot

10-15-2005, 10:32 PM

I am going to see Everything is Illuminated tomorrow!!! And yes, TG, you may call me FT!! :) It's taken every bit of my will power to only lightly skim the spoiler-ish comments. I hope to really read them tomorrow night though.

HoneyElf sent me an autographed picture of Elijah Wood, along with two CD's she made of Lij goodies. Thank you so much Honey!!! :D

I've seen All I Want once, and yes, I can't wait to see it again before I make the determination of whether I like it. In looking in-depth at Elijah's movies, www.frodolivesin.us has been of such a big help!!! Thank you!!! The screencaps, summaries and everything else are so awesome!

I like parts of it. Mandy Moore and Franka Potentae didn't work out for me I decided. :eek: So the second viewing I'm gonna really try to pick out the other parts that I thought were cool, (Like his flashbacks and visions and thoughts) And, the thing that I think will make it a good movie, is his processing what happened with his mother and father, and how that has made him the person that he was at the end of the movie. So, after a second, possibly a third movie, I will know!!!

A note about Bumblebee. I know the movie is a lot lighter then the book, (I haven't read the book, but I've heard that's how it is), I wish Mazzo had realised how beautiful life is. I mean, I know this has everything to do with my worldview, but I would have liked for him to live, and embrace life, however long or short it might have been. Cassie and Barney definitely would have been with him through it all, and what if he would have patched things up with his mother??? When Dr. Harriman says, "You have to want to live", I wish she had went into a long, impassioned speech about life and how beautiful and important it is. All that, btw, is IMVHO, of course ;)

EII will be my 18th Elijah movie. And, if I hurry, I could see my 23rd Lij movie on my 23rd birthday, (Halloween!) I think I might go for it. Four more new Elwood movies in the next two weeks, and then a fifth on Monday the 31st!
I just might do it... :lol:

Well, have a good night all, see you!

honeyelf

10-16-2005, 01:34 AM

Oh, dear! :o Um...um, I'm really very sorry that I couldn't have got Elijah to autograph something for everyone here. Poor thing, I'd have had to monopolize him all nigh...(Wait a minute! Why didn't I think of that?! :rolleyes: ) Young Master Toadfoot asked and, being rather fond of young Master Toadfoot, I obliged. But I'm very sorry that I couldn't have done so for everyone of you, as you are all dear friends.

MINOR EII SPOILERS:

I saw the film again yesterday, and liked it even better the third time round. I did notice one thing that I liked very much. Jonathan's eyes, when he wordlessly greets his Grandmother are affectionate in a vague, sort of unfocussed familial way. But later, when everything has been illuminated, he shows so much more true emotion through his eyes for Grandfather Alex, and Lista (Augustine's sister.) Now he understands the value and importance of true connections. ETA: I'm sure when Jonathan saw his Grandma again, his affection was of a much more focussed, aware kind.

TGShaw, I'd like to play "if I had been the screen-writer" too! I think movie Alex got shorted. The death of Grandfather seems meaningless without Alex wresting his freedom from his abusive father as he does in the book. What, besides his newly discovered heritage does movie Alex gain? I'd have left Grandfather's suicide in, but put it in an Epilogue after Jonathan returns to the states, and also show the dreams Alex sacrifices to care for Little Igor, his "miniature" brother.

honey!

Alyon

10-16-2005, 01:35 AM

A late night drive-by post...
SPOILERS for EiI...

TG:
Yes, rather "turned it inside out," didn't it? Avoided a topic bound to be controversial, something the book never did. The movie kept the good guys good and the bad guys bad and stayed away from looking at the horrendous decisions good people had to make during terrible times. It was the hardest-hitting part of the book for me

Yeah, it made an easy weave for the movie, to make his history different, but I totally agree that the real history in the book makes for some real powerful realizations about how people are swept along with events and don't do anything to stop them...because they can't, or they don't know how...and sometimes how they are blind to the signs and let things happen, because they don't know what else to do. And in the book it was clear that everyone on both sides let the signs go by and history took them all along in an avalanche without anyone even knowing how to look at it as it was coming, much less stop it from happening.

And yeah, the movie suicide scene is referred to in Alexes final voice over...something about Alex not knowing why he did it, maybe so his history wouldn't cling to Alex (I don't remember exactly). the whole movie made for much simpler explanations than did the book. The book has no neat explanations...you have to delve in and get dirty and taste different ideas and wallow in impressions and then try to come up with a sense of why things happened. I just love that about the book. It is like a painting, like a good piece of music...you keep seeing and hearing more and coming to new insights. ANd there is no clear one answer to one's questions, but much to build a theory around. Several varying theories, in fact.

But I still thought the movie was agreat. I didn't go expecting the complexities in the book. Liev told us so many things we don't know are really true or not in the book. We don't even know who Agustine really is in the book.

All of that was fine for me---EXCEPT I was very disappointed with the grandfather's past as it guts so much of the intent of the book. And yeah, the suicide was puzzling without the broader context. I totally agree with you on that one, too.

End of spoilers

Nice to see you Fast Toadfoot...I"m one who did not enjoy All I Want...but still I like it when other people do. I like to be wrong about such things ;) I wonder what you'll say when you have let it digest a bit.
HOpe you enjoy EiI!!!
Have fun!!!

ETA: Simulposted with Honey!! Hi HoneyElf!!!!!! :k

honeyelf

10-16-2005, 03:08 AM

:k Hullo, dear Alyon! :k

Master Fast, I'll be interested to hear why you think you like All I Want. I liked it on first viewing; subsequent viewings have elicited a rather strong emotional response from me, one I'd not expected. I find myself particularly moved by Jones' relationship with his mother.

My husband liked the movie very much as well, remembering his own youth when the truth was a rather flexible thing, especially where it regarded girls. (All well before I knew him, I hasten to add! O.T. and on a purely personal note, yesterday was our 23rd wedding anniversary! :D )

More Minor EII spoilers:
I meant to comment earlier on Little Jonathan. "Little peanut" is so right to describe him, Mariole! :) I'd really hoped that the porch conversation would have told more about Little Jonathan's relationship with his Grandmother, as it was in the book.

me again

hugs to you all!

Shelbyshire

10-16-2005, 07:17 AM

*knocks on door...excuse me for interrupting...*

Attention all members conducting research or hanging around the water cooler in The Faculty Lounge, Frodo's Haremites (best not suggest what they might be up to ;) , those playing in Pippin's Playgroup, the "mobbits" of Brandy Hall, do we have any of Sam's Goonies out in the garden?, and, of course, all those KD LotR ringers or non-ringers out there. SandCastles has been maintaining the countdown to Indianapolis for us which now stands at:

6 Days

We are interested in knowing who from KD will be attending the exhibit on Saturday morning and also if you are interested in joining in afterwards for a most entertaining Hobbit activity...*blushes*...no, not that, I was thinking of FOOD! Probably lunch or afternoon tea or supper or a combination of all three. If you wouldn't mind sending a PM to myself, I'll be collecting that info. Send a cell number, a RL name, the dates you'll be in the city and the hotel you're staying at, the number in your entourage, and if you would like to join the group for a meal. SandCastles, thank you again!, has found us a place to gather.

All info will only be for KD members and will be confidential. If I'm not sure of who someone is, I will ask a mod or another member I know first. Thank you!

Shelbyshire

Mariole

10-16-2005, 11:56 AM

Whoops! I wish I could participate more in the discussion, but as many people are discussing the book (which I haven't read yet), I'm skipping past your spoilery parts. Don't worry; I'll catch up in a week. :k

YES, to the music! I adored it. I really think this movie succeeded in capturing a feeling of the Ukraine and a sense of adventure. This is from someone who knows nothing about it, but I did find that aspect delightful.

tgshaw

10-16-2005, 03:15 PM

To Mariole and anyone else who has yet to read the EII book -- Yes, I'm trying to mark any book spoilers specifically, because besides leaving out two of the three story threads in the book (which, IMHO was the only way to make any kind of a movie out of it), the movie also changed some things that I, at least, wasn't expecting to be changed (one in particular that's come up in this "spoilerized" discussion). I've basically said what I needed to say about it at this point in order to avoid bursting at the seams. :p

I'll just say that the book is a much wilder ride, and a more thought-provoking one, than the movie is. :p Not that the movie isn't a great accomplishment on its own (sounds familiar ;) ).

------------

The main part of my website isn't updated yet, but I'm starting the 50th anniversary celebration with a private showing :p . As I did with my Casey Paint Shop pics recently, I dug through files to pull up all the Frodo ones I've done (and since I'd never done any from TTT, I made some new ones from that). I've also split the Paint Shop section into two sequences of pages: Frodo and Everybody Else; don't pay any attention to page numbers at this point. The file was just getting to big to upload all at the same time. There are now something like 15 files making up the entire website, but hopefully that's not obvious when you're navigating. If you run into a jump from one to another that doesn't work, let me know.

One factor is that Paint Shop images seem to take a lot longer to load than regular screencaps. So if you're looking at the pages on a dial-up connection (as I do), have patience, and try refreshing the page if you get any red x's. I've checked, and all the pics have published (finally!), so the only red x's should come from something that hasn't been able to download yet.

You can get to the entire Paint Shop section, as always, by clicking on the "hands" picture on the guest book page (http://frodolivesin.us/Pics/). If you want to start right in on the first of the six pages of new stuff, go here (http://www.frodolivesin.us/picsfrodo/id35.htm).

FT, glad you're finding the site helpful. Wish I had time to go into full discussions of every movie! There are some great discussions of All I Want/Try Seventeen in previous Faculty Lounge threads now residing in the Barrow Downs, if you want to do a search for them. :)

ETA: There's also one small page of new screencaps about one small moment in FotR: http://www.frodolivesin.us/FotR/id52.htm .

esmeraldabrandybuck

10-16-2005, 03:59 PM

Has tg been "playing" with Frodo again? :eek:

Love the chrome effects, and especially the outline one (#9) on the ROTK list: Frodo and Sam in Mordor. Just look at Frodo's face, his hair, and especially his eyes. It seems to epitomize the fiece determination of his inner self to keep the quest alive, even when his body was failing him. :cool: Thanks EW. Thanks tg. :)

http://www.frodolivesin.us/picsfrodo/1081b4e0.jpg

Mechtild

10-16-2005, 04:19 PM

tg, I just wanted to drop in and say I just looked at your latest "little scene" from FotR you linked from your site., the one of Frodo receiving the mithril corselet from Bilbo in Rivendell. I confess I usually spend my time cruising through caps of that scene to pore over the "Frodo-unbuttoning-his-shirt" ones. :rolleyes: :D I never have really looked at the preceding caps in detail. They are gorgeous. And your comments point the viewer to the best appreciation of them. Yes, his work there is just beautiful. Thanks so much for helping me to see it better.

P.S. I looked at more of your paintshop work, too, and there was much to admire. I would have left a note in your "guestbook," but for some reason a text box would not come up to write in when I clicked it.

Other than that, I have enjoyed reading the spoilers. Having read the book (thankyou, honeyelf!), I have found it very interesting to hear what the director/adaptors decided to leave in, take out or alter.

~ Mechtild

Fast Toadfoot

10-16-2005, 07:57 PM

I saw Everything is Illuminated today!!! It was wonderful. Elijah really plays the character awesomely. Jonathan Safran Foer. I instantly tried to think of ways that I am like Jonathan. I always try to relate to Lij's characters. I will definitely see it again. And I was mistaken, it was my 19th Elijah movie, because I forgot to count Back to the Future II. :)

Jonathan is so quirky and so eccentric, I love that. He doesn't eat meat, he's afraid of dogs in the beginning, but in the end, he and Alex are so close, and when Alex calls after him in the end, and when Jonathan kisses the dog that he's so afraid of early in the movie, everything comes full circle. It was an awesome movie. I really felt it. Can't wait to see it again! G'night! Must do laundry tonight.

saile

10-17-2005, 06:49 AM

I'll start with non spoilers stuff ......About ALL I WANT/TRY SEVENTEEN.....I loved it. It pulled me in surprisingly....... Like Honeyelf....
I liked it on first viewing; subsequent viewings have elicited a rather strong emotional response from me, one I'd not expected. I find myself particularly moved by Jones' relationship with his mother.I've cried during the conversations with his mother. But I like the Franka Potente relationship as well. I do remember reading reviews , usually by male critics, who question the likelihood of that relationship, thinking that Jones is way too young or lacking in appeal to attract the more mature Jane. Little does he(the critic) know I said to myself, ...he has NO idea....well ..........I think I best keep the rest to myself. :o :D :o :D

NO Spoilers EII discussion...
YES, to the music! I adored it. I really think this movie succeeded in capturing a feeling of the Ukraine and a sense of adventureI did buy the soundtrack and think it stands on its own as well. I loved it too, A perfect fit for the film.

Movie SPOILERS
Mariole, when you saidShe believed that her collection, and her sister's ring in particular, drew him there. So was Jonathan really neurotic, or was he feeling from afar a disturbance in the Force, so to speak, that ultimately led to his journey?This scene is in the book but I dont think I can discuss the movie version without drawing from the book nor without seeing the movie again. It is cryptic for me to say the least.

SPOILERS BOOK and MOVIE

I was so glad to see your take here Tg.
I completely disagree with those reviewers who've said that Alex "steals the show," and even the one that said Liev Schrieber went to Alex for too many "easy laughs." Maybe it's because I've read the book and I know how much Alex humor wasn't used; Liev certainly didn't pad it. I think Elijah very successfully holds the center. After reading similar reviews I was baffled upon seeing the movie as IMHO Elijah does indeed hold the center. Alex is easily and immediately the more likeable character and funny although in the film so much of the humor is situational and depends upon other (Jonathan and Grandfather and Sammy Davis Jr Jr) characters. He delivers the line but it requires all of them to work. And by contrast to the book, movie Alex is subtle, IMHO. His character loses a lot in the movie in that he doesnt make that profound change Alex does in the book. Doesnt he just shrug when Jonathan gives him the chain/necklace/artifact (what is it?)???
Again TgWhen he gives the grandfather the bag of soil, I assume he's figured out the grandfather's (movie) past, although he hasn't been told about it?Jonathan must have figured it out, for that scene to make sense, Again giving Jonathans character real substance. It is Jonathan's character that makes the obvious change in the movie IMHO.

On my lists of things to do: See movie again.

saile

Achila

10-17-2005, 01:18 PM

Hi boys and girls!

Well, I'm back ;) from 10 days in the Holy Land. Colorado, that is. ;)

Last night, Pelagia, ceefour and I got to see Hooligans again -- first time for ceefour. Unexpectedly, it showed up at a movie theatre not too far from where we live, so we couldn't possibly pass up the opportunity, especially not knowing how long it was going to stay there. We were all of 5 people in the audience and since it wasn't advertised anywhere, we had no idea how the other couple knew about it -- but there we were, watching Elijah aka Matt bloodied and battered -- hooray! -- strange thing to say, but you guys understand! And I have to say that I liked it better the second time, although I did like it the first time too. Both Pelagia and I cringed from the same line -- ***SPOILER****

"He's been ****ing stabbed!"

(or maybe not so much a spoiler, but set apart for your viewing protection anyway)

just like we did the first time, but that was it -- the rest made perfect sense to me in that being in such a vulnerable state, the charismatic Pete totally drew Matt in. I even thought Claire Forlani did a good job with her role, which I hadn't really noticed the first time around.

Two things to add to recent discussions -- TG, your new sig line has the date October 20 in it -- that's my Mom's birthday (as well as Viggo's, btw) -- she's going to be 80 on Thursday. And as for Elijah reading LOTR, he recently said that he finally got through it, although he skipped parts (which is what I do, to tell the truth).

Anyway, glad to be with you guys on our 10th :eek: thread!

tgshaw

10-17-2005, 01:27 PM

TG, your new sig line has the date October 20 in it
Welcome back, Achila :)

Yes, October 20 is the big day!! RotK was published on October 20, 1955, so on October 20, 2005, the full text of LotR becomes 50 years old. I put that particular quote in my sig because I get a laugh out of the reason the Professor tells his publishers that they have to get the book out on schedule. :D

Last month I used the September 1955 quote where Tolkien tells the publishers that if Vol. III isn't published soon, "I shall be murdered." :haha:

honeyelf

10-17-2005, 01:47 PM

Welcome back, Achila! (I didn't know Colorado was the "holyland!" :eek: ;) )

I've missed you too, CeeFour, and Pelagia!

Achila, your GSH cringeworthy line and mine are the same. Not two syllabyls you'd waste your breath to utter in a crisis, nor would you want to risk offending the very people who's help you need. I'd think not anyhow.

Achila

10-17-2005, 01:51 PM

Welcome back, Achila! (I didn't know Colorado was the "holyland!" :eek: ;) ) It is to me! And thanks for the welcome back -- the trip was fraught with all sorts of weird difficulties, so it's nice to be back home again (heehee).

