Ever feel like someone's watching you?

http://www.frodolivesin.us/Pics/0983d530.jpg

BTW, before we start, Narya assures me that we can rename the thread if we want; I tried to come up with something "schoolly" like "The Faculty Lounge, sophomore version," but everything I could think of was too long. So take a deep breath... :k

The quote below is a version of the introduction Sheryl wrote for the Faculty Lounge thread 2+ years ago. It's been edited to update it a bit, and to remove words such as "warn" and "excruciating" (as in "Be warned: the Faculty analyzes... in excruciating detail") because they make it sound like, well, a bad thing ;) .

Hi there, and Welcome to the Faculty Lounge! Take a seat on a couch and check out an Elijah Wood movie. The Faculty analyzes Elijah Wood's performances, movies, and characters in detail. In the process we have been known to discuss everything from biology to whether PJ intends to evoke medieval paintings in his shots of Frodo.

An on-going debate in the Faculty is whether actors can make use of microexpressions, which are tiny changes in expression that pass by so fast people can't really see them, but that influence people's responses. The Faculty has been known to go through sections of EW's performances frame-by-frame in this debate, and then talk about what emotions he's trying to convey, why the character would feel that way, etc.

Since this thread was originally the Elijah Wood: Non-Swoon thread back at Imladris, I would like to ask that swoons here be kept to a minimum. Hobmom has a swoon thread where she puts up monthly wallpaper and does all manner of niftiness.

Basically, posters to this thread treat EW and each other with respect, and tolerate huge long posts on minutia and pure speculation- but don't require them.

And since this is a bit of a turning point, it might be interesting to look back. Did you realize that since The Faculty Lounge opened, there have been 7 Elijah Wood movies released, and 5 others that weren't then on DVD but now are? I'd think we could take some credit for that second number, at least. :cool:

Faculty research has also been responsible for a veritable explosion (one of my boss's favorite phrases ;) ) of specialized areas of elwoodian study including Nat angst, camera angels, jaw setting, jawline acting, nostril acting, eyebrow acting, skin-fold analysis, [that muscle whose name I can never remember] analysis, "How does he do that?" moments, cloak action, Secret Sam Smiles, The One Expression, the Golden Ratio facial feature analysis, evaluation of Ed Burns' walking skills, micro-expression theory vs. repertoire theory of Elijah Wood acting, capping vs. the Gap, Try 17 vs. All I Want, Todd vs. Boy George, and whether it's possible to watch TAMTSNBN without permanent neural damage.

All that, and still no grant funding! :rolleyes:

So find a seat :) , pop in a movie :) , and fill a cup at the water cooler (just one cup, though--Casey might still be hiding in the closet with that broom and we don't want him to get suspicious).

-----------

ETA another bit of history to remember:

At the end of the previous Faculty Lounge thread we had:

9580 posts
229,306 views. :cool:

Thanks for the hard work , Narya! :k

Have to check in so I get my email notifications.

Hello (again)! :)

The quote below is a version of the introduction Sheryl wrote for the Faculty Lounge thread 2+ years ago. It's been edited to update it a bit, and to remove words such as "warn" and "excruciating" (as in "Be warned: the Faculty analyzes... in excruciating detail") because they make it sound like, well, a bad thing ;) .

I still argue that those phrases were a valid warning to the mods of the time. :p :D

Not Narya, of course. :k


whether it's possible to watch TAMTSNBN without permanent neural damage.


I was going to protest that your continued intact existence argues against that theory - but now I'm trying to remember if you were the one who listened to the whole thing rather than watching. :D

So much of your list is new since we moved here. :cool: Nat angst remains in my top five. :) But you forgot another of my favorites - the rigor mortis discussion. :D

Here's to a new start and hopes of another nine thousand posts of niftiness (it seems like we always have to start over right before 10000 posts, but I may be misremembering?). toasts the Faculty :)

Sheryl

Still here, still mostly lurking, and still enjoying the journey. :)

I was going to protest that your continued intact existence argues against that theory - but now I'm trying to remember if you were the one who listened to the whole thing rather than watching. :D
No, I'm afraid I watched the whole thing... Your point being? ;)

So much of your list is new since we moved here. :cool: Nat angst remains in my top five. :) But you forgot another of my favorites - the rigor mortis discussion. :D
Oh, yes, I'm sure there are many, many more.

-----------

For one piece of useful information ;) -- the info at amazon now says the "collector's edition" of ESOTSM that's being released on January 4 will be a 2-disk DVD, but still doesn't say what will be on them.

---------

ETA: Anyone who is wanting a way to be helpful, and has a computer with a good CD and/or DVD "write" drive and a lot of memory, could pop in at the "Server Problems" thread at the top of the Community Cafe page where a few people are trying to figure out how to save the previous Faculty Lounge thread, which is going to have to be deleted pretty soon (too big to archive, it seems). One thought is that if the job were divided up, with a number of people each saving a number of pages, it might be easier. Sheryl has been saving pages as we've gone along, but she's quite a ways behind.

The way I understand it, if we archive the thread every thousand posts, this won't be a problem in the future. But at close to 10,000 posts, it's just too big.

If you're interested in helping save the old thread to disc to make sure it doesn't suffer the fate of the Harem thread, pop into the 'Server Troubles' thread at the top of the Cafe. I have a proposal there for splitting up the work of saving the thread, so anyone who has a bit of time and hard drive space, please go and see if you could assist. :k

Lovely welcoming post, tg! I feel very comfortable already. The Frolijah picture certainly doesn't hurt. :p

from tgshaw
Did you realize that since The Faculty Lounge opened, there have been 7 Elijah Wood movies released, and 5 others that weren't then on DVD but now are? I'd think we could take some credit for that second number, at least.
LOL! I'm taking partial credit! My library is pretty extensive. :eek: Not to mention the movies I've patronized. :D

All that, and still no grant funding! :D
I will work on this soon. The very important, difficult, refined, and extensive analysis we do in this forum should be heavily supported. *begins authoring grant proposal*

Thank you for starting the Faculty Mike 2 (I would have said "Mark 2, but I think Elijah's been Mike more than he's been Mark. Uh-oh, new research project!) :D

So glad I still can call "the Faculty" my home...it so is my home away from RL
I can't tell you how much you all mean to me.
You have been there through the most difficult year of my adult life...and it's meant so much to me.
Don't want to sound too sentimental..but I love you all :k
Back when I joined in June of this past year my life was pretty ordinary...just turned 50...just found a wonderful guy to obsess over...life was pretty good..then hubby got REAL sick...you guys really saved my butt...
Honey had just led me over here in June...I lurked awhile...I posted..and then all hell broke loose...the kicker was I made Achila my liason for info re: hubby's illness and my state of mind..and I found that I had more friends then I ever imagined possible. How could people I never met care about me so much? Back when my husband was first hospitalized..people on the board started asking where I was...how I was...You cared...it touched me beyond my wildest dreams...I will never forget that feeling...Elijah fans are the Best people in the world.
Since June I have become close to extraordinary people...Honey...who I always will be grateful to for leading me to "The Group" :k Wood who I speak with almost every morning..thru IM...and Achila who is responsible for my keeping Air Tran in business :k
Thank You TG for starting the new thread..I look forward to a new beginning...lots more of Elijah to discuss...new movies...new horizons....new possibilities...ohhh it's going to be a wonderful journey.....never want to do this alone...so want to share this ride a long... :D long time :D

Hallo ladies!!!

And thanks for the warm welcome TG!!!
I have that feeling all the time!!
But i don`t mind with those eyes and face
he can look at me any time!!!!! :)
Me swooning??No not at all!! :p :D :lol:

So glade we still in action!!!!!
I wish i coulde do something to help
but i have to take the discution with
hubby first!!! :(

A big thank you to all who has worked so
hard with this!!!! :k

Yeas,many new movies to look at, my own
libary getting bigger and bigger!!! :p :D

Seams that i can`t stop doing this but
who wants to stop??!! :cool: :lol:

Love you all/Wood

Instead of saying "Ever feel like Someone's Watching?" just change it to "Don't you love it when Someone watches over you?"

Frodo/Elijah looks so fierce in that blue picture where the first quote came from. My quote (second) can be used for it instead. :lol:

Besides, isn't it obvious in that Blue Picture to open this new place, he certainly has a manly body now.

I even noticed it when he first gives the Ring to Galadral, and stands with a sort of spotlight on him. Are his shoulders really that broad and manly and even his chest and arms? It sure looked like it to me. :D

Morning, all!

Here are some nice pics from last Thursday's event at the Arclight, with Charlie Kauffman. Nice hair, eh? :)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v236/aquila0212/lijcharlie3.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v236/aquila0212/lijcharlie2.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v236/aquila0212/lijcharlie1.jpg

Thanks Tg.

Lovely, lovely pictures, Achila! Thanks. :)

Nice hair, eh?

Mmmm!

Here's another one to help start things off again.

http://www.imagemagician.com/images/blossom/Frodo5.jpg

Well speaking of blue pictures, i found this one
I found this one very beautiful maybe becuse of the eyes!!!!!! :p :D

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v399/erendil/3260Elijah_Wallpaper_13.jpg


Thanks for your picture Achila!!!!! :k
In my opinion dosen`t his hair look that awful!! I think that
the mowhak stayle was worse!!! :(

Love you/ Wood

In my opinion dosen`t his hair look that awful!! I think that
the mowhak stayle was worse!!! :(

Awful?? Oh no, I think it's lovely. And to tell the truth, even the fauxhawk, which I hated at the beginning, grew on me after a while (well, OK, not after a very long while -- more like five minutes!).

okey!!!!

Fauxhawk!!! I coulden`t remember the name of it !!!
Thanks Achila!!!!!

YLLA!!! MY DEAR FRIEND!!!! :k :k
your words almost makes me cry!!!!! :(
You are a very good and nice person yourself
helping me out every time i having troubel!!!!!

And i know the feeling !!! All this wonderful people who i don`t even
seen! and you are like my new family all of you!!!!! :k :k :k

love/wood

Hi Faculty! Here's my first offering to the new thread :)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v327/ShirelingUK/jst14crop.jpg
Awful?? Oh no, I think it's lovely. And to tell the truth, even the fauxhawk, which I hated at the beginning, grew on me after a while (well, OK, not after a very long while -- more like five minutes!).

I love the hair too Achila - in fact if he'd just keep that style and that colour I'd be very happy - although just slightly longer might be even better. Although the fauxhawk wasn't one of my favourite styles, I have a great fondness for it - and it does look even better in the flesh ;)

Beautiful collages, Blossom and Wood :)

Well, now that the Ian Curtis role is no longer just a rumour, and we know that Elijah is either considering, or being considered for it, I can't help feeling quite excited. And its not because its probably being filmed in Manchester - oh no, how dare anyone suggest such a thing :o ;) :D

Thanks for the opening post TG - and for such a swoonworthy pic to start us off :)

LONG MAY THE FACULTY REIGN :)

A Toast to Sheryl!
...who's probably needing this about now...

http://www.imagemagician.com/images/tgshaw/off topic/champagne-resized.jpg

...after having saved the entire "old" Faculty Lounge thread. [need the applause smiley here ;) ] :cool:

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In case anyone in the U.S. hasn't noticed, John Kerry has been sporting a CTJ over the last week of the campaign. (An outdoor-type jacket, so something of a cross between EJW and PJ :p .) Don't know if it will help him win, but it couldn't hurt ;) .

--------

Okay, these pages aren't yet connected to the "skeleton" (which is about all the main site is now), but it's possible to see all of the new screencaps now by going to the appropriate subdomain:

The first 3 pages of the Mirror of Galadriel (lots more blue pictures ;) ) on http://www.frodolivesin.us/FotR

And pages 10-14 of Shelob's Lair on http://www.frodolivesin.us/RotK

(And, yes, there will be a .../TTT, but it's not up yet :) Neither is anything regarding Elijah's non-LotR movies. But it took me two days to get the FotR subdomain to publish correctly, so I'm happy to have that one up--it's probably the biggest of them all, since I've been adding pages to it for so long.)

Something I didn't mention, but is pretty obvious ;) , is that any close-ups of Frodo in the Galadriel's Mirror caps are either frame-by-frame or very close to it. And each frame could be a beautiful picture all by itself.

Are we making offerings to the new thread?



http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v480/ylla/beace310.jpg





Thought I'd offer this one before Achila gets to it :D

Nice job Sheryl :k Thank You for saving the old thread

Hullo Dear Colleagues!

Sitting here at JFK, waiting to leave NYC. :( Flourish and Achila, thank you for sharing your town with me. I hope to return sooner rather than later!

To any and all Faculty Colleagues; if you find yourself in San Francisco, let me know! :)

Lovely opening post TG! And that picture of Frodo; soon's I get home I'm saving that one to disc (i.e. NOT hubby's laptop! :D)

Love the new hair the One Lad is sporting! (Though you know I loved the fauxhawk, too!)

Conducted lots of location research :D . Found I'd been spending a disproportionate amount of my NY time in The Flatiron District, all unknowing. (If you ever find yourself there, you MUST stop in the ABC Carpet & Home store just to drool over shear visual delight!) Enjoyed Toy Tokyo (shopping for my anime-freak otaku daughter), and Babbo is an adventure, just as himself said!

Sheryl, you saved the entire old thread? :D Bravo! :k :k

Hugs to all,
honey!

Hi all,

I've been lurking for a few weeks now as I tried to make my way thru the now apparently vanished archives of this and a couple other KD threads. I have to say the Faculty is my fave place to waste time. I am in awe of all of you. I may never have anything else to add here as you ladies delve deeper and soar higher in thought than I, and put it all in to words much better.

I did want to add this link to a site that has some photos of Elijah from a concert he attended on Sunday. At first I wasn't sure the date was right but after seeing the ones posted with Charlie I will assume the hair is making a comeback! YES!! Oh sorry... I do love his hair longer I must say.

Here is a link to those pictures and if you follow the 'next' sign there are more pages full of Elijah goodness.

http://members.fortunecity.com/calicosoldier/elijahnew.html

Eáránë Elensar

Welcome to the faculty Eáránë!!!!!

I hope you will like it here as much as i am!!!!!
Thank you so much fore the link,great photos!!!!!!!! :k :k :k


Well i am the curiose on it woulde be fun if you coulde tell
us were you from and when you hade you first meating with
this gourges actor!!!!You don`t have too ansewre it if you don`t
want too!! :k

I am from sweden and i am totaly lost in this actor!!!
I have been since i saw LOTR!!!!!!

LOVE YOU ALL /WOOD

Checking in! :) tg, thanks for starting the new thread and excellent first post :k but you forgot one Faculty course! FOTD* 101: Introduction to Shawshank Redemption**. ;) ;) :D :D

* Faculty Off Topic Discourse (that can still be brought back on topic by hook or by crook because darn it, that's what the Faculty is good at)

** (admission limited to one tgshaw)

Ooh, and frodolivesin.us (yeah, I love typing that too ;) ) updates!

Narya, thanks for the mod help. :k Sheryl, thanks for keeping the old Faculty intact and safe! :)

Hugs all around!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0603/ainon/FYC1.jpg

Oh, and our first birthday in our new thread. :)

Happy Birthday, Kumari!


And Welcome, Eáránë Elensar!

One question (or two).

1. Where would Gollum have seen Sting before? Did Smeagle have a battle with Bilbo? (If they did who would win? :p )

2. Has Anybody been getting Emails from JFmodare? I would like to know info on this person.

Frodo has all the Grace and Charm of John Wayne in the Galadral's Mirror scenes doesn't he? I think so. :p Pretty Strong and Manly Hobbit too. (but I guess the Baggin's Men had that in Common, before Gandalf came and took Their Good Name along with Their Masculinity away. :eek:) (Heaven Forbid! :D )

Thought I'd offer this one before Achila gets to it :D

Nice job Sheryl :k Thank You for saving the old thread


Ylla, you know my weakness!!!! Wood elves....splat!!! LOL! And thanks much from me to Sheryl (and Narya too)! Oh, and tg, you've hit my other weakness -- The Mirror of Galadriel. A big thank you for that, my friend!

BTW, Earane, I was the one who posted those pics with Charlie Kauffman, and it looks to us like there's a distinct reason for this hairstyle. I, for one, will be sorry when it leaves us (as it's bound to!).

:::: crawling out of bed of pain ::::

Ummmmm....what happened to the old Lounge? What did I miss at the end of it? :::: sniffle :::: I liked the old place! Is everyone here? BTW, been meaning to ask, what ever happened to Rikka?

I'd like to say that the pics are *way* too much for me to take on a day like this. ;)

~grumpy

HI GRUMPY!!!!

Were have you been? And what happend to you?? I mean the pain!!!!
I think we are all here!! Thank god for that!!!!! :z: :z:

Yeas, i wonder that too i haven`t seen her in here in ages??????? :(

Well, the server at the harem broke down so they did this before it happens
in here too!!!!! They have started a new harem!!
I think the thread was too long,too many posts!!!

Very glade too "see" you again!!!! :k :k

Love/wood

If anyone is inclined to discuss the outcome of the presidential election, please take it to The 2004 Election and beyond (http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2004/pages/results/states/OH/P/00/index.html) in Rivendell. We have consistenly kept the Cafe free from political discussion, and will continue to do so.

Thanks. :k

Happy Birthday, Kumari!
Will post two birthday scans from the Book That Shall Not Be Named when I get to the right computer ....

from ylla:
Elijah fans are the Best people in the world
Aren't they just? The more you read from Elijah fans (most particularly those that lounge around here), the more obvious it becomes. Still the crème de la crème? I think so! We're not so much still as very much alive and kicking (sorry about that :rolleyes: ). It's so good to know that nothing (least of all a tiny little problem such as the entire thread threatening to slither down the cyberplughole) dampens our spirits .... does it, Sam?

Wish I had the time and space to help with storage, Narya ... is mid-December too late ....?

Lovely opening post and pic, Tg, and a great reminder of all the superbly eccentric, geekish, even esoteric discussions we've had over the years.
And thanks, wood, Blossom, ylla, shireling, Achila, ainon, Eáránë Elensar (welcome !!! Lovely name and gorgeous shot of The One Lad), for your pictorial contributions (I LOVE the hair, even if it isn't his natural colour: the black made him look even more otherworldly than usual when I saw it in Karlovy Vary, and the new semi-fringe suits him perfectly).

Ian Curtis film shooting in MANCHESTER, shireling ???? Better get back in touch with my friends there :) :cool:

Yes, grumpy and wood, I miss Rikka too.

HAPPY BIRTHDAY KUMARI!!!

HOPE YOU LIKE MY LTTLE GIFT!!!!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v399/erendil/3236d-med.jpg

love/wood

Happiest of Birthdays Kumari
No cake but will a CUPCAKE Do :D



http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v480/ylla/05elijah.jpg



Welcome Earane :k

HAPPY BIRTHDAY, KUMARI!

A little gif(t) (http://www.imagemagician.com/images/blossom/Kumari.gif)

Hope you're having a lovely day. :)

Achila and Shireling - I love the hair, too. So Elijah is definitely in the running for the Ian Curtis role? Great news.

Happy birthday, Kumari

http://photocentral.net/Ew63253.jpg


Ylla,
That picture is just about perfect for cheering somebody up. Hilarious. :D

Hi again!!!!!! ;) :) :k

I don`t no, but i have a tiny feeling that i was a little
missunderstood in earlier post about Elijahs hair!!

I meant that i think it dosen`t look that awful like some others seams too think!! No, i rather love it very much!!!!! Have a very strong memory from the first time i saw Ice storm when Elijah is running with his long curly hair blowwing in the wind !!!! my my m y!!!!! :p :D
I hope he wont cut it for a long time!!!!!


love/wood

If my feeling is wrong forget this post!!!!!!

...Have a very strong memory from the first time i saw Ice storm when Elijah is running with his long curly hair blowwing in the wind !!!! my my m y!!!!! :p :D
I hope he wont cut it for a long time!!!!!
wood, do you mean like this...

http://www.frodolivesin.us/ejw/14cd0980.jpg

...or maybe this?? :p

http://www.frodolivesin.us/ejw/14fd0980.jpg

I have a soft spot for the 1973 hair, too--probably connected to the fact that it's the year I graduated from high school :D .

---Moondancer, that's one of those pictures where you can look at the boy and see a bit of the man he'll become:

http://www.frodolivesin.us/FotR/3ba20540.jpg


A little smile for Kumari's birthday!

http://www.frodolivesin.us/FotR/2cbce2f0.jpg


And Welcome to Eáránë Elensar :) :)
(isn't copy and paste wonderful? I'd have to get out my ASCII cheat sheet for that name ;) :p .)

---------------------

I posted this over in Brandy Hall, too, but for anyone who might be interested *cough*zkg*cough*, tonight's episode of Lost is "starring Dominic Monaghan"--seems the episode centers on his character. {{{zkg}}} -- If you feel well enough to watch it, maybe it'll ease the pain a bit, for an hour at least. :k

And for the nice comment on my 'name'. I wish I could say I got it in some other way than an Elf name generator! :rolleyes: I actually went to get a hobbit name and it came up something like 'Polly Snotbucket'... Well, nearly. I then tried the Elvish one and just loved it. Is 50 to late in life to legally change your name into Elvish?

Lovely pics of the lad tg. It was your page that led me here by the way. Thanks for all the time you put into those pages.

Does anyone but me find they HAVE to say, 'My God he's beautiful' after every photo they see of Frodo/Elijah. (No matter how many times you've seen the same photograph?) Especially Frodo, he's almost painfully beautiful.

Eáránë Elensar

Ahhh, dearest colleagues! I was unaware of the recent demise of the old lounge til now. May we ever find each other when all other lights go out!


So many old friends here already! Yaaay! Many thanks to those of you who have labored long to save the collected wisdom of the Faculty. And to Moggy (all hail) and Narya! And Sheryl! And tg!

And can I hope against hope that Charlie Kauffman will write a script FOR Elijah Wood soon?

Happy Birthday, Kumari!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/elijahmovielineawards21.jpg
In honor of the occassion of your birthday, and our new home, I've gone back and found the first picture of The One Lad I ever saved to my computer! :D Just something about that look of shear joy that grabbed me. Besides which, it's a lovely display of The Gap! :D

Does anyone but me find they HAVE to say, 'My God he's beautiful' after every photo they see of Frodo/Elijah. (No matter how many times you've seen the same photograph?) Especially Frodo, he's almost painfully beautiful.

Welome Eáránë Elensar! :k To answer your question: YES. :D

TG, thank you for the beautiful illustrations of Mikey I's hair! I remember seeing that movie for the first time, and his hair blowing back to reveal his hair line. I had one of those moments Eáránë Elensar is talking about.

ZK I hope you feel better :(

Peaceweaver,

And can I hope against hope that Charlie Kauffman will write a script FOR Elijah Wood soon?

Is it wrong to swoon for a screen writer? Charlie Kauffman is brilliant; I can't think of anyone else I'd like better to write for EJW.

honey!

Greetings to the new Faculty thread. :)

Wonderful flying "Frodo" hair in those two pictures, tg. They're gorgeous. (So nice of you to drop in at Brandy Hall by the way.)

Wood, nice brown tone collage of Elijah. The orbs are a fascinating touch.

(((Faculty)))

I find it funny that a long ago article mentioned that Elijah Wood left Normal at age 22 when he completed Lord of the Rings trilogy.

My question is this: Did he leave Normal at age 7 when he started acting, or did it happen at age 15 when he tried to go to public school and he got mobbed instead?

So :lol: on him!

yeas tg, thats the one i meant!!!!
thank you!!!!!!!! i just love him and (the hair)
in this movie it looks so thick and soft!!!
HM........ i guess this is the wrong thread for this kind of talk!!! ;)

I saw the war again this morning oh i love that movie!!!
You clearly see what ìt will become o´f this young man!!!
And we have seen it!!!

lovely pic honeyelf,thanks for posting it!!!!

love you all / wood

Wow! You have all made my birthday special!

Thank you very much to Ainon and Serena for their good wishes, Wood - I loved your Try 17/All I Want pic!, Ylla - yes, a cupcake will do very nicely, thank you very much! (the one having his ear nibbled by a mouse!), Blossom - my very own gif! I'm touched!, Moondancer - that's a beautiful young Lij pic, TG - I've loved that Frodo smile since the first time I saw it! and Honeyelf - thank you for sharing your first Elijah happy smile!

Last night I was feeling a little down, because my husband had to work, my younger son had flown off to Bali in the morning, and my elder son came for dinner, then had to go out. I was feeling a little lonely. Then this morning (I'm in Australia, therefore some hours ahead of most people), I opened up this thread and discovered all my lovely gifts. It brought a tear to my eye. So once again, thank you all for your kindness. :)

Eáránë Elensar - another lady of around my vintage! It's so nice to find other people with the same taste!

This is the first Elijah (as Frodo) pic I saved to my computer, just after the first time I saw FOTR in January 2002. This is what started my (now rather large) collection!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/Maewen/ew_origcrop.jpg


Kumari

I find it funny that a long ago article mentioned that Elijah Wood left Normal at age 22 when he completed Lord of the Rings trilogy.
Is it abnormal to ask where Normal is? Normal, Oklahoma? :::: ducking ::::

My question is this: Did he leave Normal at age 7 when he started acting, or did it happen at age 15 when he tried to go to public school and he got mobbed instead?
Did he really?!? Was that after Flipper? I know he said that his family tried to move to a small town so he could have a normal life but ended up with kids hanging out on the front steps waiting for autographs. Was that when it was?

Poor baby.

I think one of my favorite "natural" hair pics is the one from one of the books, I think, that shows Elijah and Sean in their first (or one of the first) discussions with PJ (who has lost a lot of weight and really looks great, btw!). It's interesting to see the body language - you can tell that the two actors are still strangers. But Elijah's hair is post-Faculty, and he just looks so *slight* next to PJ and SA, like a sprite who just about to float effortlessly off the couch.

::: taking my ding-blasted imagination back to work ::::

~grumpyandfeelingbetterthankyouforthekindwishesanddad-gummitIforgotaboutLOSTagainand missedmostofiitbutOYcanthatkid act!!!

I don`t no, but i have a tiny feeling that i was a little
missunderstood in earlier post about Elijahs hair!!

Don't worry Wood! I knew exactly what you meant, and I'm sure everyone else did too :)

Welcome to Eáránë Elensar - and in reply to your question - in my book 50 is not too old for anything :D My hobbit name came up as Lara Cotton of Overhill which I rather liked, except that I thought all hobbit ladies were named after either flowers or jewels. :confused: And in answer to this question:
Does anyone but me find they HAVE to say, 'My God he's beautiful' after every photo they see of Frodo/Elijah. (No matter how many times you've seen the same photograph?) Especially Frodo, he's almost painfully beautiful. I can only repeat Honeyelf with a resounding YES :D Believe me, I've been doing this for nearly 3 years now :)

Was anyone else as sad as I was to hear that the LOTR Fan Club Mag is finishing after the December issue? I have looked forward excitedly to every issue, I shall really miss it. It has been a wonderful source of behind-the-scenes info - for instance, I found this little snippet in the latest issue very interesting: "When you did the scene where you stab Frodo, what kind of direction did Peter Jackson give you?" "We did that scene many times. Unfortunately, because it was such a close shot, we had to use the original steel dagger. Even though Frodo hadn't been given it [yet in the film], Elijah Wood was actually wearing his Mithril chain mail shirt under his costume at the time. It was out of sequence, but he felt safer and I felt safer." That quote was by Ben Price, who wielded the dagger.

Belated birthday greetings to KUMARI :)

And many thanks - and admiration - to Sheryl for saving the old thread :k

~grumpyandfeelingbetterthankyouforthekindwishesand dad-gummitIforgotaboutLOSTagainand missedmostofiitbutOYcanthatkid act!!!

ZK, youcandownloaditofftheinternetifyou'recleverwe'vehadsuccessesoffshareazaitwillalreadybeupsomewhereiassureyou

and glad you're feeling better:D

honey! ::looking innocent::

Also, zk and everyone, the episode is going to be repeated on Saturday night.

ETA: BIG NEWS!!!! Chain of Fools is being released on DVD!!!!!


This is a region 1 release for the US and Canada

Title: Chain of Fools
Starring: Jeff Goldblum
Released: 15th February 2005
SRP: $14.97

Further Details
Stars Steve Zahn, Jeff Goldblum, Elijah Wood and Salma Hayek. The disc will be available to own from the 15th February next year, and should retail at around $14.97. The film itself will be presented in 2.40:1 anamorphic widescreen along with an English Dolby Digital 5.1 track.

Good news about "Chain of Fools," Achila! Does that mean our two disc, mandarin sub-titled ones will now be collectibles?;)

Was talking with a friend today about movies generally, "The Incredibles" specifically. Brought up that odd little tidbit from Pixar recently. They had apparently been working on "Happy Feet" with an aim at making the penguins as realistic as possible, only to have the revelation :eek: that penguins have no facial expressions. :rolleyes:

This person I was speaking with had worked for George Lucas, founder of Pixar at one point (though in unrelated division). Apparently Mr. Lucas and company (Lassiter, et al) began the Pixar endeavor with the aim to eleminate actors. In other words their theory is that they can "create" any story using entirely computer graphics. They believe they can create something so realistic looking that the actors will become extraneous.

I'll add here, that IMVHO many of George's movies lack "soul." Not surprising in that he thinks actorless fims are a good idea. There is a human element required. Not only does the actor need to emote, the audience needs to do their part in responding to that actor. What may seem a problem -that every audience member will not respond to every actor in an entirely predictable manner- may not be a "problem" that can be addressed via special effects, specifically gee-whiz computer graphics.

While talking with Flourish and Achila the other day, we were speculating on whether LotR would ever be re-made. One my two companions (I believe we may have been dodging taxis at the time, and so don't remember which of you :k ) stated that when some new technology comes along which will make it compelling to re-do, it will happen. This led me to speculate that the "new technology" might be the computer aided ability to "cast" any actor - living, dead, or otherwise -in a role. So you could have, say, Errol Flynn as Aragorn and Gene Hackman as Frodo. (Just an example, folks! :p )

Then on Sunday in NY my husband and I took in "Dracula" at the Belasco theater. The story was a straight up re-telling, with only a very minor plot twist to the end. It did have pretty nifty special effects, though; at one point Dracula levitated straight up, and transformed into a purple bat hanging head first from the ceiling. The actors were good, but I couldn't respond to Dracula in that visceral "he's sexy, but I'm squicked that I find him so" way that seems to be sort of needful for any actor attempting the role.

Bringing this all back on topic :D then...well, jet-lag is making it a little difficult for me just at the moment. But I doubt any pile of ones and zeros will ever move me like the "beautiful boy, crying beautifully" (as Pelagia says) is able to do. Pixar may think they can make a compelling movie out of a series of pretty pictures. As an audience member, and fan of EJW, lucky enough to have "discovered" his particular brand of screen magic, I doubt it. Soulfulness and intelligence are what really move an audience. (It doesn't hurt if the actor in question is very pretty too, for those audience members able to appreciate both, and the rest who might only appreciate the latter.)

honey!

While talking with Flourish and Achila the other day, we were speculating on whether LotR would ever be re-made. One my two companions (I believe we may have been dodging taxis at the time, and so don't remember which of you :k ) stated that when some new technology comes along which will make it compelling to re-do, it will happen. This led me to speculate that the "new technology" might be the computer aided ability to "cast" any actor - living, dead, or otherwise -in a role. So you could have, say, Errol Flynn as Aragorn and Gene Hackman as Frodo. (Just an example, folks! :p )


I think that was me, and I remember you saying this. Considering the fact that "dead" actors and stars are used in commercials all the time, and appear in movies like Forrest Gump, this doesn't seem really far-fetched.

Glad to see you made it home OK -- so when are you coming back? ;)

Another use for this picture:

http://www.imagemagician.com/images/tgshaw/off topic/champagne-resized.jpg

For the news about Chain of Fools, of course!

Sometimes it's nice to have something you've written get outdated :) . From the "How Times Have Changed" essay I wrote the last time I'd put my website through a major expansion (remember when the reviews of Elijah's movies were all on one page :eek: ?):
This public wisdom doesn't seem to have reached all of the people who make decisions about what movies to make available. There's something wrong with a world in which the only way to buy Chain of Fools is with Chinese subtitles (but thank goodness for the Internet friends who let us know it's available at all), and Radio Flyer isn't on DVD. But awareness has come a long way over the last couple of years. And it's just the beginning.
That was probably written a little over a year ago. :)

Interesting thought about the VCDs becoming collectors' items, honey. I just hope this doesn't cut too deeply into yesasia.com's income ;) .

Thanks for the news on the extra showing of Lost, too, Achila (I wonder how often they replay episodes like that--seems unusual for broadcast TV). I wasn't sure who to be mad at last night: my boss for making me work til 8:00 pm, or ABC for showing Lost so early in the evening. I was hoping to make it home in time to see the last half, at least, but all I got was stupid reality shows :rolleyes: .


And can I hope against hope that Charlie Kauffman will write a script FOR Elijah Wood soon?
Can you imagine a remake of Harvey written by Charlie Kauffman? :p With Elwood playing Elwood, of course. (Yeah, I've lost track of how many times I've suggested that :o --but the Kauffman script is a new idea, and Elijah did just say again that it's his favorite movie. :p )

And regarding remakes, I definitely think LotR will be remade--remade many times, if the End of All Things doesn't come first. My prediction is that the next one will be done by someone who is (or will be) unhappy about the changes PJ made to the story that would have been so easy to keep compatible with book canon.

Technology could definitely play a role, too. Just think of the scattered moments when the SFX in PJ's movies almost worked, but were just a bit too "visible." IMHO, the CGI characters could have all been improved on (not sure about the Balrog... that was dang-near perfect). There are a couple of places where Legolas could pass for a video game avatar, and there's been enough complaining about some too-obvious blue-screen work. Even the people doing the animation admit that Gollum got better as they went along. But in order to get even close to PJ's, any remake would have to be as much an affair of the heart as his was.

I can't imagine actors ever being completely replaced. Of course, regular old animation takes over some of their role--just as much as computer-generated animation does. Final Fantasy (I think that was the movie) tried to take it a step further, but the technology wasn't there. Forrest Gump was fun, but the famous people weren't computer-generated images. When President Kennedy was onscreen, it was really President Kennedy we were looking at--he'd just been inserted into the scene with some minor alterations to match what he was saying, etc. (But I'll tell you, it was the first movie I ever saw Gary Sinese in, and I was convinced they'd gotten an amputee to play the role! Later in the movie, I kept trying to remember if we'd ever actually seen both of his legs earlier on.)

I'm sure there will be some movies done with CGI instread of actors, just as there are now animated movies made without actors. But I think like, with everything else, at some point a boundary will be hit in the efforts to make it "human", as has happened with other computer-related efforts.

Especially makes me think of how the action-figure creators said they just couldn't get a good digital version of Elijah--so none of the action figures really look like him. Random thought: Maybe in the future the only actors who'll get jobs are those who are better at acting than their CGI counterparts. That could "retire" a lot of people who are acting now, but I think Elijah would always have a job. :) Another random thought: Maybe they should have hired a sculptor for the action figures instead of trying to make them via computer--the human element, y'know ;) .

I was talking with my 11 year old son and he commented on how it was difficult for him to tell Pippin from Merry sometimes, but he could always tell Sam from Frodo because "Sam is plumper and has red hair and Frodo has black hair and those ...eyes! How does he do that with his eyes, Mom?" C4 relurks.

well speking of dvds!!!

is there someone who knows if the bumbelbee is on dvd??
i just have a very bad copy from the tv on vhs!!!

love/wood

edit: hi ceefore and welcome well you can tell your son
they are for real!!!

is there someone who knows if the bumbelbee is on dvd??
i just have a very bad copy from the tv on vhs!!!


Bumblebee is out on Region 1 DVD, and there are usually several copies available on EBay or second hand at amazon, but I have not found it on Region 2 as yet. I copied my NTSC video onto DVD, and it will play, but not perfectly. I keep wondering whether I can justify buying a multi-region player, since we seem to be missing out on director's commentaries and LOT Easter Eggs on our region 2 DVDs.

I watched Bumblebee with my husband last night. For some reason I had been keeping this one from him, possibly because the story is a bit unbelievable, and possibly because I like Elijah in this maybe more than anything else. Everytime it comes to the bit where he asks Mazzo 'If you had to give up your past to have a future, would you do it?' I really feel Barney's pain. It is the slight crack in his voice, the eyes and the body language. I could hardly believe it when, afterwards, while I was trying to find any info on the soundtrack, I came on the IMDB listing for the film and saw the review that was attached
"The rest of the actors are dull and give wooden performances, especially Elijiah Wood in the lead. I thought his inexpressive nature in the Ice Storm was on purpose- boy was I wrong!"

Some people just seem to be blind to any subtle acting performances. The negative comments about his kiss and lack of chemistry with Rachael Leigh Cook also annoy me, since it is supposed to be a first experience of love, not some Casanova seducing his woman. It made me laugh with Viggo Mortensen's film Hidalgo, when a similar comoment was made about him and his female co-stars, one of whom he he trying to avoid, and the other who would cause him to be castrated if he tried anything. His first love was supposed to be his horse - couldn't they get that?


I was going to post my first ever picture of Elijah, but since cut and paste from Word doesn't work, I am going to have to go back to the drawing board on that one. :(

As far as the dolls being made computer imaging, is that why the Frodo doll has a wrestler's body because he's supposed to be some sort of Action Figure? :lol:

I mean does Elijah's body really look like that or better, since "Hooligan's" is supposed to be his Big Action Movie? Again :lol:

I was talking with my 11 year old son and he commented on how it was difficult for him to tell Pippin from Merry sometimes...
Poor Merry and Pip--even before the movies, some people called them "the interchangeable hobbits." Ridiculous, of course, if you look at their personalities, especially in the book :rolleyes: . With the movies, you could always say, "Pippin's the one with the Scottish accent and Merry's the one with the... uhh, not Scottish accent." (I'd have to go dipping back into the old thread to find that amazing adjective for "of, from, or referring to Manchester" used in the Ian Curtis discussion :o .)

...but he could always tell Sam from Frodo because "Sam is plumper and has red hair and Frodo has black hair and those ...eyes! How does he do that with his eyes, Mom?"
A Faculty member in the making! He's already learned to recognize "How does he do that?" moments :cool: .

C4 relurks.
Nooooo... :( :( Come back! Come back!

from Skater girl:
"The rest of the actors are dull and give wooden performances, especially Elijiah Wood in the lead. I thought his inexpressive nature in the Ice Storm was on purpose- boy was I wrong!"
Evidently not realizing that Barney's an even more "shut down" character than Mikey is :confused: . Evidently needs to meet Stu ;) .

from shireling:
"When you did the scene where you stab Frodo, what kind of direction did Peter Jackson give you?" "We did that scene many times. Unfortunately, because it was such a close shot, we had to use the original steel dagger. Even though Frodo hadn't been given it [yet in the film], Elijah Wood was actually wearing his Mithril chain mail shirt under his costume at the time. It was out of sequence, but he felt safer and I felt safer." That quote was by Ben Price, who wielded the dagger.
OME! Can you think of another movie where a "costume" mail shirt could actually be thought of as any protection against a steel dagger?! The level of care and dedication for the smallest thing continually amazes me. There's an article in the latest Realms of Fantasy that quotes Karl Urban as saying there were runes (that actually meant something, of course) carved in places on the set that moviegoers would never see on film--to make it more real for the actors; reminds me of Elijah's comment about "living in Middle-earth."


from Eáránë Elensar
Lovely pics of the lad tg. It was your page that led me here by the way. Thanks for all the time you put into those pages.
Forgot to thank you for this comment before. :) I get occasional notes from people visiting the site, but the best is someone who ends up in the Faculty Lounge through it, so I'm glad to find that out :) . (This also reminds me that, along with the overall site reorganization, I need to change the URL on the several links that lead here. I tested them after the new thread was started, and now for some reason they dump you in the middle of the old thread :confused: .)

BTW, the TTT section has become a real "problem child." I'll get an error message telling me why it stopped uploading, I'll fix that problem, try to publish again and something else will stop it. :rolleyes: I'm trying not to think yet of the possibility that I may have to rebuild the entire file from scratch. Quite a few of the pictures are there, but once it gets past "They're here" in Osgiliath, there's nothing but x's.

Does anyone but me find they HAVE to say, 'My God he's beautiful' after every photo they see of Frodo/Elijah. (No matter how many times you've seen the same photograph?) Especially Frodo, he's almost painfully beautiful.
IMHO, one thing that makes screencapping Elijah so addictive is that each frame could stand alone as a beautiful photograph. There's never an off moment when he's out of character or "between" emotions; I don't think there are many actors for whom that's true.

I'm currently working on close-ups from "The Mirror of Galadriel". Need I say more :z: ? I almost always do some kind of "tweaking" to screencaps to make them clearer, etc., but with these I feel like Fonzie (for those who remember Happy Days--when he takes out his comb, then looks at himself in the mirror and realizes there's no room for improvement ;) ). I trim off the "letterbox," bring the screencap up to fullsize--then just shrug and save it as a jpeg. :) (A #%#@ lot easier than Shelob's Lair :rolleyes: ! --But that's not Elijah's fault.)

I'd have to go dipping back into the old thread to find that amazing adjective for "of, from, or referring to Manchester" used in the Ian Curtis discussion :o .

Mancunian. Yeah -- that might come in handy in the near future!


A Faculty member in the making! He's already learned to recognize "How does he do that?" moments :cool:

But I wanted to hear the answer -- what did she tell him?


OME! Can you think of another movie where a "costume" mail shirt could actually be thought of as any protection against a steel dagger?!


That's realism for you! And that's not even taking into consideration the fact that Elijah never wore a complete chain mail shirt. Just a little panel of it sewn onto a tight t-shirt.

Hi, dear faculty Ladies!
Many kisses and hugs to all of of those, whom I know and salut to those I don't. I wasn't at KD for a long time and now I find out that a lot of things had changed since my last visit. But I hope the discussions are still go on? :)

Welcome back Rikka!! :k :k

I can promise you that things are the same in
here!!!! ;) :rolleyes: :)

Same wonderful girls and some new ones,bet they are
as wonderful as the rest!!!!! :)
And same wonderful discusions!!!!

love/wood

Edit:I found someone else who wants to say welcome back!!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v399/erendil/3236ghf-med.jpg

A request by tgshaw to "Come back." An honor! In response to Achila, I told my son Pippin has a scarf, a Scottish accent , and goes to Minas Tirith with Gandalf; Merry wears a yellow vest, stays with the Rohirrim and helps Eowyn in her battle with the Witch King. If I describe them by costume first, it is because I am entranced by the costumes of the movies. In the 3rd and 4th issues of the Official Fan Club Magazine, Ngila Dickson was interviewed and explained her material and color choices for the hobbits. She also addresses the subject of "cloak action." I will gladly post this ( for research purposes, of course) if this article has not been seen.

Actually, ceefour, I meant Elijah -- how did you tell your son how he does it with his eyes? :)

from Skater girl:
Quote:
"The rest of the actors are dull and give wooden performances, especially Elijiah Wood in the lead. I thought his inexpressive nature in the Ice Storm was on purpose- boy was I wrong!"

Evidently not realizing that Barney's an even more "shut down" character than Mikey is . Evidently needs to meet Stu .
Geez. Shut down indeed! IMGLO, Elijah gave the most disturbingly realistic portrayal of a kid with absolutely nothing in his mind that I can imagine. Can you even imagine waking up and having no memories? If we start analyzing our thoughts, I think we can all see how memory weaves its way through everything we do and think. Now imagine that there's no memory. It's like the whole structure of thought and emotion would collapse.

The other great moment like that was at the end of Anna Christie, when Garbo is on a boat, gazing back at the shore. The director's instructions were for her to think of absolutely nothing - to let her mind go blank. Same effect.

Hi, dear faculty Ladies!
Many kisses and hugs to all of of those, whom I know and salut to those I don't. I wasn't at KD for a long time and now I find out that a lot of things had changed since my last visit. But I hope the discussions are still go on? :)
RIKKA! I just asked about you yesterday! Missed you, I did! It must have been some mental telepathy there! Welcome back! I've missed your wonderful posts!

:::: happy dancing ::::

~grumpy (Dunkin Donuts and coffee this morning and now Rikka's come back!)(How could this day be any more perfect?)(Except that the sky is a brilliant November blue, red and gold leaves are dancing in the wind and swirling into great drifts, and even in the 'burbs it looks like the Shire on a brisk autumn day)

Apologies for not answering your question, Achila. My son next asked if Elijah Wood's eyes were CG or some other type of special effect. I told him no. He just said, "Wow."

It's time I step into the new thread before it leaves me behind. Welcome to Ceefour and Earane

Thanks, Sheryl, for Saving the old thread :k

And to TG for starting this one. :k

RL has me distracted, so I'm only lurking lately. But had to wet my feet before pages run into the double digits.

Welcome back, Rikka!!

Hope you are feeling better, zk!!
:)

(((Faculty))) :k

Apologies for not answering your question, Achila. My son next asked if Elijah Wood's eyes were CG or some other type of special effect. I told him no. He just said, "Wow."

No need to apologize, luv -- just wondering! Welcome to The Faculty, btw!

Welcome, ceefour! Rikka, so good to see you! *hugs* Hi, Alyon! :p

from Wood
Have a very strong memory from the first time i saw Ice storm when Elijah is running with his long curly hair blowwing in the wind !!!!
Ah, me. *sigh* I love that. Your pictures were wonderful, Tg. Still, I like to watch the hair ripple and flow as he runs. Takes me back to my teenage years (remembers they were pretty awful, scrambles back to current age, but still with long-hair longing).

Great news about CoF! Yes, I will hang onto my Chinese-subtitled version for the "value". *clings*

Shireling, I loved that stabbing quote. So cool!

from honey
Soulfulness and intelligence are what really move an audience. (It doesn't hurt if the actor in question is very pretty too
Absolutely. That's why so many people love the original Star Wars. Even though the remakes are technically better, they don't have the same spirit, the lighthearted bounce of the originals. Everyone wants the "real" Star Wars, not the versions Lucas is putting out now.

It makes me wonder about a remake of LOTR. I, personally, would love to see a more canon-faithful adaptation. But the heart, the spirit that went into these movies -- if that weren't matched, it will still feel hollow. *wishes to see more Elijah Wood in LOTR -- say, December's only next month!* :p

HI dear friends,

*sigh*

I'm always a bit behind on things...most of you see movies and read articles way before I get to them...so I know this topic is getting outdated, but I just finished reading Sean's book and I'm going to throw in a few comments because because because...in the end (especially the last couple of chapters), it "annoyed" me more than a bit. I won't repeat everyone else's comments--and (((achila))) I will truly try to be understanding of Sean. I don't come out of it disliking him, but I do feel a sense of indignation because I think that though there is a level of honesty in this book, there is also a lot of the same sort of calculation in the way he wrote it that he reveals as being the way he deals with his career. He wrote it because it was a career move. The right time. And he focused on the people who had power. And some of his omissions seem a little like a betrayal of friendship to me.


There are book spoilers, in a sense--for those few who haven't yet read it.

First off, I still like Sean. I find him dear. I am famous for attracting both strong and adjusted people, as well as many others who have real problems (I seem to be a confidant for lots of bipolar people so it's not unfamiliar territory for me), and I'm also famously good at embracing my friends, flaws and all. So I can sympathize with Sean and also believe that he truly wants the goodness in his heart to prevail over his insecurites and pettiness. At the same time I recognize that even while he exhibits a hindsight perspective on his past behavior, he continues to offend in this book. I wonder what apologies he will make about this book in the future.

Some of you have said you thought that Peter, Ian...Dom...John Howe might be offended. But honestly (and yeah you're allowed to keep in mind this is coming from an EW admirer), I think the person he slighted the most was Elijah. Oh yeah, he spends a few paragraphs saying Elijah's a good guy --you know he loves and admires him--and he mentions here and there that he is physically brave in his acting. But throughout this whole absorption he has with how people are perceiving him (Sean) as an actor, as a talent, as an important person....he never mentions Elijah's acting :confused: . He doesn't. He talks about Andy. He talks about Billy, he talks about Ian....But compliments for Elijah's acting are oddly missing. This is the person he spends almost all of his time on screen with....and there is no acknowledgement or even any little story to highlight Elijah's skill. And while he worries constantly about the recognition he thinks he deserves and never gets enough of...he says nothing of Elijah's contribution and the lack of real great recognition in the end for Elijah's work. This supposedly is his friend. And throughout the book he talks about himself being the star of Return of the King, and about Sam being the hero. There is not even a nod to the idea that some people think it's Frodo--or any real description of Frodo's heroism. :rolleyes: And while he spends a great deal of ink on how the whole circus was behind HIM for THE acting nomination, there is not even a mention that Elijah was also promoted for a best actor award. It was all about Sean and how everyone thought of him as the star. It seems that he is elbowing Elijah aside by not giving Elijah or Frodo any notice. And he has to know that recognition for Elijah's work was also an issue (Ian McKellan for example says in an interview that he can't understand why it didn't get more talk). He has to know that some people perceive Frodo as the hero (duh!)--he might at least acknowledge that. That would be the graceful thing to do. At least mention it.

This omission I think reflects the jealousy he talks about in the entire book-- His continual worry that other actors get more attention than does he. Instead of ever mentioning any attention Elijah has received...he just omits any reaction people have to Elijah (except one reference to earlier attention to Elijah's big eyes). Does this seem like a friend? Does this seem like an accurate depiction of the movie?? :confused:

When such recognition seems to matter to him so much, how can he not think to give a nod himself to HIS FRIEND---realizing that it might be appreciated. He talks more about Orli re the movie, and the two Ians than he does about Elijah.

As to friendship--he says he thought Elijah was just young and idealistic when he kept proclaiming that they all would be friends for life...though now he thinks it is more possible--maybe he now believes Elijah. But what he says about friendship is so sad. He said that prior to playing Sam, he thought that friendship was just about two people mutually using one another to get ahead. He says he is NOT a good friend. He has tried to learn from Sam. But he does not claim to have reformed much.

I just finished reading the book, so I have a little passion about it. But I do not mean to diss Sean Astin. I do like him. I think he suffers greatly. And I think he can get it together. But the book is not graceful. That's okay--we all make mistakes sometimes, and this one isn't going to fool anyone because he lets people see right through him...because Sean wants to be honest and he wants to learn from his shortcomings...I like him for that.

I know Elijah is a very forgiving person who thus far has exhibited a great deal of caring for people and an understanding of flaws. And he seems strong, and ego doesn't appear todrive him. But he isn't stupid, and though I suspect he will mostly feel for Sean when he reads this, I think he also might recognize that it isn't really the way a very close friend should conduct himself. If true to form he will rise above whatever his reaction, but I wouldn't blame him for feeling some disappointment. I don't think Sean was generous towards him professionally by making his performance so sidelined in the book, and it seems to be deliberate--though Sean has praised Elijah before. Maybe it isn't deliberate and Sean is just so self-absorbed he forgot?

I might be wrong about all of this. You all may feel differently, and maybe I will after thinking it through more. And it may be it just comes off this way. But I still think Sean isn't good at friendships--in some ways. I expect there are other ways in which he does come through well as a friend. I have friends who are disfunctional in many ways who I know love me even when they do the stupidist things....and show it in their own ways. I think Sean is like that...


Hope I didn't make anyone angry. I'm still committed to being a Sean supporter. But he still can make me mad. You can love people and still they can get under your skin. ;)

thanks for listening
:k

Oh yeah. This is the pass around copy of the book ((((HoneyElf)))) ((((Shelbyshire)))). My daugher still wants to read it between her studies. When she is done I'll be ready to pass it along. Just PM me.

I've refrained up to this point from making a lot of comments re:Sean's book
because frankly I didn't want to try to persuade those who were upset about it to look at where it was coming from
Part of me clearly understands why people are annoyed with it...no he didn't talk about how fantastic Elijah was...as an actor...but I think HE knows he is gifted(Elijah)..he also greatly admires his grace and comfort as an artist..and he says that many times in the book.
Sean clearly has an ego that needs to be stroked...and I think even he knows this...being nominated for an Oscar was Very Important to Sean...probably not as important to Elijah...would Lij have liked it?...I'm sure he would have been honored and thrilled...but I don't think it holds the same meaning to him as someone like Sean
Remember years back when Sally Field won her Oscar and she cried out..."YOU LIKE ME...YOU REALLY LIKE ME."....I see that type of mentality in Sean...to him IT is all about being LIKED and ACCEPTED...it's importance is part of his basic insecurity
I felt sadness when I read the book...I didn't feel annoyed...just sad...because I know someday...probably soon.. Mr. Wood will be nominated for an Oscar..it's just inevitable...he's got a gift..and if he stays in the biz..it's just gonna happen..he's a better actor all round then Sean...and that doesn't take away anything from Sean's performance..it was wonderful and IMVHO worthy of a nomination.BUT in a film with soooo many good performances usually they cancel each other out. Mr. Wood probably didn't get one because it was such an incredible performance that grew from three movies...each one becoming more profound...and being part of an ensemble it probably wasn't singled out...getting kinda lost in there!!!
Sorry this is a mini rant but I've kinda been waiting to say this..and the time is now :D
Part of the reason I'm a fan of Elijah Wood is his incredible grace and his undeniable integrity..he will never take on a movie role JUST because it may be a bid for an award...that's probably why I'm sitting here waiting to actually see him in a film that appears in an actual cinema. :rolleyes:
I've said this MANY times in this forum...He's just NOT HOLLYWOOD...and that my dears is why I LOVE HIM :k

Please don't take what I'm saying as slam on those who are annoyed with the book..I truly DO understand you annoyance..I too was a child who was constantly trying to live up to others expectations...it sometimes takes YEARS to overcome those emotions :(

Elijah so needs to write a Rubuttal. It would be like Frodo writing The Red Book only Elijah is the writer in this World.

As far as his eyes go, I saw a reminder of the movie "Papilion." I saw it when Frodo attacked Sam. It was like watching Steve Maqueen with his bright blue eyes as he was looking out of his cell. (does it sound strange that Barney bouncing the ball was like another character Steve Maqueen played? Forget John Wayne. ) Anyway, as I was saying, when I saw that scene, I asked my mom if his eyes really were that blue. She said they were. "Are those his real eyes? And remember, "Pailion" was WAY BEFORE CGI was even used. So :lol: :lol: :lol:

I'm typing this on my new shiny computer. I love it!
You can actually give it a name...I'm still thinking of a good name. I was thinking of calling it Sting but that reminds me of the singer too much (not that I dislike that singer).
Suggestions?

On TORN, they say that Elijah Wood has signed on for The One Ring Celebration.
Elijah Wood has signed on for the One Ring Celebration!! The One Ring Celebration (or ORC for short) will be held in Pasadena, California from January 14th-16th, 2005. Elijah will be on hand to sign autographs, meet fans and much more! Wood joins Sean Astin, Billy Boyd, Bruce Hopkins, John Rhys-Davies, Charles Ross, the bands Emerald Rose, & World Without Sundays! Tickets are on sale now!
Go to the TORN site for further links for tickets,...


As far as biographies are concerned. I like reading them but not always.
Like I said, I'm reading 'Feel', a book about Robbie Williams (I'm making slow progress with the book because I'm having trouble liking what I read and I really don't understand what makes this person 'tick'). Williams is not one of my top favorite singers but he's a good entertainer and fun on stage (I've seen him in concert a couple of times and it's always been a lot of fun because he really does his best to give his fans a good time and that shows)
The man is a big mystery to me. Why is he so depressed so often? Why can't he see that he's been so blessed in his life? He almost comes across in this book as somebody who seriously dislikes himself a lot so he can't possibly understand why others like him and is that the reason why he looks down on his fans (why are you looking up to me?)
He seems so insecure as a person.
We don't know all there is to know about Elijah Wood of course but one thing I do like a lot is the fact that he seems so secure about who he is and he doesn't come across as egocentric.

What am I trying to say here? :confused:
Well, this book about Robbie Williams has made me appreciate Elijah Wood even more (or at least, the image I have of Elijah Wood).


But, a person doesn't have to be perfect for me to appreciate him a lot as an actor, a singer,...
As you all know,,I'm a fan of Russell Crowe, the actor.
I read a lot of negative stuff about him (as well as positive stuff) and a lot of what's written about him are plain lies. Some sections of the press like to feed the image that he's a big bully.
There was once a big scandal in the world press that he had beaten up a guy in some bar. He was shooting Master & Commander at the time and on the set, one of the other actors came up to him to ask him about that. Russell said something like: "Mate, look at the date and the place of this so-called bar incident. Think about it, where was I then?"
The actor looked at it and said something like: "...you were with me and a couple of others in some bar here"
Russell: "Did you see me get into a fight?"
Other guy: "erm...no, not at all"
Russell: "Well, there you have it"
Other guy: "but, it's all lies then? Why do they make up this stuff?"
Russell: "Welcome to my world, mate"


So, I'm always very cautious about what I read about stars in the press.



Welcome to Ceefour (I've seen you lurking from time to time...good to see you posting!) and Earane.
Rikka! I thought you left us!


OT: Random and very sad fact about me: You guys know the tv program "Idol", right? Well, the second series has begun here in Belgium and... :o ...I'm hooked. I really hate to admit it but I am. I have a favorite and everything. How sad is that. :rolleyes: :D
*sigh*
Those people who came up with this format are evil...pure evil. :D
(especially because it's just a program to try and get a lot of money from people through text messages and things like that...I'm keeping a tight grip on my mobile phone to prevent me from texting like mad in support of my favorite... ):o

Hello luvs!

A few further words about Sean's book (since Alyon mentioned me :) ). Yes, I too was struck by the utter lack of praise for Elijah's talent. Anyone coming from "our camp" would not fail to notice that. Quite a few mentions, though, for Elijah's looks (his eyes, in particular), how smartly his career was managed, his "Plastic Man" attitude and his "movie star" bearing. Sean is obviously in awe of the One Lad. He's even said as much repeatedly. My thought is that after spending 16 months with him, the fact of his talent just became a given. He knows that Elijah is special and gifted and how much further could possibly be said on the matter? On the other hand, the rap about Orlando suggests to me that despite what he said, Sean considers him a no-talent hack who will "out" himself eventually. He is clearly jealous of his looks and his seemingly easy ride to stardom. Maybe it has been. Maybe it's deserved and maybe, it's not. The jury's still out on Orli, as far as I'm concerned. Time will tell. Someone made this analogy, and I think it's pretty apt -- Sean is like a guy who keeps getting passed up for a promotion, only to see a new, young buck come in and waltz off with it. You can't help but admire the young buck, but you still feel a bit of sour grapes too.

Is there really something so wrong about ambition? If you were to read a book about Donald Trump, you wouldn't think so, most likely. Why isn't Sean allowed to be ambitious for himself in *his* field? Why shouldn't he strive to be another Stephen Spielberg, no matter how ridiculous that thought seems to us? There are those with talents less than Sean's, who are A-listers in Hollywood. We all know that and could easily tick off several names if we thought about it.

And wouldn't you have gotten swept up into the Academy Award hype if all you kept hearing for months -- in newspapers, in magazines, online, on tv -- was how your performance was the "heart and soul of the film" and truly Oscar calibre? As we all know, and as we discussed here many times (with much teeth gnashing), Elijah was not singled out in the media for ROTK. We still don't understand why and probably never will. Yes, New Line campaigned for him for Best Actor, but once the reviews came out, and it was Sean's Sam they were all lauding, the studio quickly put their support behind the one they figured had the best chance at actually getting a nom. Would Elijah have been thrilled if Sean had gotten the nod? Of course. Would he have been thrilled for himself if it had been he? Possibly. Considering how Fran and Pete had to pursuade him to go up on stage with them when they won Best Picture, my feeling is that Elijah would've been embarrassed to be nominated when no one else was (and actually, Sean said the same thing in the book, in the end). To him, Lord of the Rings was about the teamwork, and he was very content to simply play a part. The accolades are always very nice, but mean little in the end, and he knows that.

I think we've gotten to the point that we pass everything we think and see through the "Elijah filter". Let's face it. There is no other one like Elijah. Period. In looks, in talent, in personality. He's extraordinary. And even lovelier -- he doesn't seem to know it. It's easy to make comparisons with his peers, but I don't think we should. Sean has his demons he wrestles with, that we need to keep in mind. He can't be Elijah, nor should he be forced to be.

I'm typing this on my new shiny computer. I love it!
You can actually give it a name...I'm still thinking of a good name. I was thinking of calling it Sting but that reminds me of the singer too much (not that I dislike that singer).
Suggestions?
I suppose "The Palantir" is a little too obvious?

The man is a big mystery to me. Why is he so depressed so often? Why can't he see that he's been so blessed in his life? He almost comes across in this book as somebody who seriously dislikes himself a lot so he can't possibly understand why others like him and is that the reason why he looks down on his fans (why are you looking up to me?)
If he's depressed often, my guess would be that he has some form of clinical depression, and as I said awhile back regarding my own situation, a clinically depressed person doesn't need a reason to be depressed any more than an alcoholic needs a reason to drink--it just is (although both groups of people could come up with an answer if asked the question "Why?" it wouldn't be the answer, if you take my meaning--"Because my wife doesn't understand me," is not the reason an alcoholic drinks, even if he thinks it is). And low self-esteem and insecurity are as much a part of depression as denial and manipulation are of alcoholism. You don't think you suffer from an inferiority complex if you really believe you're inferior.

IMVHO, famous lines become famous because a lot of people resonate with them, and the statement about Robbie's fans reminds me of Groucho Marx's famous line: "I wouldn't want to belong to any club that would have me as a member." As we've said before about Elijah's appearances at fan cons, etc., I think one reason Elijah's so good with his fans is that he's experienced "fandom" from the other side, so understands some of what it means and what it doesn't mean. He knows that someone can want his autograph (or buy all of his movies :rolleyes: ) without wanting to pattern their life after his. He knows that if someone's squealing over him now, that same person will probably be squealing over someone else a few years from now (or a few weeks, depending on the fan). I don't think he's ever been a dangerously obsessive fan, :eek: so he doesn't quite know how to deal with them--but I don't imagine anyone would.

OT: Random and very sad fact about me: You guys know the tv program "Idol", right? Well, the second series has begun here in Belgium and... :o ...I'm hooked. I really hate to admit it but I am. I have a favorite and everything. How sad is that. :rolleyes: :D
Well, at least that program has something to do with talent and entertainment, so it makes some sense for so many people to watch it on TV. The competitors on Idol are trying to break into the entertainment industry, and the show's a way to get seen, so it--and they--at least have a logical purpose. Last Wednesday night, in my effort to catch Lost, I saw bits of two reality programs, neither of which had anything to do with anything except the participants' private lives (as far as I could tell from what I saw). Now, those, I think, are just plain weird :eek: .

---------------------

All interesting and well-spoken remarks about Sean's book. I'll just agree that, yes, it's definitely possible to sympathize with someone and be annoyed as heck with that person at the same time... :rolleyes:

Rikka! So good to see you again!! :k

ceefour, I for one would love to see Ngila's remarks--I think some of her remarks on the hobbit costumes may have been posted before, but it wouldn't hurt to see them again (lots of new people here since then). And I don't recall ever seeing anyone except us :p talk about "cloak action"--I'd love to read what she says about that.

As far as his eyes go, I saw a reminder of the movie "Papilion." I saw it when Frodo attacked Sam. It was like watching Steve Maqueen with his bright blue eyes as he was looking out of his cell. (does it sound strange that Barney bouncing the ball was like another character Steve Maqueen played? Forget John Wayne. ) Anyway, as I was saying, when I saw that scene, I asked my mom if his eyes really were that blue. She said they were. "Are those his real eyes? And remember, "Pailion" was WAY BEFORE CGI was even used.

You must have seen the same A&E Biography that I did, Shadowcat!
They say that Mr. McQueen was the sort of actor who threw himself so thouroughly into a role that he didn't appear to be acting. Hmmm, that sounds familiar! :) And Elijah has spoken of Mr. McQueen as one of his favorite actors, too. I thnk someone said here once that Barney's ball may have been in tribute to Steve McQueen's in "the great escape."

Welcome to the Faculty Lounge, CeeFour :k . And Welcome back to Rikka! :k Missed your smiling face! (That is your smiling face, isn't it? ;) )

Elijah Wood has signed on for the One Ring Celebration!! The One Ring Celebration (or ORC for short) will be held in Pasadena, California from January 14th-16th, 2005. Elijah will be on hand to sign autographs, meet fans and much more! Wood joins Sean Astin, Billy Boyd, Bruce Hopkins, John Rhys-Davies, Charles Ross, the bands Emerald Rose, & World Without Sundays! Tickets are on sale now!

Great Googly Moogly! :eek: It just so happens I'll be 45 minutes from there that weekend! This may be my one chance to meet The One Lad! But I simply couldn't go alone, I'd need moral support! (You know who YOU are!:) :k )

Moondancer, congrats on the new 'puter! :cool: Liked your thoughts on celebrity and the gossip it attracts like so much lint. I don't know what exactly impelled me to do it, but I dipped back into Live Journal land briefly this week. The stuff people come up with in there! I know there must be "responsible users" but somehow I always end up finding the whack jobs! They feel free to come up with the most ourtrageous theories, speculate on the most private aspects of others' lives. The weirdest part of all this, though, is that they say the same things about everybody! I can't explain it more thouroughly without stooping to their level.

Achila, I appreciate your plea for empathy for Sean. I reallly do understand the kind of jealousy he seems to fall prey to, as well as his particular brand of self-loathing. What disturbs me is the sense of entltlement, the ingratitude for what any of us might consider a priviledged position. It's one thing to struggle with those feelings, to even articulate them to one's most trusted confidants. It makes me so sad for him that he doesn't seem to see how destructive to relationships those behaviours can be. Not only that, he's set those feelings in ink for all the world to read. I'd wish for him that he can find the wisdom to work against those feelings; think what he'd accomplish of he put that energy into positive action!

Did anyone else notice, in Elijah's latest interview he was asked about the friendships he formed during the filming of LoTR? In the past,when asked this question, he would talk about all of the hobbits as his life-long friends. This time though he only said that he was still very close with Billy and Dom. :( That made me sad, but that's what happens when ego gets in the way. (Not Lij's ego, but Sean's.)

On a whole other subject, I saw "The Incredibles" last night. It was very cute, and there was a rather sweet theme about family in the story. Being the very visual person I am, I kept getting distracted by the graphics though. The rendering of the hair was incredible, indeed! Occurs to me sitting here, though, that my distraction wasn't the fault of the graphics. Heck, I can imagine getting distracted from a live action movie by the beauty of an actor! Yup, I can imagine that! :rolleyes: :o

honey!

Did anyone else notice, in Elijah's latest interview he was asked about the friendships he formed during the filming of LoTR. In the past,when asked this question, he would talk about all of the hobbits as his life-long friends. This time though he only said that he was still very close with Billy and Dom. :( That made me sad, but that's what happens when ego gets in the way. (Not Lij's ego, but Sean's.)
IMVHO, the different life situations have to be considered, too. Sean's "family man" position separated him from some of their activities even when they were all together in New Zealand, and would even more, I'd imagine, now that they're so spread out and have even been known to go to other parts of the world occasionally to meet. Billy has a long-time girlfriend, but that's different from having a couple of kids. -- I'm not saying that Sean's ego might not have something to do with it, but I think there are other factors to consider. BTW, was Orli mentioned at all? He was another of the "group" in New Zealand and for at least some time afterward (not that he hasn't been busy :p ).

The rendering of the hair was incredible, indeed!
Yeah, just kinda makes you want to see what they can do with, oh, I dunno, say maybe penguin feathers or something :D ?