Achila, your GSH cringeworthy line and mine are the same. Not two syllabyls you'd waste your breath to utter in a crisis, nor would you want to risk offending the very people who's help you need. I'd think not anyhow.Yep, that's it exactly -- it surely doesn't ring true to the character, who, despite the friends he's recently acquired, is a smart, nice, cultured boy at heart. And he'd certainly have nothing to gain by trying to impress them with that sort of language in that situation.

txtac

10-17-2005, 03:57 PM

Welcome back Achila!

Anyone who has access to TOTAL FILM magazine, there is a large article in this months edition on GREEN STREET HOOLIGANS! I would oblige everyone, but my lap top is still drawing with crayons (can't scan, or post pics right now). I know that a lot of you have your own web pages, please grab this months issue of TOTAL FILM and post the article for the rest of the Faculty who do not have access to it. Thank you. :z:

BunnieBugs

10-17-2005, 04:37 PM

txtac, is that the October issue of Total Film? I know there was an article in the August issue, and I'm wondering if what you're talking about is a second article? And I'm also wondering if there are both British and American versions of this mag, because the August article was definitely about "Green Street" rather than GSH.

EDIT: I thought this opening paragraph from this review of "Elizabethtown" (http://news.hollywoodawards.com/Article.asp?ContentID=12547&Color=Gray) was interesting:

Question: What do Jake Gyllenhaal, Topher Grace, Ryan Gosling, Heath Ledger, and Elijah Wood have in common, besides the obvious answer that theyre all talented, good-looking and under 30? Answer: Each one of them wouldve been a better choice to play Drew Baylor, the conflicted young character at the center of writer-director Cameron Crowes new comedy-drama Elizabethtown, than Orlando Bloom, the actor Crowe inexplicably decided upon for the role. I like Orlando, and I think this reviewer was extraordinarily hard on him, but I've gotta like the company that Elijah is keeping in that first sentence. :cool:

saile

10-19-2005, 06:38 AM

Hi boys and girls!
Well, I'm back .....Anyway, glad to be with you guys on our 10th :eek: thread!
I intended to say Welcome back Achila..missed you.....before Khazadum-Dum took a rest. I am glad WE are back this AM as well. Thanks Moggy.Yes I read how I can help, thanks. It's timely.

A number of us are heading to Indy for the Exhibit :D :D shortly. Wish us good weather. No doubt it will be FUN.
saile

whiteling

10-19-2005, 06:56 AM

Hurray! KD is back :k! Thanks, Moggy! (That rest was a good "reminder", I think)

A number of us are heading to Indy for the Exhibit :D :D shortly. Wish us good weather. No doubt it will be FUN.
saile
Here's wishing loads of good weather :z: and heaps of fun :) !! Save journey, all! (And behave yourselves ;) )

In other news, my Elwood Google alert has informed me that TMFKAH is now out on DVD in Germany! At that, under the one and only title, "Hooligans". How come? :confused: But I suppose that means NO cinema release here at all :( .

Achila

10-19-2005, 07:14 AM

I intended to say Welcome back Achila..missed you.....before Khazadum-Dum took a rest. Thanks, Saile -- and everyone else who wished me a welcome back.

This is a very interesting little article from MTV.com regarding our lad and the other LOTR boys and their recent career exploits -- note the quotes from John Rhys-Davies on Elijah and Orlando.

http://www.mtv.com/movies/news/articles/1511575/10142005/story.jhtml

txtac

10-19-2005, 11:00 AM

Whiteling wrote: my Elwood Google alert has informed me that TMFKAH is now out on DVD in Germany!
Over on IMDb, someone from Vienna, Austria was saying that Hooligans came out on DVD there October 14th.

Bunnie, I will have to go look at the date again on the Total Film mag. I just saw the "new" edition on the magazine rack, so assumed it is October.

BunnieBugs

10-19-2005, 11:26 AM

Over on IMDb, someone from Vienna, Austria was saying that Hooligans came out on DVD there October 14th. Apparently, the DVD is available for rental only, until early December, when it will be available for purchase. I wasn't aware that some places do that! Here in the states, the rental or purchase option is always available at the same time.

Bunnie, I will have to go look at the date again on the Total Film mag. I just saw the "new" edition on the magazine rack, so assumed it is October.
Thanks, txtac -- I actually found the magazine during the time that KD was down. ( :( ) I didn't buy it (I know, I know... :eek: ...but I just can't afford (either time or space) to buy every single mag that comes out), but I did read the article. It was pretty good, but didn't really cover much new ground, as far as I could see. Oh, and it is, indeed, the October issue. Thanks for pointing it out!

txtac

10-19-2005, 11:37 AM

At the Regal, Arbor Cinema, we have playing:

Everything is Illuminated
Thumbsucker
Green Street Hooligans
March of the Penguins

My eyes hurt...

whiteling

10-19-2005, 12:01 PM

Apparently, the DVD is available for rental only, until early December, when it will be available for purchase. I wasn't aware that some places do that! Here in the states, the rental or purchase option is always available at the same time.
Yep, Bunnie, it is available for rental since yesterday and can be pre-ordered. *rubs hands* - I'll have it on December 1st :cool: - but such a strange release convention was new to me, either.

Achila

10-19-2005, 12:02 PM

Yep, Bunnie, it is available for rental since yesterday and can be pre-ordered. *rubs hands* - I'll have it on December 1st :cool: - but such a strange release convention was new to me, either.Considering the odd release schedule they've got going here in the States, I suppose nothing would surprise me anymore.

whiteling

10-19-2005, 12:05 PM

Considering the odd release schedule they've got going here in the States, I suppose nothing would surprise me anymore.
Mhm. "Odd Lot" - Nomen est Omen :D

(Btw, welcome back, Achila :)!

txtac

10-19-2005, 03:39 PM

Whiteling wrote: ...it is available for rental since yesterday and can be pre-ordered.
What would happen if you "rented" it and just sort of never returned it? Would the cost of the rental disc be more than the retail price in December?

Nomen est Omen
O.K. I'll bite. I know that it is Latin, but what is the literal translation in a modern language?

shilohmm

10-19-2005, 04:41 PM

O.K. I'll bite. I know that it is Latin, but what is the literal
translation in a modern language?

"The name is an omen" - i.e., Odd Lot's movie is being released oddly...

Sheryl

Mariole

10-19-2005, 04:55 PM

At the Regal, Arbor Cinema, we have playing:

Everything is Illuminated
Thumbsucker
Green Street Hooligans
March of the Penguins
:lol:

Thanks for the article and review links, Achila and Bunnie! Love the "under 30" one. :)

Saile, I really enjoyed your EII movie/book post. I hope to catch up soon!

txtac

10-20-2005, 09:32 AM

Shilohmm posted: "The name is an omen" - i.e., Odd Lot's movie is being released oddly...
Thank you for the explination of Nomen est Omen. It really does fit. Not in just how they are releasing the movie, but how they do business. too. They really are just an odd Lot. :D

shilohmm

10-20-2005, 11:44 AM

Hubby actually took the day off tomorrow, so we might get down to Indy in time for me to see EII with the troops. Looks at "To Do" list. Maybe. :p

So my question for anyone who has seen it is - would EII be appropriate for my 12-year-old daughter? I have been assiduously avoiding spoilers so only have the vaguest idea of what it's about. Going on what I know I think she'll like it just fine, but I don't know much beyond the fact that Elijah plays an American who's in Europe exploring his roots. :p

Sheryl

txtac

10-20-2005, 02:24 PM

Shilohmm asked: So my question for anyone who has seen it is - would EII be appropriate for my 12-year-old daughter?
Yes! Absolutely. There is no sex, drugs, or violence in this movie, so it is safe for "family outings." The character Alex played by Eugene Hutz tries to comment about his prowess with the women, but his english is so bad that it is humorous. Some of the other mothers on this page might say more about it for a 12 year old, but from what I remember when I was 12 (yes I have outgrown it... :p ) the subject matter should be tame for any current batch of 12 year olds.

The first part of the movie is humorous dealing with Jonathan's (Elijah Wood) arrival and the road trip. The second part of the movie is more somber when they deal with the holocost. That will give you something to talk to your 12 year old about at least.

Mariole

10-20-2005, 02:47 PM

I concur with Txtac. It's a lovely, funny movie, but it does have some mature themes.

tgshaw

10-20-2005, 03:17 PM

My two bits on EII for a 12-year-old. In the second half, there are a few "disturbing images" -- mostly during the Holocaust flashbacks, but one that takes place in the "real time" of the movie. No sex, no violence, but you very much encounter death (you don't see any of the deaths actually happen; I don't know if that makes them easier or harder to take). IMHO, if your daughter is someone who can "debrief" and talk about it afterward, she'd probably be fine, and have a lot to reflect on. OTOH, if she's someone who would stuff it inside and have nightmares about it... :(

shilohmm

10-20-2005, 03:18 PM

Thanks, guys. :)

I guess I'll dig out my copy of Perverse Destiny :rolleyes: - er, I mean, The Witness ;) - and show it to her as sort of a warm up. That'll probably freak her out more than anything in EII! And it's one of the few Elijah flicks I've got she hasn't seen... Don't believe I'll let any of the younger ones watch it, though. Bit too scary for them, especially since the first question eldest son asks is always, "Is it real? Did that really happen once?" :(

Sheryl

Edit:

Thanks, tg. She's had less exposure to the Holocaust than I had at her age - I think her main exposure to WW II is as background noise in fiction - but she's been exposed to some of the same concepts motivating Hitler (in anime, oddly enough...). I think it we watch The Witness and discuss it, she'll be okay. I always try to cover that sort of thing before we're in the movie theatre, since I discourage conversation there. :p

Sheryl

saile

10-20-2005, 04:46 PM

Oh IMHO The Witness is much more disturbing because it happens in real time and it is a child. In EII you don't actually SEE it, just the aftermath. Probably depends upon how much one/she/anybody knows coming in to see the movie. Aw yes....except for the ONE scene but...well ..........recently speaking with a librarian friend we had an amusing discussion about family movies. She noted that it means different things to different people, families.

When a patron asks for a family movie, she now asks what the child has recently enjoyed because apparently in some families The Ring 2 or Texas Chain Saw Massacre is just right for the family Friday night movie. Others are looking for Anne of Avonlea. No kidding. Go figure.
saile

tgshaw

10-20-2005, 05:31 PM

I'd agree that if she can handle The Witness, she can handle EII, even the ONE scene. Kind of hard to say much about it without giving away big spoilers for Mom.

But, yes, the movie assumes that viewers have some knowledge of the Holocaust, because it doesn't explain it or go into any background. An idea of how long ago it happened... Where Germany is in relation to the Ukraine and why the German army was in the Ukraine to begin with... Some knowledge of the "final solution," although I don't know that that can include an understanding of it... No concentration camps involved in this story, but entire villages being wiped off the map as if they never existed, as the Nazis advance.

And there are some things in the flashback scenes that have become such ingrained symbols that most adults probably don't even consciously interpret them: black jackboots, yellow stars being worn... They're not explained.

She probably already knows what a Torah scroll is, but if not she needs to because it's talked about without being shown or explained.

----------------

ETA: I should say, after seeing EII a second time, that the field of sunflowers is w-a-a-y-y bigger than I thought. That is one huge field of sunflowers :eek: ! So I've come to a belated admiration of what it took to plant it :cool: . (Per recent discussion :o .)

honeyelf

10-20-2005, 11:56 PM

Hullo! Am back very briefly, then will shoot off again in the morning.

I saw Thumbsucker last night. It was a very good film, and Lou Taylor Pucci was excellent as the title character. I can make those two statements assuredly because there were only a few times when I thought about Elijah, and what he might have done differenlty, a very few times. Per the recent discussion, don't take the 12 year-old to see Thumbsucker!

(I could not say the same for the recent Peter Pan movie, where Jeremy Sumpter played Pan. Based on the rumors that the director had originally wanted Elijah for the role, and that years of funding nightmares prevented that, I sorely missed Elijah's much more capable acting. )

Huge HUGS to all; I've missed you!

honey!

Alyon

10-21-2005, 12:13 AM

Oh, Honey!!! IMVHO Peter Pan was very well acted. :haha:
I think J.S. was perfect for that part!!
:D Go watch it again!!
See ya!! :k

BunnieBugs

10-22-2005, 09:59 AM

A younger Elijah as Peter Pan would have been fantastic! I actually liked JS, but he would not hold a candle to Elijah.

I found a great article/review about GSH, from someone who understands the film much better than most of the critics and definitely better than Hollywood:

Green Street (http://blogcritics.org/archives/2005/10/22/064418.php)

ceefour

10-22-2005, 12:17 PM

Thanks, BunnieBugs, for that link.

Pelagia, achila, and I saw Hooligans last weekend. It just showed up unexpectedly at 3 area theaters (and is now gone). After having read so many wildly divergent reviews, I really wasn't sure what to expect. As honeyelf pointed out in another thread, maybe because EW's fans identify with him and, consequently, his character, we are able to believe in the story more, despite inconsistencies in the plot. I liked it and the journey Matt takes. Standing your ground doesn't have to be fists and blood. It means finding and believeing in the value of oneself.

We hope to see EII tomorrow.

C4

txtac

10-22-2005, 12:52 PM

Finally an intellegent critical review of the movie. A critic finally does "get it." Thank you Bunnie for posting that. I am going to paste the entire interview over on IMDb and the Green Street Hooligans message boards. Let them cuss and discuss this review !

Alyon

10-23-2005, 12:41 PM

Where is everybody??? :confused: So quiet....

Shilohmm, how did the EiI viewing go???

Prim

10-23-2005, 03:51 PM

Alyon: I loved JS in Peter Pan as well. We rented it recently and the boys and I both loved it and watched it several times (I really liked Hook too). I think EW would have been EXCELLENT as Peter, he has that naughty sparkle in his eyes a lot quite naturally- no acting needed to bring out the wayward I think ;) , but OMG it would have been such a career disaster. He already was being mocked quite openly about his youthful looks- this would only have put nails in his coffin. So I'm releieved the opportunity passed him by.

We had Fellowship on tv here last night and (despite having the video :rolleyes: ) the boys insisted we watch it. After rather an absence I found myself watching it with fresh eyes. And I think EW's Frodo is easily his best piece of work yet. It's astounding how in this film I still don't see EW , only the character. In all the others I've seen I've never quite been able to do that. The hair helps I guess... but I think its much more than that. I think he was particularly suited to the role and that he gave it his all. Lucky for us. :)

Fast Toadfoot

10-23-2005, 08:49 PM

Yes, Prim, Frodo really shone through in LOTR. It was so awesome. Nobody could have played Frodo better then Lij; he was perfectly cast.

I watched All I Want again the other night. I'm still not sure if I like it. Though, I really did get the sense that there was a lot going on inside Jones Dillon's head.

I watched half of Sin City, about an hour into it, I got really tired wasn't really feeling that good anyway. It was very artfully done; it was kind of different seeing a movie done in graphic novel form. Elijah as Kevin! Wow. That was interesting.

Bunnie, I liked that review of TMFKAH, I still haven't seen it yet though! I hope to be able to get to, but I don't know if it's coming to St. Louis.

Alyon

10-24-2005, 01:56 AM

Prim, it's wonderful to see you. And yeah, I think JS was really a natural as PP, and yes, it would have been a bad career move for Elijah to have taken that role at the time the movie was made. He was on to older roles by then and also it would have been oh so pigeon-holing for him to step into another fantasy role.

And you whet my appetite for Fellowship. I've been thinking it's time for another viewing!!

FT, thanks for sharing your impressions. Sounds like you aren't quite sure what you think of Sin City yet? I didn't much like All I Want, but I just looked in a movie guide in a book store in which it got a pretty good review--along with Elijah's performance. As I said before, in this area I like it when people disagree with me. I actually actively disliked the movie, but I"d rather I were in the minority. ;)

Mariole

10-24-2005, 09:40 AM

Just dropping in to violently agree with Prim. I don't see EW in Frodo at all, and I'm sometimes disappointed when I see what I think is a peep of him in other characters. Perhaps it's because the world Frodo lives in (and his look) is so very different from our modern one, that these resonances with normal reality just don't occur. But I fell in love with his Frodo during FOTR and remain in love with it. Likely it is the source more than the acting, because I think EW has done some fine work in other roles. But Frodo gets the actual love in large, generous doses. :k

ETA:
As much as an actor can vary characterizations, there are always going to be little movements that are just intrinsic to a person's face, no matter what they're doing to it.
How funny, I was just noticing this yesterday watching a completely different actor in a different movie! Yes, so many things are the same; sometimes it startles me, like that nod you mention, and other times it just blends in. That said, I really enjoyed the character portrayal of Jonathan very much. The glasses really helped me view him as a unique entity, so there were actually very few "Frodo" callbacks. Also, whatever accent he used in EII was completely invisible to me; no Frodo overtones at all. :)

Achila

10-24-2005, 09:49 AM

Just dropping in to violently agree with Prim. I don't see EW in Frodo at all, and I'm sometimes disappointed when I see what I think is a peep of him in other characters. Pelagia, ceefour and I saw EII last night -- it was ceefour's first time, and one of the things we remarked about, after having seen GSH last weekend, was how radically different Elijah's performance was as Jonathan vs. Matt. But of course, it's impossible not to see tiny little "Frodo moments" -- the slight nod just before getting onto the escalator in the airport, the sad eyes, etc. -- but that's more to do with Elijah's face, I think, than his acting. As much as an actor can vary characterizations, there are always going to be little movements that are just intrinsic to a person's face, no matter what they're doing to it. And of course, because Frodo is so iconic, particularly to us, it's easy to see those movements and think, "Ah -- Frodo's nod, etc.", when in reality, it's probably just Elijah being Elijah.