Yeah, just kinda makes you want to see what they can do with, oh, I dunno, say maybe penguin feathers or something ?

That was my one big dissapointment of the evening; no "Happy Feet" trailer! :D

IMVHO, the different life situations have to be considered, too. Sean's "family man" position separated him from some of their activities even when they were all together in New Zealand, and would even more, I'd imagine, now that they're so spread out and have even been known to go to other parts of the world occasionally to meet. Billy has a long-time girlfriend, but that's different from having a couple of kids. -- I'm not saying that Sean's ego might not have something to do with it, but I think there are other factors to consider. BTW, was Orli mentioned at all? He was another of the "group" in New Zealand and for at least some time afterward (not that he hasn't been busy :p ).


Well, it's also true that relationships grow and change. Elijah is closer in age to Dom and Orli, and although Billy is Sean's age, in NZ, he had similar circumstances to the single boys. They spent the most "social time" together, and it makes sense that they would remain closest.

Even though Elijah spent so much time onset with Sean, my bet is that it was kind of a relief to get away from him. I have an overprotective mother -- I can well imagine how much Elijah liked it coming from Sean -- NOT! And his personality, if he really was constantly questioning and wondering about himself to Elijah, could be a drain over the long haul. So I believe that they will all always love each other, but my bet is that he hasn't seen as much of Sean now that it's all over. As tg suggested, I don't think anything should be read in to Elijah only naming Billy and Dom as guys he's close to.

Tg,

I was thinking of naming it R2D2, because the new computer is shiny, tiny, has a lot of software in it and it makes lots of funny noises when it wants to tell me something.
Palantir? Not a bad choice either!
Hmmm...anybody else a suggestion?

I'm also getting a new, big computer at work (I have two weeks off!) with a fantastic, big flat screen.
Maybe I'll call that one my Palantir.

Well, at least that program has something to do with talent and entertainment
I usually don't like reality tv. I really hate Big Brother.
True, Idol does have to do with talent but this is so not the way to look for talent. I don't know how it goes in other countries, but people vote on "who they like" and not so much on the quality of the voice and the performance.
Last week, the three best performances were voted in the bottom 3 (and my favorite was one of them... :( ...although he got rave reviews from the jury). Everybody was gobsmacked by that result.
It's fun to watch but it's cruel tv at the same time. Also, there's a lot of stigma attached to being an artist coming from a show like idol.
I still have a favorite though. He's singing Footloose tomorrow. (it's movie theme night). He's going to have to move, shake and sing his little socks off :D )
***Must resist getting more hooked by that silly program.***


About Robbie's state of depression. In the book, it says that he's getting treatment now. Like I said, he's very open and honest (as far as we can tell anyway) about his flaws and I very much appreciate that.
At the same time, I don't understand the reasons of his depression but I think that you have to have been there or seen somebody close to you suffer from it, to understand it.
I've mentionned this before but I have a close friend who suffers from clinical depression. I feel so sorry for him and I would love to help him get a different perspective on things but there's too much I don't understand. Why the need for perfection? Perfection is not of this world. Why not try to do your very best and so what if it isn't perfect? Why focus on all those things that aren't going according to plan and why doesn't he focus more on the things that are working out wonderfully (having a fantastic wife, a beautiful little girl (my goddaughter),...)
That's why it's good that he's getting professional help.


The stuff people come up with in there! I know there must be "responsible users" but somehow I always end up finding the whack jobs! They feel free to come up with the most ourtrageous theories, speculate on the most private aspects of others' lives. The weirdest part of all this, though, is that they say the same things about everybody! I can't explain it more thouroughly without stooping to their level.
I like reading some of the journals! On the other hand, there are a lot of fragile people out there with egoes that get bruised very easily.
LJ-land is a weird combination of being able to talk about the most private things of your life and share it with others. IMO, it often gives you a fake feeling of knowing a person. Maybe I'm oldfashioned like that, but you can't really know somebody by reading a couple of random thoughts on the internet. So, I don't understand why some of them get offended and bruised that easily.

LJ-land is a weird combination of being able to talk about the most private things of your life and share it with others. IMO, it often gives you a fake feeling of knowing a person. Maybe I'm oldfashioned like that, but you can't really know somebody by reading a couple of random thoughts on the internet. So, I don't understand why some of them get offended and bruised that easily.

OK, I'm gonna rant now. So avert your eyes.

Well, I was really referring to the speculation about the lives of people they can't possibly know, specifically Elijah. I stumled on one journal where they had pictures evidently taken from a private web-site of one of Elijah's friends. Everytime there was a picture of Elijah with another male in proximity there were squeals of glee; "oh, he's sooo gaaaay!" They can't possibly know that from the pics. He's said he's affectionate with his male friends and I admire that. My husband says he regrets that men of his own generation can't comfortably be affectionate and close, like women can with their friends, without insighting this kind of talk. These idiots are in the stone age.

What really blows me away though, is that they say it about billy/dom, orli/viggo, ad nauseam. Practically any pairing you can come up with is mentioned, with "proof" sighted. Is the male in question inconveniently paired up with a female by the press? Well, she's naturally just a beard.

Yes, to answer the question you're probably asking, I AM ashamed of myself for reading this cr*p.

But really where does one draw the line? I'm similarly unhappy with the recent pictures of Elijah getting a parking ticket. Yes the story is sort of funny and cute; fan asks for autograph, sweet Elijah obliges, and gets a ticket as a result. But then there is this picture
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/someprivacyplease.jpg
Taken with the others he looks more upset to find himself being photographed - yet again - than at having gotten a ticket!

He's a right to his privacy - whatever that entails - as much as any one of us here. And what really makes me angry about LJ everytime I stray over there, is that no one there seems to think so. And every few months or so, when I do find myself there again, it just seems to have gotten worse.

[/rant]

Having said all that, I'm not angry at anyone here. I like it here very much, because we all are very respectful.

honey.

Well, that's odd to me too.
On the one side, some of these people claim to be so open, liberal and modern and they claim to be gay-friendly.
But at the same time, they make these silly assumptions, based on a couple of images on tv or on the internet.
I've even had discussion with some of them...trying to understand their little theories but I don't do that any longer. What's the use?

Just because we see Elijah in movies and we see things on the internet,...they seem to think that they 'know' him. Well, we don't, not really. Simple.


It's much easier for women to be close with friends without others getting the idea...oh, she's got her arms around the shoulders of her friend, she must be gay. That's true. (not that there's anything wrong with being gay of course...it's just a very silly assumption that you can only be close to somebody if you have a sexual relationship with that person)
Here, in Belgium...I think that it's easier for men. I see men, kissing each other when they meet each other without people getting ideas. It's quite normal here, certainly in the south of my country (Wallonia).
But still, it's sometimes important for men to act tough. For example, at a party or a reception or something like that, when they enter a room and they want to greet everybody...they kiss the women on the cheeks as a way of greeting but when there's a male among them...you often get the "oh, I'm not kissing you"...

Honey, I think I understand the reasons for this behavior. There are many who, I think, want Elijah (and the other LOTR boys) to be gay. It means that there's no competition from real girlfriends/wives etc, and I understand that. I know how much unrequited love for a celebrity hurts. It's hard to watch another woman have the man you want, knowing full well that there's no chance for you. Sigh. So some of them have invented this world for themselves where there are no other women, but I think they've begun to believe their own fantasies are reality.

Ljs are anonymous if you choose to keep them that way. It's a place to express your feelings without revealing who you are. And yes, I too feel sad when I see people get their feelings hurt over unimaginably tiny slights. As my Mom might say, that's what makes horse races. It's inevitable that you'll find a few very fragile people in the mix.

As for that picture, it was taken by paparazzi. It's like the ones taken recently when Elijah went into Starbucks. Our celebrity-loving culture feeds that, unfortunately. Everything they do is fascinating for some reason, even the really mundane.

What freaks me out are the cell phone cameras. Elijah was photographed recently with a cell phone camera at the salon where he had his hair redone. And then of course it is on the internet. I'm a bit of a privacy freak and I would hate the thought of someone taking secret pictures of me practically anywhere I might be.

Achila:
Is there really something so wrong about ambition? If you were to read a book about Donald Trump, you wouldn't think so, most likely. Why isn't Sean allowed to be ambitious for himself in *his* field? Why shouldn't he strive to be another Stephen Spielberg, no matter how ridiculous that thought seems to us? There are those with talents less than Sean's, who are A-listers in Hollywood. We all know that and could easily tick off several names if we thought about it.

Well, yeah, I may be unusual, but if I read a book about Donald Trump and his ambition, I would likely also be very put off. I am very skeptical of how people pursue their ambitions. Ambition is fine, but in pursuit of it so much nastiness is excused ---and personally what is often sacrificed are the things I value most. I don't like ruthlessness. And I am not really attracted to competitiveness. It's a personal taste, I admit. But it's probably why I like Elijah so much (agree with you there Ylla!!)--he has said he doesn't find it valuable to compete with others, only with himself. I'm not terrifically good with heirarchy--which is probably why I am self employed. I don't like to be bossed, and I don't want to boss others. Anyway--I was reacting to Sean's long-held assumption (as he stated) that friendships were for using each other. If that is somehow okay for the sake of ambition--it just doesn't convince me. At all.

Moondancer:
So, I'm always been very cautious about what I read about stars in the press.

Amen. This is good to remember about all press--not just about celebrities. I've been to enough events and later seen them reported so inaccurately and lazily. And not too long ago my daughter did some press interviews and lo and behold the things that were made up!! It was a further lesson in not being too ready to believe whatever I hear.

I apply this to all news events. Whenever I hear or read the news about any sort of sensational story, for instance--I stop and try to think of what it would be to be the person talked about. BEcause the press could make any of us look sleazy or wierd if they wanted to. Hey--any of us could be painted as pretty perverted old hobbit women, should we somehow get into the papers because of some other dispute or whatever. It might be easy to make any of us look a little crazy.

I never believe anything 100% in life, and I never disbelieve 100% . I think a person must be both skeptical and open-minded.


Achila:
Honey, I think I understand the reasons for this behavior. There are many who, I think, want Elijah (and the other LOTR boys) to be gay. It means that there's no competition from real girlfriends/wives etc, and I understand that. I know how much unrequited love for a celebrity hurts. It's hard to watch another woman have the man you want, knowing full well that there's no chance for you. Sigh. So some of them have invented this world for themselves where there are no other women, but I think they've begun to believe their own fantasies are reality.

Good point.

Elijah at the TORC Convention...

I really want to go! I think I am going if I can sort the finances out. For me it involves getting from PA to LA in a plane. A thing I haven't done in over 30 years. But I think I'm really going.

So is any other Faculty or Harem member going? Maybe we could meet up for a mini-hoot?

Hello, dear Faculty friends!

Woops, what happened to this place?! Has this become the new "improved" Faculty? Tg, thanks a million for starting the new thread (and a Thank you, Sheryl, for saving the old one! We do have a great scholarly history. Great job!) :cool: :k

The last few weeks had been really tough and I could only lurk on occasion. So many things happened... hubby and I moved (am still surrounded by oodles of packing cases)... loads of renovation work, the hard drive of my computer crashed and - my father passed away. He died peacefully and I am so glad for him. I had the strong feeling that many friendly spirits guarded his last way. I'd like to Thank you for your thoughts and prayers!


On a lighter note - Welcome Eáránë Elensar and Ceefour :) :) ! It's so nice to have new members aboard.
from Eáránë Elensar:
Thanks for the welcome and for the nice comment on my 'name'. I wish I could say I got it in some other way than an Elf name generator! I
actually went to get a hobbit name and it came up something like 'Polly Snotbucket'... Well, nearly. I then tried the Elvish one and just loved it.

The Hobbit lass name the name generator showed for me was Rosamunda Sackville-Baggins from Sackville - uuah, NOOO! :D My Elven name is Gorlachiel (this has a somewhat strange impression in German, sounds a bit like the word for "gurgle" :rolleyes: ), but I liked the info that in Middle-earth I was a "Virtuous Bird-tamer" (yes, I can believe that). :) But nevertheless I think I'll just stick to good ol' Whiteling.

Welcome back, Rikka :) !

A very belated Happy Birthday to Kumari!


I have a plea - is anyone of the other European Facultytiers able to receive German TV channel SuperRTL? On November 8th they'll air "Oliver Twist" and I am not sure whether I'll have television reception in our new home by then... has anyone the possibility to tape it?
In a great mag I saw this advertising - hey, our Lad is a real sales promoter :p !

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/whiteling/OliverTwist.jpg



And a warm thank you to Skater girl who was so kind to send me a DVD copy of Day-O. It works, woo-hoo! :k

Serena, I'll reply your email soon!:k

...off to empty more packing cases....

ETA:
There are many who, I think, want Elijah (and the other LOTR boys) to be gay. It means that there's no competition from real girlfriends/wives etc, and I understand that. I know how much unrequited love for a celebrity hurts. It's hard to watch another woman have the man you want, knowing full well that there's no chance for you. Sigh. So some of them have invented this world for themselves where there are no other women, but I think they've begun to believe their own fantasies are reality.
Good point. I will say that it took me years to get over George Harrison ;). It's so easy to cross the line, too, between lusting after someone generically, and slipping over to behavior that is at the very least annoying to the celeb.

I've also thought for a while that part of Elijah's attraction for some women is that he *does* have an androgynous quality about his features. Sometimes. Usually when playing a hobbit named Frodo. He has very beautiful features, though I was surprised when someone posted a picture of him with his sister how masculine he is in comparison. But Frodo was non-threatening, and to many, an androgynous-looking person can seem non-threatening. I agree, though - if Elijah were indeed gay (which I just simply do *NOT* want to know about his sexual behavior!!!), he would be seen as "safe" - someone to admire and lust after, when the luster knows full well that the feeling will never be returned. Same thing happened in the 80's when that show "Beauty and the Beast" was on. Vincent was not human, asked nothing of the woman in his life, and was therefore not only safe, he was beyond belief. The same thing happens with clergy sometimes - women have a strong attraction to someone who is apparently gentle and kind, and not a threat.

Just because we see Elijah in movies and we see things on the internet,...they seem to think that they 'know' him. Well, we don't, not really. Simple.
I wish we had that quote from someone who was in Chz - Chezch - thatcountrythatIcan'tspellafter8straighthoursatworkonaSATURDAY!!!slovakia - er - how 'bout Prague? I can spell that - yeah! Prague! - during EII, who was standing a few inches (or feet) away from The One Lad and was reflecting that he was a perfect stranger, she had nothing in common with him, and never would have. It was one of the wisest things about fandom that I've ever seen. The thing where women actively bug those guys to sleep with them is just waaaaaaay over the top. They should be ashamed of themselves. Harrrrumph.

I did sneak some time in goofing around on someone's LJ where there was a whole history of that fandom scam. Oy! What a mess! Having been ripped off recently to the tune of several hundred dollars over some yard work, I found it fascinating.

~grumpyandgoinghometoeaticecreamandwatchSuzeOrman (Hmmmmm - some Lo Mein would taste good tonight...)

I got back from vacation today and checked in to KD, and nearly panicked when I saw the listing for “Still the Faculty Lounge.” I couldn’t imagine what had happened to the old one, but then I read the explanations. Thanks to all the technically talented people who worked on saving the old thread.

And thanks to tgshaw for your opening post, and the “Ever feel like someone’s watching you?” picture: a perfect one to hang in the Lounge! Couldn’t we put it out on T-shirts, somehow?

AND thanks to everyone who has already posted such great stills, collages, etc. Isn’t it nice of Elijah, to have provided everybody with so much material to work with, drool over, etc.

There have already been so many interesting posts. I’m just going to comment at random.

Welcome to Eáránë Elensar, who wrote:

Does anyone but me find they HAVE to say, 'My God he's beautiful' after every photo they see of Frodo/Elijah. (No matter how many times you've seen the same photograph?)
I do that all the time (often accompanied by little moans of appreciation). And then I have to laugh at myself, when I remember how much I used to detest the poor guy.

I agree with Mariole about possible LotR remakes:

It makes me wonder about a remake of LOTR. I, personally, would love to see a more canon-faithful adaptation. But the heart, the spirit that went into these movies -- if that weren't matched, it will still feel hollow.
Also, while I think some roles could be re-cast pretty easily, I would have trouble accepting replacements for Elijah (obviously) and Viggo.

I was reading Sean’s book while I was on vacation, and in general, I’m with Achila in feeling more sympathy toward him than many people here seem to (though I sure wouldn’t want to live with him!). And I think that Achila made an excellent point when she wrote:

I think we've gotten to the point that we pass everything we think and see through the "Elijah filter". Let's face it. There is no other one like Elijah. Period. In looks, in talent, in personality. He's extraordinary. And even lovelier -- he doesn't seem to know it. It's easy to make comparisons with his peers, but I don't think we should. Sean has his demons he wrestles with, that we need to keep in mind. He can't be Elijah, nor should he be forced to be.
Also, as far as Sean's ambition is concerned: Some things he says remind me of the ambitious young corporate types I have to deal with in my job: always concerned about how they are being perceived and how important their contributions are considered, always studying the higher-ups for clues and cues and pointers, etc. Even the bit about "Ian McKellen stole my makeup artist!" was familiar, except that in my business, it's usually administrative assistants who are being poached. I hate that whole attitude, and I hate it even more when associated with something that I'd LIKE to think of as an art form. But film making is very much a business, too (and a nasty one, at times); and maybe the fact that Sean grew up in a "Hollywood" family makes him so hyper-aware of this.

The book does have some nice pictures. I especially like the one of the “band,” with Elijah in glasses and that silly hat. You could cut him out and stick him right in an illustrated dictionary, in the “G” section!

Moondancer – So glad you got your computer! I suppose you could just give it a low-tech name like The Red Book.

Happy birthday, Pelagia!
http://www.laynekennedy.com/Wood-1.jpg

I've mentionned this before but I have a close friend who suffers from clinical depression. I feel so sorry for him and I would love to help him get a different perspective on things but there's too much I don't understand...
I'm not sure I know what else to say. It has nothing to do with what's going on in someone's life. It's an imbalance in the neurotransmitter chemicals in the brain. In some cases, there's probably a genetic element. They're finding now that similar neurotransmitter imbalances in the spinal cord (that and the brain make up the central nervous system) can be a cause of fibromyaligia.

Like alcoholism--and fibromyaligia--depression can cause a lot of problems in someone's life. But it works that direction, not the other way around (problems in someone's life don't cause depression, or alcoholism, or fibromyalgia). If someone's sad or grieving about something that's normal to be sad or grieving about, that's not clinical depression--that's normal.

Like an alcoholic, someone who's been chronically depressed has to learn to recognize the thinking patterns that are part of the disease. Until then, it's a vicious circle. So people with depression have to learn to deal with their thought patterns in a way somewhat similar to what alcoholics need to do (a lot do use the Twelve Steps as an aid), but the thought patterns aren't the basis of either disease--they come from it.

Usually the best thing you can do for a depressed person (aside from encouraging them to get professional help if they're not) is to support, love and accept them the way they are.

I know this is completely off-topic :o , but it's so important for people to understand this...

--------

Regarding the "someone watching you" pic--there are lots more in the 3 pages of screencaps from The Mirror of Galadriel over at http://www.frodolivesin.us/FotR . In fact, the picture ended up in the thread because I was so struck by it; I'd never noticed that Frodo's looking at us in that shot, but he seems to be, doesn't he? Evidently, we're seeing out of Galadriel's eyes there.

Speaking of the website, I do have all the various pieces published now (TTT decided to behave itself last night after I replaced a couple more pages of screencaps :rolleyes: ). But a lot of the linking isn't done yet. If all else fails :o , you can get anywhere from the home page. While checking out links, I tried the one to the Everything Is Illuminated fansite and got a 404 page. Has it been moved? Or was I just having an "internet moment"? ;) BTW, I actually finished that book this afternoon (having to sit at the computer without doing anything except move the mouse every once in awhile is a great time for reading :rolleyes: ). There are a couple of things I'd like to discuss, and was hoping to do it at that site.

Also speaking of the website, I've been working on a piece of crass commercialism that I've been planning to add after I got the rest of the renovation done. It kind of goes against my grain, but I've tried to make the "shopping mall" a little fun and, hopefully, convenient. I haven't published it yet--kind of embarrassed about the idea. But I hope it will end up being a useful service, too.

Wise words, Tg.

Btw, I checked out your 'Wizards Are Odd' at frodolivesin.us. :lol: My fave cap: 'Frodorothy, the not-quite-a-munchkin looking more like a munchkin than usual.' Brilliant and funny. Thanks for making me laugh. :)

HAPPY BIRTHDAY, PELAGIA

Is this young man on his way to your party? (http://www.imagemagician.com/images/blossom/Pelagia1.gif)

Lovely birthday pic, Moondancer!

Welcome Eáránë Elensar, and ceefour.

And a huge welcome back to Rikka. We've missed you. :)

Nice to see you again too, Whiteling. I'm so sorry to hear the sad news about your father. I hope you'll be happy in your new home. :)

Re-lurking...

Edit: Tg, I looked for the EII site a few days ago, and couldn't get anything either. :confused:

Happy birthday Pelagia!!
http://webplaza.pt.lu/barbara/firstparty2.jpg

I think there's another surprise party waiting for you and Kumari round at Barrie Osborne's house!
(Another wonderful gif, Blossom - it's so nice to be able to share people's birthday presents!)
(For those who haven't read Sean's infamous book, this is a - rather bad-quality, sorry! - scan from it. You may need a magnifying glass to make out the 18-year-old geekboy in a green jumper and heavy-rimmed glasses, pictured at the very first cast party in Wellington in 1999.)

Sorry it’s taken so long, Kumari!
And incidentally you chose the very same Frodo pic as I did as your first “save” …. I gazed at that every day at the office for six months in 2002! It is totally mesmerising. So ....

from Eáránë Elensar:
Does anyone but me find they HAVE to say, 'My God he's beautiful' after every photo they see of Frodo/Elijah. (No matter how many times you've seen the same photograph?)

In a word, YES!!! :D

Lots of wise words this past page or so. For example:

Ylla:
He's just NOT HOLLYWOOD...and that my dears is why I LOVE HIM

Achila:
I think we've gotten to the point that we pass everything we think and see through the "Elijah filter". Let's face it. There is no other one like Elijah. Period. In looks, in talent, in personality. He's extraordinary. And even lovelier -- he doesn't seem to know it.

Jon Avnet (who directed The War) said almost exactly that: "His professionalism, his intelligence and his talent are singular. There's no-one like him. Period."
And you're right, Achila, he genuinely doesn't seem to know it. And that may actually be the main reason Sean reveres him - because that quality is the hardest for Sean to emulate. And yes, I too noticed that Sean never once mentioned Elijah's extraordinary acting in the book (although, to be fair, he has done in other contexts). As you suggest, in a sense that is almost a compliment in itself: the acting is self-evident, so it doesn't need to be mentioned. But also, for Sean, it may be a quality too far: I get the feeling he both admires and resents Elijah's grace and beauty and wisdom and fame, so he's damned if he's going to acknowledge Elijah's acting talent in his book and distract attention from his own.
And yes, to be compared with Elijah every day for 18 months must have been purgatory for someone as insecure as Sean. I can't help feeling that, in a perverse way, that actually hardened Sean's resolve not to learn from him, however much he claims he did learn. If he learnt anything about grace during that time, he usually keeps it well hidden in his book.

Finally:
from Zkgrumpy:
But Frodo was non-threatening, and to many, an androgynous-looking person can seem non-threatening. I agree, though - if Elijah were indeed gay (which I just simply do *NOT* want to know about his sexual behavior!!!), he would be seen as "safe" - someone to admire and lust after, when the luster knows full well that the feeling will never be returned.

It's said that no sexual creature - of any species - is 100% heterosexual. But I'm 100% sure Elijah does not prefer men to women in a general sexual sense (I won't list all the reasons here, but the No 1 reason is that I happen to believe what he himself says on the subject).
But be that as it may, I think you and Achila may have solved the puzzle of why certain women want him (and the other cast members) to be gay: it's because that preserves him for them, so that they don't have to face the pain of imagining him with another woman. So they turn him - and the others - into exotic animals they can put in a cage of their own making, safe from the clutches of others all over the world.

Funny - while I was writing this, far too late at night, there was a memorial broadcast for John Peel on BBC 4, featuring (inter alia) Ian Curtis and Joy Division. Two connections with Elijah there! (What a pity Elijah didn't get to take over JP's Radio 1 slot ... maybe he still will, for a time anyway?)
Actually I don't think Ian Curtis really looked all that much like Elijah. But it will be one hell of an interesting acting job!

Hello, Ladies! Many thanks for your warm welcomes and my sympathies to Whiteling on you loss. From Issue No.4 Aug./Sept 2002 of the LOTR Fan Club Magazine: Q: A lot of our fans have asked about the Elven cloaks that were given to the Fellowship and commented on howthey flowed so beautifully. How did you go about creating those? Ngila Dickson: That is an interesting story. We went through so many variations on those Elven cloaks adn what they were going to be. We looked into having metal woven into the fabric so that they would be sparkling and, in the end, they just looked too cheesy. It was not a good image. Then we found this fabulous family in Wellington that was weaving its own fabric. They had their very own sheep that were unlike any other sheep breed, and they were weaving this fantastic material directly off the backs of these sheep. You will see the cloaks more in the next film, but when the fabric catches the light, it is almost translucent. It has this weird thing where sometimes it appears to be quite thick and dense, and then, when the light catches it, it is almost coompletely see-through. Yet, it has this beautiful weave in it, and the weave is very magical. That's the only way I can describe it. I remember we had experimented with so many things and had many things woven, and I was absolutely in despair, thinking, "I am never going to conquer this!" Then we found this special fabric, and we all knew it was the right one. It's just got this extraordinary, almost kaleidoscopic pattern in it. It's interesting because no one has ever asked me about those Elven cloaks, but I would say that they were the toughest things I had to deal with on the film. I have said that the Ringwraiths costumes were difficult, but at least you knew what you were dealing with. How you achieve a Elven cloak without any digital effect element to it at times seemed really beyond us. I really did not want to end up with that shimmering fabric thing we tried early on. We always tried to keep things very grounded on the film, and that was the one element that I just did not want to get away from us. I wanted those cloaks to look so practical at times but then have that moment when you knew that they weren't-that they had something Elven about them. I was so thrilled at the range that that natural fiber gave us.

Pardon if this has been posted before. From the same issue-Q: Can you give us some brief comments on each of the major costumes? Let's start with the Hobbits. Ngila Dickson:" Well, we wanted to make each character quite separate; we wanted you to be able to spot each one from a distance. We wanted to give you a sense of who each character was. Frodo's costume is probably the most princely of them all. He's got a bit of velvet, which doesn't really appear with the hobbits very much. His colors-that very warm golden brown and that maroon red-were used to set him slightly apart form the others. Sam, on the other hand, had to be at the absolute opposite extreme; he had to be as rustic as we could make him. All of his fabric was woven specifically for him-it's a very rough fabric, very country, very workmanlike. He has very country-mum stitching. He has patches on the elbowsof his jacket. Pippin was someone we just wanted to make slightly eccentric, and that was why we gave him that fabulous scarf. That scarf was really never intended to be used as much as it has been. But he really really adopted it. Merry was my little braggart. He kind of saw himself as being a bit more "up there" with Frodo. He was loud. With Merry, we gave him that lovely bright yellow waistcoat with all of the quilting in it and brass buttons. He is a bit of a sharp little dude." My home work assignment this weekend is to compare and contrast "The Money Shot" and "The Turn" shown in High-Definition TV vs. Regular Broadcast TV.

Very cool, ceefour. Thanks so much for sharing. Love that they didn't go for the shimmery cloth.

HAPPY BIRTHDAY PELAGIA!!!

Kumari, too!! sorry to be late

((((Whiteling)))) I'm glad you checked in. I'm so sorry for your loss. What an overwhelming time. :( I hope you can be happy and settled in your new home.

Grumpy:
I will say that it took me years to get over George Harrison


ahhh....I can relate to that!! ;)

Well, it's not quite Pelagia's birthday yet in this part of the world, but that doesn't mean it's too early to light the candles ;) .

http://www.frodolivesin.us/Pics/033204f0.jpg

A Very Happy Birthday, Pelagia!

Thanks for the quote on the cloaks, ceefour. I'm glad, too, that they didn't have to make them "sparkly" to look Elven :z: . It's just perfect that they seem rather ordinary until we catch a glimpse of that translucence. And their ability to seem to change color is straight out of the book! (There are also some subtle little reminders of their source that don't need special cloth--such as the cloaks being in perfect shape even when the rest of the person's clothes are falling apart.)

----Coming back to the thread just now, I realized that last time I was here I totally missed about a half page of posts :o :o , including Whiteling's. So glad to see you back :k . Hope your move continues to go smoothly. It's good to hear that your father's last days were able to be peaceful.

Happy Birthday, Pelagia!


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/exotic.bmp


Whiteling, I'm sorry to hear about your loss, but I'm glad your father passed gently. And I'm glad you're back! :k

TG, I was just looking at your site today, and at "The Mirror" sequence. There are so many beautiful shots there. Thank you for allowing me to look at the composition of them. And I really loved the series of Frodo at Bag End, "Nothing Unnatural." It revealed whole new aspects of Elijah's face that I hadn't seen before. Although it really seems more like Frodo's face, since he somehow manages to look so much like maybe a near relative, but not the same person.

Blossom, adorable gif! :)

Honey, I think I understand the reasons for this behavior. There are many who, I think, want Elijah (and the other LOTR boys) to be gay. It means that there's no competition from real girlfriends/wives etc, and I understand that. I know how much unrequited love for a celebrity hurts. It's hard to watch another woman have the man you want, knowing full well that there's no chance for you. Sigh. So some of them have invented this world for themselves where there are no other women, but I think they've begun to believe their own fantasies are reality.

Yeah, I've kind of suspected that was the motivation of these folks. But, honestly, it still baffles me. I don't need to "own" any part of a celebrity. And really, if you love someone enough, can't you just be happy that they are happy?

I want to apologize though, for bringing a rather icky topic in here, where it really doesn't belong. Like I said, I feel safe here, and that it is somehow "safe" for Elijah here, in that we are so respectful of him as a person.

honey!

So sorry to hear about your father, Whiteling!! :(
But i`m glade to see you back in here! :)
And hope you will sattel down and enjoy your new place!! :)

Pelagia, HAPPY BIRTH DAY too you!!!!! :k :k :k


Well i don`t know how too write this so i dont expose my self too much!!! ;)

But i know how it feels to love a celebe you can`t have!!! But i`m with thoose who dosen`t make him a guy for that reson!
I want him too bee happy with a woman who is worthy his love!!
And who loves him for what he is!!
I hope you all understands what i trying too say here!!!

love you all/ wood

HAPPY BIRTHDAY TO PELAGIA!

This just a little something I picked up for you!
http://www.elijahfan.com/gallery/gal/Magazines/Entertainment_Weekly/ew-026.jpg

I would also like to thank everyone for their birthday wishes. It is very much appreciated.

Serena - That pic we both adore - that was also my first LOTR-related wallpaper I saved on my computer. I couldn't take my eyes off it! I wonder if my husband ever noticed me staring at the "blank" screen?

Whiteling - my sympathy to you on the passing of your father. My husband lost his mother four months ago, and her passing was peaceful after difficult times. I was sad, yet happy she no longer had to suffer.

Kumari

Wouldn't it be real funny if Elijah fell down while he was dancing down the hall of the "Tonight Show?"

The way he was moving it looked like he might do that in that gif. You know how Our Boy will sometimes fall down if he doesn't watch where he's going! :D

Adrogynous is a good way to describe him because he looks Cute, but at the same time Manly.

What I'd like to know is, why doesn't movie Moses ever get described as Adrogynous? I mean doesn't Charlton Heston have the same quality? Masculine looking, but equally Feminine with his beautiful smile? :confused:

Has Anyone ever thought of this before? :eek:

He died peacefully and I am so glad for him. I had the strong feeling that many friendly spirits guarded his last way.
Isn't that something? I'm very sceptical about these things usually but, I had the same strong feeling when my mother died. I could tell you a couple of weird but wonderful stories about that.
Not only did I experience friendly spirits guarding and guiding my mother, but I also felt friendly spirits guarding me in those tough days, as I'm sure they're out there to help you, Whiteling.
----------------

Tg,

Thanks for the explanation. It does help me. In the case of my friend, his entire family suffers from it and I'm sure it's some chemical imbalance with them. Life can be such a struggle for him. :(
We talked about perfectionism before. I think that in my case, I learned very early in my life that perfectionism isn't from this world. Like I said, because of complications during the pregnancy and being born too soon...parts of my brain didn't develop the way they should have been.
My parents had no idea of the sort of damage in me when I was born but the doctors warned them of the possibilities. When I was about 5, a specialist tested me and concluded that I was going to 'catch up'. You would begin to see the improvement from the age of 8 and so it did! School wasn't easy in those days because I was aware of my situation and I refused to give in. I wanted to catch up and to learn as easily as the others. It took me 14 to 15 years to catch up (the parts of my brain that were underdevelopped). It's very tough to fully realize that it's not normal to not being able to understand something when everybody arounds you does understand it with a teacher who thinks you're just playing games and ends up calling you stupid (thank God I was smart enough to not accept that!)
I had troubles with abstract thinking. The odd thing is that I went on to study economics at university and that requires a lot of abstract thinking.
Anyway...I do have a point in all this. (me and my ramblings :rolleyes: ). The one positive that came from it is that I learned to deal with the fact that striving for perfectionism was just not an option for me. I was happy (well, I had no choice, really) to aim for 'my very best' and just prove to the rest of the world that I was clever.


Achila,
you may have a point there.

It's always been odd to me, though. Those stars are out of reach for me anyway (I never really fantasized about getting to meet and marry a star...the admiration I feel for a star simply doesn't go there) and the fact that they might be gay or not does not alter one thing for me.


Blossom!
What a great gif!

Hello to all you Good Faculty People...
Haven't been here in ages, due to other things going on at TORC, and the fact that I lost my Internet connection for a while...most frustrating !!
I'm SO glad that the Mods have managed to avoid the deletion of this thread too....( so far anyway ) It would be a crying shame to lose such a precious thread, just because it got a little unwieldy...don't you think ?

Whiteling,
My condolences for the loss of your Father...I'm so sorry...
I lost my own Dear Old Dad about ten years ago, and will never forget it as long as I live..although I do agree, the feeling of friendly spirits being there to guide is sometimes very strong, and as a result, very comforting ...My Mother said something similar at the time of my Dad's departure...

Honey,
I'm very definitely with you where your thoughts and discomfort about the gay rumour-mongers are concerned...
For a while, last year, I got quite fascinated, in a "watching a car-crash" sort of way, with the Data-Lounge Refugee Threads at Bag-End Inn...I couldn't quite fathom the kind of Mass Self-delusion going on with the whole database of sightings, nods and whispers, and so-called hints thrown out by Elijah and Dom, with the colours they were wearing, about their supposed affair...
The whole thing was completely and utterly WEIRD !!! ..and I often wondered what they themselves must think of it, because undoubtedly they knew that it was going on ...Dom met MsAllegro ( The owner of the Bag-end Inn website) once, at a convention, and he called her mad to her face...:D

I think it's very revealing that the so-called database has been taken down, the message-boards at both BEI and Data-Lounge Refugees have been closed, and now there isn't any trace of it left...makes you wonder whether Elijah, Dom, or their respective agents, issued C & D Notices to them all....I'd LOVE to think they did !!!

The invasion of their privacy was really atrocious, imho...

I also agree with Achila's point about the reasons why straight women should want Elijah to be gay...sounds daft on the surface of it, doesn't it ?,,,but the fact that it removes the danger of another woman...shock, horror...actually getting the relationship with him that they crave for themselves, does sound very feasible to me...and somehow the thought of another man getting him isn't threatening at all...weird !!!
Anyway, enough of my talk of EJW's proclivities one way or another...it's his talent that matters here...

Moondancer, having read your story I have even more admiration for you than before! To have had those early problems and be as creative and articulate as you are in a foreign language is amazing. :k

This is OT - sorry - but Tg, thank you for that explanation of depression. It does seem that it has very little to do with outside circumstances, and everything to do with one's reaction to them. A former colleague of mine had been bipolar most of his life. He went through a depressive crisis, was prescribed lithium and recovered more or less completely. So he decided he no longer needed the medication, and stopped taking it - at which point he entered a downward spiral that ended in suicide. In the depressive state he couldn't make the connection between his state of mind and the lithium, so he concluded that the world was against him. I still feel sad that I failed to give him the support he probably needed, because I didn't understand the mechanism of his illness at the time.
Of course the core reasons for depression lie very deep and it isn't clear whether the chemical imbalance is the cause or the effect of unresolved pain - but the imbalance is nevertheless there, and treatable, in cases of clinical depression. At least one "alternative" doctor I know takes lithium (in smallish doses) every day as a general brain tonic! Apparently it's a mineral we all need in certain quantities.
Better still, perhaps, there's an amazingly simple and effective method of stopping negative feelings in their tracks (provided you're not seriously disturbed, that is). It's called EFT - Emotional Freedom Technique. You can apply it to yourself - and it works! It's often good for physical illness too. If anyone's interested in the link, please PM me.

Dear Whiteling, I omitted to say WELCOME BACK! :k
And thank you for telling us about the friendly spirits who accompanied your father on his way. Maybe some were from The Faculty (old or new?). We were certainly thinking of you ... and still are.
Don't worry about the email - there is all the time in the world for that!
BTW, I've just discovered I can get Super RTL - and will actually be at home tomorrow evening (the only evening for the next 3 weeks!). So I'll record Oliver Twist for you (dubbed in German? What fun!) Do you know what time it's on? (I haven't bought the TV programme, as I can't really use it right now .....) How nice that The One Lad is the advertising draw!

And welcome back Rikka too! :) We'd missed you.

Have just discovered my Elvish name is Eámanë Telemnar (better than Bramblerose Sandybanks of Frogmorton?). Actually the Hobbit one is not bad either. Am tempted to change my identity to match the new thread .... ;)

EDIT after Lady Wendy's simulpost (welcome back, LW!!)
I think it's very revealing that the so-called database has been taken down, the message-boards at both BEI and Data-Lounge Refugees have been closed, and now there isn't any trace of it left...makes you wonder whether Elijah, Dom, or their respective agents, issued C & D Notices to them all....I'd LOVE to think they did !!!

Have they really been closed down? Yippee! Wendy, what was the connection between BEI and DL? Were they run by the same coterie? I never found out, because I've avoided linking to them for years (didn't want to encourage them).

Hey, I'm touched by all your kind words... thank you, you friendly spirits (and yes, Moondancer, there are many more, helping to cope with the loss. It's very comforting).



Better still, perhaps, there's an amazingly simple and effective method of stopping negative feelings in their tracks (provided you're not seriously disturbed, that is). It's called EFT - Emotional Freedom Technique. You can apply it to yourself - and it works! It's often good for physical illness too.

I can only second this advice - EFT is a very useful tool. It really deserves more popularity!


BTW, I've just discovered I can get Super RTL - and will actually be at home tomorrow evening (the only evening for the next 3 weeks!). So I'll record Oliver Twist for you (dubbed in German? What fun!) Do you know what time it's on?

What a "coincidence" , huh? Thanks a lot in advance for taping it, Serena. :k It aires at 20.15 (see advertising above).


Bramblerose Sandybanks of Frogmorton?

Love it ! :D


HAPPY BIRTHDAY PELAGIA!
:)

Whiteling, my sincere condolences on your loss. I hope you are comforted by all your friends and happy memories.

Blossom, I have never seen the entire sequence of that gif before. It is truly hilarious!

Achila and Honey, we miss you in the Big Apple!

Thank you, Ceefour, that was fascinating stuff.

To several people, I am a bit behind in my correspondence. :o But not forgetful! Never that! ;)

Whiteling, please allow me to add my deepest sympathies regarding the loss of your father. My thoughts are with you.

Moondancer, as serena said, you're now even more amazing to me that before! You're such an inspiration for overcoming your difficulties. :k

Serena, count me as one of those interested in the Emotional Freedom Technique!

And I think I missed a Happy Birthday to Pelagia somewhere in there! :)

Teeny weeny miniscule spoilers (possibly) about CoF:
Mel stopped by last night (she's going to a conference in Denver). We chatted about various things, and ended the evening with a viewing of Chain of Fools -- the soon-to-be collector's item with real Chinese subtitles! She enjoyed it very much, and wondered why it didn't get at least a video release (my theory was the suicide theme). She was pleased that it's coming out on DVD (without subtitles, the cowards!). :p

In both our opinions, Elijah did the stunts himself. He does so much of this leaping around, falling down, big spills, etc. that it just has to be a talent of his. It's ironic that people who don't think the matter through think he must be clumsy (or in the case of Frodo, "delicate"). :p You have to be pretty talented to pull off a prat fall. (Reveals secret crush on Dick Van Dyke when based on when he tripped over the ottoman in his TV show.)



In other news, I will only add my voice to what Honeyelf began and others seconded: I don't like speculation on Elijah's sexuality, and I don't like pictures where spies have caught him doing totally normal things (shopping, standing on a street corner, etc.). Yes, I see them, because people post them on LJ where I hang out, but when I realize I'm looking at spy pics I leave. It feels creepy to me, like I'm a peeping tom.

OT: Sean's book
Alyon, thank you for sharing your thoughts on it. It's an interesting thing to discuss. I liked your defense of Elijah, and was aware of the omissions also as I read. But my impression was that Sean hardly remarked on anyone's acting, except in how it made him feel (jealous, depressed, confused, etc.). It was an extremely egocentric focus. My particular chuckle over Sam being the complete hero of ROTK was Sean pointing out how Sam takes on Shelob in this tremendous battle! The battle of the movie! My inner voice was saying at that time, "Aragorn?" I mean, if we're going to compare whacking bad guys with a sword, Aragorn's 1,636,485 enemies personally whacked overcomes Sam's 1 (or 4, if you count the orcs he kills in the movie).

I'm afraid I do look at this book rather cynically. Sean (in his own words) is so much about money, and the book was obviously published now in order to maximize sales while the fandom is still here (although I suppose Andy's was, also). Some people will say, what's wrong with making money? But I can't help thinking he strained some friendships or alienated some people with this book, so it hardly seems worth it to me. I have the feeling he'll look back on this as yet another mistake he'll regret.

Serena,
Have they really been closed down? Yippee! Wendy, what was the connection between BEI and DL? Were they run by the same coterie? I never found out, because I've avoided linking to them for years (didn't want to encourage them).

Here, for you, and anyone else who is vaguely curious, is the sordid tale as I understand it :-

I wasn't there from the beginning, so I didn't read all the threads, ( there were simply far too many )...Ms Allegro posted regularly, on the Prancing Pony messageboard at the Gay website Data-Lounge, which had a LOTR-related Forum...out of the chatting there, somehow, came the idea that Elijah and Dom were, and had been having for some time, since meeting on the LOTR set, a rather passionate affair...( probably from one of these people who can't see that simple close friendship between two men can't be just that !! ) From that, someone who claimed to be an insider, ( ie, someone who knew them both personally), started the idea that they wanted to come out to other gay people, but not to the whole world, because of what this would do to their careers...and so, the whole thing of what they called shout-outs started ....and went on for ages and ages...ad nauseum...then Ms Allegro collated her infamous "Database" of all the shout-outs and all the apparent "Evidence"...
Then, DataLounge got fed up with all the sheer nastiness that was going on with all the bitchiness and flaming of trolls whenever someone dared to question the validity of their claims, that that particular Forum was closed...

Ms Allegro then opened a new Forum at her own website at Bag-End Inn, and called it The DataLounge Refugees Forum, which collected all their old threads from the original Forum, together with all the clues and "Evidence" on her database...and that became the new home for all these somewhat delusional obsessives for a while...and then that Forum was closed too, just recently...I don't know what happened to cause her to close it, but her Bag-End Inn Forum was closed too...

I shall leave you to draw your own conclusions... :D :D :D

( Sorry - I'm sure that this isn't a topic that the Faculty Lounge wants to discuss really, but it is interesting to see just how far a mass-delusion can go, when you have so many people contributing regularly to it )

There was something similar that happened with David Duchovny and Gillian Anderson from the X-Files too...of course, David's marriage to Tea Leoni was simply a front to disguise the torrid affair they were supposed to be having in secret..:D :D :D !!!
So you see, it can happen to other people too...

By the way...what is Emotional Freedom Technique ? I've never heard of it, but it sounds interesting...
( Hmmm...Perhaps you should PM me with the details as it IS OT for the Faculty !!!)

Well, Serena and Mariole, I'm supposed to have caught up now ;) and the parts of my brain that were not properly developped were the sections with wich you do mathematics and stuff (hence the difficulty with abstract thinking in those early days). The language section of my brain was alright. My sister acknowledged some time ago that I was an early talker and I was one of the first at my class to read and write (which I did on purpose once I found out that words were easier for me that figures...it was an area that allowed me to prove to my teacher and my parents that I wasn't dumn).

I'm one of the lucky ones. In Time magazine, I once saw survival statistics for people who were born in my birth year and with my birth weight and it's shocking how few survived (only 14% or so), let alone survived in good health.

I was also very lucky to have had fantastic parents who always kept on believing in me and help me fight against teachers who didn't believe in me. They taught me to not give up on myself too soon.
They were simply amazing.

Enough about me, tough.


Lady Wendy,

Did you follow that whole 'colour coded messages' debate at DL-A? :lol:
Hilarious.
I had fun reading DL-A but I stopped doing that after a while because it was just a bit too weird at times.

Moondancer,
Did you follow that whole 'colour coded messages' debate at DL-A.
Hilarious.
I had fun reading DL-A but I stopped doing that after a while because it was just a bit too weird at times.

If you are referring to what I think you are referring to...that is the "Database"that Ms Allegro listed out...all the colour-referenced shout-outs...supposedly Elijah and Dom, or at least the so-called "insider", would post a very cryptic message referring to particular colours that they would be wearing the next time we saw them at some public LOTR event or other...and Hey Presto !! The next time we saw Elijah and Dom, sure enough, they would be wearing those exact colours !! This, apparently, was a shout-out to the Gay Community that they were havingan affair !!!...This happened enough times to convince people that it was true...
( Franke, of course, was just a front, what they call a "Beard "...)

The whole thing was quite bizarre...

For myself, I wouldn't put it past Dom, ( Elijah, I'm not sure about ) to take these people for a ride as a joke, just to see how gullible they would be...
Does that sound at all feasible ?
Yes...the whole thing was TOTALLY weird...and I HAD to follow it :rolleyes: out of curiosity as to how far this delusion would actually go, and whether Elijah and Dom would finally, issue them with Cease & Desist Notices...which, of course, they may have done...

I have found it interesting reading about the Data Lounge and BEI. I somehow found my way to Datalounge not long after I had been drawn to Elijah. I still knew very little about him, and was naive about what was out there on the net, and it took me a while to realise that there was unlikely to any truth in what was being said. It was not long before he came to the UK to do Hooligans, and I was quite scared that if there were a grain of truth in what was being discussed, the British press would hound him until they outed him.

I don't know if any of you look at A&F at all, but there was recently someone there saying they were a journalist doing a piece on Elijah. He was reckoned to be into orgies and treating the many girls he went with shoddily. I think much of this person's info must have come from the LJs, because if he really went through loads of women and there was anything legitimate to tell, one would surely have sold her story by now.

Robbie Williams may indeed have clinical depression, but the situation can't be helped when he is in a position that makes having ordinary relationships almost impossible. When I saw the pictures someone posted of Elijah sitting outside a hair salon, I felt really sad. At the moment seems to be a well adjusted person, managing to live a fairly normal life away from his work, but just how long can he remain that way while his every move is story or a photo wating to be posted. Wouldn't it be a shame if he rejected acting as a career because the attention became more than he needed, and we never got to see how he develops and matures as an actor.

Personally, I don't want to know about his private life at all. I love his acting, and find him very attractive when he is in role, or putting on his public face in interviews. The reality of a 23 year old, with a dress sense that does not match my own, who likes to drink and smoke and go to clubs till the early hour of the morning does not appeal to me in the least.

I don't think I could bring myself to go to a convention type thing either, as I would find the fan/star meeting a bit embarrasing. I was married for a few years to a professional sportsman who had his moment of fame, and I found it very uncomfortable when people came up for his autograph while I was with him. I also find it very awkward now when complete strangers come up to hubby and I to tell us what wonderful dancers/skaters they think we are, when the reality is that we aren't that good at all among our peers, just to the untrained eye. Occasionally at a festival someone has really acted the goofy fan over several days, and almost fawned. Knowing how I feel about this, and having watched the film Galaxy Quest, I just couldn't go up to Elijah without feeling like a complete jerk.

Whiteling- I am glad the DVD works, I was a bit worried about it. I will be recording Oliver Twist on RTL, so if you need it, I can do that for you.

Could any Native German speakers explain to me how they put over the Cockney(London) accent when it is dubbed in German. Do they pick the accent of a particular German town, or simply not bother going into such detail.

In both our opinions, Elijah did the stunts himself. He does so much of this leaping around, falling down, big spills, etc. that it just has to be a talent of his. It's ironic that people who don't think the matter through think he must be clumsy (or in the case of Frodo, "delicate"). You have to be pretty talented to pull off a prat fall.

It became quite noticable and amusing to me how many times Elijah gets to trip/slip/slide in his films. Was it always scripted??? :D It is also amazing how many treehouses he got to go in. From his early films, you could end up thinking every American kid has a treehouse.

Thank you for the DL recap, Lady Wendy. Very interesting! I also was fooled when I first went on the net. I was turned off by the vicious attacks of anyone who challenged the world view, or even said, "I don't personally care." But someone speaking with such authority is often believed. I'll stop there. :p

from Skater Girl
The reality of a 23 year old, with a dress sense that does not match my own, who likes to drink and smoke and go to clubs till the early hour of the morning does not appeal to me in the least.
That's certainly true for me. I have a 23-yr-old niece, and she's young! I think Elijah is much more mature, but he is young and has different interests, more power to him. (Just the thought of playing some video game makes my temples throb.) I am captivated by his beauty and ability to move me in one of his roles. I'm so glad he's continuing to make more movies!

Hmm, were all his falls scripted? Well, those who attended the Charity Charades a while back reported that he nearly tripped leaping over the rope to jump into the ring, so perhaps not! I don't really know. He certainly seems graceful to me. I imagine him doing goofy stunts that might make him fall down (such as trying to jump a rope), but not just walking and falling down, which Frodo seemed to excel at. *hugs the dear little mite*

Happy Birthday, Pelagia! Ylla and I are looking forward to meeting you on the 20th!

In both our opinions, Elijah did the stunts himself. He does so much of this leaping around, falling down, big spills, etc. that it just has to be a talent of his. It's ironic that people who don't think the matter through think he must be clumsy (or in the case of Frodo, "delicate"). :p You have to be pretty talented to pull off a prat fall. (Reveals secret crush on Dick Van Dyke when based on when he tripped over the ottoman in his TV show.)

Well, one piece has received frame-by-frame research analysis, with (as far as I could tell) only one moment that was possibly not Elijah:
Foot Chase from Chain of Fools (http://www.frodolivesin.us/ejw/id45.htm).

IMVHO, it's a talent. He gets in a couple of good pratfalls in All I Want, too. One of them--when he's rushing out to try to keep his furniture from being destroyed--looks an awful lot like that chase in Chain of Fools).

There are some places in LotR where, IMHO, it's amazing that Frodo doesn't fall down--the most noticeable one when he quickly backs away from Aragorn at Amon Hen. If that had been me, I'd have gone head over heels off the side of the hill :rolleyes: . There are some others in Shelob's lair--where it must have been hard for Elijah to keep on his feet, but he does. He tries so many different things that I'm sure there's an occasional unintentional slip (whether any of them end up on screen, I don't know), but I think most of them are planned.

----On the gay relationship issue, there was at least one occasion when Dom definitely "led them on." IIRC, he was being interviewed at one of the premieres, and IIRC again, it was with a reporter who'd bought into the rumors. These days, IMVHO the idea of them keeping it secret so it wouldn't "ruin their careers" is pretty ridiculous. Being gay doesn't seem to stop other actors from working. I think the "history" of Ellen Degeneres says a lot about where the public is regarding entertainers' sexual proclivities. When she was "coming out," she got pretty strident about it, and it seemed that everything she did had to somehow be related to being gay, and I think a lot of people just got tired of it. But now her talk show is at the top of a heavily competitive field, where very few shows even survive. She gets good guests, and people watch and enjoy the show. I really think it's a case of, "We like you! You're funny! The fact that you're lesbian doesn't keep us from having a warm spot in our hearts for you! We just don't like getting hit over the head with your sexuality every time we watch you!" And, really, I think that would be true with heterosexual entertainers, too.


In other news, I will only add my voice to what Honeyelf began and others seconded: I don't like speculation on Elijah's sexuality, and I don't like pictures where spies have caught him doing totally normal things (shopping, standing on a street corner, etc.). Yes, I see them, because people post them on LJ where I hang out, but when I realize I'm looking at spy pics I leave. It feels creepy to me, like I'm a peeping tom.
I think I've asked this before, but... is this something that basically happens only online? Does it make it out into the "real world"? I just never see or hear anything like it on entertainment-related TV shows or magazines (and I do keep an eye out for Elijah-related news). Is that just because Elijah's not a big enough star for the media to be all that concerned about? Or is it something that's kept alive only by a few online flakes? ---- I do think that some people tend to have a fascination with celebrities doing "normal things," even more than they would with celebrities doing "celebrity things."

I think I've asked this before, but... is this something that basically happens only online? Does it make it out into the "real world"? I just never see or hear anything like it on entertainment-related TV shows or magazines (and I do keep an eye out for Elijah-related news). Is that just because Elijah's not a big enough star for the media to be all that concerned about? Or is it something that's kept alive only by a few online flakes? ---- I do think that some people tend to have a fascination with celebrities doing "normal things," even more than they would with celebrities doing "celebrity things."

It may be that by acting because he enjoys it, rather than from a need to be a 'star', he his just too normal for the general public to be interested in seeing him go about his daily life. With people like Joan Collins, who glam up incredibly to present their public persona, seeing them in a headscarf out shopping is quite a shock. I also don't think he is actually a big household name. Even people who aren't big film goers have heard of people like Tom Cruise because their films are on TV. I don't think any of Elijah's adult films (including LOTR)have reached the free channels in the UK yet, and I always find myself having to explain to people who he is.

With regard to his talent for pratfalls, do you think this also applies to earlier films such as the Good Son, where the trip doesn't seem necessary to the plot?

Dear Faculty-ites,

Flourish copied and pasted some of your recent discussions, since I still can’t open any of K-D’s site. *sniff* Since fixing it may take forever, I wanted to go on record to say that having finally finished Sean Astin’s book, I wanted to tone down my negative remarks made a few weeks back. I still think it poorly written and wonder why his editor or co-writer didn’t take more responsibility for shaping it up better, but, oh well.

NOTE: This is quite long, making up for all those posts I never posted *grin face.* It does make specific references to the book, which may constitute spoilers. I thank Flourish for copying and posting this into the thread, on my behalf. [note from Flourish: I had to break it into two posts--sorry for the apparent DP.]

My impressions changed as I progressed through the book, chronologically. At first, I thought it was simply because Sean was finally talking about his time on LotR. But then I scribbled on my notepad, “Sean’s book seems to be rising to the level of his content.” The extreme callowness I saw in the opening chapters seemed lessened in the later ones. The nadir, for me, of his self-presentation was in those chapters describing his early weeks on the job in New Zealand, in which he most revealed his near idol-worship of Peter Jackson -- and anyone else who seemed to exude power and command -- nearly salivating onto the page from the lust and need to have these things himself (approximately, chapters 6-10). Sean’s envy and jealousy, impatience and sheer foolishness; his sheer obtuseness about the possibility that others might not think along the same driven lines as he, all were most forcefully on view here. That was the point in my reading at which I wrote that derogatory post.

But by the time he got to chapter 11, I thought I heard Sean speaking much more about his fellow artists with true appreciation and not just wound-licking, self-comparing anguish. It was obvious to me that he admired Elijah, but not only Elijah. He says very complimentary things about many of the actors. Not too much, in terms of acting, about Elijah, but I’ll get to that later.

The most happy Sean ever seemed in this book, was in the material in ch. 14. He could say, as he did on p. 226 of the very happy group dinner at a nice restaurant, “See, we’re all just colleagues after all; they really do care about me and want to spend time with me.” He tells there what he really cares about -- being valued as an artist and cared for as a person. “I remember feeling like my value as an actor was perceived as important that night,” he says on the same page. Back on p. 57, he had stated that first, he was an actor, “acting is my craft, my profession, and my passion.” Would that he could hold onto that thought more often. As to being valued as a person, a passage that stood out for me was on the next page, in which he tells about how, after getting the wound in his foot in the near-drowning scene, Peter presented him with a Maori walking stick from the crew, because Sean came back to work right away. “I have to tell you, when Peter handed me that stick, I felt like the king of New Zealand. It was one of the best moments of the entire production.”

That Sean felt valued personally is implied throughout, by the fidelity of the other actors shown towards him in spite of his difficulties as a personality. He noted on p. 242, that he normally needed reams of positive feedback to feel good about himself as an actor during the shoot, but that on a production of this scale, in which he was not a star, he had to learn to do without it, or try to. I see this as very typical-actor stuff. Even that he was disappointed in his relationship with Jackson, however unrealistically (p. 226), “It wasn’t Peter’s job to be my friend or mentor, even if that’s what I wanted,” I see that as a common, normal sentiment. Everyone wants their boss/teacher whom they admire to think well of them, to think them special, etc. In spite of having to live without as much attention from the director as he wanted, I think it sounds like Sean, the actor and friend, was truly satisfied, working and living in the company of Elijah, Billy and Viggo, etc.

BUT, Sean seemed continually to make himself miserable over all the other bull ****, all that stuff about being the best and biggest and the most successful -- and “why didn’t I make this business move,” or, “why didn’t I grab that opportunity,” and not some other? I am talking about all that desired and driven-ness that comes out in his obsessing over whether he'll ever get to be that millionaire artist-industrialist he has set up as a golden idol for himself. This intense, almost erotic desire seems to have been what made him continually unhappy – with himself and with his lot, making him difficult for others to tolerate. At least, when he was in the throes of it. Who wants to be the “friend and mentor” to someone so driven by what is necessarily an opportunistic obsession?

I think all of you have noted that Sean, although he speaks very highly of Elijah Wood throughout, doesn’t say much about EW’s acting gifts, while he does regarding Sir Ian, Viggo, Billy, Dom, Bernard and especially Andy (whose sheer determination and zeal he greatly admired and would like to emulate, esp. toward becoming the next “artist-industrialist”). I don't think this should be interpreted as a slighting of EW as an actor in Sean's eyes. I think that this is because, what Sean admires most about Elijah, is something that hasn't anything directly to do with his acting, but which Sean sees as uniquely pronounced in EW.

Many of you have noted this in EW; I am going to call this quality or attribute, “detachment,” or equanimity.” Some of you have related this to EW’s perceived humility; others, to his self-confidence. Sean points with admiration (and envy), to EW’s “poise,” his unflappable-ness in the midst of apparent chaos, criticises Elijah's blitheness towards physical dangers with a reluctant admiration he cannot hide -- although EW is not described as a “dare devil,” like Orlando. Then, there is the “self-confidence.” Elijah could “slack” on the repeated preliminary takes (p. 220), when he felt it was necessary to preserve his energy so he could pour it on later, no matter how that might look on set. He really seemed to know what he was capable of, and could, prudently, marshal his reserves accordingly, without sweating over the decision to do so. For he could tap those reserves, when it was called for. On p. 273, Sean tells how when it came time to do the actual filming of the Osgiliath sequence and Sam’s “Great tales” speech in TTT, which he had been panting and thrilled to do, he came up dry. Somehow, it wasn’t clicking for him; they did twenty-five takes. And E.W. was fully invested in every take as Sean struggled. Sean wrote,

"When we finally finished, Elijah gave me a hug and said, “That was hard, wasn’t it But he was so patient. It was a strong Sam moment, and I needed his help and inspiration to get through it."

Now if that isn’t high professional, as well as personal, praise and appreciation of his co-actor, I don’t know what it.

But in everything, by comparison with Elijah (and the rest of them, though to a much lesser degree), Sean sounds like a person of extremes. Elijah seems able to proceed from a core of moderation; Sean sounds almost like a manic-depressive type; experiencing alternating fits of manic effort and periods of inertia. These would be mirrored in/exacerbated by Seans' body-image. Feeling fired up = working out and dieting. Feeling uninspired = not working out and eating whatever he wanted -- both of them, in an obsessive-compulsive manner. Buff = valuable. Fat = worthless. No wonder he made such a big deal over those 30 pounds! He's just an all-American citizen, in the end.

From this book and elsewhere, Elijah Wood the actor seems NOT to be an obsessive compulsive worker or person. He seems, in fact, to have an air of what Frodo the character will be sent to Tol Eressëa to acquire, post-Ring tainting. I mean, EW seems, already, at such a young age, to have a lively sense of himself, “within the greater scheme of things,” wherever he is, “of both his smallness and his greatness.” So, he can be described as both very humble and very self-confident, at the same time. He seems ready for anything – almost heedless -- yet is somehow still moderate: reliable and dependable in the eyes of his friends and employers/directors. He’s open, telling the most outrageous stuff on himself—almost flamboyantly so; yet he seems essentially private, keeping back what truly matters to him. With all the stuff unbosomed in interviews about peeing off fountains, stopping off for porn and chocolates and getting his testicles checked, he manages yet to seem an essentially modest person. He really does seem to possess and undue degree of “perspective,” “detachment,” and “equanimity,” which makes him seem very in touch with reality.

Sean, however, seems to have tremendous trouble with perspective, detachment and equanimity. “As was often the case, Elijah’s grasp on objectivity was superior to mine,” Sean wrote on p. 283. No kidding. Sean sees himself as either too great or too little – which is out of touch with reality -- or, at least, with his relation to it. I hurt for Sean as I read along, deeper and deeper into his telling, as I experience with him his extreme hunger and thirst for all the things he desires, most of which seem ultimately unfruitful for him and/or unattainable. It makes the times when he messes up all the worse, because he allows it all to hit him so hard (e.g. the Time interview mess-up, the revealing of the tattoo mess-up, etc.).

Perhaps because of our recent election, I finished Sean’s book by seeing him as an archetypically American character, one which F. Scott Fitzgerald could have written. Raised and fed, culturally and perhaps at home, with the typical extreme dream of American self-actualization, his perspective seems to exemplify that hard-core, raise-yourself-up-by-my-bootstraps imperative. Like so many of us here, he seems to try to approach living in the world as he were in a big superstore, in which all the consumers race to get the most and best, all out to grab up everything they can get -- or be thought slackers, or worse, fools if we do not. Here Sean is, panting and dying for a big-winner’s share of “The Best,” and “The Most,” racing up and down the aisles with his perfectly good but modest cart, heaping it full of junk food and half-price stuff all jumbled in with the good, agonizing over his choices, but driven to race on, all the while jealously eyeing the “Titans” he reveres, who don’t even push their own carts, but have staff to push their huge, gleaming carts. Sean keeps looking at theirs, full of all the priciest and most desirable things, racing, up and down the aisles, frantically trying to find the same stuff before it’s all taken.

And in the midst of it all, he is nagged by the sight of his co-star. His co-star doesn’t have a cart at all, only one of those little hand-baskets; just taking what he thinks he actually needs; reading the labels, perhaps changing his mind, putting this or that back, getting the smaller size; just strolling along -- and beating them all to the check-out stand, without rushing or grabbing at all. Sean can’t help but note and envy that fellow with just the simple hand-basket, who seems to end up with just what he needs though no more, with plenty of time left over to check everything out and even talk to other shoppers along the way. But he just can’t seem to believe that this approach would work for him. It’s -- it's un-American! So, he HAS throw himself into this rat-race, he feels BOUND to do it -- to try and be like the big-time shoppers he so admires and envies, or – he fears – there will be nothing left, or not enough, for him to "win." Then he will be the worst of American sinners: a Loser, a Failure. And, perhaps, according to his own fears, the very worst sort of American Loser/Failure: a Fat one.

How did Elijah Wood escape this cultural attitude so well? Home schooling? *winky face*

First of all, my apologies to Kumari for not wishing you a happy birthday on time. And a belated welcome to ceefour. There was so much going on in the Lounge while I was away that I missed some of the most important happenings!

Interesting items about the LotR costumes, ceefour. I wondered how they managed to make the Elven cloaks seem to have so many textures. I’m always amazed when I read about the care and attention to detail that were lavished on the costumes – even on layers we never saw.

whiteling: I’m sorry to hear about your father. My father died four years ago, so I know it’s hard. The fact that he went peacefully is a comfort.

Moondancer: What an adorable “babylij” picture! Where is that from?

Blossom: Your “Tonight Show” sequence is a riot! He is such a foxy little guy, isn’t he? Someone could maybe write an analysis comparing this with the “circus parade” scene in Avalon (tg???).

serena: The picture you posted is another of my favorites from Sean’s book. Definitely the cutest geekboy out there.

tgshaw: Quite a candle! – thank you. I’ve been working my way through your “Shelob’s lair” screencaps (page 9 is my favorite, although I ran into the Dreaded Red Xs before the end; will have to look at it at the office).

honeyelf, kumari: You both went in more for the “broody” look. More evidence of The Lad’s wide range!

And thanks to everyone else for the birthday wishes. It made up for my having to WORK (insert yucky face here) part of today (at home, at least).

On the subject of Elijah and stunts: I noticed that Sean repeatedly talks about how he (EW) would fling himself into stunts without any apparent thought for his own safety. And I remember that in the Premiere interview last December (“Four Hobbits Walk into a Bar,” I think it was called), the writer described him as “fearless,” whether hurling himself into stunts or into highly emotional scenes. Sean says at one point:

If a scene called for a stunt, the crew would wrap something around Elijah’s leg and use a cherry picker to haul him up into the sky. . . .
I was wondering whether that was a reference to the “Watcher in the Water” scene, where Frodo is being dangled upside down by one leg. I’ve practically stood on my head trying to see whether that’s really Elijah, or a double, or some CGI thing. The way his free leg kicks out perpendicularly to his body at one point certainly LOOKS like an Elijah move. (Can we use the term “Elijahnastics,” perhaps?? Or “Lijnastics”?)

Regarding Elijah’s personal life: I’m just so impressed by the grace with which he seems to handle all the intrusion and gossip and speculation. Remember that incident at a press conference in Karlovy Vary last summer, when some fans handed him an envelope containing what turned out to be (apparently) a piece of LotR “slash” art? They had written something like “Sit down before you open this” on the outside. Elijah being Elijah, he opened it on the spot, and then proceeded not only to laugh about it, but also to tell the crowd about it.

As for the whole completely bizarre DL/BEI furore, there’s a website called “Sanity Please” that describes the evolution of the tale, and fact-checks (and demolishes) all the weird claims about massive New Line conspiracies and payoffs, shout-outs, color-coding, etc. They also have links to some essays and articles about the psychology behind fandom and delusions. (Confession: After reading something in Entertainment Weekly about how Datalounge's Gossip forum features "more speculation about the personal life of Elijah Wood than is healthy or sane," I took a look at it. Hey, I was a new fan, and desperate for any information I could find! I kept seeing references to some past controversy, and subsequently was led to the "Sanity Please" site.)

Mechtild (sorry -- I originally credited this to Flourish): Your post about Sean's book just came up. I agree with most of what you say; and I love your "superstore" metaphor. (Would like to comment more, but have to run!)