One note about EII -- if you can, try to see it more than once, because I picked up a whole lot more the second time around. Usually, the second time is when I stop paying 100% attention to you know who and realize that there actually ARE other actors in the film!

BunnieBugs

10-25-2005, 12:17 AM

Just popping in to let you know that OddLot says that the Region 1 DVD of GSH will be available in March. :cool:

Achila, I agree with you about the second viewing of EII. I also caught a lot more, and was able to watch it much more carefully. I also found it more affecting the second time, which surprised me!

saile

10-25-2005, 08:06 AM

if you can, try to see it more than once, because I picked up a whole lot more the second time around. I also found it more affecting the second time, which surprised me!Oh I so agree with that! I know some have found the implication?/inference of violence too strong to become a favorite but I LOVE this film. I have seen it four times now (again in Indianapolis with KD friends- more later) and have found it more engrossing with each viewing. The first viewing is a different experience than the fourth. The first just taking it all in, referencing the book and the changes made, the critics reviews and evaluating TOL. Awwwww very good indeed. The second, cementing ones first impressions and then noting how well the cast plays off each other. The ACTING is top notch all around, simply superb. By the third being totally absorbed in the movie and its journey, without reference to the book or the critics. What a wonderful job Liev did here. On the fourth viewing with friends responding to the film, I saw new things as they cried and laughed. Maybe it is playing in art houses of the movie industry because it IS a work of art. Maybe not available content-wise to all, but appreciated by many. Hey it is FRESH on rotten tomatoes (saile knocks on wood here).

SPOILERS

Question? So what do you think Liev intended when Jonathan, towards the end of the film, makes a connection with the people at the airport. The woman, boy and man are played by the same actors that appeared in the film earlier in different roles. Jonathan has changed and is now connecting, thinking of his goodbye to Sammy Davis Jr. Jr. and to Alex And of course when he made the bag for Grandfather from the river bank and actually gave it to him. Is he connecting to strangers, opening up a bit or recognizing in these faces that seem familiar that the world is smaller than he thought and we all have some things in common?? Or something else??????

END SPOILERS

Good news about the DVD of GSH being released in March. Woo hoo! Thanks Bunnie :k

Mechtild

10-25-2005, 08:17 AM

You make a good suggestion in your "Spoilers" section, saile, for interpreting the airport scene. I had been toying with various interpretations for that recurrence of the people from the Ukraine. I like yours better. :cool:

~ Mechtild

ceefour

10-25-2005, 08:50 AM

OT, but LOTR related.

Last night (in a gusty rain storm), Pelagia, Achila, and I went to hear Alan Lee speak about his new book, The Lord of the Rings Sketchbook. Not nearly long enough, of course. He spoke quite a bit of how he started using Paint Shop towards the end of filming. Especially beautiful was the tiled ceiling he created above the throne in Minas Tirith with Paint Shop.

He had photos of the bigatures of Osgiliath, Minas Tirith, and the Grey Havens. I'm sure we've all seen the documentaries about these, but the enormity of the size of these things was more apparent in his pictures than in the EE DVDs. Alex Funke said how the top of Minas Tirith nearly touched the ceiling, but AL had the picture. In contrast, he also showed how small the details were with a close-up picture of Minas Tirith with a roll of film case in the picture as a reference.

An abandoned concept was having the five Istari sail to Middle-earth on the Elven ship that carries Frodo away.

The lava in the Cracks of Doom as the Ring melts looks suspiciously like the pepperoni pizza Jim Rygiel and the Weta Digital staff were living on by the end of production of ROTK.

He had sketches of Minas Tirith statues in armor and how the armor had to be connected to what the soldiers wear at the time of the story.

He is soft-spoken, and he would turn towards the screen and it was difficult to hear sometimes. I felt like my father sometimes, with my hand cupped behind my ear!

He had a sketch of Denethor surveying the Pelennor Fields while walking his dog! :lol:

We saw EII on Sunday.

Spoiler

Changing the Grandfather's past completely alters one of the themes of the book. BookAlex is freed from the past by the Grandfather's suicide, but MovieAlex says only by remembering the past can he be free. The storyline of Alex's abusive father isn't developed past the scene of Alex being punched at the table, so Grandfather's death to free Alex from the past so he can save himself, his brother and mother isn't needed.

Liev Schriber has said he as a terrible memory and when his grandfather died, he was afraid he would forget him. I wonder if this is part of why the story was changed.

It is tricky to watch movies after reading books. I knew of the changes, and tried to watch with fresh eyes, but I am not sure it was successful. After one viewing, the changes undermine the book story, but I would have to watch the movie again to see if the characters' actions make sense for the movie story.

End Spoiler

In a couple of weeks, Pelagia and I will see Savion Glover, who will be the happy feet in Happy Feet. Apparently, I am a bad influence on Pelagia and Achila, as I casually mention going somewhere and somehow they find themselves there. Maybe because I'm the driver? ;) (Anybody want to go to New Zealand?)

C4

Achila

10-25-2005, 08:52 AM

I have a slight variation on saile's interpretation, due to the scene that comes right before that. Alex writes about the past and the way it affects us in the present, and I think seeing the people in the airport (and the slight nod of acknowledgement) is symbolic of coming to terms with the trip and that it now informs "Jonfen's" life.

ETA -- Obviously, I simulposted with ceefour and wanted to add one thing about Grandfather's "choice"...

****SPOILER*****

I had initially thought that Grandfather's suicide (after revealing his true background) had to do with self-loathing regarding giving up his background. But after watching Boris Leskin's performance a little more closely this time around, I saw that he appeared to be much more at peace than I had noticed previously, and Alex says of him that he appeared to be where he wanted to be for the first time in his life. So now, I'm thinking that the suicide was Grandfather's way of showing that his life was complete -- he was done, he had nothing further to do.

Still very interested to know why Liev changed that ending. We discussed it a bit and I can only conclude that for him, personally, renouncing faith and living with the consequences of that was more meaningful than the revelation JSF has in the book.

honeyelf

10-25-2005, 11:42 AM

Great post CeeFour. Excellent observations about how Dee-yed Alex's end differed in the book and the film. I guess I need to see it a fourth time. Any word on when that DVD will be out?

Good news about TMFKAH, Bunnie! Wish I could have you all over to see it on my big screen! (Mine's bigger than Elijah's! ;) )

I found a cheap videotape of Child in the Night and watched it, completist geek that I am. The direction, writing and dialogue were dreadful. Probably standard for a TV film of the era. Elijah had some nice emotional moments. But he had some of the worst dialogue, with lines no eight year-old kid would come up with. It was almost like the director saw Elijah's intelligence, and tried to direct him like a little adult.

I wonder if Bobby has started filming yet? They only have a limited amount of time to film on location before the Ambassador Hotel is torn down.

honey!

ETA: an interesting article HERE (http://movies.yahoo.com/mv/news/va/20050825/112497289100p.html) indicates that filming of Bobby is to start today, and that the Ambassador won't be used, but will be "re-created" on soundstages.

ETAAgain:
Look! It's Mumbles!
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/mumbles.jpg
Oh dear! Looking at that little penguin, I can just imagine Elijah doing that little chipmunk voice he does! :eek:
From HERE (http://movies.indiatimes.com/quickies/1257321.cms)

shilohmm

10-25-2005, 01:12 PM

Shilohmm, how did the EiI viewing go???

Quite well, I think. Asked eldest daughter if she liked it, she said she did, but she says that about any movie she thinks I like. :p So I asked her if she wanted to go see it again, and she said, "Of course!" - which she does not always say. So I guess she really did like it. :D

I liked it, but that probably goes without saying. Hey, I even enjoyed EJW's bits in Ash Wednesday. :p I think there are parallels between Elijah's characters in EII and in All I Want, in that they are both very "interior" (in an impassive way that Frodo isn't, in the movie version), and that it might be interesting to compare the handling of the two, because his character in EII is much more successfully handled than his character in AIW, I think.

I was caught up more by EII than by AIW - it's a much more stylized movie, telling a much more dramatic story - but I'm one who enjoyed both. I get the impression that EII is getting more consistently positive Faculty reviews than AIW did-? I need to go back and re-read all the spoilerish comments I skipped - haven't done that yet. :o

Sheryl

honeyelf

10-26-2005, 10:58 AM

Found this wandering around in LiveJournal. HERE (http://star94.com/steve_vikki/ElijahWood_index.cfm) There is a really nice audio interview linked there. Elijah talks about Ice Storm, LoTR, doing SNL, and even discusses the end of Radio Flier.

honey!

Skater girl

10-26-2005, 11:33 AM

Thank you so much for that link Honeyelf. It is such a pleasure to hear Elijah talking in this way, especially after all the typical, repetetive press junket type interviews of the last few months.

Looks like we in the UK will be getting EII next month, so hopefully we can join in the conversations again then.

whiteling

10-26-2005, 02:56 PM

Ja! Ja! erm... sorry, I mean Yes! Yes! :D - I've just learned that the German cinema release date of EII is on December 15th!
I'm with Skater girl on this - it is quite impossible to join the discussion in here, not having seen the film (and not knowing the book either).

But, Honey, nice news on Mumbles :), and thanks for the interview link!

saile

10-26-2005, 03:17 PM

Oh thanks Honeyelf, :k wonderful interview. Love hearing him talk about choosing his own films......starting with the Faculty. Interesting.
saile

tgshaw

10-26-2005, 07:17 PM

Woo-hoo!! Our first look at Mumble :cool: ! Thanks, Honey. I'm at work with no audio on the computer so haven't listened to the interview (I don't think I've ever used an MP3 before--do they open with just about anything on the computer?) But I liked the print write-up, too - one of the best overviews of Elijah's career that I've seen. One statement I particularly liked:
As the soulfully dazed and confused Mikey Carver, Wood gave a portrayal remarkable for its rendering of the thoughtfulness and exquisite hopelessness inherent in the character.
Finally, Honey, yes, your observations about Child in the Night are pretty standard for a "Movie of the Week" from that era. They were normally slapped together very quickly. IMHO, Day-O fared a bit better than CitN because it didn't make any pretense of being serious drama.

Of course, Child in the Night gives an opportunity to see Little Lij's rendition of Peter Pan. ;)

...And I think EW's Frodo is easily his best piece of work yet. It's astounding how in this film I still don't see EW , only the character.... but I think its much more than that. I think he was particularly suited to the role and that he gave it his all. Lucky for us. :)
Hi, Prim :k !! and I absolutely agree with all you said! Even if I look at a screencap of Frodo and try to see Elijah in it, I can't. I find that to be somewhat true in the movies where he does his best acting - Huck Finn, The War, The Ice Storm - but not as true as with Frodo.

I think there's a combination of reasons for that. The long shooting schedule gave a chance to really become the character in a way that probably wouldn't be possible in a quick shoot, especially for an actor like Elijah who works from within the character. His statements about moments when he really felt like he was a hobbit, and the sense of being surrounded by Middle-earth, say something about it, too, I think. And I'm sure it helped having a director who wouldn't take "good enough" as, well, good enough, but would push him to get even deeper into the character (Ang Lee seemed able to do that, too).

But if I can pull a bit from the part of letter #328 that I quoted in this month's essay (http://www.frodolivesin.us/id307.htm):
Very well: that may explain to some extent why it [LotR] 'feels' like history; why it was accepted for publication; and why it has proved readable for a large number of very different kinds of people. But it does not fully explain what has happened.
In the same way, IMHO all the rational explanations that can be given for the existence of Frolijah don't "fully explain what has happened." I wish Elijah a long, happy, and varied acting career, but he was meant to play Frodo. And, personally speaking, I have no doubt that the Professor had something to do with the chain of coincidences (if coincidence you call it) that led to Elijah being cast. During his life, Tolkien was protective of his characters and didn't like them being misunderstood, and I can't imagine that his care ended when he died.
There simply was no one who could have played Frodo better than Elijah (either by ability or by willingness to give of himself), so who else would he choose?

The only way Tolkien could "fully explain what had happened" regarding the effect LotR had on the world was to think of himself as an instrument used by a higher Author. It touched people in ways and to an extent he never expected or planned. And I don't think the work's been abandoned. We're talking about LotR, and we're talking about Frodo, FES! The movies weren't perfect, but they kept enough of the spirit of the book that they affected people deeply and in unexpected ways, and IMVHO the fact that Frolijah came into existence had a lot to do with that. The merging of this actor with this character was/is unique.

-------------

Holding off on EII comments, because I hope to see it again tomorrow night, and there are a few things that have been mentioned in recent posts that I want to look at again (with other people's comments in my mind as I look at them).

Prim

10-27-2005, 03:20 AM

hi tg. :) I'm sorry about your mother. :( Been there and done that. It's such a gap in my life so I send my kindest thoughts to you.

The long shooting schedule gave a chance to really become the character in a way that probably wouldn't be possible in a quick shoot, especially for an actor like Elijah who works from within the character.

Yes. I think you may have something there. Because it was three films all done consecutively and so protracted it probably made it much easier for the actors to inhabit the characters. I also give credit here to Billy and Dom who seem to have been more than willing to be "hobbits" off set. It's almost as if they were reluctant to let their alter egos go.

I'm not sure I believe in destiny but acknowledge the strange merging of EW and Frodo. I hope to see young Mr Wood absorb himself so totally in another role, but still.... I do wonder if the Frodo role will be his pinnacle.

Having said that I enjoyed Eternal Sunshine and am looking forward to seeing Hooligans. If I can stomach American X, then I reckon Hooligans should be ok? Hope. ;)

Prim

tgshaw

10-27-2005, 07:58 AM

hi tg. :) I'm sorry about your mother. :( Been there and done that. It's such a gap in my life so I send my kindest thoughts to you.
(((Prim))) I lost both of my parents suddenly (dad 25 years ago), so I haven't had to deal with the long good-bye of an illness the way you did. I still have many "I'll have to tell Mom about that next time I talk to her," moments, and expect I will for some time. I talked about her a lot in the thread over the past few years (always completely on-topic, of course ;) ), so I feel as if she's a part of it in some way. And she did lurk here once--the only time she ever went online :) .

I hope to see young Mr Wood absorb himself so totally in another role....
It's selfish of me but, y'know, I don't. I don't want him to ever be as much another character as he was Frodo (and as much as he is and will be Frodo on film for many, many years). During at least one interview when he was asked about fear of type-casting, Elijah said that he understands that people will always link him to Frodo and that he considers that not a problem but an honor. So maybe I don't have to feel too guilty about the way I feel. :)

Of course, even though I was something of a pre-LotR Elijah Wood fan, he's always been Frodo to me--he was just 12 years old and living along the Brandywine ;) . So, actually, I did become an Elijah Wood fan because of Frodo :) -- If Huck hadn't been a dead ringer for the way I pictured young Frodo, I probably never would have bought the video... and any fandom would have been nipped in the bud.

Having said that I enjoyed Eternal Sunshine and am looking forward to seeing Hooligans. If I can stomach American X, then I reckon Hooligans should be ok? Hope. ;)
Notice you don't mention EII -- any chance you'll get to see that soon?

Achila

10-27-2005, 08:55 AM

The news today is that Lindsay Lohan has joined the cast of Bobby -- according to the Guardian, "Lohan will play a woman who marries her boyfriend's brother to keep him out of Vietnam."

This...ugh...means that....ugh....she's the one Elijah's character will be...ugh...marrying.....

UGH

Mariole

10-27-2005, 09:20 AM

This...ugh...means that....ugh....she's the one Elijah's character will be...ugh...marrying.....
Sometimes I'm glad that I'm so blissfully ignorant. I'm clueless who this is.

Tg, best wishes to you. Do let us know your EII thoughts when ready. :k

honeyelf

10-27-2005, 11:07 AM

Lindsay Lohan: Mean Girls, Herbie: Fullie Loaded, Freaky Friday, and The Parent Trap (the last two being remakes.) Not a lot of real hard-hitting stuff in there. Very, very mainstream. I haven't seen any of those movies, so I'll reserve judgement.

Still can't figure out the bit about EW's character getting married so that he doesn't have to go to Viet Nam. :confused: My dad didn't get called up for the Korean conflict because he was just freshly married, but by the Viet Namese war, hadn't that stopped being reason enough not to call a service man up? I was pretty young then (I'd turned nine the day before Bobby Kennedy was shot) so I don't remember those kind of details.

honey!

BunnieBugs

10-27-2005, 12:39 PM

This...ugh...means that....ugh....she's the one Elijah's character will be...ugh...marrying.....
NOOOOOOOOoooooooooo!

Oh, no no no. :(

That said, I have seen Freaky Friday and The Parent Trap, and I think Miss Lohan is a credible actress. Unfortunately, her personal life and choices overshadow what talent she has, :eek: :rolleyes: and my opinion of this film just took a bit of a nosedive. Not really fair, I admit, but I'm sure I'm not alone.