Whiteling- I am glad the DVD works, I was a bit worried about it. I will be recording Oliver Twist on RTL, so if you need it, I can do that for you.

"Oliver Twist" is one of the Elijah movies that I lack by now. What a nice offer, thank you :) !

Could any Native German speakers explain to me how they put over the Cockney(London) accent when it is dubbed in German. Do they pick the accent of a particular German town, or simply not bother going into such detail.

Mostly such details are ignored. Sometimes they try to find an equivalent German accent, but this is often quite ridiculous - I'm trying to imagine the Artful Dodger speaking Bavarian... :eek: --- the mind boggles... :rolleyes:

Great stuff from you Mechtild, as usual! Miss you. Why can't you come visit us "in person?" I'll just echo Pelagia, by saying I loved the shopping cart metaphor!

Wendy, glad you're back too. Ain't human nature a funny thing? The "watching the train-wreck" phenomenon is one I don't understand, but I fall prey to it often enough.

I think I've asked this before, but... is this something that basically happens only online? Does it make it out into the "real world"? I just never see or hear anything like it on entertainment-related TV shows or magazines (and I do keep an eye out for Elijah-related news). Is that just because Elijah's not a big enough star for the media to be all that concerned about? Or is it something that's kept alive only by a few online flakes? ---- I do think that some people tend to have a fascination with celebrities doing "normal things," even more than they would with celebrities doing "celebrity things."

TG, I was discussing all this with my husband (in very general terms.) I compared it to Abu Grahib, weirdly enough. You have a small, closed society where people get a strange mind-set about something. They re-inforce each others' bizarre ideas, and the more they re-inforce them, the more "correct" they seem. Soon they are participating in bizarrely inappopropriate behaviours, which they see as perfectly within their rights, and which they've justified until they no longer seem inappropriate. The thing about the internet though, is that these people are doing all of these things in a glass house. Any normal person speeding by on the internet suprer-highway can take a glimpse in. To those unitiated in the ways of these cliques of people, their ideas may briefly take on a shimmer of "truth."

I don't think I could bring myself to go to a convention type thing either, as I would find the fan/star meeting a bit embarrasing.

Skater Girl, I'll have to agree with you. I mentioned before that I'll be in the area of the ORC convention. For a few hours I actually contemplated buying a ticket for an autograph or photograph. But then I rememberd that interview once where EJW talked about his family trying to have a normal life in Cedar Rapids after he'd been acting for a bit; they eventually left, partly because he was constantly being invited to the parties of children he didn't really know, sort of as the "entertainment" or drawing point. I know it's part of his job, but it feels creepy, articficial. And somehow a little bit like pinning a butterfly to a board!

Skater Girl

The reality of a 23 year old, with a dress sense that does not match my own, who likes to drink and smoke and go to clubs till the early hour of the morning does not appeal to me in the least.

Well, I can sort of identify with the dress sense (just ask Flourish, Achila or Alyon! :D) But the drinking/smoking thing does turn me off. I adore those peaks at his humor that we see on talk-shows (Blossom's gif :D). I'm fascinated that someone who looks like that can be so geeky! And that "shopping basket" (Mech) philosophy he seems to exhibit draws me very much.

'nuff of honey! nattering on!

Brilliant analogy Mechtild...so well said
Welcome Ceefour....Happy Birthday Pelagia...as Achila said I am so looking forward to meeting you :cool:

Whiteling: .....My Most Heartfelt sympathy for your loss...and welcome back to your loving friends here! :k

This next bit is slightly off topic...but in actuality IS...because in a recent interview Elijah mentioned he was looking forward to seeing the movie "Birth"

Well I just returned from seeing this one..... :(
Wish I could say something...anything....positive about this film :eek:
One of the worst movies I've ever seen...nothing redeeming in this movie (IMHO)
The director seems to be a fan of looooong close-up shots of people's faces as they do absolutely nothing
No character development...no reason at all to care why or what happens to these people...just dreadful
I'm always drawn to this genre of movie...just to see how they carry it off...to see how believeable they can make the idea of re-incarnation work
Some movies work eg. "Audrey Rose" is one that comes to mind...this one doesn't work AT all. So save your money....I don't know about you...but I work too hard to waste my money on junk like this ;)

Be interested to see if anybody else thought this one was as BAD as I did.
Maybe I should have read a few reviews first...but then again I don't always agree with most critics :D

Goodness! Where to start?? (And I mean that in a good way! :) )

Honey, I think your points about small, closed societies are good ones. And if a "them" can be pointed to (New Line, for example), the ones who know the TRUTH will just become more sure of it.

If I had the chance to go to a con where Elijah was scheduled to be, and there was an autograph table, I wouldn't have any qualms at all about lining up at it. IMVHO, that's what they're there for--and, hopefully, to keep the autograph givers from being mobbed at other places. If he was having a question and answer session, I'd go to it. Don't know if I'd have the guts to ask a question, if the chance came up... But I do think that kind of thing, when the actor has agreed to do it, is exactly "part of the job," and not an encroachment on his personal life.

And, yes, the "cherry picker" example is from the Watcher in the Water scene. That is Elijah up there--at least most of the time (maybe all of it). The account at the time--which might have been from Sean--was that Elijah was always ready to go right back up again for the next take. What I haven't quite been able to tell is whether he has his hobbit feet on at the time :p .

One that sounds almost worse to me is the scene where he's wrapped up mummy-style in Shelob's webbing, when Sam thinks Frodo is dead. Besides having to lie there without blinking or twitching (I'd never make it as an actor :o ), he'd be wrapped up in that stuff for an hour at a time--then they'd take it off him, then wrap him back up again.

Interesting story from Mechtild about the scene with Sam's speech in Osgiliath. That really is an emotional scene for Frodo, one where he's in that tears-almost-but-not-quite-falling-from-his-eyes state throughout. Sean does seem to appreciate Elijah's effort at throwing himself into each take there, especially since he realized that Elijah would usually "pace himself" emotionally during early takes. That's an intriguing little item in itself, if you try to reconcile it with Elijah's acting being more natural than consciously thought out. We do know that in the Wheel of Fire scene PJ kept urging him to "go deeper" in subsequent takes (meaning deeper into Frodo, not deeper into himself), so he does seem to have different levels of becoming the character. Maybe that would be worth a question at a Q&A session ;) . 'Course, we also know he can "disappear into the character" immediately--the "one-take" scene from Huck Finn gets pretty emotional, too.

-----------

from Pelagia:
Interesting items about the LotR costumes, ceefour. I wondered how they managed to make the Elven cloaks seem to have so many textures. I’m always amazed when I read about the care and attention to detail that were lavished on the costumes – even on layers we never saw.
With Ngila's comments about the "special weave" I kept thinking about the different scales they used on the costumes, even in things like stitch length and weave size, so that the costumes of the scale doubles would "match" the main actors'.

Blossom: Your “Tonight Show” sequence is a riot! He is such a foxy little guy, isn’t he? Someone could maybe write an analysis comparing this with the “circus parade” scene in Avalon (tg???).
Or how about comparing it to Michael's little dance in the school hallway? :D

On the "Dreaded Red Xs" (Why does that always make me think of The Princess Bride :p ?) -- At times over the last few weeks, some of those pics were very possibly actually missing from the page. All the pieces of the site are successfully published now, so hitting the refresh button will often give the reluctant pics a second chance to open (I have dial-up at home, too :rolleyes: .)

-------------

Flourish, thanks for posting Mechtild's thoughts (do you know what the problem is with her getting into KD?). The analogy of the "Great American Shopping Cart Race" is a good one--there used to be an actual game show that was like that; can't remember the name of it now.

Someone said earlier that we look at things through an "Elijah filter," and I think that's true in more ways than one. Not only do we compare everyone to him, but we're something of a "self-selected" group to begin with. Everyone here has some kind of affinity for Elijah Wood. Most of us resonate more with Frodo than with traditional action heroes. I'd guess that more than half of us appreciate a lot of Tolkien's values and view of the world. And, to be honest, all of those sentiments tend to be somewhat countercultural, at least in the United States. As a group, we probably wouldn't pick Donald Trump as the person we'd most like to be--just the ads for The Apprentice turn my stomach (but you never hear his admirers called "Donald Trump geeks"). That's certainly going to affect the way we look at someone who does try to "chase" the American dream and who has a good bit of ambition, competitive drive and ego.

tg, I am not sure exactly what the technical problem is that Mech is having, but I don't think she would mind if I answered your question more accurately by quoting from an e-mail she sent me a couple of days ago.

this evening I called up our ISP and spoke to someone more willing to go through it all with me, now that it's been over four days of no K-D access. Coaching me, he had me "ping" K-D, entering their IP address number ... which DIDN't WORK!!! It was blocked somehow. Then, with him, we ran a tracer on the block, but that was blocked, too. He was mystified, since he could find nothing amiss at our end, nothing amiss with K-D itself, nor with his end, the ISP. He had me give him all the info. and said he would have to take the problem to the lead team there.

He said he suspected it was a "Domain name server issue," whatever that is.

I think she's calling the ISP guy back tomorrow as he never did get back to her. She simply hasn't been able to reach the K-D site, alone among all the websites she frequents, and even the restarting of all the threads hasn't helped solve her problem. It's really mystifying.

Honey, I think you have a wonderful fashion sense! :)

I think I'm really talked out about Elijah and Frodo, which is why I've been lurking so much (and RL has been in the mix as well). But just to add something on-topic here, tg, you probably meant to say this in your post--the funny thing about the scene of Frodo wrapped up in Shelob's webbing stuff was that Elijah said somewhere how much he LIKED filming that. :confused: I guess that can-do spirit is one of the things Peter Jackson divined in him way back at the beginning of the process.

I find it funny that Elijah leaping over the person in "Chain of Fools" looks like Casey flying through the bleachers in the gym in "The Faculty." :lol:

This next bit is slightly off topic...but in actuality IS...because in a recent interview Elijah mentioned he was looking forward to seeing the movie "Birth"

Well I just returned from seeing this one..... :(
Wish I could say something...anything....positive about this film :eek:
One of the worst movies I've ever seen...nothing redeeming in this movie (IMHO)

Oh Dear!! I have promised to go to this with a friend this week, and I wasn't too sure about it in the first place. I find Nicole Kidman hard to get along with since seeing in a 'making off' documentary for Portrait of a Lady just how hard she has to work to get into character. What I see now when I watch her films are finely tuned performances by Nicole Kidman, rather than her becoming a character.

But I do think that kind of thing, when the actor has agreed to do it, is exactly "part of the job," and not an encroachment on his personal life.

My own problem with this situation is not that it encroaches on his public life, I agree with you that it is better than him being mobbed in the street. I personally just can't shake off the feeling that behind the polite, friendly face, there is the real person, that I of course will never know, lumping me into the general bracket 'fan', and thinking 'what a saddo, idolising an image of me enough to pay for an autograph'. The reality is that to some 'stars', we fans are merely food for their ego's, to others at the other end of the spectrum we are a necessary evil of the job. I don't actually think that Elijah falls into either of these extremes, but I still wouldn't want to meet him in such an uneven situation, where I am just yet another fan.

The question and answer session are a different matter. Obviously there are going to be questions that are really cringe worthy and make the asker look rather silly, but there is the opportunity for a more balanced meeting between person with experience and person interested in hearing about this experience. Most people like to talk about what interests them, and it must make a nice change for actors to be questioned by people really interested in their work, as opposed to journalists just doing their job during press junkets.

Skatergirl, thank you for bringing up the subject of what has been going on lately at A&F. I was really quite disturbed by the whole thing, and I really wanted to hear what the people here at K-D would have to say about it.

It also made me wonder if comment boxes are somehow exempt from the netiquette that normally governs forums and is preserved by purposely chosen people. I give you Efan as an example, where the Forums are moderated with great care, whereas the comments box is a cesspit for all kinds of OT rubbbish, people posing as Elijah, gossip and bad language. :confused:

I personally just can't shake off the feeling that behind the polite, friendly face, there is the real person, that I of course will never know, lumping me into the general bracket 'fan', and thinking 'what a saddo, idolising an image of me enough to pay for an autograph'.
That's where Elijah's "previous life" as a fan himself makes a difference to me. He's collected action figures. He's bought t-shirts. He's stood in line for the better part of a day to get into a midnight movie showing. He's been excited about getting to meet some of his favorite musicians. He knows what it's like to be a fan and, even though he can't do it in the same way now that he's become more well known, I think he still understands it.

On the "other side of the table," it doesn't bother me to be seen as a generic "fan." Partly because I do think Elijah understands what it's like. Partly because, well, that's what I am--but that doesn't mean I'm nothing.

This may sound like a weird comparison, but to the clerk at the Walgreen's store I'm a generic customer. I'm sure she's a nice person privately, but that's not the reason she's there helping me find what I'm looking for or checking a sale price if it doesn't match what rings up on the cash register. She's at the store doing that because it makes it possible for her to get a paycheck. She appeciates the fact that if no one shopped at that store, she wouldn't have a job. And, on the "other side of the counter," I know that, too. That doesn't give me the right to be overly demanding, expect more than any other customer would expect, or ask about her love life, but it does give me the right to have my Walgreen's-specific wants and needs met politely--as long as I'm polite on my end--and to be treated with respect (and even thanked for shopping there).

A number of times, I've told a clerk or wait-person (or, better yet, their manager) that I come to their store or restaurant because the staff is so polite and helpful. I usually get something like, "Wow! Thanks." In the same way, if someone waiting for an autograph tells Elijah, "I've bought all of your movies," or "I went to see Return of the King in the theater five times because your acting was so amazing in it," he really should say, "Wow! Thanks." (Which seems to be what he usually says :p .) And I can thank him for giving me some good movie-watching experiences by putting as much of himself into his acting as he does.

I don't want it to sound as if it's completely economic. It's pretty easy to tell if someone's gritting their teeth behind a pasted-on smile because they've been told to be nice to the customers or they'll be fired. And there are times I could save a few cents by going to a store where the service is crummy and the clerks are surly, but I'll go to the "friendly" store anyway because it's just more pleasant and enjoyable and makes my day a bit brighter. I've been on the other side enough to know that if I return the favor, it can brighten the day of the person helping me. I don't see it as asking for a relationship that isn't there, but an acknowledgement--on both sides--of a relationship that is there. And even those of us who'll never meet Elijah can look at the way he treats the fans who do line up for those autographs and realize that he appreciates us.

(And isn't it kind of "against the rules" to charge for autographs unless it's a charity event?)

-------------

And ceefour, you sneaky thing ;) ;) ;) . Delurking just in time for your birthday! [You know I'm kidding, right?]

Hope it's a great one :) :k . I'll offer you a glass of wine as soon as Jones figures out how to open the bottle :p .

http://www.imagemagician.com/images/tgshaw/off topic/capA2639-85.jpg

A little musical entertainment while we're waiting:

http://www.imagemagician.com/images/tgshaw/CoE/41-Todd.jpg

(Geesh, I can't believe I let the thread get five pages long without a picture of Todd! :D )

Thank you, TG. I wasn't going to include my birthday in my user information (wasn't even going to post until my son made that remark), but then I thought maybe some pictures might be posted that I could gaze at--I mean study. P.S. I also share an your affinity for a certain dancer.

then I thought maybe some pictures might be posted that I could gaze at
Fantastic excuse!


Happy birthday, Ceefour!
http://a.madboot.com/Oh_Baby.jpg


Whiteling,
I found that great picture through google. Just type in Elijah Wood, click on 'images' (don't remember what page but you'll find it).


I don't know why, but I don't have the habit of going to signing sessions. Probably because the people I would like to see rarely come to Belgium (pfff...they don't know what they're missing ;) )




Btw: another episode in the sad tale of Moondancer's Idol obsession: (OK...it's not an obsession yet...not that I think so...I hope I got it under control :z: ;) )
My favorite set the place on fire (where's the bouncing smilie when you need it....http://smile.smilies.nl/1729.gif ). It wasn't easy because he has laryngitis and the doctor advised him against signing. It gave his voice a raw edge and he compensated the lack of high notes with some sexy dance moves and a raw and angry sounding voice...perfect for the song
none of you is probably in the slightest bit interested in this. :) Sorry, my enthousiasm for certain things sometimes gets the better of me

Happy Birthday Ceefour :k



http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v480/ylla/1lotr8.jpg




This picture has absolutely No relevance to birthdays...But I Just happen to adore it :D

happy birthday ceefour!!!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v399/erendil/3133elijah53.jpg


And a belated happy birthday too you pelagia!!!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v399/erendil/2556Stone-Angel.jpg


this two pictures have nothing to do with birthdays either!!
but i think they are lovely,and i love birthdays becuse then i have a reson too post them!!!!! :p :D :k

Enjoy ladies!!

love/wood

...Dom met MsAllegro ( The owner of the Bag-end Inn website) once, at a convention, and he called her mad to her face... :lol: Go Dom! Oh my! IMGLO, the lads handled the whole issue beautifully - Dom stating with a straight face on one interview that he and EW were getting married - so straight, that anyone with half a brain knew that he was doing a major leg-pull.

I'm not sure I know what else to say.
I'd say you about nailed it. A beautifully stated summary!
It has nothing to do with what's going on in someone's life. It's an imbalance in the neurotransmitter chemicals in the brain. In some cases, there's probably a genetic element.
Oh, absolutely, hence Sean and his wife being concerned about the possiblity of bi-polar disorder in his own family (from his statements on 20/20).

They're finding now that similar neurotransmitter imbalances in the spinal cord (that and the brain make up the central nervous system) can be a cause of fibromyaligia. Really!?!? Maybe there's hope! I remember that "Chronic Fatique Syndrome" was widely dismissed as a made-up disease until the Epstein-Barr virus was discovered. Of course, allergies were too, as recently as 1954.

Like alcoholism--and fibromyaligia--depression can cause a lot of problems in someone's life. But it works that direction, not the other way around (problems in someone's life don't cause depression, or alcoholism, or fibromyalgia). If someone's sad or grieving about something that's normal to be sad or grieving about, that's not clinical depression--that's normal. The problem is that the whole thing can turn into a downward spiral very quickly, especially if there's some sort of physical thing attached. Depression leads to aggravation of the physical thing which leads to exacerbation of the depression which leads to... Put together Sean's family history, his public statements, 18 months of hobbit feet, and a 40 lb weight gain, and it doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that this not something that he can just brush off, but something that is very much a part of his life. Of course it would make it into a book about his experiences.

Like an alcoholic, someone who's been chronically depressed has to learn to recognize the thinking patterns that are part of the disease. Until then, it's a vicious circle. So people with depression have to learn to deal with their thought patterns in a way somewhat similar to what alcoholics need to do (a lot do use the Twelve Steps as an aid), but the thought patterns aren't the basis of either disease--they come from it.It takes an unbelievable level of vigilance to keep ahead of it, or to stop the cycle once it starts. It's frustrating, too, because a person spends so much time inside his head that he often loses even more perspective, plus it's very, very hard and time-consuming. It must have been a treat for Sean to be around and develop close friendships with people who probably had an entirely different take on things. Can you imagine, being saddled with Sean's history and thought patterns, working next to a sprite like Elijah for several years? It must have been *wonderful*! Sean's very analytical, from what I can tell from public statements, and he probably spent a lot of time inside his head analyzing Billeh's or Dominic's or Viggo's or Elijah's view of things, trying to shift around and in a sense look at a situation through their eyes, and just *learn* how someone else does things. The magnificence and redeeming quality of Sean is that he does not assume that his way of thinking and doing is normal and everyone else is whacked. I know enough people like that to see Sean as a breath of fresh air.

~grumpy

(btw and a mite off-topic - I've often wondered what went into the casting of Merry and Pippen - I think I got an answer while watching "Lost" on Sat. night. When Charlie was in the cave, and his face was all dirty, he smiled at Jack, and it was like a spotlight went on. Dominic can change his expression from thunder to sunshine in a blink, and I'm sure Peter J. picked up on that. It's nice to see that the Lost folks recognize it too.)

The magnificence and redeeming quality of Sean is that he does not assume that his way of thinking and doing is normal and everyone else is whacked. I know enough people like that to see Sean as a breath of fresh air.

ZK, that's the sweetest, most compassionate thing any of us has said about Sean! :k (((Grupmpy)))(((Sean)))
Happy Birthday, CeeFour!

to make up for the "broody" Picture I last posted:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/notbroody.jpg
And just for the comtemplation of a really fine nose (ever look around you at noses? :lol: )
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/nose.jpg
And this one because he seems very amused at us all! (And because the pics where he seems to be looking directly at you always give me a delicious shiver!)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/naughty.jpg

honey!
rethinkingrethinkingtheconvetionthingynosqueakybirkenstocksthough ;)

That's where Elijah's "previous life" as a fan himself makes a difference to me. He's collected action figures. He's bought t-shirts. He's stood in line for the better part of a day to get into a midnight movie showing. He's been excited about getting to meet some of his favorite musicians. He knows what it's like to be a fan and, even though he can't do it in the same way now that he's become more well known, I think he still understands it.

Tg- He still does all these things. Here's some very recent pics of him going for theater tickets all by himself just like the rest of us. Well, except for the photographer which is a whole other issue.

I'll just post the links to the pics because they are big...

http://elijahwoodnow.com/images/new/CB031104B_01.jpg

http://elijahwoodnow.com/images/new/CB031104B_02.jpg

http://elijahwoodnow.com/images/new/CB031104B_03.jpg


I get the impression that Elijah really understands how the fans feel since he is such a fan himself.

*Checks to make sure the new Faculty is up and running. Smiles to note it is. Raises eyebrows to note the number of posts in the new thread already!*

Oh, well. Even if I never do manage to catch up with this thread again, I am pleased to see it here and doing well.

Congratulations on the new thread - hope there are many more to come.

*Note: Sheryl - how are you saving those backup files? Do you have them some place online where they can be accessed?*

Ariel

ETA: My word, that's a nice suit in those pictures! The Lad looks all grown up. :::: sniffle :::: Nice shirt and tie, too. Quite the gentleman, isn't he? :::: bursting with surrogate-aunt pride :::: ;) :D ;) :D

It became quite noticable and amusing to me how many times Elijah gets to trip/slip/slide in his films. Was it always scripted??? :D
I'm sure we all noticed through extensive study (for scholastic research, of course ;) ;) ) that during the credits of the SNL show he took a spill on the ice. The camera only caught him when he was already sliding around on his stomach and then got up. I was *astounded* - I suspect that, possibly because of his movie work, he's learned to just totally collapse when he's falling, which would prevent injury. A person who would stiffen up or try to prevent the fall would land awkwardly, and probably break something. When he got up, which was very fast, I had the impression that in a sense it just wasn't that far to the ground, the way he handled it. He seems to have incredible control and know what's going to happen in that kind of fall. I've forgotten what it's like to be young and limber and not terrified of falling. Cool.

It is also amazing how many treehouses he got to go in. From his early films, you could end up thinking every American kid has a treehouse. I believe it's a law in several states. We didn't have a treehouse, but we built a small wooden "shack" in the backyard, had a really cool spooky old cellar to play in, and a big climbable spruce tree right on the property line. :)

Not to keep the rumormongoring discussion going longer than it should, but I read a great deal over the weekend a scam perpetrated in LotR fandom. I gathered that at least one of scammers was responsible for a great deal of the rumors, since so many of them were similar to other speculation I've seen. I wouldn't be surprised if that tied in somehow with what others have said.

And no, I certainly wouldn't put it past either of the lads to pull the fan's collective leg in that way. It would by hysterically funny, watching the fans scramble. Up to a point, that is. Even a good joke gets old, and like the usually-patient Mr. Wood filing a restraining order against a fan, I doubt if either EW or DM would have any compunctions about having a C&D order issued or having their representatives intervene to shut certain forums down. ISP's don't like misbehavior; brings up all kinds of unpleasant things like Communications Deceny legislation. So if people are overstepping the bounds, I suspect that a company would take steps if asked.

Me? I try to never put anything online that couldn't be read by my grandmother. ;)

~grumpy

grumpy, do youknow were i can find this fall in SNL?
Is it some were on the net it can be found?

I haven`t seen that epidsode.I don`t know if it been showed
here yet or i just missed it!! :(

love/wood

While checking out links, I tried the one to the Everything Is Illuminated fansite and got a 404 page. Has it been moved? Or was I just having an "internet moment"? BTW, I actually finished that book this afternoon (having to sit at the computer without doing anything except move the mouse every once in awhile is a great time for reading ). There are a couple of things I'd like to discuss, and was hoping to do it at that site.

TG, what if we created a discussion group for EII in the Library? Is that an appropriate place to do so? I liked the book, but i'm still scratching my head over a lot of it, and would like to discuss it, too. Or on your website?

ETA: Have you seen this? http://channels.aimtoday.com/celebrity/hollywoodexclusive.jsp?column=/becksmith_jsp/content/hol20041105.htm
Oh, please no! :o Coincedentally, today I found that Rolling Stones article on my hard-drive and re-read it. Somebody give them a Bartlett's before they decide to "diffuse" some "great, great, very forceful" negative words! No, but hopefully they'll print things on their t-shirts which are socially responsible. I HOPE.
honey!

Hello, Ladies! Many thanks for the birthday pictures, Honeyelf,wood, ylla, and Moondancer. Just what I wanted. ;) After seeing the ticket buying pictures, I am trying to comprehend what it must be like to be followed by a photographer all the time;by viewing them (a pleasant pastime, I'll admit) do I condone it? I suffered through LOTR on the WB (lost sound, lost picture, endless commercials) because it was broadcast in High-Definition. The picture clarity and sharpness were truly amazing. The crewel work on Boromir's sleeves, the embroidery on Pippin's shirt front, Frodo's party vest... :rolleyes: Towards the end of the Council of Elrond, Frodo has two beads of perspiration glide slowly down his cheek. I thought to myself, "Well, Elijah Wood can weep in character. Maybe he can sweat in character, too." :D

Thanks, ceefour, for reminding me about the broadcast. I have a love/hate relationship with broadcast TV - it still has some magic over me that I do not understand. I haven't succumbed to TIVO like most of my friends, and I don't have cable or dish. But FotR (theatrical) is playing on the little TV that sits next to my computer RIGHT NOW!!!!! Oh, my, it is pretty! Grrr, commercial, just after Boromir threatens Frodo. Who cares about buffalo wings! I need to see Aragorn relinquish all claim to the ring, and Frodo weep... and it's not like I don't have the whole thing on my hard drive, and both the theatrical and extended DVDs close by.

Fellowship I saw 14 times in the theatre, and I almost always start crying whenever, where ever it's playing. I've absorbed it in ways TTT never grabbed me, and how I can only hope that RotK-SE will (50 added minutes!). I no longer remember how the process of the knowing the books affected me, I only know that LotR has been in my psyche for nearly 40 years.

Oh, and the cloth in the cloaks? I bought a shawl in that cloth and weave from the company that wove the cloaks, and it is incredible - it is just that light, floaty, and beautiful when you hold it in your hand, in the raw, undyed colors of the wool. I believe you can now purchase yardage from them.

Oh, Boromir! How many times have I seen him die, and I still cry!

Ahem.

chattegrise

What kind of T shirts do we mean? :eek: Are They going to be Tasteful, Child Friendly ones, or are They going to Adult ones that are funny, but equally gross that you usually find in bars or head shops? :eek:

They had better be the Former, or I'm going to be :mad:

hi to you all!!!

just wondering if there is a posibilety that i can change my name
from "wood" to something else`? and can i loog in with username and
password everytime i loog in here!!!`???

I have a very curiose and difficult hubby in this matter!!! :(

And if it is possible is there any suggestions for a good name!!
refering to my love for elijah!!?? :p :D :k :lol: ;) :) :rolleyes:


love you all/wood

Wood, you can change your name. Either I can change it for you, if you want to keep your post count and the picture by your name, or you can just register again with a new name if you want a totally fresh start.

As for not logging in automatically - there's a button on the top scroll bar at KD that says "log out". If you click on that, and then try to reply to a thread, it will ask you for your username and password. When it does that, there will be a little box below that asks if you want the site to remember your username and password. Make sure that little box is NOT checked, and then you will be required to sign in to post to the site.

No one is required to sign in to read this site, though, so if you're trying to avoid your hubby being able to see that you were here, you'll have to clear your history and cookies everytime you come here (let me know if you need help with that.) But if you just want to not have it automatically sign you in, so the site shows the "Welcome, wood" greeting at the top, the first set of instructions I gave you will be enough.

Thanks for your help Narya!! :k :k

If i can come up with a new name i will let you know and then maybe you can help me out!! :k :k

Love/Wood

Oh, chattegrise, you have given me a wonderful idea. Next year is a significant birthday for me. That shawl would make the perfect present. I have just 364 days to drop hints. C4

Hi, dear ladies!
You are so quick in writing interesting posts, that it's quite difficult to keep up with you! :) Nowadays I can visit KD only from my PC at work; In my country there were 3 days holidays, so I stayed at home - and now I find here almost 3 new pages to read!
-------
(((Whiteling))).
I'm sorry to hear about your father. :( This is a very painful loss.
------

I'm reading with interest you discussion about Sean's book. I didn't read it yet and after knowing your opinions I'm not sure that I really want to buy it, the more so this is not so easy to order it for Russia... Well, no, this is easy to order, but not easy to get. ;) I ordered "Radio Flyer" at Amazon already long time ago, and the date of its' delivery estimate is over, but I still waiting the DVD... :( And some movies that are only second-hand at Amazon, can't be send to Russia at all! Imagine? Because of it I couldn't get "Paradise"... :(

But back to the Sean's book topic. Somehow the things you say about Sean and the "demons" of his ( big ego, his ambitions and jealousy, his obsession and so on) strangely do not surprise me. I confess that I never liked Sean so much - both as an actor (among the 4 hobbits he's a "weak chain" for me, while he has his superb acting moments in LOTR movies.) and as a person, too. After watching him in LOTR documentaries, I thought that he's too full of himself and in many things too "sam-ish" in bad meaning of it. But anyway, this is his life. If Sean thinks that publishing the book of this kind is a profitable bis for thim, well, this is his free choice.

Mechtild, your post abour Sean (I mean 'Great American Shopping Cart Race') was very interesting for me, helped to understand some things.

My 5 cents to the funny stories about EW eyes.
It seems to me, a lot of people all over the world after LOTR movies asked the same strange questions about EW eyes. At my 3d watching of FOTR in the Moscow cinema I was acompanied by my friend. He never saw EW before and his first quiestion after the movie was: 'This fellow who playes Frodo... did they do some CG on his eyes' - to enlarge them and to make them more impressive? He was really surprised when I said 'no' - and these are EW's "real" eyes! ;)

About 'adrogynous' look of Frodo in the movie...
Well, interesting definition, IMHO, a good one. EW is 'mannish' enough in RL and in other his movies, this is only a characteristic of his Frodo. IMHO, it was a good choice, that Frodo wasn't ...how to say..extremely masculine in the movie. I love this. In fact, a sex of Frodo character in not so important for LOTR story, especially because this male character has to act in the story inside the archetype scheme that is closer to traditional female's one. I mean that for reaching his goal Frodo needs not an 'active', 'agressive' masculine heroism of sword and charge, but the 'feminine', 'passive' type of it - of patience, fortitude, quiet inner resistance of soul... We spoke about it already in the past here.

And I love this kind of strange and shimmering non-sexual beauty of his in LOTR. I remember that a year ago I was surprised, when I read in some ROTK review that EW's Frodo in 3d LOTR movie 'looks like diminutive Uma Turman'. Some days ago I finally watched 'To Kill Bill' (IMHO, disgusting, meaningless movie, I'm angry that I lost my time watching it!) and know now what did they mean saying this. But now I also have to say that your LOTR 'diminutive Uma Turman' is much more beatiful than real Uma! :D

At the same time I stoped to read those stupid gay rumours about LOTR cast and personally EW already long time ago. I was shocked when I found this king of mangering for the first time and now I try to avoid any places in the net when these silly obsessed folk create and discuss there topics...
-------
tgshow,
your explanation about the natural reasons for chronicall depressions was interesting. I heard the same from doctors here. The fact is that I have this problem myself, so I had to learn something about depression to understand how to fight with this problem. zkgrumpy is right - this is very difficult to stop the next attack of depressions at the very beginning, but you have to, other wise, if you give it a chance to capture you, it will be very difficult to get out of this condition... Because of it I don't like early spring - the time of year when depression usually attacks me in the strongest way, the difficultest season to cope with it...... sometimes I sadly laught at myself -I - LOTR and Frodo lover for the most part of my life - have my own personal March illness... :)
-----------------
Happy birthday to all lagies, whose B-days I missed! :k

I guess I have to relinquish my UFO club membership. :( I didn't watch FoTR on the TV when I had the chance. Knew there would have been all the commercial breaks for one thing. For another, I would have had to get around the smirking/gaping face of my husband, who would be telling me most reasonably that I have it on DVD... :rolleyes:

Rikka
Because of it I don't like early spring - the time of year when depression usually attacks me in the strongest way, the difficultest season to cope with it...... sometimes I sadly laught at myself -I - LOTR and Frodo lover for the most part of my life - have my own personal March illness...
For me the sad time fall/winter, when it gets dark so early. Lack of daylight, I suppose. And, as you predicted Achila, it's even worse at the moment since I've quit my job. I've plenty to do without it; it's just gettin' myself off my tail to do it! :rolleyes:

Just a quick heads up for anyone lurking in Belgium and the Netherlands...

"The Yank" (http://us.imdb.com/title/tt0385002/releaseinfo)

How much are we all waiting for the news about this film coming to the U.S. and the UK ??

CeeFour, and Chattegrise,
Hi and welcome to Our Lounge...hope you post often and enjoy your visits...

I suffered through LOTR on the WB (lost sound, lost picture, endless commercials) because it was broadcast in High-Definition.

I have a love/hate relationship with broadcast TV - it still has some magic over me that I do not understand. I haven't succumbed to TIVO like most of my friends, and I don't have cable or dish. But FotR (theatrical) is playing on the little TV that sits next to my computer RIGHT NOW!!!!! Oh, my, it is pretty! Grrr, commercial, just after Boromir threatens Frodo. Who cares about buffalo wings! I need to see Aragorn relinquish all claim to the ring, and Frodo weep...