Why, oh, why could they not have cast someone else to be his co-star?

Achila

10-27-2005, 12:50 PM

NOOOOOOOOoooooooooo!

Oh, no no no. :( Tell us how you really feel, Bunnie (just like I did). I'm in 100% agreement with you. I saw The Parent Trap with her in it a week or so ago -- I went to visit my Mom and she wanted to watch it -- and thought that she did a very nice job. Of course, she was 12 then -- what happened to her since then???

Man, would I LOVE to know what Elijah thinks of this! They start filming next week -- not enough time for him to have a "conflict"???

txtac

10-27-2005, 03:42 PM

Lindsay Lohan is the newest "American Girl Next Door." The scrubbed clean, freckled face, tomboy that we (as boys) are supposed to grow up next to.
She is the new up and coming female star as Elijah is still percieved of as the up and coming male star. Lindsay can still show a young, fresh, innocent face on screen just as Elijah can still show a fresh, young, innocent face. Both together will show you the stereotypical fresh, young, innocence of the "golden years" of the American society during the "Camelot Years" of the Kennedy White House in early sixties before the Viet Nam war, rock and roll music, the Peace Marches, Anti-War marches, Civil Rights Marches, Civil Rights riots (Watts), sexual revolution, hippies, drugs and the Volkswagon Beetle destroyed America.

I remember the sixties. Both Lindsay and Elijah are excellent choices to show the "stereotype" of the "Golden Years of prosperity and innocence" before all hell broke loose. Give them both a chance to show you what they can do. I for one am looking forward to the kissing scenes. :haha:

P.S. Getting married during the Viet-Nam draft era did NOT keep you out of the military. Only being the last one left in the family, sole provider for the family, in college, or escaped and living in Canada could get you out of the military.

honeyelf

10-27-2005, 03:48 PM

They start filming next week -- not enough time for him to have a "conflict"???

C'mon. You're not seriously suggesting that he back out of this project just because of Ms. Lohan's casting? If he did that he'd not be the person I think he maybe is, and I'd be very dissapointed in him. And he's actor enough to work around his co-star's shortcomings, don't you think? Who would be the "right" casting choice for this role?

Having said that, I mercifully uninformed as to Ms. Lohan's public shennanigans. And Elijah's grounded enough that I doubt a younger actor's character flaws are going to rub off on him. I'm willing to suspend criticism until I see the film.

But then, if she totally sucks...? The gloves'll be off, baby! ;)

And I look forward to seeing him play a rather ordinary guy, not a martyred hobbit, an oddball compulsive obsessive, or a misguided hooligan/creep!

Over at IMDB they still don't show Elijah as part of the cast of Paris je T'aime, but rumor has it that he's been cast opposite Olga Kurylenko (The Femme Fatale - segment "8th arrondissement") , a former model in that one. (The cast list changes so frequently I'm beginning to worry that Elijah has been dropped.) She's certainly exotic enough to look good opposite our beautiful Elijah!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/18424340.jpg

ETA: Simulposted with you, TxTac! Thanks for the info about Viet Nam, as regards avoiding the draft. So will Ms. Lohan's character be pregnant then, by Elijah's caddish brother??? Is that the only other way one might avoid the draft?

Mariole

10-27-2005, 09:22 PM

And I look forward to seeing him play a rather ordinary guy, not a martyred hobbit, an oddball compulsive obsessive, or a misguided hooligan/creep!
LOL! Yes, this will be fun! And please, don't tell my what Ms. Lohan has been up to. I think I'll be happier in ignorance. :p

Achila

10-28-2005, 07:21 AM

C'mon. You're not seriously suggesting that he back out of this project just because of Ms. Lohan's casting? If he did that he'd not be the person I think he maybe is, and I'd be very dissapointed in him. And he's actor enough to work around his co-star's shortcomings, don't you think? You did know I was kidding, right? :(

honeyelf

10-28-2005, 07:57 AM

Achila

10-28-2005, 08:19 AM

Oh, I'm sorry Achila! :( Everybody on LJ is so "kill me now" over this, it's just bizarre. She is so young, and somebody somewhere must see some (as yet untapped?) talent lurking in her. I just hope it works! {{{Achila}}}

honey!

PS I am frequently an idiot! apologiesNot to worry, sweetie :)

As for Lohan, I don't feel "kill me now" about it, but I'm not exactly impressed either. She showed quite a bit of promise as a child, yet I'm seeing how her personal life appears to be ruining it (child actor syndrome, anyone?). So yes -- maybe it'll be OK in the long run, but my initial reaction was Ugh and remains so until I see otherwise.

honeyelf

10-28-2005, 08:54 AM

Out of curiosity, I went to Wikipedia and read up on Ms. Lohan. Not so good. Then I read the entry on Elijah. There is certainly a huge contrast in the way the two of them choose to live out their lives, she as celebrity with a capital "C"; he as a private man who happens to be an actor. It also seems quite apparent that Ms. Lohan has not had the good fortune to have a strong family to back her up, and she's lived out the consequences of that in a rather public way, sadly. I hope she's a better actress than she is a 'celebrity'. And, as always, I'm very grateful that Elijah is an actor who shys away from celebrity.

txtac

10-28-2005, 09:39 AM

Achila wrote: maybe it'll be OK in the long run, but my initial reaction was Ugh and remains so until I see otherwise.
Give the girl a chance. Elijah has the same problem. They are both much better actors than their string of childhood movies. They only need a chance (a good movie) to show off what they can really do as adults. It has been said by many people that Elijah is the most under-rated actor in Hollywood. Has he been able to show his true full range as an actor in his last three movies? Give Lindsay a chance to show you what she can do as an adult actress. I think that they both will do well to show the "American Innocence" of the time period.

Honeyelf wrote: Elijah is an actor who shys away from celebrity.
Elijah does not shy away from celebrity. He runs away from it like the plague.
Elijah wants celebrity about as much as Saddam Hussain wants to become Christian. :eek:

Mechtild

10-28-2005, 11:04 AM

Out of curiosity, I went to Wikipedia and read up on Ms. Lohan. Not so good. Then I read the entry on Elijah. There is certainly a huge contrast in the way the two of them choose to live out their lives, she as celebrity with a capital "C"; he as a private man who happens to be an actor. (...) I hope she's a better actress than she is a 'celebrity'. And, as always, I'm very grateful that Elijah is an actor who shys away from celebrity.
Just because I like to argue the other side, honey :cool: , maybe it's typical for young female performers to do their best to get in the news. Their shelf life, professionally, is very short. Elijah's chances will only improve with age; hers will not.

But, that said, EW certainly does not covet the spotlight. Yes, his homelife was exceptionally helpful in this. From what you hint, Lohan's early life was not so sanguine. :(

~ Mechtild

honeyelf

10-28-2005, 11:43 AM

Just because I like to argue the other side, honey , maybe it's typical for young female performers to do their best to get in the news. Their shelf life, professionally, is very short. Elijah's chances will only improve with age; hers will not.

Interesting thought, Mech! I'd never thought of this side of Hollywood's sexual inequalities before.

But, that said, EW certainly does not covet the spotlight. Yes, his homelife was exceptionally helpful in this. From what you hint, Lohan's early life was not so sanguine. :(

Her family situation is similar to Elijah's, in that both of their fathers are not longer part of the family. Eljiah has mentioned this in the Rollingstone interview, but I thought he spoke of it in an amazingly fair way, given the bitterness I know that kind of hurt can engendered.

By contrast, Ms. Lohan and her sister made it the subject of a music video. I'll always believe that the creators of these "controversial" videos know exactly what they are doing: generating publicity. But I'll give her the benefit of the doubt, and say that she might done this to show sympathy for all the young women (and men) in similar home situations.

honey!

Alyon

10-28-2005, 11:44 AM

On Lindsay Lohan--

I hadn't seen her, just heard of her, until a few months ago when I went to see Herbie Reloaded. I normally would not have sought out a viewing of Herbie Reloaded, but the circumstances being what they were, I went along for the ride.. I expected to not like it, but actually I enjoyed myself. The thing that carried the movie were the two leads, Lindsay L. and Justin Long. It was a movie that depended a lot on personality to make it fun. I came away thinking she had a strong and fiesty presence --not a glam girl in the move, more a natural beauty Tom boy type. At least in this movie she came off well. I haven't seen her in anything else (except for the Parent Trap a few years ago), and by the looks of things she is doing the glam thing in her personal life now. I'm guessing she is trying to take a different turn in her career by taking on a more serious role. I think most of us know her from her recent celebrity rep...but maybe as an actress she might be better than that??????? Hopefully.

ETA: When I hit Edit it didn't show me the rest of the posts so I can't do a quote---but Mechtild--it is a good point that there is a shorter window of limelight for actresses than for actors...but there still are good examples of women who don't run after celebrity. LIke Jody Foster, and then a fave young indie actress, Jenna Malone, shuns the celebrity like and pigeon holing of young women. Kiera Knightly hates it and has to be cajoled into making appearances...But likely it depends upon what someone wants as a career. Getting those top box office pictures you have to prove you can draw the audience so keeping yourself in the public eye is probably a common strategy. So far, those have been the pictures Lindsay Lohan has been in--she is sort of the top draw among young actresses playing teen roles. But she likely wants to move on to more adult roles and prove herself ...

tgshaw

10-28-2005, 03:27 PM

...Both together will show you the stereotypical fresh, young, innocence of the "golden years" of the American society during the "Camelot Years" of the Kennedy White House in early sixties before the Viet Nam war, rock and roll music, the Peace Marches, Anti-War marches, Civil Rights Marches, Civil Rights riots (Watts), sexual revolution, hippies, drugs and the Volkswagon Beetle destroyed America.
(...or saved America, depending on your point of view.)

//Warning: Old codger reminiscing ahead.//

Ummm.... txtac, honey, we're talking the summer of 1968! The Camelot years are long past, Johnson has already said that if nominated he would not run, if elected would not serve. Vietnam is in full bloom, as are Anti-War marches (Miami and the siege of Chicago are only a couple of months in the future). Martin Luther King had been assassinated only a couple of months in the past, while in Memphis for a civil rights march (involving sanitation workers, IIRC). On the other end of the spectrum, because most of them were apolitical, the hippies were also in full bloom. (And people with both political and apolitical leanings were sometimes sporting "Frodo Lives" buttons :cool: .) And there were probably about as many TAR's [Teen-age Republicans] running around as there were YD's [Young Democrats], although I don't remember any TAR's wearing "Frodo Lives" buttons ;) . (While cleaning out my mom's house, I ran across two mimeographed letters from the president of my high school YD group. He's a psychiatrist and a Jesuit now--and is here at Creighton. I'm going to use the campus mail to send him one of the letters reminding members to pay their dues and ask him if I'm in arrears :haha: .)

Most importantly to this movie, Bobby was the last best hope for turning things around without some kind of revolution. He was the only one who saw the need for change who actually could have won the Presidency. I was a member of Eugene McCarthy's "Children's Crusade," but no one ever entertained any hope that he could actually be elected--he was a voice who said things someone needed to say, so we were behind him. (We did get Harold Hughes elected to the Senate from Iowa, though :cool: .) When Bobby was killed, that was, for a great number of people, the end of the hope that things could be changed from "within the system." So, yes, things got a little more violent after that, but they had certainly started earlier (some people were already so jaded that even Bobby hadn't given them any hope).

P.S. Getting married during the Viet-Nam draft era did NOT keep you out of the military. Only being the last one left in the family, sole provider for the family, in college, or escaped and living in Canada could get you out of the military.
The draft rules weren't consistent through the entire Vietnam "engagement". I don't remember what they were specifically in June of 1968 (my two older brothers would know, I'm sure), but IIRC more things could keep you from being drafted then than was true 2 or 3 years later, because the number of men needed kept going up. If I trusted my senior brain, I'd say that when the Vietnam era draft started, marriage was enough to keep you out of it, but I have no recollection of when that changed (i.e., whether it was before or after June 1968). But it does seem to me that I remember some guys getting married to stay out of the draft, then a short time later the rules changed and they got drafted, anyway. The lottery was still years off. I'm trusting that Emilio will have done his homework well enough to have the movie consistent with the rules in force at the time.

What's warmed my heart the most regarding the project is Elijah saying that RFK said some things that America needs to hear today. 1968 was a true watershed year, with a lot of things being said and done that shouldn't be forgotten.

I kind of hope they stick with the stories at the hotel. It almost made things worse that Bobby didn't die immediately. I think if I had to hear someone playing Teddy say "He'll play touch football again," it would break my heart.

End of old codger reminiscences

Alyon

10-28-2005, 06:05 PM

Tgshaw-- :cool: :cool: :cool: :k for it all

and yeah...
What's warmed my heart the most regarding the project is Elijah saying that RFK said some things that America needs to hear today. 1968 was a true watershed year, with a lot of things being said and done that shouldn't be forgotten.

:k :k

shireling

10-28-2005, 06:09 PM

Perhaps I should be relieved that I don't have the foggiest idea of who Lindsay Lohan is. :) What I do have, however, is the latest copy of Empire. Perhaps someone could translate this for me:

Just as Jonathan backs away from reality, Alex grabs it and tackles it, creating an odd-couple chemistry that's only enhanced by Wood's generous, second-string performance, which begins inscrutably enough and in the final frames almost morphs entirely into a moving, Magritte-like enigma.

Is that good or bad? :confused: They gave it four stars so I guess it must be good :)

A few more snippets:

Schreiber: Elijah's a humanist. He pretends sometimes that he's something else, but he's a deep, deep humanist, that guy. I've never met a better natured person in my life. Very, very open and in some ways really, really awkward. Because for someone who's acted as a child for a lot of his life, he's making that transition into being a man, and that was part of what I liked about casting him as Jonathan.

Elijah: I have family in Eastern Europe, oddly enough. And Illuminated kind of came at a time when I was searching for my roots. But I haven't been on that journey of self-discovery; the closest thing would have to be the LOTR experience - leaving home at 18 was really the first time I lived as an adult outside of my comfort zone.

Hutz: I had never seen LOTR or any films with Elijah before I met him. It seems to be kind of ridiculous, knowing the popularity of those films (LOTR) but I'd never even heard of them before. So I met Elijah basically as a person. And that was a very good way to build a natural chemistry.

Elijah: I didn't meet the real Jonathan until we'd been filming for six weeks, and he was totally different. But I love my character and the fact that he is so, seemingly, insular. The thing about Jonathan is that there's a world going on inside of his mind, there's so much more than anybody could possibly imagine. So he seems to be reacting to everything around him, but there is this whole inner self that is quite intense, and in some ways its actually more challenging to play a character like that. Because you have to make sure that the character can seem alive while still being somewhat deadpan.

Not long to go til 25 November :)

ceefour

10-29-2005, 11:05 AM

Draft Classifications:

http://members.aol.com/warlibrary/draft.htm

Mr. ceefour was deferred as he had started college by 1968 and later on he had a high number in the draft lottery.

C4

ETA-I have never been very good at interpreting paintings and such. But wandering around trying to find information about Magritte, I came upon this picture of a sculpture he did. It does bear a striking resemblence to the poster for EII.

www.lehmbruckmuseum.de/english/sammlung/skulptur.htm

The clouds in the EII poster look very much like Magritte's clouds.

ETA 2-BookJonathan is more enigmatic than MovieJonathan, but MovieJonathan doesn't give much more away either. My wanderings also found this quote by Magritte on The Magritte Site.

My painting is visible images which conceal nothing; they evoke mystery and, indeed, when one sees one of my pictures, one asks oneself this simple question 'What does that mean'? It does not mean anything, because mystery means nothing either. It is unknowable.

Well, that illuminates everything, doesn't it? ;)

C4

honeyelf

10-29-2005, 12:09 PM

Thanks for the very pertinent information TG and CeeFour :k :k

CeeFour, I looked at your Vietnam Era Draft Classifications, and the only one I could come up with that might apply to a man freshly married is

Class III-A:
Extreme hardship deferment, or registrant with a child.

So maybe the Lohan character will be pregnant? Just a semi-informed guess.

Shireling, I love those quotes from the Empire magazine. I love that the people he works with continue to talk about him in terms of being "sweet" and "good natured."

honey!

Alyon

10-30-2005, 01:14 AM

Shireling, thanks for the Empire snippets. Really nice stuff. Liev seems to really think about Elijah. He always describes him in some depth and it's not just about him as an actor, but as a person. He must really like him as he often makes claims that Elijah is the most polite, or the most controlled, or generous, or professional, and in this case the most good-natured person he has ever met. He always talks about him as if he is so singular. And he goes into interesting detail, such as also being ackward, or being a humanist, and in one case he talked about how Elijah is an instigator, though one might not think it. :cool: I think I like Liev ;)

wood

10-30-2005, 02:22 AM

thank you all for the reports !!!!

i just wait for EII to come here thou i haven`t heard anything
of a realese date!!! :(

but i waiting so i can yoin you all in the discution !!!

miss you all

LOVE YOU ALL/WOOD

Random

10-30-2005, 04:40 AM

Hi everyone!

Shireling beat me to that Empire scoop. :) I was going to ask what a 'moving, Magritte-like enigma' is as well. How can an enigma be moving? And when they say 'Magritte-like', do they mean visually, or in EW's acting? Of course, whatever it is, I'm sure Elijah is capable of it. ;)

I'm a fan of Lindsay Lohen - I thought she was great in Mean Girls. She's v. pretty too. But for me, the most interesting thing about it is that she became attached to the project after Elijah did. To mean this seems to suggest that he was the main reason she decided to take it on - she knew he could give her class, and that he usually picked projects that were interesting and successful.

tgshaw

10-30-2005, 07:54 PM

Also loved Liev's comments as posted by shireling. The one phrase from the review that I'd disagree with is:
Just as Jonathan backs away from reality...
:confused: Maybe the things that most of us saw as connecting with reality (the glances at the airport, etc.) the reviewer saw as backing away?

ceefour--That sculpture really does have a lot in common with the poster! Back when the first EII poster showed up (the one in my avatar), someone here immediately compared it to Magritte's painting of the man standing like a "stick" with his face obscured. I haven't been able to find that one online, but did run across this one that uses kind of the same idea:

http://www.afewwordsabout.us/magritte/a03febc0.jpg

And this one makes me think of Jonathan--not so much by looks as by body language:

http://www.afewwordsabout.us/magritte/9d9bc2d0.jpg

------------

ETA--Don't remember if I mentioned that our little theater decided to keep EII on for a third week, so I'm hoping to get another friend or two there before it's gone. Business must have picked up after the propreitors told me they'd decided to keep it only two weeks because they were disappointed in attendance.

Hobmom

10-30-2005, 10:19 PM

Tg- Reading your discription for the 'youngins' of the US in 1968 gave me such a flash back! LOL I Remember all of that! I was in my teens then and all those things made a vivid impact on me.

And since I've lately started to really listen to old Joan Baez music the 'feelings' of that time have really been flooding back.

BTW - They really HAVE to use Joan Baez songs in the soundtrack of 'Bobby'. No question about it!

I remember the young guys back then being terrified of fighting in a war they did not believe in. I don't remember a 'marriage deferment', but perhaps it did exist for a short time. I do know being under-weight could get a guy deferred! One of my oldest friends who was very slight (and still is!) lost enough weight to get deferred.

Anyway.... it was a turbulent and emotional time. A lot like now, except our current young fellows ..so far...don't have to face a draft. This movie will have a lot of relevancy(good-old sixties word there!) to the current state of affairs in many other ways, though. Elijah will be wonderful in this role, I have no doubt.

But..Man! They gotta have Joan Baez and Bob Dylan on the sound track,man! Heavy! ;)

ceefour

10-30-2005, 11:42 PM

Happy Birthday, Fast Toadfoot!

C4

Lady Wendy

10-30-2005, 11:58 PM

You mean this one, Tg...
http://a1259.g.akamai.net/f/1259/5586/5d/images.art.com/images/-/Rene-Magritte/The-Son-of-Man--C10090968.jpeg

Very interesting discussion...no time ...
Be back later !!

Shelbyshire

10-31-2005, 06:36 AM

:) Happy Halloween Faculty :)

And...

HAPPY BIRTHDAY FAST TOADFOOT!!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v638/Shelbyshire/new_sohoposter.jpg

honeyelf

10-31-2005, 07:54 AM

Happy Birthday, HAMFAST TOADFOOT! :k :k

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/wl12.jpg

And many more!

honey!

saile

10-31-2005, 09:17 AM

Found my way to Wikipedia (thanks Honeyelf). Interesting site. Mostly accurate accounting of TOL.

And ceefour and Tg, thanks for the Magritte photos and quotes. I love this quote. As you said ceefour, very illuminating. Gives a new layer of meaning to the Movie.My painting is visible images which conceal nothing; they evoke mystery and, indeed, when one sees one of my pictures, one asks oneself this simple question 'What does that mean'? It does not mean anything, because mystery means nothing either. It is unknowable.
Liev seems to really think about Elijah. He always describes him in some depth and it's not just about him as an actor, but as a person. He must really like him as he often makes claims that Elijah is the most polite, or the most controlled, or generous, or professional, and in this case the most good-natured person he has ever met. He always talks about him as if he is so singular. And he goes into interesting detail, such as also being ackward, or being a humanist, and in one case he talked about how Elijah is an instigator, though one might not think it. I think I like Liev.I definitely agree Alyon.

Oh and wanted to thank shireling for the quotes from Empire. I do love hearing others speak of TOL. Music to my ears.

They gotta have Joan Baez and Bob Dylan on the sound track,man....well I will certainly agree on Bob Dylan. I know I missed a discussion earlier this month that touched on Dylan (Lady Wendy IIRC). His biography Chronicles: Volume 1 was a very interesting read as well.

And Happy Birthday Fast Toadfoot. Photo to come later.
saile :D

wood

10-31-2005, 10:00 AM

HAPPY BIRTHDAY FAST TOADFOOT!!!!

like saile sade, photos later!!!

beutiful pcyures all!!!!

WOOD

saile

10-31-2005, 11:03 AM

OT but so excited and anticipating the release of this music. :D Can't wait to get my greedy little hands on these. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v404/billiep/Artwork.jpg
saile

Mechtild

10-31-2005, 11:43 AM

Oh, saile That looks scrumptious! :p Thank you for posting the link to the pic of box. *strokes cover covetously*

~ Mechtild

whiteling

10-31-2005, 12:36 PM

Happy Birthday, Fast Toadfoot!! :)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/whiteling/Frodon_byPMalenfant_janvierjpg.jpg
Picture by "Malenfant Janvier"

Wow - a Birthday on Halloween *and* on the same day as Peter Jackson ;)!

Shireling, thanks for the lovely Empire quotes :).

Wonderful Magritte discussion!
Maybe the things that most of us saw as connecting with reality (the glances at the airport, etc.) the reviewer saw as backing away?
Not knowing book or movie (EII), all I can do is just guess, but somehow I thought this Magritte painting could fit the character of Jonathan - at least at some stages of the story?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/whiteling/magritte_nottobereproduced.jpg

Ceefour, that Magritte quote was *very* enlightening ;)

wood

10-31-2005, 12:54 PM

here comes the promising birthday picture!!

somebody waites to give you some flowers toadfoot!!!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v399/erendil/flower3.jpg

sorry maybe a bit big!!!!

WOOD

Lady Wendy

10-31-2005, 01:00 PM

HAPPY BIRTHDAY, FAST TOADFOOT !!!

Here....have a beautiful picture to get you through the day ..
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v449/wendylady1/Elijah/EJWelle1crop.jpg

The discussion has been very interesting lately, what with Liev's wonderful comments on working with Elijah, and the musings on Rene Magritte's enigmatic works....the sculpture that Ceefour linked to is one that I am not familiar with, but I was struck by how much it brought EII to mind...
He is one of the Surrealist Movement artists, along with Salvadore Dali, that have fascinated me more than any other this century...

We go to see "Everything is Illuminated" tomorrow night...( Hurrah !! )...and so, I will be posting a review on my LJ soon, ( this week ) which I might C & P in here too !!

Fast Toadfoot

10-31-2005, 01:21 PM

Hello!

I've had a wonderful weekend, hanging out with some friends Friday night, going line dancing Saturday night, being in church Sunday morning, then my mom came down to see me and we've been hanging out ever since. We took a walk this morning in Forest Park, which, if anyone here ever comes to St. Louis, is a must to see.

Lovely Pics! :)

23 is a good age to be, I think. I'm looking forward to this year. It's funny, Elijah's 23rd birthday, in 2004, was the first Elijah birthday I observed, when I really was developing my fandom, and now I am turning 23! That's hilarious.

I didn't make it to 23 Lij movies by tonight, but that's OK. Trying to rush movies just to get to a certain number by a certain time just doesn't sound hobbity somehow. It would have been like Bilbo, having exactly 144 invited guests at his party, to fill a gross! :lol:

Plus, you gotta have time to reflect on a new Elwood movie the first time you watch it.

I am seeing TMFKAH Wednesday night, which will be Elijah movie #21. Yeah!!!!

I have to go to work in a little while, and I don't get off til 11, but tomorrow morning I'll be back on the site! Thanks again everyone!!!! Much love and God bless!!!

tgshaw

10-31-2005, 01:56 PM

Happy Birthday, Fast Toadfoot!

I was going to post something more recent, but all this talk has me wanting to see some of that great early-'70's hair. :p

http://www.frodolivesin.us/ejw/14fd0980.jpg

http://www.frodolivesin.us/ejw/3ced0980.jpg

Achila

10-31-2005, 01:56 PM

Happy Birthday, Fast Toadfoot!

Just found the track listing for the "extended FOTR" soundtrack --

Disc 1:
1. Prologue: One Ring To Rule Them All
2. Shire, The
3. Bag End
4. Very Old Friends
5. Flaming Red Hair
6. Farewell Dear Bilbo
7. Keep It Secret
8. Keep It Safe
9. Conspiracy Unmasked, A
10. Three Is Company
11. Passing Of The Elves, The
12. Saruman The White
13. Shortcut To Mushrooms, A
14. Strider
15. Nazgul, The

Disc 2:
1. Weathertop
2. Caverns Of Isengard, The
3. Give Up The Halfling
4. Orthanc
5. Rivendell
6. Sword That Was Broken, The
7. Council Assembles, The
8. Great Eye, The
9. Gilraen's Memorial
10. Pass Of Caradhras, The
11. Doors Of Durin, The
12. Moria
13. Gollum
14. Balin's Tomb

Disc 3:
1. Khazad-dum
2. Caras Galadhon
3. Mirror Of Galadriel, The
4. Fighting Uruk-hai, The
5. Parth Galen
6. Departure Of Boromir, The
7. Road Goes Ever On..., The

The site I found it on shows it as a CD/DVD -- not sure what the DVD might be. And the cheapest price I've seen so far is $50.98. I'm personally really excited to see The Passing of the Elves on the list!

tgshaw

10-31-2005, 02:02 PM

Was going to edit my last post but Achila beat me to it. ;) Was going to add, regarding Magritte--Lady Wendy, I think that's it. Interesting that he uses those green apples in other paintings, too.
http://www.afewwordsabout.us/magritte/9d81dbc0.jpg

And Whiteling, IMHO the one with the mirror fits movie-Jonathan so well it's almost spooky.

This Magritte is really apropos nothing, but I just ran across it yesterday and liked it :) :

http://www.afewwordsabout.us/magritte/a0627bc0.jpg

honeyelf

10-31-2005, 03:59 PM

TG said: And Whiteling, IMHO the one with the mirror fits movie-Jonathan so well it's almost spooky.

I agree; it's very Jonathan! And Joel Barish would probably think that painting is rather Patrick-like, too! ;)

My husband has become a huge fan of EII. We saw it again on Saturday night, the penultimate night of its engagement at our local 'art house' theater. He compares Jonathan to an angel arriving to 'enlighten' the two generations of Alexei (the plural of Alex, right? ;) ) I think this angelic description fits bookJonathan even better, as we know only what Alex can tell us about him.

Just because I think it's so very cool, here is CeeFour's Magritte comparison, also very enigmatic, and Jonathan-like.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/magritte.jpg

honey!

Achila

10-31-2005, 04:19 PM

Just over at IMDB and noticed that they've given Elijah's character's name in "Bobby" as William. This' a new one. Billy, Willy, William? Not Mikey???? :lol:

Mechtild

10-31-2005, 04:27 PM

Ah, tg, just loooooved those screencaps from The Ice Storm you posted for Fast Toadfoot's birthday.

Fast Toadfoot, I'm posting you this swell shot of Ice Storm's Mikey reading his molecule speech. Mikey could read that to me on my birthday an-y-time....

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v382/mechtild/pics%20for%20posts/elijahmikeymoleculessepia.jpg

And, just to celebrate a bit more, FT, here's a big smoocheroo from The Faculty's Casey:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v382/mechtild/pics%20for%20posts/elijahkissthefaculty2.jpg

~ Mechtild

honeyelf

10-31-2005, 09:41 PM

Yeux de Bleux at LJ posted this little goodie from Rollingstone.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/100_0181.jpg
It's a wee bit dark.

Wish they'd creditted The One Lad with a speck of intelligence at least; we know he's got buckets of it. I have my moments when this movie sounds like the worse idea since thalidomide (sorry, just floated to the top; the twisted workings of honey's! mind.) But just at the moment? I can't wait to see Elijah RRRIP into this role! He could blow 'em away, and have 'em all eating crow, hats, whatever! And handing him little gold statues.

Peronally, I just don't like straight up bio-pics. They never satisfy. They de-mystify. Why'd Iggy Pop role around in peanut butter? Do you really want to know? Because it'll be something banal, like the roadies were making sandwiches... and then what are you leff with?

And then too, the subject of the bio-pic always starts out with a flash (no pun intended) and goes out with a fizzle, unless he or she died early like Jim Morrison, or Jimi Hendrix. If they survive into their 60's like Mr. Pop, you don't get even the melancholy of unrealized potential.

So I'm hoping hoping hoping that this movie will have some surreal elements. If the screen-play were written by Charlie Kaufman, that'd be about right.

ETA: Sorry that came out so little! :mad: What to do? What say I come back with a transcript? BRB

BIO HAZARDS, by Rob Sheffield in Rollingstone

If theres one thing Hollywood loves, its a bad movie about a rock star. Theyre greenlighting loads of rock biopics these days, hoping to copy the success of Jamie Foxxs Ray[i/]. Mike Meyers signed on to play Keith Moon. Joaquin Phoenix plays Johnny Cash. Renee Zellweger and Pink have both been connected to movies about Janis Joplin. ERs Shane West is playing L.A. hardcore burnout Darby Crash in [I]What We Do is Secret. But the really bizarre one: Elijah Wood as Iggy Pop. Frodo, please! You cant play a hobbit and a Stooge in one lifetime! Im scared to death of doing it, Wood says. I love him so much, and I respect the music so much. I dont want to be the person responsible for screwing that up. Wood should bring in his fellow hobbits dont you think Sean Astin would make a cute Lou Reed? And maybe he can bring back his co-star from The Good Son, MacCauley Culkin, to play David Bowie, so they can reunite on Lust for Life.

You can never make a great movie about a rock star, because no movie star is cool enough to fill the role. If he had any rock-star charisma in him, hed have been a rock star instead of settling for acting. Thats why the best rock movies are about fictional wanna-bes, like This is Spinal Tap or Hedwig and the Angry Inch. Sometimes an unknown actor brings enough intensity to disappear into the part, like Gary Oldman in Sid and Nancy and Gary Busey in The Buddy Holly Story. But rock stars have a magnetic madness actors cant touch. Theres never been a half-decent movie about Elvis, because whos going to play him? Angelina Jolie, maybe. You could never make a movie about Prince. Prince already tried that in Purple Rain (You have to purify yourself in the waters of Lake Minnetonka!), and not even he could play Prince.

But Ray Charles changed everything by dying just in time to win the Oscar for Jamie Foxx. If the old man had held on another year, Ray would have been filler for VH1s Movies That Rock slot, right between The Jacksons: An American Dream and Hysteria: the Def Leppard Story. Yet the mass public mourning turned Ray into a hit, and you could just hear the middled-aged execs raving, Wait a sec: Christian Slater is George Jones! Ben Afleck is Bachman-Turner Overdrive!

Now its getting out of hand with Todd Haynes upcoming Im Not There: Suppositions On A Film Concerning Dylan, with seven actors playing different sides of Bob Dylan, including Christian Bale, Cate Blanchett, Colin Ferrell, Richard Gere and Julianne Moore. I hope other rock stars get this kind of in depth psychic exploration. I cant wait for Man, That Suit is You: Fragments From a Portrait of David Lee Roth, with Diamond Dave portrayed by Owen Wilson, Judd Nelson, Brandy, Sir Ian McKellen, Suzanne Somers and the entire cast of How I Met Your Mother. Michael Pitt was excellent as the Kurt Cobain figure in Last Days, but still, you kept thinking, Nice job, Dawsons Creek dude! Thats the way an actors life goes you start out on Dawsons and hope for a shot at Cobain. But Kurt didnt start out as a bassist for Glass Tiger or the cowbell player for C&C Music Factory and then graduate to Nirvana. Rock stars create the illusion of making up their own roles. Thats why actors dont have a chance. Besides, actors have to know how to read.

ceefour

11-01-2005, 01:08 PM

Thanks to Honeyelf for transcribing the Rolling Stone article.

Check the link for what a DVD-Audio is.

http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/question344.htm

As best as I can figure it out, it's like Surround Sound without the picture. More information can be stored on a DVD than a CD, so a DVD-Audio has 5 or 6 speakers playing music, as opposed to 2 speakers with a CD. There's also some limited space for pictures, too.