What you all need is our very own BBC....no ads at all !! :D :D :D
Pretty good since these days we have to pay for satellite and cable film-channels anyway, so the £100 or so Annual Licence fee seems good value all of a sudden !!

Or FilmFour at Channel 4...only ads during the spaces between the films...what Bliss !!!

Well, no, this is easy to order, but not easy to get.
I just had to :D at this--a very good description of what happens sometimes in the U.S., too (Child in the Night, Bumblebee).

...in many things too "sam-ish" in bad meaning of it.
Interesting point--Tolkien says that one of Sam's faults was being cocksure and self-satisfied: "...a mental myopia which is proud of itself" and "...a readiness to measure and sum up all things from a limited experience..." I don't mean this to be specifically "Sam bashing"--a Tolkienian character without any faults wouldn't be very believable and certainly not well-drawn. The tragedy of this particular fault in Sam is that it shapes his attitude toward Gollum. -- But it does bring up a mental "checklist" of actors that PJ seemed to match up with their roles. (For example, Billy saying that he couldn't imagine anything he'd rather be doing than playing Pippin--I'd suspect a lot of actors would have preferred a bigger part if given the choice, but he had such an affinity for the character.)

It seems to me, a lot of people all over the world after LOTR movies asked the same strange questions about EW eyes. At my 3d watching of FOTR in the Moscow cinema I was acompanied by my friend. He never saw EW before and his first quiestion after the movie was: 'This fellow who playes Frodo... did they do some CG on his eyes' - to enlarge them and to make them more impressive? He was really surprised when I said 'no' - and these are EW's "real" eyes!
Was it Bridget Chubb who said a friend of hers was quite "huffy" about it, saying that if they had to do CGI to Elijah's eyes (which in her mind they obviously had ;) ), they should have just hired someone who could act :p ? It's also a question Sean has said he's had posed to him quite often by fans.

...especially because this male character has to act in the story inside the archetype scheme that is closer to traditional female's one. I mean that for reaching his goal Frodo needs not an 'active', 'agressive' masculine heroism of sword and charge, but the 'feminine', 'passive' type of it - of patience, fortitude, quiet inner resistance of soul... We spoke about it already in the past here.
Yes, IMHO this is one area where the movies kept close to the spirit of the book. I think many of Tolkien's "heroes" are quite in touch with their feminine side, even some that we would see as more traditional hero-types (Aragorn and Faramir, for example).

...zkgrumpy is right - this is very difficult to stop the next attack of depressions at the very beginning, but you have to, other wise, if you give it a chance to capture you, it will be very difficult to get out of this condition... Because of it I don't like early spring - the time of year when depression usually attacks me in the strongest way, the difficultest season to cope with it...... sometimes I sadly laught at myself -I - LOTR and Frodo lover for the most part of my life - have my own personal March illness... :)
Some people think that's odd--they think the effect of the lack of sunlight should be at its height in December and early January, when the days are shortest--not realizing that it's a cumulative effect of the excess melatonin building up during the shorter days of the year so that late February and March are really the "killers." I'd never thought of connecting it with Frodo, though :) ; that's kind of a nice idea.

I've had a special light therapy lamp for a number of years (brand suggested by my doctor). I just got it out of storage for this year and it wouldn't "light" so I figured it needed new bulbs (which are also of a special kind, so have to be ordered). But after trying that, I'm afraid I have to admit it's the lamp itself that's not working. I've had it so long that I can't really complain, but it's another $200 I have to think about spending :rolleyes: . (Hmmm... if I waited til January and had my doctor write a prescription for a new one, I could put it against next year's deductible, but I'm not sure I want to wait that long.)

Of course, when I become independently wealthy ;) I plan to solve this part of the problem by living in North America for half of the year and in New Zealand for the other half, so that it's always summer :) .

But, yes, getting to know your own body well enough so that you catch the early signs is important. One of mine, for example, is when eating becomes "too much trouble"--I know I can't just give in to that, although it would be easier, but have to have some healthy meals on hand that I only need to heat up, or things will just keep going downhill.

But my first "early warning device" is the body aches. Per zkg's question, I'm not at all surprised that research is indicating a connection between depression and fibromyalgia. The hardest part of depression for me to manage isn't the emotional side but the physical: the "hurting all over" body aches and the fatigue. (And by that I mean "manage" mostly in the medical sense; they're very resistant to treatment, at least for me.)

[ETA: Maybe we need a discussion board for this topic. (See below.)]

---------------

from ceefour:
Towards the end of the Council of Elrond, Frodo has two beads of perspiration glide slowly down his cheek. I thought to myself, "Well, Elijah Wood can weep in character. Maybe he can sweat in character, too."
Hey, I wouldn't put it past him at all. :p That's what the "microexpression" and "How does he do it?" fields of research are basically about--his being able to do things in character that aren't (or aren't supposed to be :confused: ) under a person's conscious control.

TG, what if we created a discussion group for EII in the Library? Is that an appropriate place to do so? I liked the book, but i'm still scratching my head over a lot of it, and would like to discuss it, too. Or on your website?
The Library would be a good place. Or, we could "take over" The One Thread guest book on my website at http://www.frodolivesin.us/Pics , since nothing's been posted there for several days (but that's been Frodo-related since it started, so it might be best to keep it that way).

My webhost does have an option for a free discussion board that's (supposedly :rolleyes: ) easy to set up, and I confess I do get tempted. But I don't know if there's need for it, and, as I said to someone with the same webhost, IMHO one of the loneliest things to see is a discussion board where no one posts :( . Although, logically, it wouldn't really hurt anything to have a discussion board sitting there unused for much of the time. I've brought up the idea here before and haven't gotten much reaction, but it always remains a possibility. As with everything on my site, I wouldn't see it in any way as a replacement for The Faculty Lounge :eek: but just an additional "research aid" if, say, some wanted to get into a more involved discussion about something than would fit in here.


from wood:
I haven`t seen that epidsode.I don`t know if it been showed
here yet or i just missed it!!
Elijah's only been on the one episode of Saturday Night Live--the one that aired last December (13th--no, I didn't have to look it up; isn't that pitiful ;) ?). The fall is after the show itself is over and they're showing the cast skating during the closing credits.

As far as the fall, we do know he planned once to play in a charity hockey game, although the idea was mysteriously nixed. If he's had any hockey experience at all, I'd think he'd have learned the best way to fall on ice without getting hurt. Of course, he seems to have learned that about every other kind of surface, too ;) . Trying to remember from ESOTSM, since I don't have the DVD yet--does he fall on the ice when he's on the river with Clementine, or does he just slip around a lot (again, something that would probably be harder to act than would either walking steadily or falling down).

ETA: For some reason it strikes me as pretty funny that there's an ad for "colored contact lenses" on the IMDb page for The Yank. (And, in case anyone didn't notice, on this thread in the last day or so we've gone through ads for "natural remedies" for chronic fatigue syndrome and treatment for alcoholism.)

Just a quick heads up for anyone lurking in Belgium and the Netherlands...

"The Yank" (http://us.imdb.com/title/tt0385002/releaseinfo)


Belgium: 2 march 2005
:) :) :)
http://smile.smilies.nl/488.gif

I thought the premiere was in The Netherlands but this date is before Holland?
Are we getting the premiere? Surely not. Impossible.

The Library would be a good place. Or, we could "take over" The One Thread guest book on my website at http://www.frodolivesin.us/Pics , since nothing's been posted there for several days (but that's been Frodo-related since it started, so it might be best to keep it that way).

I've taken the liberty of starting a new discussion thread in the Library. It's here:
Everything will be Illuminated Herein! (http://www.khazaddum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3187)

Everyone interested in discussing this complex book, you are welcome to join us there! :)

honey!

As far as the fall, we do know he planned once to play in a charity hockey game, although the idea was mysteriously nixed.


Yep -- don't know what happened with that -- that was during a time that he cancelled quite a few engagements, leading to a whole host of very humorous and creative theories on just where the One Lad was.


If he's had any hockey experience at all, I'd think he'd have learned the best way to fall on ice without getting hurt.

He also had some figure skating lessons and I would bet they teach you that your first day.

So many birthdays!

Welcome, and Happy Belated Birthday to Ceefour!

Someone's happy to see you!

http://www.elijahfan.com/gallery/gal/Magazines/Roadshow_2/roadshow2-027.jpg


Kumari

It's hopeless. I'll never catch up. Gabby wimmin! ;) :D

I missed the K-D Crash and its immediate aftermath last week, as well as a lot of RL goings on (for which I am grateful :rolleyes: ).

Sooo....Hello to new members, Happy Birthday to everyone who's had one recently, and thanks to all for the always interesting discussion and news. There, that about covers it all. :D

ETA:
(And, in case anyone didn't notice, on this thread in the last day or so we've gone through ads for "natural remedies" for chronic fatigue syndrome and treatment for alcoholism.)
:lol: Yes, I did! Big Brother, or at least Ad bots, are watching us! ::: cackling evilly :::

I thought what Tolkein said about Samwise is interesting. I suspect that LotR resonated so strongly with so many people because the characters are so flawed - even our beloved Frodo, though he is indeed the Bestest of Hobbits, and that's sayin' a lot! :)

ETA: Have you seen this? http://channels.aimtoday.com/celebrity/hollywoodexclusive.jsp?column=/becksmith_jsp/content/hol20041105.htm


Awwwwwww....isn't that just so cute? The guys still hang out together! I have a feeling that during DM's dry spell after LotR, he just kind of got stuck; now that he's working, I suspect that we'll start seeing Billy and Dom scripts here and there over the next few years.

And speaking of the Fellowship, did anyone else notice Dominic's Elvish tatoo on his upper arm just below his shoulder in his LOST episode?

Oh, please no! :o Coincedentally, today I found that Rolling Stones article on my hard-drive and re-read it. Somebody give them a Bartlett's before they decide to "diffuse" some "great, great, very forceful" negative words! No, but hopefully they'll print things on their t-shirts which are socially responsible. I HOPE.
honey!
:::: giggle :::: I suspect that the longevity of their line of t-shirts will be directly proportional to the sales. With those two, who knows *what* will end up on the shirts?!?

~grumpy (here's to seeing Elijah's Elvish tattoo in future productions...)(I did *NOT* say that! :eek: :eek: )

I did NOT say this either, i have a wish to
see elijah`s tatoo too!!!! :p :D :eek:

I think its great that they still are friends!!! :k

love/wood

ETA:
:And speaking of the Fellowship, did anyone else notice Dominic's Elvish tatoo on his upper arm just below his shoulder in his LOST episode?

**points to sig** That one isn't his Elvish tattoo, actually - it says "Living is easy with eyes closed", and I'm sure it's not a real tatto, but there because it matches the character he plays. (I don't think they'd let his elvish tattoo be seen during the filming of LOST.) I seem to remember DM showing his Elvish tattoo on a show once, and it was on his ankle - I'm pretty sure Billy Boyd's is on his ankle, too.

**tries not to think about Elijah's tattoo, gets back to work**

**points to sig** That one isn't his Elvish tattoo, actually - it says "Living is easy with eyes closed", and I'm sure it's not a real tatto, but there because it matches the character he plays. (I don't think they'd let his elvish tattoo be seen during the filming of LOST.)


Actually, it is real, according to my friends who are big DM fans. Dom's been wanting a Beatles lyric tattoo for some time, and it looks fresh because it is. What was seen WAS Dom's Fellowship tattoo, on the other shoulder.


I seem to remember DM showing his Elvish tattoo on a show once, and it was on his ankle - I'm pretty sure Billy Boyd's is on his ankle, too.

**tries not to think about Elijah's tattoo, gets back to work**


Dom's is definitely on his shoulder -- I think it's Sean Astin who has it on the ankle.

**points to sig** That one isn't his Elvish tattoo, actually - it says "Living is easy with eyes closed", and I'm sure it's not a real tatto, but there because it matches the character he plays. (I don't think they'd let his elvish tattoo be seen during the filming of LOST.) I seem to remember DM showing his Elvish tattoo on a show once, and it was on his ankle - I'm pretty sure Billy Boyd's is on his ankle, too.



Actually, you can see Dom's elvish tattoo quite clearly (and frequently) on his right shoulder, and the tattoo on his left shoulder is real, a quote from "Strawberry Fields Forever", written by his favourite Beatle. :)

EDIT: Whoops! We simlul-posted, Achila. :D

What was seen WAS Dom's Fellowship tattoo, on the other shoulder.


Cool. :) I'm obviously not as up to date on my info on the other hobbits. ;) Something about a Frodo / Elijah obsession. :D

Well Narya!!!

I can tell you that you are not alone!!! ;)
At least i have only eyes for one hobbit(THE ONE WITH BIG BLUE EYES :cool: ) :D :p

love/wood

Actually, it is real, according to my friends who are big DM fans. Dom's been wanting a Beatles lyric tattoo for some time, and it looks fresh because it is. What was seen WAS Dom's Fellowship tattoo, on the other shoulder. Neener neener neeeeeee-ner!!! :haha: See? Toldjaso! :p

I slo-mo'd it past several times to make sure; it's a pretty distinctive tattoo. Didn't notice the other one.

And why shouldn't they show Dom's Fellowship tattoo, if they could have a white moth fluttering by to point the way to iminent salvation? ;) (I kept waiting for the boy soprano) The LOST producers are well aware that a huge part of their audience consists of LotR fans tuning in on Wed. night to see Dom, and I know they've seen the reaction to Dom at publicity events. So why shouldn't they give a little "private" nod to the LotR fans in appreciation? They probably have marketing execs tracking the recognition of each LotR reference on the Internet. It's interesting how fandom (or is it geekdom?) kind of bleeds in and out of the fabric of entertainment. PJ put little things in the DVDs etc. for the fans, and even went to the TORN Oscar party in appreciation. He's moved the entertainment/fan interaction to a whole new level, IMGLO. I'm sure ABC isn't above following his example in some respects.

~grumpyandwishingthatwegottoseeTheOneLadeveryweeklikewedoDominic

grumpy!

itotallyagreewithyouonthelastmening

whycantweseetheoneladeverynight?

love/wood

Hello, Ladies! Thank you, Kumari. What a delightful surprise! I, too, have been very mindful of Dominic Monaghan's tatoo and find it somewhat distracting because then I start thinking about LOTR which leads to thoughts of another actor... :rolleyes: In another bit of trivia, the Korean couple never address each other by their first names; they call one another "Yobo." (Not sure of the spelling, but the o's are long o sounds.) It is considered disrespectful to call your spouse by their first name in Korean culture. C4.

This next bit is slightly off topic...but in actuality IS...because in a recent interview Elijah mentioned he was looking forward to seeing the movie "Birth"

Well I just returned from seeing this one..... :(
Wish I could say something...anything....positive about this film :eek:
One of the worst movies I've ever seen...nothing redeeming in this movie.

Be interested to see if anybody else thought this one was as BAD as I did.


I didn't enjoy this film at all, though I am open to being impressed with the young boy's performance, if I see him doing well in another different character in the future. It felt like it should have been one of those half hour 'Tale of the Unexpected' from the early 80s, not a full length film. Even the friend who dragged me to the cinema was disappointed.

My mind was drawn from the film by the fact that apart from us, there were just 2 others in the audience, both men on there own. 'Must be Nicole Kidman fans' I thought to myself at the beginning, but as the film went on I was became slightly worried that they could be paedophiles, there to salivate through the scenes where the young lad undresses. This brought to mind the following comments on IMDB about Elijah's film North. Another characteristic of this film I offer more by way of observation than criticism. James Kincaid in his book "Erotic innocence: the culture of child molesting" analyzes with particular insight how American cinema frequently appeals to its audience's repressed yet obsessive pedophilic interests. This is a tradition of long standing in our fair land, going back at least to Shirley Temple. While I do not recall whether Kincaid mentions "North" in his discussion, this film is a striking example in support of his argument. We are invited repeatedly to view both North and Winchell, his young adversary, as sex objects.

I personally couldn't see what this person was getting, though it did make me take a deep look at my own reasons for repeatedly watching Elijah's early films. This film Birth really could deserve such criticism though.

Re Elijah's stunt falls - He also had some figure skating lessons and I would bet they teach you that your first day.

In thirty years of having skating lessons, no one ever taught me how to fall. They teach you how to get up though. Even if you are told to relax or whatever, it happens too fast and when you least expect it, and in my experience there are people like Elijah who just 'go with it' and don't get hurt unless they land in an unavoidably awkward position, and those who get hurt regularly. After a while, you just expect to fall, and it does put you in good stead for the rare occasions when you might fall elsewhere. I fell sideways, from standing and on to concrete, out of one of those picnic tables with attached benches, my arms full of coats, and I actually remember just letting myself go and thinking 'oh well, I can't stop this happening, bet there'll be some major damage here'. Everyone, including me, was amazed that there was only a cut elbow.

I watched Oliver Twist dubbed for German TV, and they gave Elijah a deepish voice. It so didn't work for me, and somehow made him look even more wrong for the part of the Artful Dodger. For me it has to be his worst film.

Love those ad bots! :D Now we have two offers involving tattoos, and Elijah Wood for sale (well, not quite--but there are Elijah Wood handbag mirrors and Elijah Wood key ring/bottle openers). When I first got to this page there was an ad for Elvish wedding jewelry, but that's now turned into one for the trilogy boxed set (ho hum).

Lost is evidently a hot property. Amazon already has a page where you can sign up for email notification when the first season is released on DVD (along with their usual note that your signing up is also a "vote" for it to be made available, and they'll let the powers-that-be know how many people want it). Not bad for a show that's only a couple of months old. Thanks for the info on the tatoos and the Korean form of address. I don't get that much detail, since I'm watching it on a 13-inch TV with a fuzzy picture. Can't read the subtitles at all, so I've been having fun puzzling out what's going on with the Korean couple :p .

I have mixed feelings about EW having a regular TV stint. I think I'd rather have him doing movies, but if it were a high-quality show it might be all right (maybe they can use him as a guest star in someone's backstory on Lost ;) ). I liked Charley's backstory episode--fit Dom well, I thought, as he's good at showing both the character's "tough" side and his vulnerable side. (Speaking of which, the first season of Hetty Wainthropp is on DVD now :) , including that vulnerable juvenile delinquent ;) .)

Oh, ah, hmmm.... Elijah Wood thread, eh? I gave Amazon another "kick in the pants" on Chain of Fools now that the release has been announced. Interesting that they don't have a page to sign up for email notification for it, but when I did a search for "Chain of Fools" it came up with no matches but with "elijah wood" listed as a related search ;) . If that's all computerized, like most of their info, there must be people looking. If anyone wants to give them a nudge, do a search in DVDs for "Chain of Fools," and if it comes up with no matches they'll give you a comment box to tell them what you'd like to see available. And if the search doesn't come up empty, FES let us know! :z:

Skater girl--Interesting comment on boys as sex objects in North. I could possibly see it referring to some of the shots of North on the beach in Hawaii, but that's pretty tame--and I don't see why "repeatedly" would apply. But, good heavens, Winchell?? :confused:

from zkgrumpy
PJ put little things in the DVDs etc. for the fans, and even went to the TORN Oscar party in appreciation. He's moved the entertainment/fan interaction to a whole new level, IMGLO.
Definitely--even during the making of the movies, which I don't think had been done before. Enough stuff was legitimately released to fan websites that when two pics were leaked and NewLine asked the sites to take them down, they did, immediately and with no complaints. Comes of having someone at the helm who's also a fan, IMHO; there was a feeling of partnership in the whole thing. And they did, actually, keep an eye on comment boards; we've taken credit for deep-sixing Xenarwin fighting at Helm's Deep (noticed that a form of her has turned up in the latest computer game--it's not Liv's face, but it's definitely Arwen's sword).


--------ETA: Now all four of our ads are for tattoo offers or supplies. Wonder if the fact I keep clicking on them has anything to do with that :p ?

I just had to :D at this--a very good description of what happens sometimes in the U.S., too (Child in the Night, Bumblebee).

Oh, really? So Amazon play tricks not only with us, poor Russians! :D
Well, this time my Amazon affair had the happy end! Today my long wait was over -I finally got my 'Radio Flyer' DVD ! Strangely it has not only English, but Japan subtitles, too... sadly no Russian ones! ;) But thanks to my teachers at school, English subtitles will be enough for me to understand the movie. I intend to watch 'Radio Flyer' for the first time on this week-end and after I will tell what I think about the movie and EW in it. But recalling discussions on this movie at Faculty, I think I will like it. I love this kind of psychological dramas.


Interesting point--Tolkien says that one of Sam's faults was being cocksure and self-satisfied: "...a mental myopia which is proud of itself" and "...a readiness to measure and sum up all things from a limited experience..." I don't mean this to be specifically "Sam bashing"--a Tolkienian character without any faults wouldn't be very believable and certainly not well-drawn.
I've read these Tolkien letters and notes about Sam many years after my first reading of the book. But I must admit my personal perception of this character was very close to this definition. I respected Sam for his outstanding loyalty and hope, but never really liked him with all my heart - definitely because of these qualities Tolkien mentioned in his note. And I agree that there is no any kind of 'bashing' in it - just the reality, truth of life. All of us have our pluses and minuses. Sam seems so real because he's not ideal.


Yes, IMHO this is one area where the movies kept close to the spirit of the book. I think many of Tolkien's "heroes" are quite in touch with their feminine side, even some that we would see as more traditional hero-types (Aragorn and Faramir, for example).

Right you are. I agree with you, especially about Faramir.

Good morning -- thought you'd like to see these -- they are from Index Magazine (Nov/Dec 04 issue) and were posted on lj by primula_baggins (sorry for not giving you credit, Prim, if you're out there).


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v236/aquila0212/Index-Mag-Nov-Dec-2004-N3.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v236/aquila0212/Index-Mag-Nov-Dec-2004-K2.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v236/aquila0212/Index-Mag-Nov-Dec-2004-A2.jpg

An interesting comment -- the photographer said that Lijh's glasses magnified 5x, and that he had to wear his contacts to be able to function.

Good morning -- thought you'd like to see these -- they are from Index Magazine (Nov/Dec 04 issue)

An interesting comment -- the photographer said that Lijh's glasses magnified 5x, and that he had to wear his contacts to be able to function.


WOOW! Thanks, Achila. Such interesting pics! They really look like old photos ! Very stylish.
"Wrong" glasses... he-he...I know what it means - to wear it :) .

Blossom: Your “Tonight Show” sequence is a riot!

It's all down to The One Lad, Pelagia. :)

He is such a foxy little guy, isn’t he? Someone could maybe write an analysis comparing this with the "circus parade” scene in Avalon (tg???).

I made a clip of the circus scene from my VHS TV-taped copy of 'Avalon,' but I'm having trouble making a gif from it. I'll have to break it down into sections, I think. I love that sequence. He's so natural.


Or how about comparing it to Michael's little dance in the school hallway?

Since you mentioned it, Tg...

Mikey's little dance (http://www.imagemagician.com/images/blossom/Dance.gif)

... and I couldn't resist sharing this one:

Mikey lights up! (http://www.imagemagician.com/images/blossom/Light-up.gif)

Happy belated birthday to you, ceefour. Here's a little something anyway:

http://www.imagemagician.com/images/blossom/WhenWeTwoParted.jpg

Sorry I missed it.

Nice to see you both again, Goldie and Bunnie.

Glad you're back with us, Lady Wendy.

Great EII pics, Achila. Thanks.

A lovely present, Blossom; thank you very much! My children gave me a ROTK lunchbox, complete with thermos. "The next time you work during the day, Mom, you can take your lunch in it." Not sure if I want my co-workers to know what a geek I am! I remember renting "Avalon" when it was released on VHS and liking it and thinkng the little boy in it was absolutely adorable. Who knew? (Well, except for tg.) When it was broadcast on my local UPN station last month I was able to catch about the last hour or so. The scene that really caught my attention was in the basement of the new store when the cousins blew up the model airplane and debris in the basement started to burn. The other little boy acted scared, but Elijah Wood looked scared.
P.S. No tatoos visible last night, so was able to remain focused on the story. Until the peanut butter... ;) C4.

Achila, :cool: pictures! 5x strength glasses, I get headachy and nauseous just thinkin' about it!

CeeFour, ROTK lunchbox???? I loooove lunch boxes! must hunt that down. :cool:

honey!

Well, well, look'ee here. I can look at this thread again, and all the K-D threads. I don't have contacts; it must be my 5X glasses! Nope, it turned out to be nothing more than a need to re-boot the router. A week without K-D for that! It was like kicking the TV set -- my kind of repair.

I've enjoyed catching up on the discussions, but saw only one thing that I felt required a comment from me in particular.

Tg wrote,

Interesting story from Mechtild about the scene with Sam's speech in Osgiliath. That really is an emotional scene for Frodo, one where he's in that tears-almost-but-not-quite-falling-from-his-eyes state throughout. Sean does seem to appreciate Elijah's effort at throwing himself into each take there, especially since he realized that Elijah would usually "pace himself" emotionally during early takes. That's an intriguing little item in itself, if you try to reconcile it with Elijah's acting being more natural than consciously thought out. We do know that in the Wheel of Fire scene PJ kept urging him to "go deeper" in subsequent takes (meaning deeper into Frodo, not deeper into himself), so he does seem to have different levels of becoming the character. Maybe that would be worth a question at a Q&A session . 'Course, we also know he can "disappear into the character" immediately--the "one-take" scene from Huck Finn gets pretty emotional, too.
At first, I was going to say, we don't really know if or to what degree Elijah paced himself (or, "slacked," as Sean said of the both of them) -- since we are reading it in Sean's book. But I do remember Andy Serkis telling of how frustrated, and angry, he was, because Sean and Elijah tended to hold back during their passes with him, "saving" themselves for the pass without him, that was supposed to be the one they'd use in the end (though, it was said that P.J. often preferred the reference pass and had the CGI team erase Andy from the frames, to keep those takes). So, it probably is true. However, it sounds as though the twenty-five takes Elijah did with Sean for the Osgiliath sequence were, all of them, cranked up all the way, to get Sean through it.

But what you said was intriguing; can an actor be said to be so natural in the way he just "becomes" a character, if he also, consciously, is able to "pace" himself?

Perhaps, the pacing isn't consicous, though. I may be imagining it to have been said in an interview, but I thought I remembered the two, Elijah and Sean, being taken aback by Andy's complaint that they weren't going all out, in their takes with him, which would imply they hadn't been aware they were husbanding their energy in that way.

Also, what was being "paced" or "slacked" on, might not have been the portrayal itself, but the energy, fueling the portrayal. Elijah could have "been" Frodo, while pacing himself in terms of energy, but the result would have been a less fired-up, involved Frodo. It might be like looking at an image in the photo program, on the monitor. Whether I adjust the contrast and exposure to be brighter or dimmer, I still am seeing the same image.

Andy's complaint wasn't that they weren't in character enough, but they weren't -- as their characters -- invested enough in the scenes they were playing with him; their characters were not at the intensity levels the particular scene demanded.

Or something like that. :rolleyes:

~ think I'll go check out the Harem, now. It's been ages! Mechtild

WELCOME BACK MECHTILD!!!!

GOOD TO "SEE" YOU AGAIN!!!!! :k :k

LOVE/WOOD

Thank you for the "Welcome back," wood. Have you decided on a new name, yet?

Hobmom, I just tried looking for your screencaps -- I had saved the links into my "Favourites," but they are gone. Are they at another site, now? I'd love to be able to look at them again.

grumpy wrote:

(here's to seeing Elijah's Elvish tattoo in future productions...)(I did *NOT* say that! )
Why wait for future productions?


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v382/mechtild/Elijah-NINE.jpg

~ Mechtild

My photo site is having technical difficulties. It will be back up very soon.

I thought about the director on the set of "The War" that said things like Elijah Wood was singular in talent, intellegence, and professionalism, and that there was no one like him.

Did he mean of All the actors even Adults in general, or did he mean among the other kid actors? :confused:

It sounded strange, but wasn't it like watching an Old Man all most, like he was born Middle Aged or something? :D

I find the idea SO hilarious. How about You out there?

And wha twas meant about his hair in that film? It was said that if he had Huck Finn's hairdo in that film, Elijah would make the camera explode by his sheer beauty? Is this to suggest Stu wasn't beautiful already? I just didn't get that. If Stu had Huck's hairdo, he would have looked like a Real Wimp, not the Manly Man he would become Right? :D

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v377/honeyelf/umbrella.bmp
Look at his fingers! Looks like he quit the nibbling habit! :)

Look between his fingres. Wish he'd quit that habit, too. :(

You think Liev Schreiber added those (awful) glasses because he intended JSF to be a contrast to Grandpa Alex, "the one who thinks he is blind?" JSF is wide-eyed and seeking. Grandpa Alex chooses not to see. Oops, I should be asking that in the Everything will be Illuminated Herein (http://www.khazaddum.com/forums/showthread.php?p=265005#post265005) thread. :D

honey!

ETA: post 300! :cool:

Hi everyone:

I'm glad I found you again. I had actually seen the forum change and thought I had re-subscribed to this new faculty, but somehow the problems KD has been having, coupled with my own computer problems, kicked me out of the loop. (Are you familiar with the plot line of T-3? I'm starting to think Skynet is taking over, with all the computer problems sites and my own friends have been having). It's been nice to catch up on EW news again, and be around people who can talk about EW without immediately jumping to the conclusion that he is gay :rolleyes: (as if any of us should be concerned about that, anyhoo. I mean, really, all the contact we will have with Wood in our lives in through his films and possibly a brief fan meeting).

I've also linked to the EII thread--thanks for starting that one.

I'll be lurking, but not posting too much. I'm trying to really put my own writing into top gear now, so I don't have too much time to play. I'm a bit under the weather today, so I'm taking the time off, feeling too drugged to write (I also have laryngitis--fate worse than death for me!)

Glad to be listening in to your posts again, ladies!

BTW--Hobmom mentioned she might be considering going to the ORC meeting in January. I've been toying with the idea myself (my husband owes me one since he took a golfing trip to Scotland last June). Anyone have any thoughts on that? Is anyone else thinking of going? Has anyone been to something like that and found it worthwhile, or not? I don't even post on TORN, just here and TORC, so I wouldn't be a real part of their community, but it might be nice to get Wood and others autographs and even a brief meeting.

Hmmmm...let me know your thoughts.

Thinking about going to ORC? Yes! Able to go? No! Sigh. :(

I just came BACK from Pasadena, so I'm afraid there's no chance of my going either. My sister was making plans to go to California but I was unable to persuade her to wait for the TORn event (me? living vicariously? Why no!). She's going next week. :(

No ORC for me, sadly. I too just returned from vacation.

but but but...ORC is in January! I'm thinkin' of going, as is a friend from the north, I hope?? ;) It would be a great moot! I'd love to see you two again, Flourish and Achila. And it would be great to meet new friends, too, Ereshkigal!

honey!

I wish i coulde go with you Honey!!
But it so far away!! Its the other side of the sea! :( :(
But if i coulde i do it in the name of love!!! :z:
I so want to see him in real life but i guess that wont happend
and if it does happend i probebly will faint and all the love i have
will be written in my forhead!!!! :rolleyes:
Swoon me?? nah not at all!!!! :p :D :cool:

Well, i will pray :z: that you come there and that you get some great company
from here! I am sure there is some one who is going!!
And i hope you guyes are showing us some great photos
when you are back!!!

Well i will stop rumbeling now!!

love/wood

Aw, Honey...... :k I'm going to be very jealous, you know. But the next long trip I take won't be for a while, and I was actually thinking Alaska...

Please DO take pictures, you lucky thing! :z:

but but but...ORC is in January! I'm thinkin' of going, as is a friend from the north, I hope?? ;) It would be a great moot! I'd love to see you two again, Flourish and Achila. And it would be great to meet new friends, too, Ereshkigal!

Yes, it would be great to see you again, but sadly, I'm unemployed and another expensive trip in the near future is just incomprehensible. *sobs*

Aw, Honey...... I'm going to be very jealous, you know.

And i hope you guyes are showing us some great photos when you are back!!!


Well, nothing definite yet. I'm still in the "thinking" stage. And the chickening-out-every-twentieth-breath-or-so stage, for that matter.

Flourish and Achila, guess what I just found in my too-many-durn-books-to-keep-track-of pile? A book called "Design for Life" with items from the Cooper-Hewitt National Design Museum! :cool:

Yes, it would be great to see you again, but sadly, I'm unemployed and another expensive trip in the near future is just incomprehensible. *sobs*

I'm sorry Achila. I'll send a few prayers up for you that the situation may soon resolve itself.

ETA: continuing in my Off-Topic mode :rolleyes: a really nice interview with Johnny Depp from NPR, in which he talks about acting HERE (http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4165508) He does a scottish accent for J.M. Barrie in "Finding Neverland." Swwwwooooonnnn! :D

honey!

Don’t have much to add to the ongoing conversation, but I’m enjoying reading it!

I don’t remember seeing anything about this on here: The Lord of the Rings Complete Visual Companion, by Jude Fisher, is now available. She did separate ones for each of the three films, but they were lacking some key pictures (I assume because New Line wanted to keep some stuff – what Shelob looks like, for instance – under wraps until the films were released). This one-volume version has some new illustrations, especially from RotK. Unfortunately, the quality of some of the pictures isn’t too sharp; and the fold-out pages (e.g., map of Middle-earth) that were in the original, separate volumes are not included. There is, however, a fine view of The Hands, in a shot looking down on Frodo as he’s climbing the stairs of Cirith Ungol.

I re-watched Avalon this week. I keep going back to this one because I just love everything about it, even apart from Elijah: the family relationships, the picture of a changing society, etc. Also, it's beautifully photographed. Even the burning of the store -- with the fireworks exploding overhead -- is beautiful.