Not that I need to have the soundtrack blasting out of 5 speakers. When Achila, Pelagia, and Ylla watched FOTR at my house, they made me crank up the volume. :rolleyes:

Here's hoping EW's character in Bobby is William and not Willy. :eek:

C4

Achila

11-01-2005, 01:19 PM

As best as I can figure it out, it's like Surround Sound without the picture. More information can be stored on a DVD than a CD, so a DVD-Audio has 5 or 6 speakers playing music, as opposed to 2 speakers with a CD. There's also some limited space for pictures, too.

Oh, I see. I thought it was CDs *AND* a DVD. Thanks for clearing that up.

Not that I need to have the soundtrack blasting out of 5 speakers. When Achila, Pelagia, and Ylla watched FOTR at my house, they made me crank up the volume. :rolleyes:Yep -- and it was a good thing ceefour's family was nowhere in sight or we would've been thrown out on our collective ears!

txtac

11-01-2005, 03:42 PM

Here's a fun one. Does she look 18 to you?

http://www.starmagazine.com/gossip/62648

Mechtild

11-01-2005, 05:23 PM

txtac, I just opened your link from the Star Magazine.

"Lindsay, who you do not think of as an indie film actress, is an inspired choice and is the heart of the movie," said producer Edward Bass.
If she's the heart of the movie, what does that make Elijah? The heart's sweetheart? Maybe his role is bigger than I thought it would be. Halleluia, if so.

~ Mechtild

Alyon

11-01-2005, 07:36 PM

Thanks, Honey, for transcribing from Rolling Stone. Elijah had to prove himself for this, you can be sure. He must have shown them something they could buy into.

TxTac--great link. That little indie movie, (or did they say "flick"?) sure does have a lot of star power. I don't think of Sharon Stone, Demi Moore, or Lindsay Lohan when I think of indies. But maybe I don't know ;)
Thanks for posting it.

txtac

11-02-2005, 09:25 AM

My take is that Emelio Estevez is calling up his friends list just like Ben Afflek and Matt Damon did for their little flick(s). The script is a neat idea anyway and when an actor has nothing on the horizon to do, why not make a flick for a friend. At least they are working. It gives them something to do. When you look at the cast list, they are also very heavy Democartic party hitters. To do a movie about the last great Democartic party family (the Kennedys) might seem like an honour to these actors, or it could just be a really good script. (?) How many times did Elijah chose to do a movie just because it was a really good script and a good/neat/fun idea for a movie? (Flipper, the Faculty, Spy Kids 3-D, Sin City, Hooligans, EiI.)

NEW ARTICLE
Elijah Wood Keeps Faith In 'Different Kind of Heroism'
http://www.teenhollywood.com/d.asp?r=108589&cat=1027

honeyelf

11-02-2005, 11:15 AM

When you look at the cast list, they are also very heavy Democartic party hitters. To do a movie about the last great Democartic party family (the Kennedys) might seem like an honour to these actors, or it could just be a really good script.

Is it the patina of nostalgia, or did the ideals Bobby Kennedy stood for really transcend "Democrat" or "Republican"? The more elections, and political scuffling I see, the less I believe in a two-party system. Be informed, vote your choice, and learn to look beyond the catch-phrases and ideoligical short-cuts, I'd say. Sorry! Did I just get political? What's next, religion? :o

Elijah has said he chooses roles becuase the script moved him in some way. I doubt we can infer anything about his political views from this choice. In fact that's one of his more minor refreshing traits; he doesn't seem to feel the need to burden us with his political views, other than the fact that he dislikes actors who use their fame to reach for power. I saw a quote very recently where he said so, in regards to California's "Governator;" wish I could find it again.

Where is everyone?

honey!

whiteling

11-02-2005, 11:25 AM

I'm here, Honey!
It seems that I have nothing valuable to contribute these days... :rolleyes:

Txtac, for some odd reason your link to Star Magazine doesn't work for me :confused:

Skimming the news today, I came across some photos of Lindsay Lohan in the boulevard section. Aha! Now I know what she looks like at last (never seen anything she's been in). - She's said to be anorexic. And in the next issue of "Vanity Fair" there will be apparently nude photos of her.

See what I mean? Was that valuable?? :p
:k Faculty!

wood

11-02-2005, 03:32 PM

And i am here Honey !!

Evening to you all!!!

Finally i have seen GSE!!!! With very good quality and with swedish
subtitel!!!!
And i must say i really liked this movie !!! Better then the first time i saw
it!!
I think Elijah did a really good job in this one ,you can clearly see the yourney
he is taking and wht a diffrent man he is when the movie is over!!
Look whos taking, i who think he is good in every movie!! ;)
And i liked Charlie to!! Dont ask me of his accent!! Have no ider!!!
I thought he played is part really good!!
And i even cried in the end!!

Now i have to wait for EII!!!
I wrote a letter to the town near by here to ask if they are going to show
EII they wrote back and sade they have no plans for that!!!!!!!!!!!
:confused: :confused: :( :(

Eandme help me out !!! if they show it in Stockholm can i come and see it with you??? :z: :z:

Well i not very good of writing rewiew but i think you all understand i thought it was a very good movie!!!

And i really looking forward to his next prodjekts maybe more the about kennedy then Iggy !! maybe becuse i never liked iggy much
but that is another story !!!

And by the way !! it feels good to be back on track again
i have missed you all!!!

LOVE YOU /WOOD

txtac

11-02-2005, 04:13 PM

HoneyIf memory serves, Emilio asked Elijah to be in the movie, so Emilio's motives would be: 1. Elijah is a friend; 2. Emilio recognizes that Elijah is the best actor for the part; 3. Emilio knows Elijah's secret political leanings, so asked him to be in the movie; 4. ???

Whiteling, I originally posted the entire article, then went back and deleted it leaving only the link. Articles sometimes tend to be rather lengthy and not everyone wants to read all of the articles, so I just posted the link. Since you are having problems, here is the article sans picture:

Elijah Wood Keeps Faith In 'Different Kind of Heroism'
by BOB LONGINO 10/10/2005

Go ahead, call him Frodo. Many people on the planet still do.

"Oh, it's pretty consistent," Elijah Wood says of being hailed on the street as hobbit Frodo Baggins by "Lord of the Rings" fans. "It doesn't bother me. But it is funny. It's literally everywhere in the world I go."

Like on a tiny island in Malaysia, where he was vacationing a few months ago. This Southeast Asian dot on a globe was so small it didn't have a movie theater.

"But everybody there knew 'Lord of the Rings,' " Wood says. "It's really amazing."

So here sits Frodo recently in an Atlanta hotel, visiting to talk about his latest movie, "Everything Is Illuminated," opening today. At 5-foot-6, Wood is maybe a hair taller in real life than the ultra-short Baggins was portrayed onscreen. Maybe. He's as thin as Gandalf's staff and has pasty-white, almost translucent, skin.

At 24, Wood's career choices are not unlike life pre-"Rings." He gravitates toward indie films and his first love, music.

This year he launched his own indie record label, Simian, in Los Angeles ("I like the idea of having a small label where I can release bands I believe in purely as a love of music"). The moniker Simian echoes Wood's boyhood nickname - Monkey. He's also made three small-studio or indie movies this year, including Frank Miller's graphic-novel-come-to-life, "Sin City."

"Everything Is Illuminated" is based on Jonathan Safran Foer's intelligent novel exploring his family's past. It was adapted for the screen and directed by accomplished stage and film actor Liev Schreiber. The film is like its marquee star - small, smart, at times, well, illuminating and always veering more than a bit to the left of the mainstream.

Wood plays Foer as an ultra-introvert. Having his hair plastered to his head and sporting thick glasses, a neatly pressed dark suit and the whitest of shirts, Foer quietly and studiously collects family mementos and keepsakes. Buttons and flowers. Rings and old photos.

One particular, yellowing photograph of his grandfather as a young man standing in a field with a mysterious young woman sends Foer on a quest to Ukraine to uncover family secrets.

There, he travels in a tiny car, escorted by the strangest of strange trios - an old driver (who claims to be blind), a ratty dog and the aged man's grandson Alex, who idolizes American pop culture and regurgitates it through his own kind of Eastern European verbal riffs .

"Illuminated" is Schreiber's first directorial effort. Wood met with him in Los Angeles for a two-hour conversation and knew immediately he would accept the role.

"It was one of those things where he's having his first experience meeting actors from that perspective and we both kind of acknowledged that, so it was easy from there on out," Wood says. "He basically articulated to me the story he wanted to tell, how he wanted to tell it. We talked about the cinematography. We talked about how the character of Jonathan would be visualized, the suit and all that. It excited me."

Almost as much as when he heard about plans for the big-screen version of "Sin City."

Wood had just finished re-reading Miller's graphic novel series and was having dinner with pals Robert Rodriguez (they worked together on "The Faculty") and George Huang ("Swimming with Sharks") when Wood found out Rodriguez was going to co-direct "Sin City."

"I nearly fell out of my chair," Wood says.

Eventually, Wood landed the small, nonspeaking part of Kevin, the ultra-creepy cannibal killer with the kung-fu kicks, a long haul from the earnest demeanor of Frodo.

"To be on the set for two days with Frank Miller, like, giving me directions about his own character was incredible," Wood says.

Wood's third film this year is the violent "Green Street Hooligans," the soccer gang story filled with beer and bloody brawls. Wood plays an American Ivy League student who becomes embroiled in the soccer-mad gang fights in England.

"The challenge with that film and that character was to make it seem authentic," Wood says. "I find fists to be far more brutal (than guns). And the way these guys fight is so unhinged and so chaotic. There is something incredibly frightening about 20 guys here and 20 guys there running at each other."

The frequent fist fights are a far cry from the more reflective, Eastern Europe-set "Illuminated," in which Wood's Foer is incredibly insular - a very quiet hero.

"It's all about the information reflected back on him from Alex and the grandfather and the dog and the foreign place he's in," Wood says. "For me, the most complicated element of playing a character like that is to not make him so still that he's lifeless or to be so subtle that there's no sense of a person."

For Wood these days, acting seems to frequently hark back to Frodo.

"There is always that thing - understanding what your role is in reference to everything else," he says, talking about "Rings." "Frodo is merely the conduit to get that ring."

He isn't Aragorn, the future king, or Legolas, the brave killer of giant beasts .

"You learn to accept your role and understand it's not insignificant," Wood says, speaking of Frodo and Foer. "It's just a different kind of heroism."

honeyelf

11-02-2005, 06:54 PM

Fast Toadfoot

11-02-2005, 11:09 PM

I saw my 21st movie starring our favorite actor, Mr. Wood. I didn't even know it was playing in St. Louis until I was hanging out with a friend of mine who lived across the street from Ronnie's 20. So, I went over there and found out it wasn't doing well and was probably leaving the theatre at the end of this week, so I made hurried plans to see it tonight. I had seen the clip with the first 8 minutes on it on the Internet before, so no surprises there, :lol: but,

Begin Spoilers

I really loved it when Matt gets the idea to steal the truck and get to Manchester on that, instead of on the train like they were expecting. After that, he really started fitting in. My biggest sadness in the movie, was them suspecting of him of being a journalist mole, (Even I, as a Journalism major myself, have heard of journalists doing disdainful things and not thinking twice about it because, hey, they're journalists, hence, my not too high opinion of my chosen field of study, but I fully intend to keep my purity and innocence and not be corrupted by the journalism profession, but, I digress), and they're subsequent anger at Matt. When the guy, Bovver, messes things up with his antics, and brings the Millwall thugs in on that bar, I cringed. I hated the part in the diner where the Millwall thugs were messing with Bovver and smashed that guys head on the table. Why wasn't he carrying a concealed weapon? Where was the restaurant owner with a shotgun? Anyway, at the end that creep that tried to go after Shannon and her son, was an absolute jerk. I concur with others on this board that this movie definitely does NOT glorify violence, as I've heard that it has been accused of doing.

End Spoilers

I saw Elijah very clearly in this movie. In EII he plays a character whose mannerisms and appearance are so very different from Lij in real life that we see JSF first, then Lij. In this, we see a lot of him as he appears in life.

He does make such a remarkable change in this movie from beginning to end! I hope I get to see it a second time soon!

There is love of some sort between the members of the GSE. I liked that. It was an enlightening movie, and I loved the British accents.

I have got to come up with a quote signature! Any suggestions?

Am I a good poster on movies? I hope so. I'll probably post on other Lij movies I've seen, I have many thoughts on them.

G'Night everyone!!!!

honeyelf

11-03-2005, 12:22 AM

Bunnie posted this pic in her LJ today; just a candid of Lij at a Gogol Bordello concert
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/283451983_l.jpg

But look closely at what he's wearing on his left breast pocket flap!
Yes, it really is one of these!
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/000exwr1.jpg

Super report on GSH, Toadfoot! Glad you enjoyed it! Enjoyed IMing you, and finding that we had each had the experience of feeling "taller" when we saw the film the first time round! :D

TxTac, in re-reading what I said in my last post I realize I was kinda smart-alecky. I publicly apoligize, and plead insomnia due to the stoopid time change! :k

*yawn* honey!

Skater girl

11-03-2005, 03:41 AM

I hated the part in the diner where the Millwall thugs were messing with Bovver and smashed that guys head on the table. Why wasn't he carrying a concealed weapon? Where was the restaurant owner with a shotgun?

I loved what you wrote Fast Toadfoot, and I couldn't help but smile when I read this. Is America really so different from the UK? When I think carefully about the 'why' and 'where' questions, I come to the conclusion that the answers are tied in closely with the image the British have of not being able to complain about bad service. On some levels we are a meek race. Ordinary people don't carry concealed weapons (and would probably be jailed for using one in self-defence anyway), and a fair majority do tend to cross the street and turn the other cheek when they see trouble brewing. 'Don't get involved' would be a fair motto for many of us.

If I imagine the scene unfolding with the cafe owner actually getting out a shot gun and taking charge of the situation, I instantly hear everyone speaking in American accents, since it is something that seems synonymous with American movies and far, far removed from English corner cafe culture. Somehow, making a connection between shot guns and fish n'chips with mushy peas and a strong mug of tea sets up a rather commical Wallace and Grommit, or Shaun of the Dead type scene for me.

A good way to start the day :D

whiteling

11-03-2005, 04:19 AM

Great GSH review, Fast! :) I must admit, I had kind of the same reaction like Skater girl regarding the possible pulling out of a gun. :p I think to us Europeans such things seem very "american". I reckon over here someone would rather call the police than reacting the way you suggested, Fast.

Txtac, thanks a lot for posting the Star Magazine article! :) That was very nice of you. I liked especially Elijah's comment on playing Jonathan:
For me, the most complicated element of playing a character like that is to not make him so still that he's lifeless or to be so subtle that there's no sense of a person.
Just the other day I watched "Being there" with Peter Sellers as Chancey Gardiner, and now I know what Liev and Elijah meant when they said, they used Gardiner as basis for modelling Jonathan. Lovely. I'm so looking forward to EII! (ETA: Wood and Eandme, I'm crossing my fingers that you will get to see it soon! *kisses to you two*

Kumari, are you still around?? If so, then....

Happy Birthday, Kumari!! :)
Hope it's a good one!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/whiteling/ringer.jpg

Kumari

11-03-2005, 06:08 AM

Thank you Whiteling! :k I'm still here, just enjoying the conversation about EII and Hooligans. I have no idea if/when either of these movies will be shown in Australia, so this is the closest I'm likely to get to them for quite some time. :(

I love the pic - I don't think I've seen that one before!

Kumari

BunnieBugs

11-03-2005, 06:53 AM

Wasn't there some discussion recently about EII and whether something might (literally) be lost in translation? Well, I found a lovely review by someone who speaks Russian that implies that it might be so:

Everything Is Illuminated, Grade A- (http://www.filmblather.com/review.php?n=everythingisilluminated)

Happy Birthday, Kumari!
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v32/bunniebugs/Elijah/billy.jpg

Mechtild

11-03-2005, 08:19 AM

Happy birthday, Kumari, INDEED!!!!!! :k

*smooches*

First, for Elijah as himself, I'm borrowing "Scarlet's shot" to wish it to you. :cool:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v382/mechtild/Elijah-BWScarlet.jpg

And here's "Lembas Junkie's 'Puttin' of the Ritz' Frodo" to wish you a "Happy Birthday", too:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v382/mechtild/Frodointophatandtails-larger.jpg

~ Mechtild

Fast Toadfoot

11-03-2005, 10:47 AM

Thanks for the props, Whiteling, SkaterGirl and Honey!

Honey, I had a great time IM'ing last night, too!

Yes, if any of the scenes of street violence had played out in any mid-size town in Missouri, (of which St. Louis is not one of them, but I say this from my knowledge of the surrounding countryside), any average citizen who was armed would have pulled out a gun, fired a warning shot and that would have been the end of it. IMHO, an armed society is a polite society! :)

Re the Cafe scene, the WIFE might have pulled out the gun, and said, "Allright you f*#$er, unhand my husband or you will be breathing through a different hole!"

And lousy service is not tolerated! But the political/cultural differences between America, (especially a state like Missouri) and today's United Kingdom is a very long discussion that would take us on many tangents! :lol:

I'm going to Iowa this weekend with my dad to see some of our extended family. I haven't been to the little town of Albia for 4 years, although I have been to Cedar Falls 3 times in that time with my friend from college, Aaron.

Speaking of Iowa, in an attempt to tie this post with relevant subject matter, ;) Elijah Wood is from Iowa! And I had the privelege to live in Dubuque, Iowa, which is not too far from Cedar Rapids, during the time Elijah was there!!!! (August of 1987-May of 1988) When my dad was in seminary, and I was 5 years old!!! Of course, I didn't realise it at the time.

There is a major part of me that is British though, I like to spell words like realise, materialise, cognisant, recognise, etc... the British way. I like it better then spelling it with Z. We'll share some of our gun culture with you, but to trade we'll take your spelling preferences!!! Now you see, I am very easily distracted and go into tangents while posting. :lol:

See you all on Monday when I get back!

-FT

honeyelf

11-03-2005, 11:29 AM

Happy Birthday, KUMARI!!!
:k :k :k
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/e011c0dv.jpg

OK, either Missouri is a lot more primitive than I remember, or California has got a lot more wimpified with the "dot.com" boom, bust and impending boom. Bad service is tolerated here, but not without (my) grumbling. ;)

I cannot imagine anyone around here, in the Silicon Valley, pulling a gun - even faced with Tommy Hatcher's brutality. To be honest, I can't imagine Tommy Hatcher existing here, since we are rather densely populated, and he'd have a hard time lording it over us, hardened individualists that we are. I'm picturing my favorite noodle bar her, as I say that I can imagine a few hard-body university students jumping to that poor man's aid, and bringing the villainous Mr. Hatcher down under their weight.

Fast said: IMHO, an armed society is a polite society!
I know from conversations I've had with TxTac that he feels the same way. I have to ask, is this notion common in the middle part of this country I call home, or is it a peculiarly male perspective? My husband won't own a gun for which I am grateful. Am I so out of touch with Real Life?

honey!

ceefour

11-03-2005, 01:25 PM

Trying to imaging Tommy Hatcher in a noodle bar.....Nope, can't picture it. A Starbucks, maybe, but not a noodle bar. :haha:

Achila, Pelagia, and I saw Good Night, and Good Luck last evening. Excellent movie. Instead of an actor playing Joseph McCarthy, George Clooney (the director) used old B&W film of the man and House Un-American Activities Commitee in session. One face seemed familiar.

A JuniorCouncil for the House Un-American Activities Commitee resigned from it,even though he was hired by Sen. McCarthy, because of the outrageous actions of McCarthy and the commitee. Who might that have been (and what does it have to do with EW)? Because it was Robert Kennedy.

It's a good day; I learned something!

C4

Happy Birthday, Kumari!

wood

11-03-2005, 01:37 PM

HAPPY BIRTHDAY KUMARI!!!!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v399/erendil/3340ejw23.jpg

LOVE YOU ALL/WOOD

Eandme

11-04-2005, 04:52 AM

Hi everyone!
Thank you Whiteling for bringing some positive energy to the project of getting EII shown in Sweden... and Wood, of course you should come to Stockholm and see it witth me if it does come to theatres here!
I would love to join in the conversqtions, but I am in a monastery in France and the French keyboard is driving me bonkers and besides it is prayertime very soon (again)... ;) so Ciao everyone, take care of yurselves!
love ~Eandme :k

Kumari

11-04-2005, 05:58 AM

Thank you BunnieBugs, Mechtild, honeyelf, ceefour and wood for your good wishes! I love the pics too, thank you so much everyone! :k

I'm always here, lurking and enjoying the conversation, even though I don't surface very often! :)

Kumari

Lady Wendy

11-04-2005, 11:20 AM

HAPPY BIRTHDAY, KUMARI !!!

Here, have a lovely pic that we don't see often enough, I think !!!
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v449/wendylady1/Elijah/elijah-bw.jpg

Well, as you all know, I am no longer, "Waiting for Jonathan" :p :D ...last Tuesday, a group of us toddled off to see the first UK screening of " Everything is Illuminated "

Here's what I wrote up in my Live Journal...

"Yesterday, I and a selection of KD friends ( Pearlette, Opaline, Elenya, Sam, Brummie, and Hobbitonlass ) went along to Leicester Square to get ourselves an eyeful of a film that the rest of the UK won't see until December ...

"Everything is Illuminated"
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v449/wendylady1/Elijah/EII1.jpg

Adapted from a novel by Jonathan Safran Foer, "Everything is Illuminated" screened as part of the British Film Institute's London Film Festival for two showings only, yesterday and Thursday 3rd November...both screenings are a total sell-out...

I really looked forward to this film, almost as much as the last two installments of "The Lord of the Rings" trilogy, and I have to say that I wasn't disappointed !! I know that a few of you have been a little underwhelmed by their first look at this film (*cough* Mechtild*cough*) however, for me, it was a very good adaptation with a couple of things that simply didn't work for me...

First the things I just LOVED...

Elijah Wood was an inspired first choice to play the lead role - there is simply no-one better to pin down the role of the emotionally repressed Jonathan, giving us a beautifully restrained and egoless performance, and managing to annoy us and engage us at the same time....who IS this weirdo collector-guy, looking like he is a cast-off from the 1950's, ( with his perfectly unrumpled black suit and white shirt, and ridiculously unflattering huge black-framed glasses )and why does he not get a life ? Elijah managed to connect with our sympathy and became the quiet and very thoughtful centre-point for a story of family discovery that went way beyond Jonathan's 'very rigid search' His look for this film was just perfect for Jonathan, but a sartorial disaster for EJW himself...the only time he looked remotely like someone you would find attractive was when he woke up in the open air beside Alex, with his glasses beside him and his hair all rumpled and sticking up...( see photo above )...that is, up until he fumbled around for his specs !!

Eugene Hurtz was absolutely perfectly cast, and gave us a very well-rounded character in Alex, Jonathan's slightly mad translator with terrible English...He was exactly as I imagined Alex to be, and actually reminded me speechwise, of a few Polish people I have met on my travels in the Eastern European bloc...

The cinematography was just lovely, especially the use of sepia toning for the flash-backs, just like the old photo in Jonathan's possession, and the use of beautiful natural light and flare into the camera lens...

Laryssa Lauret and Boris Leskin were both enchanting in their respective roles as Lista and Grandfather Alex...they are both really talented, very experienced character actors and it showed...

The couple of things that I took issue with, are not in themselves disastrous, but, in my honest opinion, the film would have benefitted from a different approach to both ...

Firstly, the music....I would have preferred to have had a LOT more of the genuine Ukrainian folk-type music, coupled with a LOT more of Devotchka, to fill in the modern musical aspect...( Devotchka are the band who played that haunting song on the trailer, that, unfortunately doesn't appear in the film anywhere at all...)Yes, I'm afraid that Gogol Bordello, ( Eugene Hutz's gypsy-punk band ) just doesn't do it for me AT ALL !!! The film just didn't benefit at all from that raucous racket...kinda spoiled the atmosphere for me...that's all !

The second thing is a point that is generating interesting discussion all over the Internet, by all those who have read the book as well as seeing the film...

Why, oh WHY, was Grandfather's backstory changed so dramatically ????!!!!...

Anyone watching this film would leave it under the impression that Grandfather had been Jewish up until the Nazis came, and having survived the massacre of his shtetl, had cast off his Jewish faith in disgust...

The truth is very different, as readers of the book will find out if they haven't finished it yet...I will not spoil it for those who haven't read the book, suffice to say, that Grandfather's story provokes the inevitable question:

"Well, what would YOU have done ???"

Having got to the point of asking that question, we are suddenly not quite so judgemnental about Grandfather's actions, given his predicament at the time...and even more symapathetic to his reasons for suicide at the end...

This film is a bit of a gem, in my opinion, and could be the Oscar-sleeper of 2006...a bit like "The Pianist"...not for Elijah's performance, good though it was, but for adaptation, cinematography, scriptwriting, direction, and possibly Eugene's Alex...he is a truly memorable character !!!

All in all, we had a lovely evening, the film being followed by a meal at LaTasca Tapas restaurant over in Covent Garden....loads of interesting Spanish bar-snacks and jugs full of Sangria.....yum !!!

tgshaw

11-04-2005, 12:07 PM

Bunnie--Thanks for the link to the review. I'd read at least parts of it before, but somehow had completely missed the last paragraph, which I think is especially lovely and insightful (so I had to grab a bit for my sig ;) ).

So I'm not sure if it was that review or another one that brought up the discussion of the movie's translation. An interesting point that the movie had to actually contain Russian as spoken in the Ukraine, which the book didn't--the book gave us what the movie put in subtitles, and then what Alex said to Jonathan in English. So we get the jokes of the difference between the two: Grandfather: "Maybe you want me to stop the car and the two of you can **** yourselves to Lutsk." Alex: "He said you should look at the beautiful countryside.") But whoever did the translation for the movie must have done a great job. Has the movie been shown in Russia or the Ukraine? It'd be interesting to get any reactions.

As with the book, I find some of the translations touching rather than funny. I was so glad they kept the line "She flew a little," in the movie.

ceefour

11-04-2005, 02:25 PM

When Achila, Pelagia, and I saw EII, there was a group of people sitting a few rows back who must have understood Russian. While the subtitles were funny, they seemed to laugh a bit more than the rest of the audience. They laughed the most and the loudest at the site of the derelict apartment building, the result of "Independence."

Of all that made it from the book to the screen, I was most moved to see the scene of Alex questioning Lista about the photo and Trachimbrod, especially her reply of "You are here. I am it." :(

Seeing EII and TMFKAH within a week of each other provided a fascinating contrast in EW's mannerisms and body language for these very different characters. Strangely, watching Jonathan, I kept thinking of the springs in a wrist watch that if wound too much would break.

C4

Kumari

11-05-2005, 08:06 AM

Thank you for you birthday wishes Wendy! (And another beautiful pic to add to the collection!)

Woo hoo! I've just checked the listings at our local movie theatre and EII starts here in three weeks!

Kumari

BunnieBugs

11-05-2005, 12:32 PM

A fun little item that I just had to pass along: Elijah won the Total Film readers' choice award for "Best Movie Death", and this photo is in the latest issue of the magazine:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v32/bunniebugs/Elijah%202/bestdeath.jpg

This is the blurb that accompanied the article (SPOILERY if you haven't seen Sin City):

Nice bloke Elijah Wood. Sprawled by a swimming pool flicking through Total Film, he's "extremely honoured" to be recognised for expiring so impressively in Sin City... "Best Death, eh? Well, you know, when your arms and legs are cut off and you're eaten by a dog, you can't really argue with that! It was such a great experience. To jump into that film noir-esque world, that's so dark and ****ed up, and to play a character like Kevin, was an unbelievable treat and this award is great. And it's definitely a first for me! Thank you so much!"

I'll bet he was just tickled... to death. :D

saile

11-05-2005, 02:07 PM

Love that photo Bunnie :k and accompanying blurb. I bet he was thrilled.

Had to be in Lurkin mode this week so catchin upI missed Kumaris birthday and neglected to post a picture for Fast Toadfoots so here are two from my cant go wrong with these collection. Happy Birthday Kumari and Fast Toadfoot.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v404/billiep/Frodo.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v404/billiep/Frodo2.jpg

Thanks for the links and articles ceefour, BunnieBugs, Honeyelf, Txtac (whod I miss?).

You may all have seen this one since it dates from Sept 29, 2005 but I loved reading this
Im very grateful to Elijah because what I asked him to do was very difficult, says Schreiber. Thats to create a character you dont ask the audience to immediately identify with. The natural conventions of film are to identify with whats familiar, which in this case would be the American. There was an effort on our part to make him unfamiliar and to keep him at arms distance. In effect, the American becomes the alien. What we do is find ourselves through the foreigner, then the foreigner gives us the American.It is from an article by Jason Anderson found here (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v404/billiep/EII%20Articles/JasonAndersonArticlepage1.jpg) and here (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v404/billiep/EII%20Articles/JasonAndersonArticlepage2.jpg) and here (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v404/billiep/EII%20Articles/JasonAndersonArticlepage3.jpg).

And I loved your thoughts/reviews ceefour and Lady Wendy on EII.
saile

BunnieBugs

11-05-2005, 02:30 PM

Thanks for that, Saile; I'm not sure I read that one. It might be one of the ones I skimmed lightly for fear of spoilers. It's a good one!

tgshaw

11-05-2005, 08:34 PM

EJW NEWSWIRE, Herrington, Ohio: It's not the excitement of a new movie opening that's felt in the air of the Herrington High faculty lounge tonight. It's a quiet, almost hushed, anticipation for the first display of a newly unearthed specimen of The Profile, dating from year 17 of the elwoodian epoch. The background has been carefully brushed away, pixel by pixel, so as not to deface the treasured artifact. Since this effort was completed on the birthday of faculty member Kumari, the work has been dedicated to her.

http://www.frodolivesin.us/Pics/2cb94fa0.jpg

(And you can see more versions of it here (http://www.frodolivesin.us/Pics/id42.htm).)

Kumari

11-05-2005, 09:45 PM

EJW NEWSWIRE, Herrington, Ohio: It's not the excitement of a new movie opening that's felt in the air of the Herrington High faculty lounge tonight. It's a quiet, almost hushed, anticipation for the first display of a newly unearthed specimen of The Profile, dating from year 17 of the elwoodian epoch. The background has been carefully brushed away, pixel by pixel, so as not to deface the treasured artifact. Since this effort was completed on the birthday of faculty member Kumari, the work has been dedicated to her.
Oh my! What an honour, TG! Thank you so much! :k It's beautiful - and the other versions as well..

I know what painstaking work is involved removing those unwanted pixels - you have unveiled a masterpiece!

Saile - both of your pics are beautiful, but that second one just melted me. :k Thank you!

wood

11-06-2005, 02:05 PM

EVENING ALL!!!

oh my god Saile what a beautiful picture!!!
it now decorate my desktop as my new background!!! :p

Like Kumari was saying it realy melted my heart!!!

And TG thanks for sharing!! :k :k

And thanks all for the rewies and article!!! :k :k

WOOD

ceefour

11-06-2005, 05:26 PM

tg, :lol:

C4

Fast Toadfoot

11-06-2005, 10:32 PM

Hello all. I had a great weekend in Elijah Wood's home state of Iowa. I got to see a lot of extended family, which was wonderful. I felt a little like JSF, reconnecting with my past... ;)

Although, now I actually DO plan on keeping in touch with my Iowa relatives better. My cousin Bobby and I were really happy to see each other.

Anyway, I missed you all, Happy Birthday to Kumari, and thank you again to everyone who wished me a happy birthday!!!

Three months til Elwood turns 25!!! Time flies quickly!

Some observations about The FAculty. Thank you for posting that pic and bit about Herrington High School!

You could really notice the difference between Principal Drake and Mrs. Olson before and after the aliens got 'em.

Before they got Drake, she had straight hair, and was a frustrated, burnt out principal who I think wanted out. Then, she had teased hair, smiled a lot, and was overall kind of freaky. Mrs. Olson had her hair up, glasses and looked very prim, proper. Then, she changed her outfit, wore her hair down and just had that weird look.

These people were all of a sudden more comfortable with themselves, more at ease. If Casey noticed all this, which I'm sure he did, it had to be tempting for him when Mary Beth was walking uncovered in the locker room asking him to join them.

I absolutely love this movie, because Casey says, "I'd rather be afraid", which is possibly the best line in the movie. Being a human isn't necessarily about being comfortable and fitting in, it's about having your own quirks, fading into the shadows, being your own person. Using the different gifts and traits you've been given. I would love to hear observations from anyone along these lines, as well as minute observations about differences in characters before and after they get "alienated". Famke Janssen's character, obviously had the most obvious change; but that probably made it a little unbelievable because it was a little bit too obvious.

Also, does anyone know exactly when they got Delilah?

One more thing, I think she got Coach Willis, who stabbed Drake in the hand, then he got Mrs. Olson, who got Drake when she came outside. I find this movie absolutely fascinating!!! And since this is named the Faculty Lounge!!!

-FT

honeyelf

11-07-2005, 01:11 AM

Faculty Spoilers[COLOR=Red]

Don't know if I need to mark that, but ya never know.

The next to the last time I watched the Faculty, I finally picked up on where Stokley got "converted;" at the water fountain she feels something weird in her throat. It's just a quick reaction from her, and then her (our) attetion gets directed elsewhere. The very next big scene was in Jon Stewarts classroom, when he looks at that thing Casey found on the football field. The last shot of the scene was of Stokley with her hand against the aquarium glass, and the things tentacles form themselves to the shape of her hand.

So the last time I watche The Faculty, I watched the "test" scene, where all the principle characters snort the scat to prove they are not alien. Delilah is revealed in that scene, but Stokely seems to snort the stuff and not get found out.

I think Mr. Rodriguez played a little fast and loose, faking out the audience, convincing us that we'd seen things that we actually didn't. I'm not sure that he didn't leave a few truck-sized holes in the plot.

As for Delilah, I don't think we see where she gets "converted' on screen, but by Casey's next morning at school, when she appears "in disguise" it's probably a done deal.

honey!

BunnieBugs

11-07-2005, 01:25 AM

Honey, I always figured that Stokely got "assimilated" ;) in the pool when MaryBeth was chasing her. Don't you think that the water fountain scene was a bit early for it? :confused: But, now I have a good excuse to pull it out and watch it. :cool:

And I agree that Delilah's conversion happens offscreen between one day and the next.

Hobmom

11-07-2005, 01:35 AM

More possible Faculty spoilers.......

Ah! Interesting deductions, Honey.

I've always thought that Delilah gets taken over that first night and NOT in the lab by one of Jon Stewart's runaway alien fingers as some have previously supposed.

But I do think Stokely isn't 'gotten' till she's in the pool being attacked by Marybeth. I know the scene you are referring to but I think that's just when Stokely catches on that something really wierd is going on.

Not that I've studied this or anything. ;)

whiteling

11-07-2005, 07:35 AM

Happy Birthday, Pelagia! :)

in light of the current Faculty discussion as well as suitable for occasion and name (pelagios - Greek for "of the sea") I thought a Casey moment would be nice as present ---

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/whiteling/Faculty_find.jpg

pic courtesy of undone27

Tg, *loved* THE PROFILE :)!

Saile and Bunnie, wonderful pics! :)

...spoilery comment on The Faculty...

I, too, would vote for Stokely's assimilation not before the pool scene.
Delilah? Not sure about her, but I tend to agree with Honey's suggestion.

ceefour

11-07-2005, 07:55 AM

Happy Birthday, Pelagia!

C4

Achila

11-07-2005, 08:02 AM

Happy Birthday to my dear Pelagia !

Here's a little something to brighten your day (he may not look happy, but I know you will be, to see this) --

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v236/aquila0212/the-yank-behind-hi-res-059.jpg

And here's something that brightened MY day -- William H. Macy (and others) has joined the cast of Bobby (note who is playing Elijah's brother) --

Macy, Hunt, Slater join RFK campaign By Borys Kit
Mon Nov 7, 5:50 AM ET

LOS ANGELES (Hollywood Reporter) - William H. Macy, Helen Hunt, Christian Slater, Joshua Jackson and James Marsden have been enlisted for "Bobby," Emilio Estevez's project about the assassination of Robert F. Kennedy.

Estevez's father, Martin Sheen, and Joy Bryant are in negotiations to join the project, which Estevez wrote and is directing.

The film chronicles the intertwining lives of a grand cast of characters at Los Angeles' Ambassador Hotel in the hours leading up to Kennedy's assassination. Anthony Hopkins, Demi Moore, Sharon Stone, Elijah Wood, Lindsay Lohan, Shia LaBeouf, Nick Cannon, Freddy Rodriguez and Brian Geraghty already are cast in the film, currently shooting in Los Angeles. Estevez also has a role.

Macy plays the hotel's manager, and Slater is the bigoted food and beverage manager. Jackson ("Dawson's Creek") plays the head of the Los Angeles chapter of the Youth for Kennedy brigade, while Marsden ("Superman Returns") is a man whose brother is being drafted into war.

Sheen would portray a wealthy East Coast financier staying at the hotel with his wife (Hunt). Bryant ("Get Rich or Die Tryin"') will play a switchboard operator.

Mechtild

11-07-2005, 08:15 AM

Happy Birthday, Pelagia.....

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v382/mechtild/ElijahBWautograph-500wide.jpg

***

And here's something that brightened MY day -- William H. Macy (and others) has joined the cast of Bobby (note who is playing Elijah's brother) --
That does, in fact brighten my day. I like William H. Macy's work an awful lot. (And he's a little, quirky guy with giant eyes, too.)

Who is James Marsden? I suppose I will have to look him up and see if I have seen him in anything (unlikely, since I rarely go to see a film :rolleyes: ). I don't think I saw a Superman film called, "Superman Returns," only the old Christopher Reeves ones, which would make any actor in them too old to play EW's brother at this point.

ETA: OK, I looked James Marsden up and see the Superman film is still being worked on. From his pics, he looks like a young Willem Dafoe, but more conventionally handsome. He sure doesn't look like Elijah Wood's brother. Maybe they are step brothers? ;)

~ Mechtild

Kumari

11-07-2005, 08:43 AM

Thank you Fast Toadfoot - and the same back at you!

Also, Happy Birthday to Pelagia. November seems to be a busy birthday month!

Here's an oldie but goodie! I'm sorry it's so huge - but then again, maybe not! :D

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/Maewen/torontolijhuge2A.jpg

Kumari

wood

11-07-2005, 10:18 AM

HAPPY BIRTHDAY PELAGIA !!!!

It was the meaning i woulde post a picture from the Faculty since the discution was about that one but for some reson i diden`t have one picture
from that movie !!! :eek: I guess i have to go on a teasure hunt!!! :cool:

But here come a picture from one of my favo.movies! :cool:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v399/erendil/elijah%20movie/bumblebee16.jpg

Hope you like it!! And that you will have a very good day!!!! :k

And going back to the faculty i have to agree,I think Stokley was "taken"
in the pool,i think her reaction at the fontan was when she saw something strange was going on,maybe the ear thing and the police showing up.

Dehlila on the other hand have not a clue must be as you sade of screen!!

LOVE YOU ALL/WOOD

BunnieBugs

11-07-2005, 10:39 AM

Happy Birthday, Pelagia!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v32/bunniebugs/Elijah%202/elle25.jpg

saile

11-07-2005, 10:55 AM

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v404/billiep/phoenixsept292005.jpg

Happy Birthday Pelagia
saile

honeyelf

11-07-2005, 11:20 AM

Happy Birthday, PELAGIA! :k :k :k
Well, he lost his comb, the next stop is definitely a pot of coffee, but he's ready to spend your day with you. Have fun!
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/justback2.jpg

Bunnie said: I always figured that Stokely got "assimilated" in the pool when MaryBeth was chasing her. Don't you think that the water fountain scene was a bit early for it? And everyone else seconded and thirded and forthded her! ;)

OK, I guess that makes more sense. Take a close look at the scene where Stokes puts her hand on the aquarium glass though. The creature in the tank does something very odd. Was that just it sensing her seperateness from the rest, and trying to seduce her with promises of not being alone anymore? I guess that makes alot of sense.

I meant to say earlier that I enjoyed your review of EII, Lady Wendy.

TG, glad to know someone is keeping up the scholarly end of things! ;)

Bunnie, loved the Total Film award for "Best Death" news! And that picture!

hugs all around,
honey!

ylla

11-07-2005, 11:37 AM

Happiest of Birthdays Pelagia

Go up the blue stairs to join your party

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v480/ylla/stairs2.jpg

And a belated happy birthday to everyone else that I missed!
Sorry I've not been around much, but RL has kept me quite busy

tgshaw

11-07-2005, 12:14 PM

ylla! Good to see you!

What can I say? Great pics from everyone! :cool:

And a Very Happy Birthday to Pelagia! Since I've posted just about all the pics I have, how about a re-run of Casey looking through the acquarium (minus those pesky red filaments in front of his face)?

http://www.frodolivesin.us/Pics/0ca22dc0.jpg

On that topic, Honey, I think it's very likely the alien is doing something weird to Stokes there, but I don't think she's been taken over at that point. Trying to make some kind of a connection? Scoping her out? I'll have to watch that more carefully, so thanks for bringing it up.

from Fast Toadfoot:
These people were all of a sudden more comfortable with themselves, more at ease...
...and the coach being all nice when Stan tells him he's quitting the football team. Another parallel, in a way, with Invasion of the Body Snatchers, which comes up several times during the movie.

I absolutely love this movie, because Casey says, "I'd rather be afraid", which is possibly the best line in the movie. Being a human isn't necessarily about being comfortable and fitting in, it's about having your own quirks, fading into the shadows, being your own person. Using the different gifts and traits you've been given. I would love to hear observations from anyone along these lines...

Well, here are some of mine ;) . You haven't, by any chance, been reading my website, Master Fast :p ? Or just a case of great minds running in the same channels :) .
Frodo's the ultimate example of that [unconventional, non-obvious heroism], as he has been for 50 years, but Casey's a good study in it, too. His final face-off with the alien may be his most heroic-looking action, but I see an even deeper courage in the moment shown in the picture in this page's lefthand border [below], as the tormented outsider listens to a description of the perfect life of acceptance and self-confidence he can have by simply agreeing to deny who he really is: and then rejects it. Why do I believe that's what's happening? How do I know he isn't just sitting there with his eyes closed getting his breath back, or waiting for the perfect time to attack? By looking at his face... and his head position... and his entire body posture... It's a perfect elwoodian acting moment that lets you look into the character's soul, even if you can't see his eyes.

http://www.frodolivesin.us/143c96ce0.jpg

Link to full essay (http://www.frodolivesin.us/id295.htm).

I thought there was something more, but it took me a little while to find it ;) . From "The Tests" (http://www.frodolivesin.us/Casey/id8.htm) in Casey Connor: Action Hero:

I found this to be an emotionally affecting moment. This is Casey while Mary Beth describes the pain-free, fearless acceptance he could find as part of her "hive." Could be quite a tempting offer to an outcast, geeky Stephen King kid.

http://www.frodolivesin.us/Casey/0f5f41c0.jpg

But when Mary Beth comes around the corner of the lockers, she sees this:

http://www.frodolivesin.us/Casey/15ff41b0.jpg

...and hears (from someplace else), what I think is Casey's greatest line in the movie: "I'd rather be afraid."

Achila

11-07-2005, 01:38 PM

Re: Stokely in The Faculty -- this' what it says in the script for the scene we've been discussing: "Stokely presses her hand against the glass of the tank and gazed at the creature, mesmerized." That's where the scene ends. So my thought is that because you find out later that Stokes is a big science fiction buff, she's already imagining/fantasizing that this thing is some sort of alien (which, of course, it turns out to be). I don't think there's anything, really, behind the creature seemingly responding to her in particular by extending its filaments, but it's Stokely's reaction to it that's important.

Mechtild

11-07-2005, 01:57 PM

:k Thanks, all!

*scrolls back up to admire all the pictures*

(I just love birthdays around here, even when they are not mine. ;) )

~ Mechtild

Lady Wendy

11-07-2005, 02:04 PM

HAPPY BIRTHDAY, PELAGIA !!!

Oh look....Elijah has bought you a flower !! How thoughtful...
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v449/wendylady1/Elijah/EJWsunflower1.jpg

Hope you have a lovely day...

Now, here's a peculiar thought....what if Elijah had been cast as another character in LOTR, and not Frodo ?
Whilst pootling around on the Internet, I found this creation by a LJ regular called Roqui, who posted this at Elijah Daily...( thank-you, Roqui !! )
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v449/wendylady1/Elijah/EJWasLegolas.jpg
...and it got me thinking, I wonder how we would be discussing Elijah's work if he had been another character...it's a strange thought, because we are SO accustomed to him as Frodo, but what if he HAD been cast as Legolas instead...what sort of Elf would he have made...( aside from a very short one !! )...well, you don't really have to answer that one, as he has already been described umpteen times as 'elfin'...!!
However, I do wonder how it would have affected his subsequent roles, if the world had got to know him as an Elf rather than a Hobbit...

ceefour

11-07-2005, 02:47 PM

I've only seen The Faculty once ( :eek: Am I expelled from The Faculty now?), but, at the time, I thought the aliens recognized Stokely as a potential victim, but couldn't attack through the glass.

EW as an elf?! He makes a nice one in the picture, Lady Wendy.

Achila, do you have any other screenplays?

Yes, Mechtild, birthdays are nice here.

C4

Achila

11-07-2005, 02:55 PM

Achila, do you have any other screenplays?
I also found The Ice Storm online somewhere, and tg has that -- TG, the offer still stands for The Faculty script, if you want it. But that's it in the way of screenplays. I know where the transcripts live for LOTR, if you want those.

Alyon

11-07-2005, 02:59 PM

Sorry to miss so many birthdays!!

Happy Birthday Kumari, Fast Toadfoot, and Pelagia!! NIce to see you back, Wood, and Ylla.

Lady Wendy!! That is one very nice looking elf!! ;)

ceefour

11-07-2005, 03:00 PM

Achila, it sounds like we'd be making a cash-only deal in some dark alley somewhere!

C4

Achila

11-07-2005, 03:11 PM

Achila, it sounds like we'd be making a cash-only deal in some dark alley somewhere! Hmmm...that could be arranged...

Pssst.....it's ceefour's birthday tomorrow....pass it on...

Shelbyshire

11-07-2005, 07:31 PM

Happy Birthday Pelagia!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v638/Shelbyshire/seanlijahspam_45tn.jpg

ETA:

"Where?" inquires Elijah.

"Over there. She's right over there. She would love it if you walked over and wished her a happy birthday today!" says Sean.

"Oh, okay. I see her." Elijah says as he points towards ceefour.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v638/Shelbyshire/seanlijahspam_68tn.jpg

"I can do that. Her name's ceefour, right?" asks Elijah.

"Yes." answers Sean.

"Wasn't it Pelagia's birthday yesterday too. I'll wish them both a happy birthday since we're in the same post!" announces Elijah.

"Excellent idea! And, tell them to have a most wonderful day!!" says Sean.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v638/Shelbyshire/seanlijahspam_69tn.jpg

He's on his way ladies!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v638/Shelbyshire/rtmewb55.jpg

Happy Birthday ceefour and Pelagia!

Pelagia

11-08-2005, 07:54 AM

Happy birthday, ceefour! My fellow Scorpio! Heres my offering for the day, because I know you love LOTR, and because none of us can ever have too much of Frolijah (sorry about Samwise being in there, too, but Im not clever enough to cut him out):

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v653/Lalage/FOTRfinalscene.jpg

Hello to everybody else! Achila alerted me to all the birthday greetings. Thank you so much, whiteling (like everyone else here, I adore Casey; and yes, "pelagic" is appropriate), Achila (you know I love that scene the battered look; the ultimate expression of angst, I suppose), ceefour, Mechtild (never saw that pic before), Kumari (happy birthday back at you, belatedly), wood (what movie is that from??), BunnieBugs (SO glad to hear about Elijahs award from Total Film ;) ), saile, honeyelf, ylla, tgshaw (I completely agree with your commentary on Casey in the locker room), Lady Wendy (oh, he makes a great Elf! Can somebody Photoshop him to look like some other key LOTR characters? Aragorn? Gimli?? Arwen???), Alyon, and Shelbyshire (I love those wet-head stills). Sorry if I missed anyone.

I feel bad about not having been on here in so long (nearly 2 months, I think)! Abject apologies to everyone whose birthday Ive missed. Ive just been busy (in a good way) with real life. Also, increasingly frustrated with my slow dial-up Internet connection. Id like to get something faster, but theres not much point in that unless I get a new computer (mine is vintage 1998), and the mind quails at the prospect.

And I suppose Ive been frustrated by the (mis)fortunes of TMFKAH and EII. I think Elijah has been badly served by the marketers/distributors of those films. Achila and ceefour (who, I assume, have kept KD posted on the exploits of our Terrible Trio) have probably already reported on our going to see both of those movies. We were lucky to have the opportunity! So far as I know, TMFKAH played in the Philadelphia area for only 1 week, and only in five widely scattered suburban theaters (no downtown venue). EII spent 2 weeks in one downtown theater and three small suburban ones (including the one where I work). All three suburban theaters are independent nonprofits, so I dont imagine that they provided much revenue for EII. But at least we got to see the films.

My general impressions of both TMFKAH and EII when I first saw them were pretty much borne out by the second viewings. In TMFKAH, I found the London accents easier to understand the second time around. I thought that Matts confrontation with his father was perhaps Elijahs finest moment in the film (although for pure swoonability, the navy jacket with turned-up collar still reigns supreme!). As for EII, there is a lot more going on in his performance than is apparent upon first viewing. And just in terms of body language, his stiff little walk down the train corridor is hilarious. (Who was it who described his Jonathan as "a precise little exclamation point of a man"?) I cant wait for both of these to come out on DVD. Oh, the opportunities for pause, slo-mo, and zoom!

BTW, our office at the theater has acquired a large EII poster (Jonathan with eyes closed and cloud-y glasses) signed, no less! It has been placed high up on the wall, not far from my desk. So I feel as if our activities are being presided over by this very serene, rather Buddha-ish being looking down upon us. Not to mention the fact that I have the chance to study The Mouth and The Chin simply by lifting up mine eyes unto the walls.

One last note on subtle performances: David Strathairns Edward R. Murrow, in Good Night, and Good Luck, is a masterpiece of subtlety. His impersonation of Murrow is the least of it. Its just a pleasure to watch how much he can convey with apparently minimal shifts in expression. Thats the sort of role Id like to see Elijah play 30 years from now. (Frank Langella is also excellent in GNAGL; plus interesting, atmospheric cinematography. And huge clouds of cigarette smoke. . . .)

And for any fellow Joss Whedon devotees who may be out there Serenity is a blast! But another movie that didnt do as well as I had hoped, and that didnt stay around long enough.

(Sorry that was such a long post, but Ive been quiet for so long.)