And I’ve been noticing some of Elijah’s quieter line readings that are just wonderful. For instance, his muttered “Oh, now I’m going to be made an example of!” in the can/may scene. And the hopeless way he says, “How am I gonna tell him that?” when Sam says that he has to tell Jules about setting the fire. And his resigned “Lots,” when Jules asks him how many times he’s been told not to play with fire. Even at that age, he could be so subtle.

Achila and honeyelf – Thank you for the EII pix. Even those glasses can't spoil that face! And honey, I just got around to looking at the pictures you posted on 11-08. Yes, he does have a very nice nose. And that third picture – the one where he’s “looking directly at you” – if his PR people want to present a sexier side of EJW, THAT’s the way to go, rather than the wanna-be-sultry efforts.

BTW, Blossom: I've seen (online) a scene of Elijah on "The Tonight Show" where he's dancing around on stage, while Jay Leno stands in the background. Do you know whether the scene you posted (with him running down the hallway) the lead-in to that? Or were they from two different shows? EJW looks as if he's wearing the same outfit; but that doesn't necessarily mean anything. . . .

Pelagia, they are from the same show. ;)

The dog ate my homework.

:::: looking around ::::

Oh - sorry - saw all the - er - um - posts & thought that's what we were doing. ;) :p ;)

I had something deep and insightful to say...

Lesseee....

Oh, I remember! 5X lenses and dorky glasses frames cannot hide the classic lines of jaw and cheekbone. :) :)

I find it hard to believe that adult women would be watching Elijah's old movies out of some repressed child-molestation tendencies. I also disagree that everyone has those tendencies. It is possible to appreciate beauty and skill, even if the actor is a 10-year-old, without lusting after said 10-year-old. I think it's possible to watch movies of about any subject without necessarily having repressed tendencies. I'd bet a whole lot of ppl watched "Saving Private Ryan" last night without having sudden urges to storm the beaches of Normandy. I would hate to think that we must start self-examining our motives every time we watch a movie. I'm sure that there are pedophiles out there (sorry about the missing dipthong, there), but normal people can watch movies - well - normally.

Are we objectifying The One Lad? Possibly. Is he - um - er - sexy? Absolutely, in an adorable geekish way. From his photo shoots, he seems to be able to look as sexy as he wants. Are we reducing The One Lad to a mere object of sexual desire? No. That's for other forums. His Ladness is an artist of sufficient depth, skill, and complexity to provide discussion of his work, past and present, for a long time to come.


~grumpy (deep and insightful - right)(of course, then there's the cupcake-and-mouse picture, which defies logical explanation ;) )

Are we objectifying The One Lad? Possibly. Is he - um - er - sexy? Absolutely, in an adorable geekish way. From his photo shoots, he seems to be able to look as sexy as he wants. Are we reducing The One Lad to a mere object of sexual desire? No. That's for other forums. His Ladness is an artist of sufficient depth, skill, and complexity to provide discussion of his work, past and present, for a long time to come.

Objectifying Elijah?! Well, we could point to all the hundreds of years of men doing that to women, but we won't, because there's so much more to this than appreciating him for his beauty (which we, of course, do too). To be honest, if it weren't for his talent and adorable personality, he'd be naught but a pretty face, and I, for one, would not still be here. :) The fact that he's all these things is what makes him so desirable.

Flourish: Thanks for answering my question.

Achila wrote:

To be honest, if it weren't for his talent and adorable personality, he'd be naught but a pretty face, and I, for one, would not still be here.
Well said! Me neither!

On the subject of what makes Me think some one is appealing...or if I may say for want of a better word...Sexy

Talent....Wit....Generosity..Sensitivity.....a Gentle spirit ...a Playful nature...Charisma....Soulful eyes...A love for Family, Friends ...and Animals...an Ability to listen...an Ability to converse with Intelligence...a Good sense of Humor....and it's an extra bonus to have ALL That and look gorgeous to boot!!!
Anyone come to mind? ;)

Feel Free to Add On Extras....I'm Sure I could have expanded the List...but this is a Swoon Free Zone After ALL :D

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v480/ylla/37.jpg




Even wearing a silly hat and a Crappy Tan Jacket :haha:

This is it...

Chain of Fools available for pre-order on Amazon.com! Coming Feb. 15, 2005!

:lol:

Jeez...this place is busy.
Go away for a few days and you can't keep up when you come back.
:)

Ah well, I have nothing much to add anyway so I'll just enjoy what you all have to say.

Achila,
thanks for the pictures.
5xglasses+lenses! Ouch!
I always heard that putting on somebody else's glasses is not good for the eyes, so that can't have been good either.


Zkgrumpy
I'd bet a whole lot of ppl watched "Saving Private Ryan" last night without having sudden urges to storm the beaches of Normandy.
:lol:
Very well said, grumpy!

I agree with Achila on this one: if it was just a pretty face, I would have been bored talking about him a long time ago.

Honey,
I wish I could come but it's just a tiny bit too far with not just an ocean but also an entire continent to cross. Have a great time and do tell us about it, please.

ESOTSM is finally out in the theaters from this week on (I see the early release of The Yank over here as some sort of revenge... :rolleyes: ). The reviews here have been most excellent but the reviewers mostly talked about the main actors in it, saying for example that Jim Carrey is finally silencing his critics and really establishing himself as a very good actor.

tgshaw, I just found this (while re-reading this past week’s posts more carefully, now that I have some free time):

Everyone here has some kind of affinity for Elijah Wood. Most of us resonate more with Frodo than with traditional action heroes. I'd guess that more than half of us appreciate a lot of Tolkien's values and view of the world. And, to be honest, all of those sentiments tend to be somewhat countercultural, at least in the United States. As a group, we probably wouldn't pick Donald Trump as the person we'd most like to be.
There doesn’t seem to be much of an overt “counterculture” in the US nowadays, by comparison with the 1960s. And the “values” of materialism, ambition, aggressiveness, self-promotion, and self-interest seem more dominant today than at any other point in MY lifetime – maybe more than at any time since the “Gilded Age.” Certainly “patience, fortitude, quiet inner resistance of soul” (Rikka’s words) are not highly regarded by such a culture (to use the word very loosely). So Tolkien’s work is perhaps more important and more appealing than ever, to people who are uncomfortable with the prevailing beliefs. And Elijah also seems “countercultural” in the sense that he is so different from so many Hollywood standards: in his apparent attitudes and outlook, in his approach to his career (I keep expecting him to do a Depp and move to Europe one of these years), and even physically (small, not all muscled-up, not macho).

Rikka, you describe “Frolijah” so well:
this kind of strange and shimmering non-sexual beauty of his in LOTR

ylla: I think you’ve covered the ground pretty thoroughly, on the topic of

what makes Me think some one is appealing...or if I may say for want of a better word...Sexy
I’d just add, Not taking yourself too seriously (which probably goes along with “a Playful nature” and “a Good sense of Humor”). One of Elijah’s most attractive qualities, for me, is his apparent lack of pretentiousness. (Love the singing cowboys, BTW!)

Hi Faculty!
What a great community we are - thanks to Serena ( :k ) and Skater girl
( :k ) I finally had the pleasure of getting to know Elijah's portrayal of the Artful Dodger in Oliver Twist.

*possible Oliver Twist spoilers ahead*

I am not that familiar with other interpretations of this Dickens story, however, I recall to having had it on record when I was a child and I listened to it often and I loved the story dearly. I think, it was my first encounter with classic English literature. The more I was astonished that the movie left me quite unaffected. Where the heck was the stories' magic and the empathy with Oliver I knew from former times? Hubby fell almost asleep after the first third of the film and I cannot blame him for that. :rolleyes: Neither Richard Dreyfuss (has anyone seen his hilarious portrayal of a classic Freudian psychoanalyst in "What about Bob?"? Apart from the cheesy ending I love this film [probably I find it so funny because there are several headshrinkers in my circle of friends :p ], nor Elijah came across as really convincing in their parts. In fact, the word that comes to my mind regarding his performance is "uninspired". Sorry.
I hated Dreyfuss' German voice (obviously there is only one actor here dubbing all villains :confused: ) and, Skater girl has already mentioned it, Elijah's voice was far too deep and gruff. BTW, his German voice in "Chain of Fools" is almost perfectly fitting and very easy on the ears.
The little boy who played Oliver didn't make any impression on me, either. Anyone knows what happened to him after O.T.? Imdb has no further info.

Isn't it odd - I keep wondering what happened to the great story and how on earth a film with a quite big Elwood part can be so flat.

/Oliver Twist spoilers



Achila, thank you for the EII pictures! Those glasses! They must weigh tons! The night after seeing those pictures I dreamt of Elwood in this outfit and I must say, it was rather surreal :p ! Too bad I couldn't recall any details... :eek:


Honey, many thanks for the link to the Johnny Depp interview. This made me think of Elijah:
"... an actor owes it to himself to try different things each time out of the gate... You don't want to keep serving up the same dish. [The audience will] get sick of it."
Fingers crossed our Lad will get as much interesting parts as possible!

Wishing you all a nice weekend :) !

Considering that he has played a creepy little nerd, a soccer hooligan, a cannibalistic serial killer and a geeky American journalist since LOTR makes me feel like he is off to a good start, huh Whiteling?

I also found his performance in Oliver Twist uninspiring, but think that was true of the whole production as well. I hate to admit it, but I liked the musical version much better! And, as usual, the book is still the definitive one for me.

Tgshaw:
Everyone here has some kind of affinity for Elijah Wood. Most of us resonate more with Frodo than with traditional action heroes. I'd guess that more than half of us appreciate a lot of Tolkien's values and view of the world. And, to be honest, all of those sentiments tend to be somewhat countercultural, at least in the United States. As a group, we probably wouldn't pick Donald Trump as the person we'd most like to be.

Pelagia:
There doesn’t seem to be much of an overt “counterculture” in the US nowadays, by comparison with the 1960s. And the “values” of materialism, ambition, aggressiveness, self-promotion, and self-interest seem more dominant today than at any other point in MY lifetime – maybe more than at any time since the “Gilded Age.” Certainly “patience, fortitude, quiet inner resistance of soul” (Rikka’s words) are not highly regarded by such a culture (to use the word very loosely). So Tolkien’s work is perhaps more important and more appealing than ever, to people who are uncomfortable with the prevailing beliefs. And Elijah also seems “countercultural” in the sense that he is so different from so many Hollywood standards: in his apparent attitudes and outlook, in his approach to his career (I keep expecting him to do a Depp and move to Europe one of these years), and even physically (small, not all muscled-up, not macho).

Good points. I had meant to respond to Tgs comment from a few days ago. glad you pointed it up again, Pelagia.

The counterculture still has appeal in various areas and pockets of the U.S. population. Even among American youth--at least in some areas. I happen to live in a city with a lot of counterculture community. And my work community is totally countercultural. My daughter goes to a public school that is absolutely countercultural. (In how many schools in america can kids who are gay be as public about their partnerships as the straight kids? In her school, it's all cool). The kids still are attracted to the Beatles and some kind of wish they could have been back in the '60's. But still--since the media connections aren't readily there for them, you sometimes have to push the connection. LIke I tell them about the social impact of the Beatles (they get the feel of it from the music, but don't have the information about the extent of the cultural transformation)---and Frodo?? He gets a lot more cred it I tell them "It's a hippie thing!" :cool: ;) Sort of. You know, if I start going on about the hope of middle earth is in the hands of someone who doesn't lift a weapon to win his fight. These anti-war kids start to go, oh yeah. Now I get it. ;) . Often got to point it out to them, though. Of course, I'm willing to do that :) . I am desperately, trying to shape their tastes. Is this wrong??? :rolleyes: :) ;) (Luckily, my daugher needs no coaxing in this area).


Mechtild:

Also, what was being "paced" or "slacked" on, might not have been the portrayal itself, but the energy, fueling the portrayal. Elijah could have "been" Frodo, while pacing himself in terms of energy, but the result would have been a less fired-up, involved Frodo. It might be like looking at an image in the photo program, on the monitor. Whether I adjust the contrast and exposure to be brighter or dimmer, I still am seeing the same image.

Sean did say in his book that acting is HARD. It is hard work. I have helped in some taping of audtion scenes and if it goes on beyond a few takes, the actor can get very exhausted. Peter Jackson had the luxury of having a lot of film at his disposal (people doing low budget indies, for instance, have to really try to limit the takes as film is so expensive). Twentyfive takes (the example being the scene Sean talked about in Osgiliath at the end of TTT) of an emotion filled scene seems exhausting to me. Those guys are good. And professional to keep emoting for each one, having to think that each one might be the real take, so they can't let up. And both actors are in frame.

As to Andy's scene. If Sean and Elijah didn't think it was a "real" take--I think it's part of an actors job skill to save themselves. As practiced professionals, they know this. I was on a movie set once and watched the actors rehearse an emotional scene. The rehearsal was good--but once the camera was on--that's when they all really came to life. That's when it became intense for real. I heard one of the older actors, a very experienced professional, say "I always save my performance for the camera." And that is what they all did, essentially. It was an amazing transformation.

I know Sean talked about his best performances being off-camera--but he didn't mean the camera wasn't going. It was for when the shot was set for the other actor and Sean wanted to give his fellow actor something good to act off of. The takes were real.

I could see how frustrating it would have been for Andy that they were giving a more low wattage performance for him--it also underlined that his own performance wasn't the "real" one. But they worked it all out, as professionals and as friends. :cool:

cool EII pics, Achila!!
Welcome back, Ereshkigal. And Mechtild!! technology sucks, sometimes. Seems to have a wicked sense of humor, it does.
Rikka!! Goldie!! about time we see you both in here again!!


but but but...ORC is in January! I'm thinkin' of going, as is a friend from the north, I hope??

Honey, subtle persuasion, I do declare :p :D :D

Grumpy:
normal people can watch movies - well - normally.

:lol:

Somehow this makes me want to make ID cards for Normal People. I don't want to be caught watching movies...in any other way when the normalcy police come checking... :p ;)

But seriously, you are totally right (IMVHO)

(cool list, Ylla. and I agree Pelegia--lack of pretention is well..majorly cool)

Over at TORN, the pictures that Achila shared from the magazine article from the set of "Everything is Illuminated" are posted along with the captions that accompanied two of the pictures. C4

Just wanted to drop in to Thank whoever is responsible for the 2nd reputation square I gained...you have no idea how pleased I was to see that :)
I sometimes still feel I'm not as articulate as some of the gang in here and often I'm in awe of people's insights and observations regarding our favorite young lad...but that doesn't deter me in posting :D On the contrary, I feel it inspires and encourages me to be a better writer...also this group has aided in sharpening my computer and typing skills.....Could I possibly use this as an educational tax write-off? :o ;) well...maybe not :D But seriously...Thank You All
for making me Always feel so comfortable and welcome in this room :k

I know many of you....myself included, are Johnny Depp fans, one of my very dearest friends is a huge JD fan and she missed the recent Oprah show that he was a guest on. Is there anyone out there that might have a tape of that show so that I may give her a copy?....she was practically in tears over missing it....I think the poor girl has a slight obsession over a certain actor!
How ridiculous is that....imagine obsessing over an actor :eek: :D :D
I'd love to bring a smile to her when she looks into her Christmas stocking and finds that tape...I don't want to add sadness to this post but my friend has a terminally ill child (who also happens to be my godchild) and giving her a reason to smile would bring me a lot of joy!!! Please pm me if you can help me with this little quest of mine :z:

Thanks for once again indulging me as I go OT :k

First of all, I have to say, Yes! I have seen it! Thanks to Whiteling, Moondancer, and Skater Girl--ah, the importance of group research :k . I'm talking about Day-O, of course :) :). Dubbed in German, but Skater girl's write-up of what was happening in each scene really helped me follow along.

So, what did I think of it? I think it's a fairly well-done early 1990's made-for-TV movie, which means low production costs, probably a very short shooting schedule, and not much time spent "fine tuning" the characters or the acting. But I think Day-O works much better in that format than Child in the Night, because Day-O's not meant to be serious, or subtle, or nuanced, or to show us characters' psychological depths. Child in the Night wanted to do those things, but the way those movies were produced just didn't allow it, so it comes off as half-finished (IMHO). Whoever was in on the scripting and shooting of Day-O realized the limitations and stuck with what could be done well within them. None of it's perfect--including Elijah's acting. The characters are broadly drawn, and the ending is telegraphed a mile away. But I thought it was an entertaining movie with enough human interest in it to make it possible to identify with Grace, and even some of the other characters. Elijah's acting isn't bad--it's just more broad than subtle, which is what the movie and the character call for. The Froshadowings are few, but there are definitely some there :p .

The counterculture still has appeal in various areas and pockets of the U.S. population...
I guess I don't think of being countercultural as necessarily being part of a "counterculture"--that is, I think one person can choose to swim upstream without necessarily doing it as part of a group. Although having group support isn't a bad thing. "Even" in the sixties, there were almost as many ways to be countercultural as there were people doing it. But IMHO part of swimming against the stream yourself is being supportive of the way other people are doing that, even if you're not fighting the same currents (if that makes any sense at all :confused: ). Just from reading Alyon's post, for example, I'm wondering if we didn't come from somewhat different directions--perhaps with me being more involved in the political "movement" and her more active regarding interpersonal issues (just a guess :) ).

LIke I tell them about the social impact of the Beatles (they get the feel of it from the music, but don't have the information about the extent of the cultural transformation)
A few years ago, I had a next-door neighbor who was working on his master's degree and taking a course in "The History of the 1960s"--geesh, if you want something to make you feel old :eek: ! We did talk about it a fair amount, and what he seemed to get from me was the "feel" of the time. He said that the "historical events" :rolleyes: made a lot more sense after he heard how polarized things were--he had no idea of how brutal it sometimes was even on a personal level, with people you encountered every day labeling you as a traitor for being anti-war, or a Communist for supporting Earth Day. The first time I heard someone called a traitor for not supporting the war in Iraq my heart dropped--I was afraid we were going right back to "the bad old times," but it does seem now as if we might have learned something from previous experience, with people at least a bit more careful about assuming ulterior motives in opinions different from their own.

You know, if I start going on about the hope of middle earth is in the hands of someone who doesn't lift a weapon to win his fight. These anti-war kids start to go, oh yeah. Now I get it. ;) .
And Tolkien fought some of his own "upstream battles." Some of the letters he sent to Christopher during WWII... Well, let's just say I'm glad he kept copies of all the letters he sent, because I'm sure some of those that have been published would never had made it past the RAF censors and actually gotten delivered to his son! But a couple of decades later, he did have some difficulty understanding his "hippie" followers :p .

For me, the "issue" connected with Frodo goes beyond war, and even beyond violence, to power, which is something Tolkien gave a lot of thought to. This is from a letter written in 1947:
You can make the Ring into an allegory of our own time, if you like: an allegory of the inevitable fate that waits for all attempts to defeat evil power by power. But that is only because all power magical or mechanical does always so work.
As a Franciscan, I tend to resonate with that view of power. Francis didn't rant against evil power, or try to get control of the forces of power in order to move them in the direction he thought they should go. He just completely and utterly refused to be part of--or, as much as was possible, to even take notice of--the power structures that existed. And a lot of historians think that personal stance of his, disseminated throughout Europe through all the people who were drawn to follow him, was instrumental in ending feudalism (although I'm not too sure Francis would have liked some of its replacements much better :( ). I don't know if that's an exact parallel to two hobbits who've completely thrown away any power they might have had being able to destroy the foundations of Barad-dur an Age after the combined armies of Men and Elves hadn't been able to. But I think there's something of a common spirit there.

I know Sean talked about his best performances being off-camera--but he didn't mean the camera wasn't going. It was for when the shot was set for the other actor and Sean wanted to give his fellow actor something good to act off of. The takes were real.
One I remember Sean talking about even before he wrote his book was the "squash court" filming of what became the scene where Frodo sends Sam home. It had to be done twice: once with the focus on Sam and again with the focus on Frodo. When they were forced to do the scene earlier than planned because of the flooding, they did the shooting that emphasized Sam. Then months later, when it actually came up on the shooting schedule, they did the "Frodo-centric" version. Sean said that he wished he could have re-shot his part at that later time, because he knew the character so much better. He might have even requested a reshoot--I don't remember. But if he did, it was turned down. Even if he didn't get to redo the part with the camera on him, though, I'd imagine it would have helped Elijah to have that more fully-realized Sam to react to when shooting the Frodo-centered part of the scene.

----------

On reputation points--partly in response to ylla's post: It can be difficult to get a lot of "points" within the Community Cafe, because of the rule that after you give a point to someone, you have to give points to a certain number of individuals (maybe 20?) before the system will let you go back and give a second point to the first one again. Sometimes I'll think I've reached my quota and will try to give a point to someone I've "reputed" before, only to have the system tell me I can't do that yet. So, I guess what I'm trying to say is don't be too discouraged if the points don't add up very fast in this particular forum--if I could give a point every time I really appreciated what someone said, everyone here would have more green boxes than would fit in the space :p !

TG:
I guess I don't think of being countercultural as necessarily being part of a "counterculture"--that is, I think one person can choose to swim upstream without necessarily doing it as part of a group. Although having group support isn't a bad thing. "Even" in the sixties, there were almost as many ways to be countercultural as there were people doing it. But IMHO part of swimming against the stream yourself is being supportive of the way other people are doing that, even if you're not fighting the same currents (if that makes any sense at all ). Just from reading Alyon's post, for example, I'm wondering if we didn't come from somewhat different directions--perhaps with me being more involved in the political "movement" and her more active regarding interpersonal issues (just a guess ).

Oh, I agree about not having to be part of a community to be countercultural. I wasn't quite old enough in the "60's to be really aware or involved--but in the '70's I became very interested in both the cultural and political movements of the '60's. But I was living in a more conservative area and was pretty alone in my beliefs. I've always been involved politically, I also thought it important to try to act out what you believe. You want to the government to be tolerant and diplomatic, you try to be that way yourself. That sort of thing. Interpersonal issues?? hmmm...that could mean a lot of things!! ;) my mind is whirring... :D

I don't know if that's an exact parallel to two hobbits who've completely thrown away any power they might have had being able to destroy the foundations of Barad-dur an Age after the combined armies of Men and Elves hadn't been able to. But I think there's something of a common spirit there.

Oh--I like everything you say about power. I like that these hobbits are trying to give up something of power, rather than try to aquire it. It is in the renuciation of power that the world gets saved. Thank you for sharing some about the Francescan view. I'd like to look into that more. Thank you!!!

As usual, your conversation is very interesting...I feel not worthy at the moment as I have never really felt like being countercultural myself.

My parents brought their children up to be free thinkers and not just do something because 'others do it also'.
I know a lot of people who rather go with the flow just to avoid conflict. They'd rather blend in than be different.
Not that I'm so original or anything ;) but I certainly won't avoid conflict if it's important enough to me.

I like discussing with people who think differently. The odd thing is that lots of people see that as arguing and fighting. I have a colleague at work I like to discuss with during our lunch break. Other colleagues often shrug their shoulders when they hear us and they say "they're fighting again".
Our reaction is usually very similar: fighting, we? No, we're just talking.
I like that.
Too many people I know just stop the conversation when they sense that the other person thinks differently because they like to avoid any conflict.

Anyway...I have nothing much to add to this conversation but it's great to read.

----

Other topic: did you see this link on the TORN site?
http://www.jade-ov-arcc.com/elijah/

This is the text from the TORN site:
JadeValour writes: Last year I was given the wonderful gift of being able to be in New Zealand for the ROTK World Premiere festivities (and at the Return of the Ringers Party).

I am a singer/songwriter, and shortly before I came to NZ I wrote and recorded a demo of a song inspired by Elijah ("Elijah's Song") with my friend and fellow musician Ken Norris. I actually had the magical experience of meeting Elijah at the Los Angeles airport, as he was on the same Air New Zealand flight to Auckland as I was, and I was able to give him the CD personally, along with a film script I had co-written containing a lead role written for him (the script is now with two major film studios in the States and has been passed on to some major people in the film industry). A number of CDs of the song were also auctioned off at the TORn Party.

I have just put a new presentation website online with my music, and there is a special page on the site especially for LOTR fans, with "Elijah's Song" that they can listen to for free, dedications, a photo Elijah graciously let me take of him at the airport, and two direct links to the donation pages of Cancer Research UK.

Elijah has so generously been supporting Cancer Research in Britain and elsewhere, and I wanted to support him in this endeavor somehow, so this special page has been included on my site, in the hope that the fans would enjoy the song and possibly even make a small donation.

In this way a contribution could be made to this wonderful cause that I alone would financially not be able to make. The direct link to this page is jade-ov-arcc.com/elijah

So many people have friends and family who have suffered or died of cancer. For me, this page is a special gift to my friend Rosie in London who has suffered from breast cancer twice. She has a wonderful husband and two beautiful teenage daughters who she would like to see grow up and have children of their own. If this page and song helps her, and others, in any way, then I'm honored to do this - for them, and in honor of Elijah's committment to this cause. (I originally wanted to offer a free download, but I could not have afforded it, so the next best alternative was a 'free listen'.)

I'd be most grateful if you could publicize this information through TheOneRing.net, Michael. Thanky you so much

Trouble is: I can't listen to Elijah's song and I can't be bothered to download yet another thing to be able to listen to that. Anybody, let me know if it's worth the download.

----
Edit: I think that they lost the plot a bit at the imdb.com site.
They're listing both The Yank (2005, post-production) and Hooligans (2004, completed) in Elijah's filmography.
The Yank, according to imdb:
Genre: Drama
Plot outline: A recently expelled Harvard student travels to London and is introduced to the passion and excitement of the English soccer culture.

Hooligans, according to imdb:
Genre: Comedy
Tagline: Everything was going just the way the planned until they met him

:lol:

Trouble is: I can't listen to Elijah's song and I can't be bothered to download yet another thing to be able to listen to that. Anybody, let me know if it's worth the download.


I personally thought it was pretty sappy, and I didn't like the woman's voice, but you might! :)


Hooligans, according to imdb:
Genre: Comedy
Tagline: Everything was going just the way the planned until they met him

:lol:


Hmm...that sounds like it might have interesting possibilities. Hee hee. Actually, that could be the plot of the movie about us here at the Faculty -- that sums up my life before I "met" Elijah!

I personally thought it was pretty sappy, and I didn't like the woman's voice, but you might! :)


I, for my part, would use the term drippy :D , but then, there is no accounting for taste! ;)


Originally posted by tgshaw
First of all, I have to say, Yes! I have seen it! Thanks to Whiteling, Moondancer, and Skater Girl--ah, the importance of group research. I'm talking about Day-O, of course. Dubbed in German, but Skater girl's write-up of what was happening in each scene really helped me follow along.

Tg, I'm so glad you enjoyed Day-O :) !
And you are right - within its limitations it is an entertaining comedy, with an exceedingly cute little Elijah. One distinct Froshadowing is in the scene where Grace meets Day-O again after 30 years... very much like Frodo when he encounters Gandalf the first time in FotR, just mirrored. I'll see whether I can make a screencap of it (DVD - the wonder of modern technology ;) !). I don't know the English line, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was "You're late!"

Ha, so you've seen Day-O, tg! :)

Erm...forgive me, I seemed to have overlooked that bit of your post. I'm easily distracted, you see. ;)

I'm glad you were finally able to see it.
I quite agree with you...it was fun to watch without being really a fantastic movie. The plotline was not well written enough, very predictable, not enough attention for detail and I really didn't enjoy Delta Burke's acting.
The difference with a movie like Avalon is huge but still...I'm happy to have seen it even if it was not in the original language. :) (Thanks again, Whiteling for sharing this)


Also, thanks for warning me about Elijah's song. I won't bother downloading the necessary feature to listen to it.

Alyon wrote:

The counterculture still has appeal in various areas and pockets of the U.S. population. Even among American youth--at least in some areas. I happen to live in a city with a lot of counterculture community. And my work community is totally countercultural.
Lucky you! I work in the corporate heart of darkness (I now think of it as Mordor, so I guess I’m Frodo – creeping through enemy territory), and most of the young people I know would be good candidates for “The Apprentice” (where Frodo’s virtues obviously would get him nowhere). When I put a “Frodo & Sam ‘04” bumper sticker on my office door, just about the only coworkers who asked me for one were in their 40s or older. (One 25-year-old asked, “What does that mean, anyway?”) .” It’s pretty depressing. Which is one reason why I'm quitting! :D

A followup to tgshaw’s Tolkien quote about power: I found the following in a book called Defending Middle-earth by Patrick Curry. I THINK the quote is also from Tolkien, but it’s hard to tell, given the way Curry sets up his end-notes:

. . . frightful evil can and does arise from an apparently good root, the desire to benefit the world and others – speedily and according to the benefactor’s own plans. . .

Also from Alyon:

Peter Jackson had the luxury of having a lot of film at his disposal (people doing low budget indies, for instance, have to really try to limit the takes as film is so expensive). Twenty-five takes (the example being the scene Sean talked about in Osgiliath at the end of TTT) of an emotion filled scene seems exhausting to me.
I was struck by the fact that the multiple takes were sometimes necessary because the actors had received their rewritten lines right before the scene. For me, one of the most interesting things about Sean’s book was the overall picture of how seemingly chaotic the whole production was at times. I can certainly understand why an admitted control freak like Sean would have had trouble dealing with it. Especially with shooting out of sequence, and all the special-effects work, it would be really difficult to have any idea of what your work was going to look like, in the final product.

Re: Elijah's Song

I also didn't care for her voice, but I tried to put that aside and really listen to the song and... well, I found it to be 'sappy' as well, and actually found myself feeling embarrassed, perhaps in empathy with what I imagined Elijah's reaction to be...? I don't know. But I couldn't even manage to listen to the whole thing, I'm afraid.

Pelagia wrote:
Lucky you! I work in the corporate heart of darkness (I now think of it as Mordor, so I guess I’m Frodo – creeping through enemy territory), and most of the young people I know would be good candidates for “The Apprentice” (where Frodo’s virtues obviously would get him nowhere)

Oh, I know--I count my blessings every day. I work in an arts community. I've always been self-employed (almost always) and though there are times I get restless and feel I don't use all of my time productively, I don't think I could make the transition to having a boss and be in a hierarchical environment. Sometimes I feel like jumping into the fray to do something different, but then I hear enough from my friends to try to remember to appreciate my relative freedom and the colorful (though sometimes quite eccentric) characters I work around. My husband and I don't make a lot of money--but we consciously chose the trade-off for more time. And as to kids, I get a kick out of the cheerleading squad at my kid's school. They have no sports team--they cheer at protest rallys!!!

I found the following in a book called Defending Middle-earth by Patrick Curry
I have that book, too!! Am I wrong or is it relatively uncommon? I've asked a few people about it and they hadn't heard of it. I found it at a rumage sale. It has some pretty cool things in it. :)

I have that book, too!! Am I wrong or is it relatively uncommon? I've asked a few people about it and they hadn't heard of it. I found it at a rumage sale. It has some pretty cool things in it. :)
Hmmm... Is your rummage sale find in pretty good shape? I've seen two used copies of that book available--each for close to $200! (Original price back in 1997 was $55.) So, yes, "relatively uncommon" is probably a good description!

But--thanks to the movies, I'm sure--the book has just been reissued (and I mean just: less than a month ago). In paperback this time, for the more manageable price of about $10 ;) , depending on where you buy it.

I haven't read it yet, but I've read discussions of it from people who are familiar with the earlier edition (some of the book-purist Tolkien scholars in the email discussion group I lurk in). The upshot of it seems to be that it's not a book to read expecting a lot of "facts" on Tolkien or his writing, but is more of the author's personal interpretation (applicability if you will), coming from his own political/economic/personal POV. Personally, I don't think that's a "bad" kind of book at all, as long as the author is upfront about it, but some of the more purist scholars, of course, are afraid people will be "misled" into thinking it's the only way to interpret Tolkien. IMVHO, there are scholars in every field who credit "ordinary readers" with far less intelligence than they really have :rolleyes: .

Re: Reprising Elijah's Song:

:::: donning Groucho nose and glasses ::::

:::: ahem ::::

la-la-la-LA-la-la-la....

"Are you in voice, Winstead?"
"I believe I am in voice"
-- Spike Jones and Doodles Weaver, "The Man on the Flying Trapeze",
circa 1950

Sung to the tune of "Lydia the Tattooed Lady":

la-la-laaaaaaaa,
la-la-laaaaaaaa,
la-la-laaaaaaaa,
la-la-laaaaaaaa....

'Lijah oh 'Lijah,
O have you met 'Lijah,
O 'Lijah the taaaaa-toooed hobbit....
He has lips that we adore so
And his blue eyes even moreso,
O 'Lijah oh 'Lijah,
O have you met 'Lijah,
O 'Lijah the champ of them alllllll.....
He once took a Ring up the side of Mt. Doom,
He drives us all nuts when he walks in a room,
And darned if the kid isn't cuter than Bloom...
You can learn a lot from 'Lijah!

la-la-laaaaaaaa,
la-la-laaaaaaaa,
la-la-laaaaaaaa,
la-la-laaaaaaaa....


~grumpy (sappy my big hairy foot!) ;) ;)

ZKG--Yes, but do you have a website where we can buy it on CD?? ;)

http://www.imagemagician.com/images/tgshaw/off topic/clipart_people_103.gif

I LOVE IT GRUMPY!!!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

LOVE/WOOD

EDIT: I JUST SAW I HAVE BEEN A MEMBER OF THIS
LOVELY FAMILY FOR A HOLE YEAR!!!! :k :k

WOOD

zkgrumpy, I like your song very much! Although instead of Groucho Marx singing I tend to think of Kermit the Frog. Don't you wish The Muppet Show was still on? Elijah Wood would have been a super guest for that show. I was unable to listen to "Elijah's Song" (my computer wouldn't let me-one thing I am not is computer savvy. I can point and click and type and that's about it.) So I wandered around her site a bit. She has an unusual fashion sense. Don't think I'll see that in the L.L.Bean catalouge. C4

ZK! Your song is... well, it ROCKS. :z: Hee! I sang it all the way through in my head (my family already thinks I'm crazy enough). Thanks for that smile today! :D

Elijah Wood on The Muppet Show! :lol:

Oh, be still my heart! That would have been fabulous--what a great idea, Ceefour.

Yesterday I accompanied my mum to a film called Ladies in Lavendar, and I was totally unprepared for the effect it had on me. Two elderly sister, one a spinster played by Judi Dench, living together by the sea in 1936 Cornwall have their lives turned upside down when they find an injured young man washed up on their beach. The young man is played by a German actor called Daniel Brühl, who visually bears a ressemblance to Toby Maguire in Ice Storm, but who brings an awful lot of what I can only describe as Elijahness to the role. (A refined gentleness, soft voice, eyes that pull you in etc.) He is Polish and as he speaks no English at first, much of the relationship development between the characters has to be achieved without words. Judi Dench's character develops a serious crush on this young man, and her pain is obvious. Having found myself drawn so deeply, against my will and better judgement, to a young actor 20 years my junior and completely unavailable to me, I could totally to her confusion and torment.

I came out thanking my lucky stars that my home life is satisying enough for me to simply enjoy the relationship I have with Elijah through his films, and hoping that I never, ever actually physically meet someone who affects me in the same way.

With regards to Dayo:
I'll see whether I can make a screencap of it (DVD - the wonder of modern technology !). I don't know the English line, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was "You're late!"
I couldn't neither hear the full remark in German, nor lip read the English, but I think you are probably right. I'd love to see a screencap of this frame. It was also one of my favourite moments, along with his line in the car, where he says something like 'You can drive a car - AND you've got wrinkles!'

I have never seen Delta Burke in anything else, but despite her OTT screams, I did think she was perfect for this role. I just hope that if ever I see it in English, she hasn't got a deep voice. For years, I only saw the american sitcom 'Married with Children' on german TV - the lady had a high voice, the man a deep one. When I eventually heard the real actors voices, it was dreadful, as they seemed not to suit the characters I had come to know at all, despite being the true voices of the actors chosen for the roles.

Elijah's acting isn't bad--it's just more broad than subtle, which is what the movie and the character call for. I liked seeing him do something lighter, since it only serves to make his heavier roles more impressive. I still thought his maturity showed through. Sometimes with these early I feel like he was an adult in a child's body acting out what he believes is child's behaviour.

tgshaw wrote, about Curry’s Defending Middle-earth:

it's not a book to read expecting a lot of "facts" on Tolkien or his writing, but is more of the author's personal interpretation (applicability if you will), coming from his own political/economic/personal POV.
Yes; and I think he is upfront about his point of view, which he pretty well sums up in the last chapter (added for the new edition):

More than ever, we need reminding of the courage that lies buried deep in the hearts of unsung ‘small,’ ordinary people; of the wonder of what we have too long taken for granted: living water, fresh air, clean earth; of something as basic as good food cooked with care and eaten with appreciation in convivial company (compare the oxymoron of a ‘power lunch’); of our souls’ hunger for such ‘useless’ activities as (say) walking in woods under starlight; and of the value of loyalty, honour and friendship which, like all such things, cannot be measured, weighed or expressed in dollars and cents.
Oh, zkgrumpy! You’ve opened up a whole new creative area with “’Lijah the Tattooed Hobbit.” Surely, as a group, the Faculty members could come up with a whole CD of Lijsongs. And ceefour, your idea of Elijah on “The Muppet Show” is absolutely inspired. He would have fit right in! Miss Piggy would have swooned all over him, of course.

Hi everyone!
Very interesting discussions as always!
I love the quotes from Curry's book "Defending Middle-Earth". is this a book one can get hold of?
Also love the idear of Elijah on the Muppet show...hahhaha fantastic! :lol:
btw - Ceefour, never mind about "Elijah's song" In my (not-so-humble) opinion it is awful. :rolleyes:

Skater girl, thank you for the Ladies in Lavendar recap. It sounds wonderful, if heartbreaking.

Interesting comment on Elijah "acting" like a child. We know from other director's comments (such as on Good Son) that he played like a kid between takes. Yet people often commented on his "old soul" quality. He strikes me as scarily well balanced -- I so hope he can stay that way!

Tg, congrats on seeing Day-O at last! WHAHOO! A clean sweep! *crowns you Queen of the Faculty*

Wood, congratulations on your year's anniversary. I can't believe time has flown so fast. I'm so glad this board and these lovely conversations are alive and well. :D

Do I look a little frazzled? You won't believe what I've been through, and all for YOU, my esteemed Faculty Colleagues! CeeFour, I scoured the web for a lovely picture I saw once of Elijah with The Count ::v-v:: (<--fangs) from Sesame Street. I had to look at page after page of pictures of Elijah Wood! Oh the pulchritude!

Alas, I did not find said picture. :(

Skater Girl, I hope Ladies in Lavendar makes it to these fair shores! Sounds like a must-see.

ZK that song is a classic!

honey!

CeeFour, I scoured the web for a lovely picture I saw once of Elijah with The Count ::v-v:: (<--fangs) from Sesame Street. Alas, I did not find said picture. :(



You must mean these, Honey:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v32/bunniebugs/Elijah/aeo.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v32/bunniebugs/Elijah/halloween.jpg

Not Sesame Street, actually, but a storytime sort of program that he visited and read a story for. Still adorable! :)

Thanks Bunnie those pictures are priceless :k

Bunnie! Thank you! I'd never seen the second one before! :D Adorable!
::right-click-save::

honey!

BunnieBugs: Thanks for the great pictures of Elijah with The Count! Which Elijah-era would those be from? Somebody should be able to figure it out from the hairdo. Around the time of The Ice Storm, maybe? (BTW, I love your second signature: “Enjoying the fruits of geekdom”).

Tomorrow I will go to see and listen LOTR Symphony in Kremlin. Howard Shore is now in Moscow...

Enjoy, Rikka -- I'm sure you will!

Rikka, lucky you!

Well, I forced myself to finish "There and Back Again" last night, and I might have to add Sean's book to my pile of things to give away. It is really awful. How sad, how self-defeating, how embarrassing. I was embarrassed to read it. I winced for him every time he pulled out his "I am so not worthy but why does no one value me" schtick, about four times per page and often several times per anecdote.

I got a little bit excited to see that he mentioned the NY trilogy showing at the end, but again, it was in that sad sack context that he whips himself into and it just left me so depressed. I must say, he managed to diss just about everyone in the production, even his best friend Elijah Wood.

I mean, not that he doesn't think the world of Elijah, but sometimes he thought Elijah was, you know, trying too hard to make the Fellowship real, even though he never doubted his sincerity for a moment, but, you know, that was just the sort of foolishly idealistic thing he would do because he was, you know, so young but that was part of his charm, wasn't it, and he loves him dearly and still hears from hm every year at Christmas which Christine tells him is just normal for actors and he tries really really hard to understand it and at least it's better than Orlando or Sir Ian publicly snubbing him when all he wanted to do was "connect" with them because, you know, they have a right to snub him, really, as he's so insignificant but of course they're far too heroic and manly and great ever to do that anyway as they both have explained to him if he could only understand, not like when he ruined ROTK for everyone by doing all that whining that he is so sadly prey to and has been all his life but he really did think he deserved better because of his greatness until of course everyone showed him the error of his ways and he realized that yes, finally, after all these years of waiting forgotten in the wings Sam Gamgee emerged at last as the TRUE HERO of the tale as Tolkien must have always meant him to be and as Sean knew in his heart from the first day and Christine always told him and Peter promised and everyone but the Academy could see with blinders on.

Well, sorry about that sentence--that's what I get for reading half the book in one go. The cast must all be nodding their heads going, "Yup, that's Sean, now everyone will see what we had to put up with for three years." It's as if he is so upset at not being great that he can draw attention to himself only by showing off how flawed he is. But he makes himself into a freak show! "Look at me, how stupid I was! How blind, how egotistical, how wrong, how [fill in ad infinitum], BUT did you notice me???-----" Really, it's very, very sad.

And the cut scene from ROTK on which he based his Oscar hopes--awful! Sam threatening Gollum with "If one hair is out of place on [Frodo's] head"--please. Could we have Frodo in here, for just a minute, please? (Thanks, Mech.) One hair out of place?? Excuuuuse me?? Would you look at this guy?! Not exactly GQ cover material lately....

Please, Sean, count your blessings. Cutting that scene was the best thing that ever happened to Sam.

I know some people have felt sorry for Sean after reading the book. I'm afraid I lost patience with him after a while. I'm sure he was given plenty of good advice about how to handle his story and he clearly chose not to take it.

Woow, Flourish, what a diatribe ! :cool: Bravo!

Yesterday I finally watched Radio Flyer for the first time. I must say that I like the movie, it is very emotional, sad and has some simple poetry in it. I also liked some of director's trains of thought and devices. For example, that we can't see the face of the violent stepfather...

For EW Radio Flyer is a nice acting work. He's natural, emotional and sincere as always, and he's more expressive than other kid.

Flourish--The sense of "mental whiplash" in that sentence is great!

from Flourish:
One hair out of place?? Excuuuuse me?? Would you look at this guy?! Not exactly GQ cover material lately....
Uh, yeah... Would that be around the time of this particular shot? :rolleyes:

http://www.frodolivesin.us/RotK/381204f0.jpg

Actually, that's an honest question--where would that scene have fit into the story? The only time I can think of is when Frodo and Sam parted (right after the above pic), but if it took place then, how did Sam plan to know about any hair being out of place? :confused: IMHO, for that to make any sense, an entire section of the story would have needed to be different. Does it seems that Sean thought more in terms of "scenes" than in terms of the project as a whole?

from Rikka:
Yesterday I finally watched Radio Flyer for the first time. I must say that I like the movie, it is very emotional, sad and has some simple poetry in it. I also liked some of director's trains of thought and devices. For example, that we can't see the face of the violent stepfather...
Yes, I like that, too. Especially since we've already seen the opening part of the "frame story," so we know we're getting it through the POV of an adult who's looking back on an abusive childhood. Not remembering what the abuser looked like strikes me as some very real "disassociation" from the memories.

Rikka, you'll probably have been to the symphony by the time you read this--so, I hope it was a wonderful experience! :)

------------

Someone asked earlier about Delta Burke's voice. I wouldn't call it "low." I was going to say it's sometimes "sharp"--but that's mostly when it fits the character, which I don't think would be true with Grace. Delta's a "Southern belle" by background, and I've never heard her speak without a southern accent, or seen her without makeup, styled hair, and stylish clothes (or "used to be stylish" clothes, depending on the character). That just all seems to be part of her persona, and I think it is consciously done as a persona, at least to a certain extent. My guess is that the only place Europeans would have had a chance to see her is in Designing Women. She was in some other TV series after that, but none that became as popular as that one. I think she's had some minor movie roles, but she's basically a television actor (or, as her projected persona would probably prefer, actress ;) ).

First prize to BunnieBugs for the pictures. Honorable mention to Honeyelf for her persistance in searching for hours and hours, forced to gaze upon picture after picture. (It's a dirty job, but someone has to do it.) You are so lucky to be able to see Howard Shore, Rikka. I saw LOTR Symphony this summer and it was wonderful, but without H. Shore conducting. Flourish, I have not read Sean Astin's book. Readers seem to love it or hate it, though. Until I do, I'm inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt, considering the instability of his childhood and how that must still affect him. I've been laughing about the Muppet Show since yesterday. Elijah Wood as Frodo; Kermit as Aragorn; Miss Piggy as Arwen(imagine her at Helm's Deep -hiyah!); Fozzie Bear as Sam; Sam the Eagle as Elrond; the geezers in the balcony as Gandalf and Saruman. I saw the trailer for "The Flight of the Phoenix" with Miranda Otto, among other actors. I've always like the original, which starred James Stewart, who also starred in "Harvey", which is the favorite movie of ...Elijah Wood! My posts don't have paragraphs. I apologize. (Can't figure out how to do it. Help!) C4

My posts don't have paragraphs. I apologize. (Can't figure out how to do it. Help!) C4

All you have to do is click your enter key a couple of times, and the cursor will jump down to make a new 'section', or paragraph. :)

Oh, and thanks for the first prize! I'll wear my blue ribbon proudly. :D

Rikka, you'll probably have been to the symphony by the time you read this--so, I hope it was a wonderful experience! :)

No, tg, not yet. This will happen only in 23 hours - at 19-00 on November, 17. :)

But I will have to come there about 2,5 hours earlier to come in without crowd problems. The Symphony will be performed in the Congress Hall which is inside Kremlin walls. But in fact Kremlin was built many centuries ago as a fortress of Moscow princes. So to enter the territory of Kremlin you need to come through a very narrow gates in the Gard tower (of 17 c.), where all the visitors are checked as in airport ;), than you cross the narrow stone bridge that leads to to another ancient tower, enter its gates - and only after you are inside.

This is the only way for the Congress Hall visitors to come inside, so it takes a lot of time, especially now, in times of a terrorism danger (Kremlin is a residence of Russian President so it's territory is seriously guarded).

You may look at the pic - this is the ancient bridge between two Kremlin towers, where you come inside. :) White-and-red building is a Guard tower - and a small arch down there is the entrance in Kremlin... Imagine what crowds are here when there is some big concert or show in Kremlin Congress Hall ?! ;)

Thank you, BunnieBugs! :k

And if I keep hitting the enter key, the cursor

keeps

moving

down! :lol:

Look out Bill Gates! :haha:

ETA, thanks for the picture, Rikka. I'll be thinking of you about this time tomorrow listening to all that lovely music. What a great place The Faculty Lounge is! To be able to talk with someone from the other side of the world from me is amazing and wonderful. C4.

TgShaw:
Hmmm... Is your rummage sale find in pretty good shape? I've seen two used copies of that book available--each for close to $200! (Original price back in 1997 was $55.) So, yes, "relatively uncommon" is probably a good description

Okay, well you prompted me to move that book to a little "safer" place and out of the sunlight. :D

I agree with Pelagia that the author is very clear that it is his own interpretations he is putting forth. But he backs up his thinking with lots of scholarly research and footnoting and references to other authors who have commented on Tolkien. He argues with them or against them, according to his reading of Tolkiens work and words.

Wood!! congratulations for a year with The Faculty. And Honey, I think I forgot to give you your ladies Daquairi for your 300th post. I have forgotten my manners. Drink up, both.

Bunnie. Bunnie! Pictures that will make my day that much better--oohhh thanks! :k

Rikka--enjoy the concert!! I wonder if anyone in Moscow will have Frodolls with them?? We saw some pretty big ones in Seattle. A little whimsy with ones culture! ;)

Skatergirl--wanna see that movie!! (Ladies in Lavender!). Sounds great!

Hi Mariole!!!! Waving madly at you!! :k

Loved the song Grumpy!!

And Flourish--Sean is talking in town in a couple of weeks and my daughter said we must go. So I ordered the tickets. I still have affection for Sean despite his book--but what, pray tell, should I do if starts going on about Sam being the real hero!! And him being the star!! What?? I'm hoping he will go the other route and graciously and lovingly talk about his costar(s) as well as his own take on things. I can imagine getting all warm and fuzzy--or I can imagine it going the other way and me getting all twitchy. Pray tell, what should I be drinking before I go??

HI TO YOU ALL!!! JUST POPING IN
TO "SEE" IF EVERY BODY IS HERE!!

DON`T HAVE NOTHING TO ADD TO YOUR
WONDERFUL POSTS!!

RIKKA, I`M GLADE YOU LIKED RADIO FLYER
IT`S ONE OF MY FAVORITS TOO!!

FLOURISH; I HAVE MY DOUBTS ABOUT READING
SEAN`S BOOK BUT NOW I`M SURE I WILL SKIP
THIS ONE!!

CEEFORE; GLADE YOU ARE ENJOY THIS PLACE AS
MUCH AS I AM!!

I THINK IT IS GREAT THAT WE CAN TALK THIS WAY
I MEAN I LIVE IN SWEDEN AND SOM OF YOU ON THE OTHER
SIDE OF THE OSCEAN AND SOME OTHER ARE CLOSER BUT STILL
IN OTHER COUNTRYS I THINK IT IS FASANATING!!

WELL I KNOW I HAVE MISS TO MANTION SOMEONES POSTS
IT IS NOT MY ITENTION!!!
I LOVE YOU ALL VERY MUCH!!!

HEY NOT A WORD ABOUT ELIJAH!!
MMMM..... WERE IS HE THE GOURGES MAN?? :p :D

I WILL STOP NOW BEFORE IT IS TO LATE!! I KNOW THIS ISEN`T THE PLACE
TO SWOORN IN!! BUT ALL THE FUNNY PEOPLE ARE IN HERE!!! :lol: :lol:

WELL, IT LOOKS LIKE I HADE SOMETHING TO ADD!! :lol:
LOVE YOU/WOOD

That was TERRIFIC, Flourish. Made me feel like running around the block, if I did things like run around the block. :p You'll know from my own ventings, that book was not one of my favourites. (No kidding :D !)

But, I still thought Sean was a great Sam. And I also think his own personal problems might have enhanced the playing, in terms of the final product, between his Sam and Elijah's Frodo. EW having to take care of him in RL (even though, in the film portrayal Frodo is taken care of by others far more than he takes care of them), might have helped develop in EW an air of personal responsibility towards Sean (out of human feeling, professional concern and even even moral obligation) that seeped into his otherwise very young, very vulnerable Frodo, which might not have been there without Sean's little un-winning ways.

Mech, we posted simultaenously. Good point, there--thanks for the observation. I guess it's not Sean I mind (I wasn't on set, lol, so I didn't have to deal with him), just his book.

I probably sound harsh regarding his book. I think he knows the negative effect it's had on fans, though, as he's publicly apologized for that (I posted his apology already--TORn reported it from one of the book signings).

The thing is, his self-pity/self-aggrandizing is so relentless that it really grates on the reader after a while to hear him sound that one note over and over again. It's morbidly fascinating to see how many different situations he can relate to prove how royally he screws everything up, and how sorry he is that he did it, but after a while you start to get just a teensy bit resentful that he threw away this opportunity too, when he could have given LOTR fans something really special instead of airing all his personality flaws at (literally) our expense.

I don't think I've ever read a book in which the word "I" appears so often.

Alyon, what to drink beforehand? Wow, I don't know--caffeine? Caffeine makes me nervous, and when I'm nervous I'm bold. I'd want the courage to shake him by the shoulders and say, "What were you thinking?! But now that you've got it off your chest, could you talk about Elijah, please?" ;)

alyon!! thanks for the congrats!!!! :k :k

flourish,were did you post his apology? i must have misst that one!

wood

oh i forgott thanks every one who is resbonsably
for give me a second green squer!!

Wood, I must have posted it at the "old" Faculty thread, but here it is again. It is from a report of the book signing on Long Island (NY) which TORn reported on 10/17. The odd thing is, I live close enough to have gone there, but I decided not to face the crowds and madness.

Here's what Sean said--

I read on TheOneRing.net or one of the other sites, why I didn't write more about Sean Bean. I have nothing but love and affection for all the actors and all the cast and crew from the movie. The book, because it is in ink, it might seem to be authoritative or definitive about my feelings of some people, it is not. It is just some thoughts that occurred to me while I was writing them down, I hold them in the highest esteem and have great affection, particularly Ian McKellen and Peter Jackson. I hope people are not put off by the fact that I took the bold gesture of putting this out there. I am proud of it, it is honest, but it also is a little more abrasive then I probably would of liked it for it to be, so I want to apologize to the fans for this.

Thank you Flourish!!!

I guess he must have heard many angry
fans arguering about this book!!
Even if it is his thoughts in the book he must
have realizt fans was supose to get upset about it,or? :(

LOVE/WOOD

For EW Radio Flyer is a nice acting work. He's natural, emotional and sincere as always, and he's more expressive than other kid.

I totally agree with this, but I do think that Joseph Mazzello managed to outdo Elijah in the 'cuteness' stakes. Radio Flyer was one of the last of Elijah's early movies I got to see, and I had begun to believe no one could be cuter than him. But while Elijah remained young looking and cute throughout his teens, Joseph's face had matured and changed even by the time he appeared in Jurassic Park.

I loved this film totally, as the independance shared by the two boys during the day absolutely mirrored my childhood experience. However, female friends I have lent it to, mothers themselves, have been horrified and upset by the content and the fact that a mother could let such things happen to their child, and they weren't able to enjoy the film.

I have my own satisfying interpretation of the ending, where Bobby doesn't fly off but is in fact badly injured in his descent down the hill and hospitalised for an extended period (this explains his absence from the house), but I would love to know what was in the mind of the writer.

Actually, that's an honest question--where would that scene have fit into the story? The only time I can think of is when Frodo and Sam parted (right after the above pic), but if it took place then, how did Sam plan to know about any hair being out of place? :confused:
).

Could it be here? There is a quote from the ROTK SEE DVD list of scenes (1st disk) - look at #16. A sign * means this is a new scene. This is just after the Minas Morgul scene (#15)... And the Stairs of Cirith Ungol in this list is only at #23.

(...)
13. the crossroads of the fallen kings *
14. "it's the deep breath before the plunge" **
15. Minas Morgul
16. the warning of Sam *
17. the job of pippin
18. the osgiliath invasion **
19. the fires upon the mountains
(...)


Skater Girl
I have my own satisfying interpretation of the ending, where Bobby doesn't fly off but is in fact badly injured in his descent down the hill and hospitalised for an extended period (this explains his absence from the house), but I would love to know what was in the mind of the writer.

Oh, really?
I understood it as Bobby did fly, died in this attempt, getting friedom from his suffering through death...

ceefour
What a great place The Faculty Lounge is! To be able to talk with someone from the other side of the world from me is amazing and wonderful.
ceefour,
I also love this variety of countries and coultures at Faculty Lounge. We are all very different here, sometimes differently understand many things and have different oppinions on many problems, but this diference gives all of us more knoledge about this world and other countries. This is great. And also all of us here united by our love to LOTR and admiration of EW acting talent.

wood
congrats with your Faculty Anniversary! :k

Oh, really?
I understood it as Bobby did fly, died in this attempt, getting friedom from his suffering through death...

Not for me. That would be too sad, and Mikey would surely have been much more unhappy than he seemed, when it was just him and his mom at home. I think he did grow up to become a pilot, because at the beginning of the film Tom Hanks talks to his own kids about Uncle Bobby, as if they personally know him. If he had died, Tom Hanks would more likely have referred to him as his brother, rather than the kids' uncle.

Not for me. That would be too sad, and Mikey would surely have been much more unhappy than he seemed, when it was just him and his mom at home. I think he did grow up to become a pilot, because at the beginning of the film Tom Hanks talks to his own kids about Uncle Bobby, as if they personally know him. If he had died, Tom Hanks would more likely have referred to him as his brother, rather than the kids' uncle.

Well it seems to me that before Mikey told his own kids many times about 'their Uncle Bobby', (so they kney well that he's their uncle), but that was the first time when he tells them the _whole_ story - about abuse, violece, suffering - and Bobby's last flight... But for discussing this point deeply I need to watch the movie again. English isn't my native language, may be I just didn't understand the situation in the movie correctly.

Alyon: What to drink before going to see Sean? Surely a bottle of Old Winyards would have been appropriate; but apparently Frodo and company finished off the last of it.

ceefour: I like your “Muppet Show” casting. How about Bunson Honeydew and that goofy lab assistant as Merry and Pippin? Or Animal as Gollum??

Rikka: I’m sure you’ll enjoy the LOTR Symphony. Unfortunately, Howard Shore did not conduct it here in Philadelphia, when I heard it in July; and it was performed at an outdoor music center, which presented some problems in terms of acoustics and of balance among singers and various sections of the orchestra. But the music was as moving as ever, and the blending of music with artwork was very effective.

Just happened to have popped an old tape in the VCR yesterday, and rediscovered the Charlie Rose interview with Sean, Andy and Elijah. (Poor Elijah! The One Lad seems to be a bit at sea in that interview doesn't he? He can be very young sometimes, still.)

But the thing that really struck me was Sean's response to Mr. Rose, when he asked about how the film was received by fans. Sean said something to the effect that he was "...overwhelmed by the outpouring of love..." from the fans. (Being Sean, he went on at some length.)

There have been times, when I was younger, when I would have identified with Sean's neediness. And so it's easier than I'd like, for me to understand how Sean could take that "outpouring," and come back for more. I really think that's what he did. People like Sean (and my previous, less mature self) can misunderstand the interest of others' in their lives. We liked him as Sam, so maybe we're ready to accept all of him, he may be thinking. He may have imagined that his book would further endear him. From the quote you posted, Flourish, he seems to have been disabused of that notion.

Nevertheless, I hold out some hope for Sean. If his ego doesn't get in the way, audience reception of the book may be a growing experience.

Alyon, give him a little shake, and then a hug from honey! ;)

Another thing I noticed in that interview was Elijah's gracious comments regarding the relationship of Sam and Frodo. He said something along the lines of "...they totally relied on one another...neither could have done it without the other..." but that Frodo eventually disentegrates to the degree that he needs Sam to carry him. No need on his part to claim heroism on the part of his own character. I imagine that JRRT might have been very pleased with his response.

honey!

ceefour: I like your “Muppet Show” casting. How about Bunson Honeydew and that goofy lab assistant as Merry and Pippin? Or Animal as Gollum??
I knew Animal reminded me of someone! :p

Any ideas for the Swedish chef?

But, I have to say, when the "Muppet Show" idea came up, the thought of a LotR take-off never entered my mind. I just thought how great it would have been to see Elwood in an episode of "Pigs in Space." :p

For some reason :confused: , that reminds me--I've been meaning to mention the fact that there's a Harvey allusion in Day-O, when Grace's father asks her about her "hare" . Just one more piece of evidence that Elwood as Elwood was meant to be ;) .

... and it was performed at an outdoor music center, which presented some problems in terms of acoustics and of balance among singers and various sections of the orchestra.
With the mentions of being able to get to know people on the other side of the globe, along with Rikka's Kremlin picture, I was reflecting on the location for the upcoming concert in Omaha. It's a "historical landmark," which means it's about 100 years old. Around here, that's [i]old! But, then, Omaha just celebrated its 150th birthday this year. Lewis and Clark came through here with their "Corps of Discovery" 200 years ago. So when the first people of European descent laid eyes on the place, the Kremlin was already centuries old.

--The concert hall does have great acoustics, though. :)


Just-in-case spoiler warning for Radio Flyer






We do have an idea of what was in the writers' minds, because there was an oiginal ending that was thrown out and replaced with the one that made it into the movie. In the original, grown-up Mikey and his kids are in the Smithsonian Air and Space Museum. At the end of the scene, the camera pulls back to show them looking at the transformed Radio Flyer, which is suspended in mid-air with no means of support. So Mikey's story about Bobby was meant to be what really happened, in the context of a movie that has quite a few other fantasy elements (the entire movie strikes me as being similar to magical realism).

But enough people thought it was wrong to show a fantasy ending to a story on child abuse, that the ending was rewritten--to purposely be very ambiguous. So the various interpretations that viewers come up with are probably all equally valid. In deference to the writers' intentions, I like to hold to the idea of Mikey's story being "real"--in the context of a fantasy movie.




End of Radio Flyer spoilers


I'm wondering if this part of Sean's quote that Flourish posted might not say a lot about what's "wrong" with the book. It's just too bad that someone (Sean, co-author, editor, publisher) didn't slow down the rush to get it published:
The book, because it is in ink, it might seem to be authoritative or definitive about my feelings of some people, it is not. It is just some thoughts that occurred to me while I was writing them down...

And, Wood, before I forget again :o : Congratulations--and Thanks--on your year in the Faculty Lounge! :k

Wood
Congratulations on your first year with The Faculty
The boys say:" ROCK ON."...many more years to come ;)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v480/ylla/0dcb2982.jpg

Good morning, all!

This was in my Yahoo Alert this morning:

PerryierPerryier sparkles in France

"Songs for Someone" is the new album from Sligo's Perry Blake.
Already much admired on mainland Europe (especially France), where he enjoys considerable success, and has been the recipient of a number of music awards, Perry's last album, "California", won him a legion of new fans worldwide, and helped cement his reputation in his native Ireland. The single from that album "Ordinary Day" (also recorded as a duet in French/English), received extensive airplay, and was a favourite with many of Ireland's leading radio presenters.

Perry has recently written songs for the new album by legendary French chanteuse Francois Hardy, and has also been invited to contribute two songs to the quirky cult teen movie "Trois Petites Filles", directed by leading French film maker, Jean-Loup Hubert. The soundtrack also includes some of the darkest songs from Radiohead and Muse!

A new single from the album, "Native New Yorker", is currently finding its way on to the Irish airwaves. Perry's version of the song is a radical reworking of the Odyssey original of the late '70s, but those not familiar with that version might still be aware of the song from the current major advertising campaign for Clarkes' footwear.

Elijah Wood, who starred as Frodo in the film trilogy "The Lord of the Rings", was a recent visitor to Perry's home on the Leitrim / Sligo border, where they enjoyed a spot of hillwalking. Elijah has offered to present a video documentary on Perry, which is due to be shot in the coming months.

Perry Blake is planning a Dublin show in December

My guess is that they're referring to the Ireland trip Lij took right after the EII filming was complete.

Achila, thanks for the news. What does "present" mean in that context? Narrate? Produce?

tg, I think you may be partly right that haste contributed to some of the flaws in Sean's book (it certainly contributed to the number of grammatical slips and typos :rolleyes: ). But Sean's view of his place in the world and his neediness may or may not have been capable of being circumvented by a slower writing process. I'm not really sure about that. A lot would have depended on how willing he was to listen to the advice I'm sure he was given, and on whether the publisher decided to treat him as a first-time author (who would need a heavier editorial hand) or as a celebrity author (who would generally be treated---well, like a celebrity. "Whatever you want, Sean!")

I know someone there, though he didn't handle this particular book. Maybe I should ask him, though.... tactfully, you know. Not like, "Hey, you know that awful book you just published? Could I just ask you-----" :p

But Sean's view of his place in the world and his neediness may or may not have been capable of being circumvented by a slower writing process. I'm not really sure about that. A lot would have depended on how willing he was to listen to the advice I'm sure he was given, and on whether the publisher decided to treat him as a first-time author (who would need a heavier editorial hand) or as a celebrity author (who would generally be treated---well, like a celebrity. "Whatever you want, Sean!")


The statement I was mostly thinking of is, "It is just some thoughts that occurred to me while I was writing them down..." That's okay for a first draft, but it's not the way to get to a published book. I'm not even thinking so much of slowing down the writing process itself as of taking the time needed to reflect on the experience and on what he wanted to say.

The publishing business ain't what it used to be, at least in the major companies. The days of actual "editors" in the traditional sense of the word are pretty much gone; if a book needs that much help it'll just get rejected or, if it has some potential, sent back to the author for a rewrite--unless, of course, the book is "hot" for some reason and people will buy it no matter what. My main curiosity is about the co-author. With celebrity authors, the co-author is often who really writes the book. Did Sean just push him and his advice aside, or did the co-author think, "He can write a halfway coherent sentence, and I have other things to do," and leave him on his own? I could easily see either scenario happening.

But that would mostly affect the quality of the writing. IMHO the content needed that reflection time, even a period of setting the draft aside and coming back to reread it later, which can be a real, "Ohmygosh! I didn't mean it to sound like that!" experience. And I expect no one could have given Sean that time but Sean--although I also expect he faced some pressure to get it done while it was hot. The publisher isn't going to care how Sean comes across or what people will think of him--it just wants to sell books.

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Achila--Yes, interesting news! And, of course, the mind goes on to... any connection with that "quirky cult teen movie" (Radiohead, eh? ;) ) Hopefully, though, if Elijah has a role in it, it will be as a post-teenager.

Hello, Ladies. Pelagia, your casting of Bunson Honeydew and Beaker as Merry and Pippin were my thoughts, too. Animal could double as Gollum and the Orcs. Tg, how about the Swedish Chef as Treebeard? Janice (from the band, who has long, blonde hair and is cool) could be Legolas (who has long, blonde hair and is cool!) :p "Pigs in Space" was one of my favorite sketches, along with "'Dr. Bob,' the continuing story of a veterenarian who has gone to the dogs." The show is available on DVD; I'll have to buy them...for my children :rolleyes:

Skater girl, thanks for the review of "Ladies in Lavender." Hopefully, it will be in theaters near me.

Flourish, please ask about how Sean Astin's book was edited (or not!). Browsing in my local book store, I came across Patty Duke's second book (forget the title-"A Beautiful Madness?"). Her present husband talked about how taken aback he was at first by the frankness of the talk between Patty Duke and her sons. They held nothing back from each other, telling each other exactly how they each felt, sometime loudly and in explicit language. Yet he never felt they did not love one another. Another reason why the book turned out the way it did? Behaviors can be so hard to change, despite our best intentions. At the rate I'm going, I'll be "grown-up" by the time I'm 80. C4.

Psst, Pelagia, I was at the Mann, too. Right Orchestra, about 15 rows from the front.

Psst, Pelagia, I was at the Mann, too. Right Orchestra, about 15 rows from the front.

Hee hee -- I was there too, center orchestra, in the second section back (I forget what row it was). Too bad we didn't know each other -- we could've had a Faculty moot!

Oh, Achila, that would have been fun. Along with the costumes, I swoon for the music. (Am I allowed to do that here?) The music and the EE are what deepened my appreciation for the movies so much. I was disapointed in ROTK and what brought me back to it were the translations of what the soloists and chorus were singing, especially at "The End of All Things." When I knew Renee Fleming was singing, "What's happened to the world? Is everything sad going to come untrue?" (one of my favorite lines from the book) everything seemed to fall into place. C4


ETA: Credit must also be given to Grammaboodawg at TORN, the Movies and Frodo/Elijah threads at TolkienOnline, this thread and tg's site for increasing my affection for these movies and renewing my love for the books. I had not read the books for 16 years when FOTR was released. In fact, in a cleaning frenzy, I had thrown away my copies that I had had since grade school (the Ballentine Books with psychadelic covers)! :eek: Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa.